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  #41  
Old 04-20-2011, 12:07 AM
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Lightbulb We are the strange...

We are The Strange Children of Change.. the Wild, Beautiful Freaks that half frighten, half excite. . It falls on us to lead the way across these waves of radical change, calling back the way forward.

We come from all the cultures across the world and all ages. From many subcultures too; from SF Fandom, Science, Goth, Steampunk, Otherkin, Cyberpunk, Biopunk, Biohackers, etc...

Radical Inclusiveness & Revolutionary Optimism are the Tools of our Trade.

We are friends to all. But remember, good friends call you on your bullshit and help you grow. They encourage you to realize your full potential and be a better (post)human.

Those within the Hierarchy see everything with binary vision: us/them, friend/foe, good/bad.. immediately judging for Fitness within itís internal categories of Correctness.

We natives of the Network see with multiplicitous eyes. Not judging, but listening.. finding all the common ways we connect, sharing our stories, offering advice, hard won wisdom and invitations to explore new things based on our own past experience and knowledge.

The only thing we donít tolerate is intolerance.

The answer isnít to appear ďmore palatable to the mainstreamĒ (the defense with which they mark such decrees), itís to shatter the whole fiction of a Mainstream to begin with!

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  #42  
Old 04-21-2011, 10:34 PM
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Default Update

Still drifting, wanting "M", slowly becoming attached to Heathers new girlfriend "E", shes very nice & sweet to us, but I still don't know...

I've come to the conclusion that when I attach to people, I really do attach for life.

Flirted with several girls while were looking for our unicorn, I've noticed even out of practice, there are already several girls I could probably sleep with, but I don't think any of them could live the triad lifestyle... And I don't want to just sleep with random people, because I probably would attach to them.

Part of the problem could be I'm not really sure what I want anymore, but it gets easier each day...

Maybe when "E" gets here it will become clear...
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  #43  
Old 04-21-2011, 11:17 PM
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When I find myself in times of trouble, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
And in my hour of darkness she is standing right in front of me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.

Let it be, let it be, let it be, let it be.
Whisper words of wisdom, let it be.

And when the broken hearted people living in the world agree,
there will be an answer, let it be.
For though they may be parted there is still a chance that they will see,
there will be an answer. let it be.

Let it be, let it be, .....

And when the night is cloudy, there is still a light, that shines on me,
shine until tomorrow, let it be.
I wake up to the sound of music, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.

Let it be, let it be, .....
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  #44  
Old 04-27-2011, 11:42 AM
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Default Update

Things move along, the universe changes shape each day, some things unexpected, & some not.

I guess I'll post an update...

Life has been odd recently.

My oldest daughter (who is far too much like me) had some hard questions for me, asking about "M" & "E" by name.
Heather had talked to her about everything in the past, but she had never come to me with questions before, she in fact seemed like she did Not want to discuss it. We have never sugar coated anything & always told it to her like it was, so I told her honest answers to everything she asked. I told her because she was young there are going to be some things you just can't understand yet. Her main concern seemed to be that Heather & I were stable, I told her that we couldn't do this if we were not.
She asked if/when we planned to tell our younger kids, I told her we did not plan to unless something got real serious, as far as they would know it would be the same as several other close family friends we have.
She even asked if we can do more family oriented things with "the new one". M was always kinda uncomfortable around the kids, we did family things, but M never wanted to get too close I think.
She asked what if she had her own kids already, I told her we would jump off that bridge if we got to it. She also said we are weird lol.
I was rather proud of her, always telling her the truth has jaded her, but it's made her smart & open minded, as well & given her my gift to see things unseen. (sorry ego trip there)

In other news...

"M" randomly asked to come over & play games (Xbox) with us, something she use to do with us. I was surprised & still can not understand why. I called Heather & asked if she could handle it, she said yes so she came over. It felt good to have her over, friendly, kinda warm & fuzzy. But I could see how hurt Heather was & I knew she wanted her back too. It didn't last long, it was nice, but I could tell it was a hard visit for Heather, M tried to reach out to her a little, but Heather kept her a fair distance away.


Then "E" came to visit a day or two later.. It didn't happen the way I expected AT ALL.
I made a couple of discoveries about myself...
1. I am shallow - I knew I would not be attracted to her. I mean she is cute, but, yea...
2. I am a slut - I could attach to almost any woman, just that easily. she would just have to say a few of those right things & pet me & I'd prolly cave in.
3. . 1 & 2 could easily make me a bad person.

