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  #81  
Old 02-17-2011, 10:08 PM
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Someone told me today that its possible to edit out peoples status updates. I didn't know that! Could be handy no?
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  #82  
Old 02-18-2011, 02:16 AM
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the significance of the picture changing? and the use of msn? T is very similar to you NYCyndie - very very selective and careful about what he does in such a public forum... everything he does on facebook or MSN has a purpose or reason behind it - even if he is unsure exactly what that is.

Also - this is a ldr for us all WW & T live in the same city in Canada - I live in Australia... facebook/msn/email/skype are how we communicate - T and I did not use skype.

he blocked me from his msn... and now suddenly I can see him sign in and out again - especially as the ONLY reason he even has MSN was me - I was his only contact on there - not even WW was on his MSN.

The picture changing - is tantamount to him standing in a public room shouting I am over here look at what I am saying... again he specifically said to me that he would be leaving facebook (he had previously been discussing that he was uncomfortable with the medium and would be deleting his account - this was prior to any of the relationship issues came into play) and giving us back that space... My job requires me to use facebook daily, as I run the facebook page for the website I admin and also run the facebook page for a hotel... he knows that whether I look for him or not he will be visible to me.

more importantly - WW agrees with this view of what T is doing. T would not ever say he is going to do something and then NOT do it... he feels this shows the immense personal struggle T is having by trying to stay away from us...

@RP I can't see his status updates as he removed us from his friends lists...

The significance is also that he DID delete me from MSN... he also deleted his fb account... then suddenly after I am in a lifethreatening situation (global news so he would have heard) his picture pops back into facebook... then a week or so later his picture changes and suddenly I can see him in MSN again... it is significant... the why is what I'm venting about... I have no way of knowing, and I was in an ok place...

I am still in a mostly ok place... but I don't like that this has stirred up WW, or brought the poly question back into the forefront of our thoughts... I want what I want and I can't change that... I guess what I am looking for here right now - is some empathy that this is all still so unsure.

and how to help WW deal with the uncertainty...
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Last edited by FlameKat; 02-18-2011 at 02:23 AM. Reason: more info
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  #83  
Old 02-18-2011, 04:14 AM
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good for you asking us for what you need; empathy. I can see how this would be very difficult and hurtful. Games, all games. I suppose you could ask him if he wants to talk. Maybe he just doesn't know how to approach you again. Or you could decide to roll your eyes, smile a little and ignore him until you have solid proof he is trying to send a message.

As for supporting WW through the uncertainty? I think it might be best to take a breath and let it go. You really don't have any choice and why waste energy on guessing?
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  #84  
Old 02-18-2011, 05:05 AM
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I agree with RP, just roll your eyes, smile and let it go. Changing pictures and turning on and off fb/msn accounts is a lousy way to communicate. Like I tell my kids, "Don't grunt and point and expect me to know what you were trying to tell me much less expect me to respond to it."

Look at it this way, if he is changing his pictures, he is more than likely alive and well.
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  #85  
Old 02-27-2011, 08:26 AM
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Default Venting/Ranting/Letting the crazy talk out of my head :P

wishing that this side of me was something i could set aside... wishing that the repressing of it didn't hurt just as much as repressing how i feel for T...

all the while hoping/knowing that there will be something that gives at some point in the future... just wish i knew when (and whether it will be my sanity that goes first :P)

still WW is right - there hasn't been a single month since this has been brought up that something hasn't happened...

Valentines day T popped back into fb and changed his pics, this week he opened it up so i can see his wall (with everything deleted except for a comment he had left on my status the year before... "receptive" ) - and yes i can see the dates on his damn pics now... stupid me for being curious about the change, he deleted a huge number of prof pics he had used over the last few months and now there are only four - all of which are significant... one was mentioned in my letter, one reminds me of a comment he made about how he would love someone in my situation from afar, before everything blew up. the other two were both put up on Valentines day, one is a lonely/thoughtful character... and the other is a close up of himself...

if i could just let go then i bloody would... i hate hurting WW, and I hate feeling like this... whatever this feeling is... the thing is though... WW and I aren't talking about it anymore... he is so right about him not getting to have a break from thinking about it.... but at the same time if I notice something and it bothers me - he wants me to talk to him about it... I can't bloody win... he seems to be using the lack of settle time as an excuse to not progress/even think at all about it, in any way... and I am starting to feel resentful... and I hate that.

It's not his fault that I am like this... It's not his fault that I didn't discover this about myself until we were already in love, and until I was already in love with someone else. BUT - It's not my fault either... If I had known I would have been walking around with flashing neon signs - arrows pointing to my head saying "guaranteed to drive you crazy" (okay maybe a small exaggeration there :P but i wouldn't have been hiding it - i would have been upfront about it)...

