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  #11  
Old 04-04-2011, 11:21 AM
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TL4everu2 TL4everu2 is offline
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Oh trust me RP, I know that the attitude of women who just have to open their legs and let the cocks in, is not the best. I know it is "sad"....However, it is TRUE.

The reality? It is this: A guy who treats women with little respect, will attract more women to him. A guy who is "the nice guy", will attract women to him who think he's gay.

It's a catch 22.

I have effectivly given up on "chasing" women. I can't dance, so I can't meet women at dance clubs. I am more introverted, so I have a hard time meeting them and "getting the digits". I can flirt no problem.....but to get past that point, is difficult for me. Meah....It's no wonder that I'm a 95% match to my wife...She talks to almost anyone about almost anything, and could EASILY get a phone number.


I would also like to mention that I have NEVER had a beer belly. I am a martial artist, so I take good care of my body. I rarely drink at all, and never smoke. I am well groomed also. And I STILL have a hard time attracting women. Most people who see me, think I'm gay. Why? Because I'm tall, and blond with blue eyes. Or so I'm told. It's not like I sache down the sidewalk or anything. I don't have a gay bone in my body. But for some odd reason a lot of ppl think I'm gay. Ask my wife. It's odd.....And maybe it's just because I'm so open minded and so open to change.
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Last edited by TL4everu2; 04-04-2011 at 11:31 AM.
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  #12  
Old 04-04-2011, 12:49 PM
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BlackUnicorn BlackUnicorn is offline
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This is veering towards general 'poly and dating' conversation, but even risking it, I have to say that I have found it hard to attract partners of either sex until very lately. I put my recent semi-success down to general increased confidence and life-happiness, and the accumulated effect of having a larger social circle. I venture a guess that before, I might have been slow to pick up cues even if someone did show interest, because in general I thought it very unlikely that anyone would be interested.

The checklist for men who are not getting laid was a humorous one made by a neighbor of mine, but I think it's made a lot less funny by the fact that TL4's post echoes the very same resentment that makes some men in the dating scene so unattractive, no matter how superficially attractive they might be on the outside.

The 'open your legs and welcome' is as untrue as saying that all men are just after sex. There are plenty of men out there who do not like sexually forward, confident women at all.
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Old 04-04-2011, 03:44 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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Before reading BlackUnicorn's last post, I was just about to mention confidence.

I believe in both sexes, confidence makes you more attractive, lack of confidence will push partners away. People mistake it for "jerk vs nice guy" because jerks tend to be confident, and nice guys might be shy. But take a confident nice guy and a jerk with no self-confidence, and the nice guy is the one getting the ladies.

The problem is compounded when the nice guy becomes bitter. Then not only does he have no self-confidence, but everything in him screams "I resent you" to women. Not attractive at all.

Then there is a line where it's too much confidence, and that's when the person is just way too forward. It's a tricky balance, I guess, and I see how it can be easier to achieve when you don't care about the other person (no reason to be nervous about it not working, and therefore more confidence), making people who don't care (jerks) seem to have the upper hand... but in the end, it's really about confidence. You want to trust your partner. You want them to be independent. You don't want to have to constantly reassure them that things are okay. That's the way it usually works for both sexes.

Then you have people who prey on people with the lack of confidence/self-esteem. And it's annoying to see men go "women are so lucky, people take advantage of them. I wish women took advantage of ME!". I doubt you actually do. It's more damaging for your self-esteem than being rejected, I can assure you.
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Old 04-05-2011, 03:19 PM
fenix fenix is offline
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This is esarati's wife. Figured it was time to jump in and bring it back to the question he actually had.

The problem isn't that he's having trouble finding another partner of his own. It's simply that he feels left out. I am aware of this, and I'm doing everything I can think of to minimize that feeling, but we're both very new to this sort of thing. I made a point to have them meet each other, I keep him as informed as he's comfortable with, I make suggestions for him on how to fill his time while I'm away, and we've talked countless times about the situation, how he feels about it, and what I can do to help him adjust. I'm actually the one that directed him here, in the hopes that you would say exactly what you did, that being fair and being equal are two very different things.

I talked with him at great lengths before I began to pursue this, and truthfully I never would have allowed anything to develop between the other man and I had my husband not given his okay. Once he realized that it wasn't just a one night fling, though, he backtracked, telling me it wasn't fair for me to leave him alone to spend time with this man, even as minimally as I am (I've only seen him once a week since this started). I told esarati I was okay with him trying to find another partner too, but he just tells me I would be too jealous if he did. I admit I do feel a little jealous when he spends time away from me, but not once have I let that stop him from doing so. I encourage it. I think it's healthy to have lives outside of each other, friends and interests and activities that aren't always shared between us. He thinks these are just justifications to get what I want.