She drove a long way to get here so she was tired, we really expected her to end up on the couch, but she ended up in bed between us, I was ok to let her sleep there, cuz we didn't plan to do anything on the first night at all, but I looked over at Heather & knew then she wan not gonna fit. I knew Heather was just thinking about M & trying not to cry. There was a bit more to it, but I'm not gonna post anything about that, because its not mine to say...
I had told Heather before she got here I thought she was gonna want more than we wanted to give on the first night, but she was sure that wasn't the case...
Heather talked to her the next day & told her what she told me in not so many words "she was not the one" but I already knew that. Not that she's not cool, caring & nice, she can be an awesome friend, but that's prolly all.

Heather says I lead people on...
And I can see that, I flirt by nature, it's always been a fun thing to do, but more than that it's become part of my normal routine, the cute things I say & do are just normal to say to Heather. Just like after spanking Heathers booty (lol) every time she bends over, when someone bends over at work or something, the instinct is to slap the booty lol.
But all of that could prolly fall under #2 up there... I'm a slut.

But anyway... So the next day a friend returned to work after being away a while, So I took her out to dinner after work, you know, just a welcome back kinda thing, (not that I didn't think about her in that way, but there are too many reasons to not even attempt it with her, so we will not even assign her a letter) & the next day at work everyone knows about it, M asked about it, C asked about it (the girl we took out for a drink after M left) & a lady that's not even my friend asked about it, after asking for a hug! All of a sudden everyone cares what I did last night & who I was with, wtf? It was kinda creepy.
on a side note C has turned out to be a good friend, she actually asks us to do stuff instead of us asking her, that's kinda neat...(So even though we assigned her no letter in the previous post we will assign her C now)

Then M asks to come over again tonight, it was a much easier visit, for everyone, but I was again surprised she asked to come over. We played some pinball, & wasted some time. Obviously a friends kinda thing, but that's what we wanted, we wanted to still be friends if it ever ended.

Then Heather & I enjoyed the rest of the night, ate, played games & now I'm sitting here at 6 am wondering why I'm not asleep, while Heather is behind me trying to not wake up lol

Thinking about asking C out to dinner with us tonight, depends on the shape of the universe tonight...

& That's all that happened in the last week or so I think... I feel like were slowly working our way through the alphabet here

I can't believe I just confessed to half of that...
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Last edited by magikman79; 04-27-2011 at 12:19 PM.
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  #45  
Old 04-27-2011, 02:12 PM
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Default My turn My turn! lol

Well seeing as I was forced against my will to leave the comfort of my cozy blankets this morning... lol... here is MY update, kinda playing off Kris's update a bit.


Let's see. I will start with "M"'s first visit to see me in for flipping ever.

When I walked in from work that night she was there. They had both asked me if it was ok, and expecting a "Friend visit" I was ok with it. When I walked into the room they were laying right next to each other. Shoulders and sides touching... almost like it used to be, playing xbox, but so so close.. That was all I saw, and my defenses broke. All I could think was " So this is going to happen right in front of my face now, huh?" I was hurt right off the bat and it affected the rest of the visit. They were all over each other all night and that was hard to see.
I walked around the corner and sat on the edge of the bed and she gave me the BIGGEST tightest hug and told me she was sorry and that she missed me. I fought the urge to hope hard. Just seeing her makes it hard, but all of this was pushing me over the edge. I am afraid my attempt at my own self control and self defense got in the way and I probably came off as cold. As we started playing xbox she reached over and wrapped her arm in mine and laid her head on my arm, and I froze. I could NOT allow myself to become weak while she was here. She runs when I am weak, and now I am fighting with the hurt (fading as it was,) from when I walked in and exhaustion from work and trying to fight hope. I was on the brink of breaking, but I would not allow her to see that. If I ever wanted to see her again I had to maintain control.
Anyway after she left I could relax a little bit. I sent her a txt saying it was so nice to see her again, and that led to other msges in which I told her I miss her too. Everyday. And that is when I lost my control on hope.

So the next day I found myself thinking and wondering about nothing else.

She says she misses me. Does she want to come back? Why else would she cuddle with me?

At this point "E" is leaving for her VERY long trip to come see us, and that posed new questions.

What do I do about "E" now if "M" wants to come back? It's too late now to turn her away.

I talked to Kris that night a little and he said that she is not coming back, so I figured I need to give "E" a chance. She was, after all super sweet and knew the right things to say to make me smile. Perhaps she could fill "M"'s position in my life ok.