I'm not asking him to change who he is, I am asking him to accept this about me... I think I have done pretty well in respecting how he feels, I have given him as much space about it - within the limits of still maintaining open and honest communication - as I can, and I haven't been pursuing the other relationship... I HAVE maintained my position of loving them both.

I am at a loss of what to do... and letting it go? as i said - I would if i could... and to me if I COULD just let it go... it wouldn't say much for the quality and strength of my love... If it were absolutely clear that T had moved on, didn't want anything to do with me... that would hurt but it would give me no choice but to move on... as it is, with him popping on and off msn... and the changes on fb (particularly as they are so out of character and ARE essentially his version of screaming to the world)... leave me torn... I WANT to sort it out, I WANT to have this work, I WANT us to work it out together...

It is also as frustrating as all get-out that WW has essentially made it a condition of me talking to T (or vice versa), that T talk to WW. I get it - but it is not a helpful thing, I think.

I believe that T allowed himself to start falling in love with me because he thought he was safe... that I obviously loved WW so much, there was no chance of me returning his feelings... and then when it became apparent that I did...and worse what I wanted... he panicked, and also allowed guilt to consume him about betraying his friendship with WW (which I don't think would be the case if I didn't return the feelings... interesting concept there), but he had fallen too far himself and now cannot himself walk away. because of all that - I don't think he has the first clue about how to talk to WW... and WW has no interest in talking to T. and I am eating my just desserts...

sorry for the long rant - if anyone has the magic code of how to switch my heart off ... let me know huh?? please feel free to discuss my thoughts... i am feeling down and need some empathy... but really need some new ideas to help work through this - cos mine obviously arent working.

and RP (and anyone else with awesome tag recalling skills) - if you read this one - i would be most pleased with some tag search ideas... i am up to speed with most of the recent threads - if there are some older ones (12mths +) on similar topics I have probably missed them (and apart from the more active members I haven't delved into too many blogs).

specifically... how do i help WW take another step or two - or at least allow me to communicate with T (yes - if T is willing, but the key for me at the moment is having WW okay with the idea and actuality of that)?

or conversely, help me find ways to let go AND find peace inside myself (which also needs for me to feel accepted by WW)??

*tootling off now to occupy myself in something thoroughly random... in a blatant attempt to stop focusing on this particular white elephant*
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  #86  
Old 02-27-2011, 08:58 PM
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Oh Flamecat. This is driving you nuts. I wish there would be some change for you on this. I don't think that anyone can change it but you and cut your ties with him. Delete him from FB for starters. He is tearing you apart and the only way forward I see is to not look so that you can move forward. I fear you are missing out on other things while going through this. He will know how to find you if you let him go. You could even send a message to say that you need a break from him for a certain length of time and that it's hard for you to see his movements on line... then stick to the time frame.

I can't think of any tagged threads that relate. My friend is the only person I have seen go through this. She had a friend that became a lover over time but in a fit of self hatred she dumped my friend and told her that lesbians were disgusting, couldn't believe she thought it was a good idea to be together and that she should be ashamed of herself for being into women. My friend was obviously upset and began following her on fb as a way to stay connected... the woman set privacy settings for a while so she couldn't see. Then would take them off. Then would put them back on for some purpose... she followed her for years! This woman moved to another city, got married, divorced, and then the last glimpse when the settings were lifted was she started dating a woman and wanted my friend to talk to about it... That didn't work out and she dumped her again on FB!!!!

My friend told me this and we talked long and hard about her dumping her on FB, when she did there was a visible lift off of her. She didn't struggle as much as she thought she would in the end. It was a huge release and she wished she had done it well before... this woman had manipulated her feelings for years. There came a lot of anger, shame along with the relief..
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  #87  
Old 02-28-2011, 12:05 AM
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Red face

*rueful smile*

I really shouldn't post when I am in a whirlpool of despair

I am not missing out on things, and yes it drives me crazy inside... but one thing I got out my marriage was the ability to continue my everyday life even while my insides are churning, I laugh, am happy, i still game and work, WW and I are GOOD... I just have moments when it all goes to hell inside me - this is the first time I can remember of having somewhere to speak freely and in complete safety about how I feel in those moments...

I do find it worrisome how deeply I react/feel in those times... but overall I am good

I know what my options are... I need to get communication happening between all three of us, or I need to stop loving T.

And that is just the way I am... I can't let go if I still love him... um... how to explain...

It's the connection, as long as I love someone I want to know they are okay... I want to be able to call them up out of the blue and say "hey - how are you doing?" I am not demanding that this relationship be pursued... I am requesting I be given that little bit...

