Freedom and commitment in Poly-fi relationships.

Originally Posted by MonoVCPHG

I was approaching it not so much as how you (the person seeking freedom as we are using the term here) are able to commit to all these people, but what type of dedication/commitment do you expect to get in return from each person or certain ones.

I'm not sure I'm understanding this definition of commitment. This sounds more like expectations than commitment to me.

Originally Posted by MonoVCPHG

Again it all seems to come down to what your goals are. Do you want multiple people to not only be romantically involved with but also to be an integrated part of your family, sharing chores, family functions, contributing to child care etc? Or do you simply want to have a very fluid, completely open relationship?

Putting it that way seems to negate all of the relationship possibilities that exist between both of those. There are so many ways partners can have an integrated family unit with multiple partners while still remaining open to possibilities of other people or partners.

Originally Posted by MonoVCPHG

multiple free flowing and fluid relationships is very possible, as we have seen with people at our poly meetings. These people do not seem to not have committed people with which they are building homes, raising children, planning a future or sharing the mundane responsibilities of life with. They tend to be single, young, or newly divorced from traditional marriages.

Having committed family integrated relationships are also possible as we ourselves are experiencing.

Having total "freedom" (as defined earlier in this thread) and total "commitment" (as defined earlier in this post) is not something we have seen working in person however.

I still feel like there's an artificial binary in this equation. Having freedom in your relationships to be open to additional partners doesn't have to mean that there's a revolving door of relationships. Having the freedom to have additional partners doesn't necessitate continually adding partners or not being able to form deep life building commitments in the process. And for some, not all partnerships have to be about raising a family together. That's the beauty of it, there is room for connections to exist on the level that's right for them to exist on. When they can just live in their natural levels, one connection doesn't have to take away or limit another connection.

For me, the freedom lies in who's choice it is. I've known people who have built multiple long term life building partnerships while still being open to additional partnerships. They do so knowing how to make their choices in ways that allow their other partnerships to remain balanced. They do so with intentionality and responsibility to the commitments they already have. But they still have the freedom to make those choices for themselves.

For me, being poly is about the freedom to make spaces for the people in my life, not to find people for the spaces in my life.

[MonoVCPHG]

Originally Posted by Ceoli

For me, the freedom lies in who's choice it is. I've known people who have built multiple long term life building partnerships while still being open to additional partnerships. They do so knowing how to make their choices in ways that allow their other partnerships to remain balanced. They do so with intentionality and responsibility to the commitments they already have. But they still have the freedom to make those choices for themselves.

For me, being poly is about the freedom to make spaces for the people in my life, not to find people for the spaces in my life.

I understand what you are saying, Ceoli, and respect your opinion and ideal of what you see as possible for yourself......I'm just a person who wants to see a working example, not just hear ot theorize about it. I just don't see it working around me and am fully aware that it is not for me.

I'm not poly...I've merely found something that against all odds works for me. I'm not asking anyone to change, but I am not wanting to change either. As long as people are happy and healthy I will be fullfilled. I would never say you can't do anything, I'm just saying I won't do it with you.

Originally Posted by MonoVCPHG

I'm just a person who wants to see a working example, not just hear ot theorize about it. I just don't see it working around me and am fully aware that it is not for me.

I'm not poly...I've merely found something that against all odds works for me. I'm not asking anyone to change, but I am not wanting to change either. As long as people are happy and healthy I will be fullfilled. I would never say you can't do anything, I'm just saying I won't do it with you.

Fair enough, but you also seem to be saying that models that do exist and work well for many people out there don't work because they don't fit your view of how relationships should be or because you haven't seen it. It's fine that they don't work for you, but many times (and please correct me if I'm wrong) I'm reading a subtext of value judgments on varied relationships styles.

While I'm sure you're very attractive, what you choose to do with me isn't in question.

[maca]

Originally Posted by MonoVCPHG

I know I will take a little heat for sure from a lot of people in this but in cases of definitive boundaries there should be radical honesty.

I fully expect people to question the resilience of our relationship after reading this thread. We do not live in a fairy tale world, we are very realistic. Just this weekend Redpepper and I had a serious and sad discussion about sustainability of our love as it is. I have my concerns about it; I am not so sure our different natures and social backgrounds/circles can come to terms in a long term healthy way in the "forever" sense. I do know we will be connected and always share love however.