Well "E" showed up. And I did find myself excited that a friend was here.
And at first things were as I would have thought.
We smiled and laughed and went our to eat with the kids and it was alot of fun.
Once we got home, I put the kids in bed (only after our teen brushed my hair in front of "E" and said, " You must look pretty for your date, mom. You are a mess"-- you better believe "E" picked right up on that")

I had to run out briefly and when I came back I was shocked to see Kris and "E" cuddling a bit. It did not bother me AT ALL. After all it is not the sharing him that I get jealous of, it's sharing the girl in "M"'s case, and the lack of time shared and a bond that they had together.
Well she pulled me into the bed and that's when it got all weird. It did not feel right. I had really just met this girl maybe 2 hours ago, and I had even told her many times before that I would not be comfortable with sex the first visit. I am NOT capable of sleeping with a stranger. (count out prostitution as a job option for me, I guess) And THIS was NOT the person I had been talking with for so many weeks. The purpose of her trip was to visit. Get to know each other. IF it just kinda happened in a heat of passion thing that would have been different, but she just jumped right into it and it was a turn off to me.
I did not feel safe. I was uncomfortable and everything felt wrong. I did not want to be left alone with her, but was for a long portion of the night while I pretended to sleep in her arms and tried not to notice when she would feel me up thinking I was unconscious while Kris was in the living room playing games.

And I dreamed of "M" all night.

"E" left the next day, as planned to go a few hours away to see her friend living near by. She and I did talk. I told her I did not expect to be so cautious, and that I was sorry. That was probably the only truth voiced by me that day.

Yesterday I told "E" I am not as ready as I thought I would be. I could not bring myself to tell her she was not what I was expecting. She is not the one.

And before our "M" requested to come over again I had come to a few conclusions about myself.

For one thing... I wondered if this is what "M" must feel like towards me, and I understand her much better after my encounter with "E". You can not force love to happen, no matter how much you want it to, and how hard you try.

2... I realized that what I liked most when I was with "M" was that it was new for us both. I had never had a girlfriend before her. "E" is much more experienced and while that is a good thing... it wasn't the same, and I wonder IF I can really call myself Bi at all,
bringing me to 3...
"E" always talked about being physically attracted to girls. While I am to a certain extent, it is WHO THEY ARE, not boob size, ect that I see. So I guess Bi is not the right category for me, either. THERE IS A LIFE TO BE HAD OUTSIDE OF SEX and I hate it when that is the only thing people think about.

and 4... That I love Kris, and I LOVE "M" and that I can not easily just replace her. Things have always just fallen into place for me. I have never had to go looking for it. How do you "LOOK" for love when it it should be a spontaneous thing? Love just happens. Most of the time when you do not expect for it to. There has to be trust and trust only comes after you KNOW someone. I did not love "M" at first by any stretch of the imagination. But it grew into that rather out of my own control. You are not going to LOVE everyone you meet.

So now I am stuck and confused, and I just want to beg "M" to come home.
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  #46  
Old 04-27-2011, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
My oldest daughter (who is far too much like me) had some hard questions for me, asking about "M" & "E" by name.
Heather had talked to her about everything in the past, but she had never come to me with questions before, she in fact seemed like she did Not want to discuss it. We have never sugar coated anything & always told it to her like it was, so I told her honest answers to everything she asked. I told her because she was young there are going to be some things you just can't understand yet. Her main concern seemed to be that Heather & I were stable, I told her that we couldn't do this if we were not.
She asked if/when we planned to tell our younger kids, I told her we did not plan to unless something got real serious, as far as they would know it would be the same as several other close family friends we have.
She even asked if we can do more family oriented things with "the new one". M was always kinda uncomfortable around the kids, we did family things, but M never wanted to get too close I think.
She asked what if she had her own kids already, I told her we would jump off that bridge if we got to it. She also said we are weird lol.
I was rather proud of her, always telling her the truth has jaded her, but it's made her smart & open minded, as well & given her my gift to see things unseen. (sorry ego trip there)
Our 15 yr old did ask me after the first visit with "M" with almost a sad hope in her eye if things were back to "Normal" with "M". I told her I was not sure, but that I honestly hope they will be again one day. She got up and she hugged me and said " I know, mom." "M" became part of our family and despite her best intentions it appeared that our oldest misses "M" as well. That child has been such a source of strength for me from day one.

