Why do things have to be so complex?

[redpepper]

Originally Posted by nycindie

I guess the thing that bugs me is how often we complicate things because we're avoiding the real issues. Much easier to struggle and fret with how to say something or what choice to make, rather than to just fucking say it or choose what we want and deal with the consequences.

I agree with your whole statement and wanted to add to this part that I find that most of the time people are lazy and don't bother dealing with things in the moment. Sure, I know that sometimes we don't know how we feel or what we should do, but I have found that most of the time its because people don't know themselves, aren't able to be empathetic and therefore have an personal agenda wrapped up in the whole thing... that leads to drama.

To me one of the suggestions I have to most people is to do some hard work on getting to know yourself; hence the term "I am my own primary" was born.

[idealist]

Nycindie, Redpepper and all.....when are we going to appear on a talk show to talk about Polyamory????? I think I'm ready!!

[redpepper]

Originally Posted by idealist

Nycindie, Redpepper and all.....when are we going to appear on a talk show to talk about Polyamory????? I think I'm ready!!

No doubt! I am so ready to break out into the real world with this stuff (on line is fine, but being live and visual would be awesome) ... I do as much as I can by organizing workshops and such. I get so passionate about this stuff. It doesn't feel like enough. I'm not very confident in person talking about all this. The workshops are helping me feel more confident... maybe one day I will count you in if it comes up idealist!

[nycindie]

Originally Posted by idealist

Nycindie, Redpepper and all.....when are we going to appear on a talk show to talk about Polyamory????? I think I'm ready!!

You know, I could produce one for public access and/or the web and have you all as guests!


[lightbulb moment]

[redpepper]

Originally Posted by nycindie

You know, I could produce one for public access and/or the web and have you all as guests!


[lightbulb moment]

Oh yes please! We talked about something like that before I think.

[Pretzels]

You know, I'm probably guilty of what you two are talking about. However, people don't reach enlightenment at the same time and definitely not by the same path. And answers that anyone had for anyone else have come from experiences, some of which cannot be directly injected into someone else's biography.

Also? Maybe I haven't looked around enough yet, but these "letter" situations are confusing. I think I'm just going to declare being in an umlaut relationship and let that be that.

[nycindie]

Originally Posted by Pretzels

Maybe I haven't looked around enough yet, but these "letter" situations are confusing. I think I'm just going to declare being in an umlaut relationship and let that be that.

Hi, what do you mean? The Vees and Ns, triads and what-have-you? Have you looked at the Glossary? Might help you with all that: http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1720

[Pretzels]

Originally Posted by nycindie

Hi, what do you mean? The Vees and Ns, triads and what-have-you? Have you looked at the Glossary? Might help you with all that: http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1720

Yep, that's exactly what I was looking for. Thanks!

[tigrrrlily]

I'm not sure i followed the original point correctly. However it seems to me that problem number one is that my personal emotional responses are no less intense and possibly confusing just because everyone else in the world has been through the same thing. It's still my own personal response, even if there is not a single original thing about it. (Talking it through with others who've been through the same thing might help).

As for 'treat others the way you would like to be treated and don't settle for anything less' - again, perfect advice as long as you keep it abstract. Concretely, it assumes that you know what you want and that everyone wants the same things in the same way, or that we don't sometimes face very difficult choices where none of the options is really what we want but what we really want is not an option (for example - do i want to endure another 6 sexless months or will I take a chance on a short term opportunity with someone in a Don't Ask Don't Tell set up).

[nycindie]

Originally Posted by tigrrrlily

As for 'treat others the way you would like to be treated and don't settle for anything less' - again, perfect advice as long as you keep it abstract. Concretely, it assumes that you know what you want and that everyone wants the same things in the same way...

No, that is not what "treat others the way you want to be treated" (the golden rule) is about. It doesn't even remotely mean that everyone wants the same things nor that you should automatically know what everyone wants. Living life by the "golden rule" is a general guideline and a way to simplify things and not muck everything up with complicated questions, I think.

We've discussed this in another thread:

Originally Posted by NeonKaos

No of course it doesn't mean treating everyone exactly the same. I don't want to be treated the same BY everyone, so why would i treat everyone else exactly the same. You treat them the way you'd want to be treated in the relationship you have with that individual.

I think my IQ just dropped ten points while writing this.

Originally Posted by nycindie

...it means, if I want to feel respected and heard, and for my wishes to be considered, I respect and listen to others and consider their wishes. It doesn't mean I treat everyone the same because everyone is different but if I tune into them and listen to them, treating them the way I want to be treated, then I relate accordingly.

It is adjustable to the people I'm relating to. It doesn't necessarily have to do with specific tasks... I would consider their wishes just as I would want my wishes considered... I would communicate honestly with that person, just as I would want honest communication. THAT is treating someone the way I want to be treated.

Originally Posted by Minxxa

Act in good faith, with good intentions, honesty, respect and love, in order to receive same back.

Originally Posted by nycindie

Here is a nice little description of how the The Golden Rule works in life, written by a Humanist and relating it to empathy:

"Sometimes people argue that the Golden Rule is imperfect because it makes the assumption that everyone has the same tastes and opinions and wants to be treated the same in every situation. But the Golden Rule is a general moral principle, not a hard and fast rule to be applied to every detail of life. Treating other people as we would wish to be treated ourselves does not mean making the assumption that others feel exactly as we do about everything. The treatment we all want is recognition that we are individuals, each with our own opinions and feelings and for these opinions and feelings to be afforded respect and consideration. The Golden Rule is not an injunction to impose one’s will on someone else!

Trying to live according to the Golden Rule means trying to empathise with other people, including those who may be very different from us. Empathy is at the root of kindness, compassion, understanding and respect – qualities that we all appreciate being shown, whoever we are, whatever we think and wherever we come from. And although it isn’t possible to know what it really feels like to be a different person or live in different circumstances and have different life experiences, it isn’t difficult for most of us to imagine what would cause us suffering and to try to avoid causing suffering to others. For this reason many people find the Golden Rule’s corollary – “do not treat people in a way you would not wish to be treated yourself” – more pragmatic.

The above is from http://www.thinkhumanism.com/the-golden-rule.html