Is there anything I'm not doing, or missteps I'm making here that I can correct? I really don't want this to distance him from me.
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  #15  
Old 04-05-2011, 03:43 PM
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JameeDee JameeDee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esarati300 View Post
am i going crazy? any help would be nice.
Hi esarati,
I don't have much to add except, I'm dealing with the same jealousy issues. My situation is a little different, but that ugly green monster does have the power to make anyone feel crazy!

Work thru it, keep posting here, these guys are great!

Best of luck. Maybe we can chat about it?
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  #16  
Old 04-05-2011, 03:58 PM
Ariakas Ariakas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix View Post
This is esarati's wife. Figured it was time to jump in and bring it back to the question he actually had.

The problem isn't that he's having trouble finding another partner of his own. It's simply that he feels left out. I am aware of this, and I'm doing everything I can think of to minimize that feeling, but we're both very new to this sort of thing. I made a point to have them meet each other, I keep him as informed as he's comfortable with, I make suggestions for him on how to fill his time while I'm away, and we've talked countless times about the situation, how he feels about it, and what I can do to help him adjust. I'm actually the one that directed him here, in the hopes that you would say exactly what you did, that being fair and being equal are two very different things.

I talked with him at great lengths before I began to pursue this, and truthfully I never would have allowed anything to develop between the other man and I had my husband not given his okay. Once he realized that it wasn't just a one night fling, though, he backtracked, telling me it wasn't fair for me to leave him alone to spend time with this man, even as minimally as I am (I've only seen him once a week since this started). I told esarati I was okay with him trying to find another partner too, but he just tells me I would be too jealous if he did. I admit I do feel a little jealous when he spends time away from me, but not once have I let that stop him from doing so. I encourage it. I think it's healthy to have lives outside of each other, friends and interests and activities that aren't always shared between us. He thinks these are just justifications to get what I want.

Is there anything I'm not doing, or missteps I'm making here that I can correct? I really don't want this to distance him from me.
I think this is one of those times where fairness can't be measured. Honestly, it just isn't possible. As with most things involved people, nothing is really created equally.

Fairness runs headlong into reality. So what do you do, slow down to hopefully, let him catch up? Or force him to pull up his pants and deal with the reality of the situation. Then look at all the posts about dating and maybe try alternatives?

He could well be "ok" with everything as long as there is a perceived eveness. Could you do something to help this? You date someone else, and then date hubby? 1v1 is common enough in non-monogamy.

If the only fairness is going to be equal partnering... then he may need to adjust his perception. Or you can try dating another couple... lots of options, but most of them will end up with your slowing down. Will that leave you resentful? Hurt? Hindered?...You both have some decisions and thoughts to process through. And these are ones we all go through.

Early in my polyamory,my wife and I discussed ending unicorn hunting. There was a distinct point when I consciously decided that I couldn't play the 1v1 game. I knew I could never keep up if she really "tried". She has an energy that attracts people. If we did this, her date card had a huge potential to always be full.. where my date card would be slower and harder to achieve (just like monogamy to be honest)...

Good luck with whatever direction you decide to walk.

btw I commonly say this isn't a poly problem. This is a dating problem. Welcome to the reality of being available.
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  #17  
Old 04-06-2011, 08:41 AM
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BlackUnicorn BlackUnicorn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix View Post
This is esarati's wife. Figured it was time to jump in and bring it back to the question he actually had.
Welcome, and sorry - I was the primus motor behind hijacking this thread.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix View Post
Once he realized that it wasn't just a one night fling, though, he backtracked, telling me it wasn't fair for me to leave him alone to spend time with this man, even as minimally as I am (I've only seen him once a week since this started). I told esarati I was okay with him trying to find another partner too, but he just tells me I would be too jealous if he did. I admit I do feel a little jealous when he spends time away from me, but not once have I let that stop him from doing so. I encourage it. I think it's healthy to have lives outside of each other, friends and interests and activities that aren't always shared between us. He thinks these are just justifications to get what I want.
Redpepper (and others, too!) has some really good points on poly being different from other forms of non-monogamy because it doesn't really encourage coupledness. There are of course a lot of people who don't identify with this, but let's say poly introduces definite obstacles to the couple mentality which aren't so much of a factor in swinging, for example.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix View Post
Is there anything I'm not doing, or missteps I'm making here that I can correct? I really don't want this to distance him from me.
Date nights? I really don't have much to add to what Ariakas already said. You might have to slow the down the progress of relationship number 2 to avoid distancing esarati. On the other hand, splitting all dates evenly isn't going to be a really workable solution at all times. Some distance will probably occur by the virtue of your whole relationship transitioning from the coupledness to... openness?
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  #18  
Old 04-07-2011, 10:49 AM
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Penny Penny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TL4everu2 View Post
Spoken like a true woman. The harsh reality is this: A woman has but to open her legs and say "anyone wanna do it?" And she will have men begging to get into her good graces.
Uh... bitter much? I mean, sure there's some truth to this, if the woman in question wants to be used and dehumanized. Aren't we talking about poly here?