Peace and love
Mono

Although I have only been with another woman ,while commited to one allready, once before( 3 some with LR and another woman).I can feel the love in conversing with LR about what /when/who I think I would be interested in. Hell I may discover that there just isnt anyone out there for me besides LR and I could and would be happy with just that.

Little off subject

I would dare say Mono that the only thing you are mono in is SEX cause you understand live and love what it truly means to be poly. Honesty, communication, compassion, being true to yourself, and loving others. I think your poly BI or mono BI which ever sounds better :P

[MonoVCPHG]

Originally Posted by Ceoli

I'm reading a subtext of value judgments on varied relationships styles.

While I'm sure you're very attractive, what you choose to do with me isn't in question.

No subtext intended Ceoli, seriously. I am just very aware of what I can be in and maintain sanity lol! Sorry if that came across though.

You are very funny....as long as you don't question what I choose to do with you we'll be fine

[redpepper]

I'm not sure how what we were talking about relates HMA? These women of yours are half your age! Of course Anne jokes about you having other women! She's only just started on her love path and really may be mature but not wise yet. She has a whole life time of lovers awaiting her, as does violet. You and I babes are on the down turn. We've lived some shit, become jaded, and baggage ladden. With that is a richness that someone who is 21 doesn't have. A richness that I personally find far more attractive in women my age than young women. In men too for that matter.

I am happy for you that you are having some good times and have some young lovin, but I wonder what kind of future that will have when you are 60 and they 40? I know what its like to be 40 (well almost), I don't want no wrinkly ass old guy. Ewww!

Yup I would be fearful about anyone at 2 monthes joking about other women for you to play with. It just doesn't hark of the comittment this thread talks about. The freedom part, yes! Perhaps she is hoping for a little extra herself. And why not! At her age, what you three have was what I called dating, not poly.

As a general question to the world... Why has that changed??!!! Please tell me you young ones who read. Why bog oneself down with those terms when you are supposed to be fucking everyone! Falling in love at the drop of a hat and getting your heart broken just as much.

HMA, thanks for giving me the inspiration for another thread starter! You rock! Sorry I rocked your boat again but I ain't no Ceoli. Lovely as you are Ceoli. I just can't get my words out as nicely as you apparently. I seem to be closer to the ygirl end.

[MonoVCPHG]

Originally Posted by maca

Little off subject

I would dare say Mono that the only thing you are mono in is SEX cause you understand live and love what it truly means to be poly. :P

It merely means I only love one person romantically including sexual expression at a time. All the other stuff is not poly specific.

In summary - I am comfortable living and loving the current poly "fI" dynamic I have and can handle the inclusion of other women. I will not be able to commit the same way to a more open form of poly. I have dedicated my love and family support to Redpepper but I would never pursue another poly relationship as a mono person and I do not recommend them to others for the health of both the mono and the poly person.

[MonoVCPHG]

ummmm...my last post..a little emotionally charged...sorry for that.

[redpepper]

Originally Posted by Ceoli

For me, being poly is about the freedom to make spaces for the people in my life, not to find people for the spaces in my life.

I totally agree Ceoli, well put... my spaces are filled quite nicely thank you very much. Because I made them first, tried some people on and found who I needed...

[HappiestManAlive]

It relates because age aside, you are having concerns about your poly nature and it's "limits" as they apply to your existing relationship(s), and so am I. :shrug:

As for the age thing - I'm realistic about it. Both girls insist that they are going to be around for the long haul; Violet has had almost a year to convince me, Anne only a couple of months to make up her mind. I absolutely get it that they have their 20's ahead of them - how would it be again, lol - in fact, there have been many conversations about me feeling that by participating in this relationship I am "robbing them of this time in their lives". Both of them are auite pointedly stating that plenty of girls marry very successfully at their age, and that if they meet that guy and he's a few years older, so be it. And for the record, the age gap is ~13 years, not 20, so when they're 40 I'll be a respectable 53 give or take. Not TOO bad, lol.

In any event, i am grateful for the time we are having, one day at a time. Every morning I wake up amazed that Violet is next to me. When we meet up with Anne, I am speechless looking at the two of them sitting next to each other smiling and saying they love me. If and when one or both of them "outgrow" it, I will have had this time and will be gratefull for it. Until then, I choose to let them make their own decisions so long as they aren't destructive, and right now they both continually choose to stay with this, and are in fact quite annoyed that I question them about it!