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  #41  
Old 01-12-2013, 08:33 PM
men men is offline
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I really want to believe this, but there is a passage in the Bible that makes me question it.


John 4





15 The woman said to him, “Sir, give me this water so that I won’t get thirsty and have to keep coming here to draw water.”

16 He told her, “Go, call your husband and come back.”

17 “I have no husband,” she replied.

Jesus said to her, “You are right when you say you have no husband. 18 The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true.”


Was Jesus against cohabitation?
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  #42  
Old 01-12-2013, 09:29 PM
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loveboston loveboston is offline
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Default 5 Husbands and a lover

What I find interesting is in spite of the fact that this woman was by anyone's standards polyamorous Jesus did not take this opportunity to lower the boom on someone who by today's neo Paulistic, pseudo-Christian standards would be condemned.

Instead He told her that He was the Living Water that would quench her spiritual thirst.

I don't see this as an encouragement to have 5 failed marriages but I also don't see any expression of disgust or condemnation.

Something Jesus was quick to do anytime a religious hypocrite objected to His mercy.
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  #43  
Old 01-16-2013, 03:02 AM
Niteowl01 Niteowl01 is offline
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Default Are there absolutes?

Hi,
What an interesting thread, I'm glad I stumbled on it. As a believer myself, I find any open dialogue about one's faith, or lack thereof, to be useful, if it's sincere and not just a platform to vent.

For me, way before you can get to any thoughtful conclusions about the intersection of christianity and poly, you have to be clear about where you're starting. There are a lot of things that are represented as christianity, but in fact are not.

To understand what anyone says on this topic you really have to understand the foundations of their beliefs because there are so many places that understanding can diverge. Let me pose just a couple of them.

For me, the place to start, the foundation of all beliefs is whether you accept that there are absolutes or not. Is there truth that's always truth, no matter the context, time, place history, culture, etc? Or is everything relative?

IMHO, if you hold to the former - there are absolutes, then you're on the path from which christianity rises. If you hold the latter, then no matter where you go from there, you will never get to christianity.

From there, there are a whole series of questions to determine where you're heading. For example:
  • Is there a god? One and only god?
  • What is god?
  • Is the bible an accurate representation of the mind of god?
  • If there is a god, is he powerful enough to ensure we get a clear picture of him in scripture?
  • If there is one true god who is lord and creator of all, and the bible reflects his heart and mind accurately, what does he expect of me?
  • Is jesus god?
  • Is there sin? What is sin?

And at this point you still have a long long way to go to even get close to how christianity and poly fit together.

Everyone has an opinion and so far is free to express it. But to say either that God is OK with poly, or that a poly lifestyle is sin, is almost impossible to interpret unless you've taken me down that whole path.

As a few folks have rightly pointed out, anyone can pluck a half dozen verses from scripture and craft an argument for or against almost anything. If that's true, then I'd say either you have to discard the whole thing or look at scripture with an end-to-end perspective. Of course, this completely depends on your perspective of what scripture is. :>)

Let's keep the conversation going.

Nite.
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  #44  
Old 01-16-2013, 03:18 AM
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Default Jesus is God

I absolutely believe that Jesus is God.

"If you are my friends you will do what I command"

"This is my command, that you love one another".

The 2 greatest commands. Love the Lord your God with all your heart soul and mind, and the second is like it, love your neighbor as yourself.

Seems to me that how 2 people love each other is governed by this simple rule.

I wouldn't ask or accept being asked to do anything that makes my relationship with Jesus difficult.

Not that there aren't absolutes but the application of the absolute command to love each other is subjective to the 2 people in the relationship.

The Bible is men's words about their relationship with God.

Jesus is the Word of God to everyone who will listen.

Problem is the words of men, mine included often times interfere with a person's ability to listen to Jesus clearly.
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  #45  
Old 01-16-2013, 03:50 AM
Niteowl01 Niteowl01 is offline
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@loveboston,
Thanks for your thoughts on this. I certainly agree and believe that jesus is who he said he is - specifically god himself. That gives what he said some clout, don't you think? ;>)

Where we might differ is on the implications of the things he said. First and foremost are those greatest commands. When he said to love one another, feelings and relationships were the furthest thing from his mind. He was pretty clear that the love he commands is a behavior, not how you feel for someone - in the way we generally interpret the word.

And in reference to the doing what he commands, he's referring to it all. Including things like denying yourself, taking up your cross, leaving your sin behind, fearing god, fleeing immorality, serving god, obeying scripture, and all the rest you can find. Actually all of these things together are the definition of the love he commanded.

On the avoiding things that make your relationship with jesus difficult, you might have a problem with 'i've not come to bring peace but a sword', ' to set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law, and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household.'

That could make your relationship with him difficult to maintain. It certainly continues to challenge me.

We'll also have to agree to disagree on the bible being only men's words. In that case, I think you have to throw the whole thing out, including what jesus said. If you can't trust god to make sure he gets his word to you, via his servants, you're kind of stuck then, having to decide yourself what's true and what's not.

Nite
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  #46  
Old 01-17-2013, 01:06 AM
AJ1 AJ1 is offline
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For me, I always go back to these two passages:

1 Corinth. 6:12
"All things are lawful for me, but not all things are profitable. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be mastered by anything."

Matthew 7:18-20
"A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them."

Polyamory has given nothing but good fruit in our marriage. It has brought us closer, enhanced our bond and trust, and helped to shelter us from one of the leading causes of divorce (infidelity). If it began to bear bad fruit for us, we would re-think it. But as yet, we have no reason to go back.
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  #47  
Old 01-17-2013, 12:14 PM
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Default Love

I agree that being open about our interest and interaction with other people is the best defense against being unfaithful and betraying our spouse's trust.

Jesus criticized overeaters, condemned the love of money and advised us not to become caught up in the worries and cares of this world.

He emphasized our need to love, even our enemies.

Learning to love is our priority. Having a best friend who helps me learn what is seldom taught or practiced is like living with an angel.

I'm very fortunate. Sounds like you are, too.
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  #48  
Old 01-29-2013, 07:37 PM
shaeffer shaeffer is offline
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This is something I've struggled to reconcile in my life.

I'm glad to know that other people have come to some of the same conclusions. But I'm also glad to see some other perspectives that make me think.

Thanks for this thread.
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  #49  
Old 01-30-2013, 01:55 PM
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Default Love

Matthew 24:12
New International Version (NIV)
12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold,

Interesting that the evangelical movement is appalled by homosexuality but supports the most wicked, illegal use of military force in history by a government they deem to be sacred. Wolves in sheep's clothing.

I find it much harder to love my enemy who claims to be my brother than it is for me to love someone who practices a form of sexuality that doesn't appeal to me.

I've not done a very good job of loving. I continue to learn and hope to get better. I look forward to the day when we will love each other without being inhibited or controlled.

I'm happy to know there are other believers who visit this forum. I hope we all continue learn to love each other as He loves us.
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  #50  
Old 02-02-2013, 04:58 AM
Pyuvii Pyuvii is offline
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You know, while I've had some big struggles with homosexuality and Christianity, I've never once thought polygamy was a sin.

Lots of people in the Bible had multiple wives, and there wasn't anything specifically stating it~

I think what Jesus was saying in that passage was "Yeah, you aren't married, but you've been with 5 men, and you aren't married to the one you are now. I know who you are, and what you've been up to, but I want to give you life."
I personally don't believe he was condemning nor condoning polygamy.

He's focusing on the big picture, life! =D
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