Quote:
Men, however, have a much more difficult time. (unless they are a greek god and hung like a horse. 50% aint bad I guess. Which 50% is for everyone on here to think about. LMAO! J/K) A man has to be witty, and cautious when looking for a woman to romance. Not to mention he has to think fast on his feet. None of these things are required by women. All she has to do is be willing to jump in the sack and she will have a man.
Again, your points have some validity, but your tone is pissing me off. Yeah, if I wanted to fuck, I could step outside, ask around, and get fucked pretty fast.

I only like men who like me for my personality, so I have to be witty and intelligent and charming and all that crap. And cautious? Are you kidding?

I am having a hard time not resorting to name-calling here, your attitude pisses me off so much. But I like it here, and I don't want the mods chastising me.

Quote:
Now, for a relationship of more substance, yes...it is a LITTLE more difficult. But not much. Usually, all it takes for a woman to find a man, is the willingness to be open to a relationship.
Seriously?

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  #19  
Old 04-07-2011, 11:10 AM
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Penny Penny is offline
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I didn't read onto the next page, and the second post makes me a little less pissed off.

Also, my husband harbors the same sort of bitterness for similar reasons. It's just, if he put it like that to me, I'd call him an asshole.

And then he'd laugh because we've been together for 11 years, and he's cool with me calling him an asshole.

I'd like to point out that men have a lot of reason to be bitter. So do women.

It sucks.
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  #20  
Old 04-07-2011, 11:14 AM
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TL4everu2 TL4everu2 is offline
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Penny,
I'm not "bitter", but women constantly claim it's just as "hard" for them to find a man, as it is for a man to find a woman. This simply is NOT TRUE.

Don't believe it? Try this experiment:

Post TWO identical ads in any classified, anywhere. One for a male, and one for a female. See which one gets more responses....or, to be more specific, more CLICKS even.

My wife's ad on OKC, gets four or five guys per DAY clicking on her profile. Mine, has gotten 2 in the past week.....and one of them is a woman I already know in person. My profile has been gone over and re-done by a woman with ZERO improvement on results.

So, please, show me where I'm wrong?

As for men and women being "cautious", they have to be cautious in different aspects. A man has to be cautious so as to not ruin his chances of going out on said date. A woman has to be cautious in the aspect of whether or not the guy is a creep and will he try to make a move on her when they are alone. Two totally different things here, so don't try to compare the two.

And on the last comment, YES, I am serious. Prove me wrong. There are certain extreemes which are deal breakers for some. Example: If the woman is severely disfigured, or obese, this may cause some problems in finding a man. If the woman is a drug user, or alcoholic, this may cause some problems.



Last night, my wife and I discussed this problem together. She said I was full of crap. So, I asked her what she did when a guy looks at her profile. She said 90% of the time, she ignores it unless he messages her. I asked her what about the other 10% of the time, and WHY she ignored it that 90%? Her response? She looked at the thumbnail pic. If he looks good in that pic, then she would check out his profile. So....I have deduced, that I am simply not attractive enough for women to be looking at my profile. I will need to go to the plastic surgeon immediatly to remedy this situation! LMAO! (Notice the sarcasm here???)

Anyway, prove to me how much easier men have it when it comes to dating than women. Post up some of your trials and tribulations.

My annalysis? The obvious is, and always has been, true. Men are more visual than women, while women are more substance driven. At the same time, women want a guy who is still easy on the eyes. (It also doesn't hurt if he's got lots of money LOL *note* More sarcasm)
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