Also.. The younger 2 DO know, they just do not care. They ask or make comments and I tell them. (as much as an 11 and 8 yr old need to know anyway.)
But our son is VERY much like his older sister. He sees the unseen as well. He will make comments that blow my mind on this subject all the time. Both of them are well beyond their yrs. We spawn geniuses.
As for the little one.. She just sees it all as normal, I guess. She has no questions on the matter ever. And I KNOW she misses "M"


Quote:
"M" randomly asked to come over & play games (Xbox) with us, something she use to do with us. I was surprised & still can not understand why. I called Heather & asked if she could handle it, she said yes so she came over. It felt good to have her over, friendly, kinda warm & fuzzy. But I could see how hurt Heather was & I knew she wanted her back too. It didn't last long, it was nice, but I could tell it was a hard visit for Heather, M tried to reach out to her a little, but Heather kept her a fair distance away.
Self defense and self control were VERY hard to maintain.


Quote:
She drove a long way to get here so she was tired, we really expected her to end up on the couch, but she ended up in bed between us, I was ok to let her sleep there, cuz we didn't plan to do anything on the first night at all, but I looked over at Heather & knew then she wan not gonna fit. I knew Heather was just thinking about M & trying not to cry.
"E" said yesterday that she has this scene she keeps replaying in her head from our visit. While she and I were alone in the room and I was trying very hard to go to sleep she says I stirred a bit, whimpered and shook like I had been crying in my sleep. She says she pulled me tight and kissed my forehead.. Ya.. Um that wasn't all, but I was not completely asleep. I had just woke up from a dream that i was in "M"'s arms and I HAD started crying. It was just so wrong. Everything just felt so so wrong.

Quote:
Heather says I lead people on...
And I can see that, I flirt by nature, it's always been a fun thing to do, but more than that it's become part of my normal routine, the cute things I say & do are just normal to say to Heather.
I flirt too, but always in play and no one really takes me serious, and everyone knows about you and that I would never leave you and even know I would never be capable of cheating on you.. When you flirt I think some girls.. knowing how girls think.. they take it serious, and I am not so sure some of these girls know that you have a wife or that you have no intention of cheating on me, or leaving me. I like "C"'s advice... present ourselves as a united front at all times. Meet and talk to people together, and never hide intentions of staying together.

But I do enjoy the daily routine of the adorable things that are normal for us.

Quote:
the next day at work everyone knows about it, M asked about it, C asked about it (the girl we took out for a drink after M left) & a lady that's not even my friend asked about it, after asking for a hug! All of a sudden everyone cares what I did last night & who I was with, wtf? It was kinda creepy.
Your life has become like a soap opera. You better believe everyone is watching you.. and I find it sad the confused looks I get when I walk into your job. I can feel the "poor girl.. She probably doesn't even know she is being cheated on" because that is what they think, not knowing. I must say the jaw dropping I witnessed when I went in with "M" was kinda fun, though. Oh to have had the ability to read minds THAT day!!

Quote:
on a side note C has turned out to be a good friend, she actually asks us to do stuff instead of us asking her, that's kinda neat...(So even though we assigned her no letter in the previous post we will assign her C now)
I like "C". She understands everything very well.
Quote:
Then M asks to come over again tonight, it was a much easier visit, for everyone, but I was again surprised she asked to come over. We played some pinball, & wasted some time. Obviously a friends kinda thing, but that's what we wanted, we wanted to still be friends if it ever ended.
It is much easier understanding things from her perspective that I gained during "E"'s visit.

Quote:
Then Heather & I enjoyed the rest of the night, ate, played games & now I'm sitting here at 6 am wondering why I'm not asleep, while Heather is behind me trying to not wake up lol
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  #47  
Old 04-29-2011, 05:31 PM
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Hmm.. What do you know? THAT did the trick. That whole can't move on problem has been very well taken care of. All feeling is long gone now. Love, Trust, Respect... Gone.
DONE.
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Old 05-01-2011, 08:45 PM
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Sorry to hear. If at some point you want to elaborate on that, feel free to vent as much as you can.
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Old 05-01-2011, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by BlackUnicorn View Post
Sorry to hear. If at some point you want to elaborate on that, feel free to vent as much as you can.
I kissed M goodnight without telling Heather
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Old 05-01-2011, 08:56 PM
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I think you guys need to go out, take a walk, hold hands, get some fresh air, and forget about poly and relationships and trying to figure things out for a while. Just enjoy each other and renew. You both seem to tend toward analysis and going over every little detail to determine what to do, how you feel, how to be, what went wrong, what this one meant when they said that, what that meant when they said this, and so on. Nothing wrong with analyzing per se -- but I have a sense you could both use a break! A kind, gentle, loving break.
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An excellent blog post against hierarchy in polyamory: http://solopoly.net/2014/10/31/why-i...short-version/

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