I would like to be able to just let things develop by themselves... just because I love T doesn't mean that in the end we would have the relationship I would like to have... but to prevent ANY relationship, and in particular, to be prevented by someone outside that relationship itself... is driving me nuts. This is the important thing for me - despite whatever T does - if he closed up his profile again and never opened it again... that would be ok...if he comes back and opens communication lines... that would be ok. It is the fact the restriction on my communication* with T was put in place by WW... and his condition to it reopening is something I have no control over... it is something that is not dependant on my actions/intentions/thoughts/or anything to do with our relationship and trust between us... it is bound to something external to us... it is bound to T's actions/thoughts/place in life it is bound to THEIR relationship and whether either of them gets off their arses and does something about it... I mean if the condition to doing something I need to do, is bound upon factors that are bound to WW and T achieving some semblance of communication - do I not have a right to expect WW (as it is his condition) to make an effort towards attaining that goal - or is he within his right to set that boundary and then refuse to work on the condition to removing it??

I left home at 16 because of people trying to control me (and got myself into a situation where i spent 15 years being controlled down to what i wore and said/who i was friends with and when and what i could speak to them about)

This situation is triggering those issues in a major way. I have given up the control of this to WW... and am finding out that I am really not okay with it... I am... but I am also SO NOT.

*adding here that this restriction was agreed to while very emotional... while feeling guilty about the pain WW was going through - at the time. because he has not had his 'at least one month without it ('it' being polamory or T) being mentioned' I do not feel I can ask him to revisit this yet.

And WW would be utterly devestated to realise this is how I am feeling. Specifically, that I am feeling controlled. The last thing he would ever want to do is behave in a way that revisits those feelings for me... I acknowledge to a large degree these feelings are mine to own.. and to deal with... I need an outside perspective though - are my feelings utterly irrational here - or is it visible to others why I might be feeling in such a way? and how do I go about reducing the feeling of control? I don't want to push WW (well I do - but not until he is ready)... I DO want to figure myself out and get over this hurdle.
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Last edited by FlameKat; 02-28-2011 at 12:19 AM. Reason: adding more information
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  #88  
Old 03-03-2011, 11:48 PM
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Default A moment of recognition...

Since my last post I have spent alot of time feeling 'grey'... and well... like a zombie. Today I have come to the realisation that I have been doing what I did in my marriage - I have been allowing myself to feel like the victim here, I have given over my power to be myself to someone else...

NOT good at all.

I have realised that who I am doesn't hurt WW... I do not hurt him... my actions don't hurt him... It's him... It's his expectations for me to be just like him that hurt him... It's his desire to have me love the same way he does that hurts him...

Thanks to Tonberry's post on another thread she said the same things I have been saying for weeks - just in another way that made it recognisable to me... and in a way that made it recognisable that what I have been doing is trying to deny who/how I am even as I fight for it (talk about muddled up huh).

I am not at fault, I am not disgusting or greedy or flighty or a cheat or less loving or any of the other multitude of things that run through my mind when I try to justify the way WW reacts... I am ME... and I am beautiful the way I am...

and I am angry, I am very very angry, that I have let myself feel like this again... what is wrong with me that I would let myself hurt so badly? that I would take on someone elses pain and claim it as my own? Now those two things ARE my issues...

And I have every right in the world to not only talk to him about how I am feeling, but expect him to hear me. I don't have the right to expect him to be okay with what he hears, and I don't have the right to expect him to hang around... but I do have the right to expect him to deal with it honestly and openly if he does hang around, and I do have the right to not feel like I need to constantly squash down who I am to ease his pain - what about my pain? Why do I constantly sacrifice myself?

Now to see if my inner bitch can be sustained
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  #89  
Old 03-03-2011, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlameKat View Post
I don't have the right to expect him to be okay with what he hears, and I don't have the right to expect him to hang around... but I do have the right to expect him to deal with it honestly and openly if he does hang around, and I do have the right to not feel like I need to constantly squash down who I am to ease his pain - what about my pain? Why do I constantly sacrifice myself?
Thanks for your whole post Flamecat! Very strong and empowered... awesome! you are so right on all fronts. Good for you!

this quote is so helpful to me as a reminder. I appreciate it... I'm going on my first date with Leo tonight since our.... "incident." I will be thinking on this tonight as I assess where I am at in my body and mind. thanks.
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Old 03-03-2011, 11:59 PM
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Woo-hoo! You go girl!

Now, don't waste time and energy directing your anger at yourself. Use it constructively, as a motivating factor in pursuing what would maximize your happiness. You just discovered something about how you were operating and that revelation is valuable. So what if you've done it before? You're seeing it now, as a pattern you tend to fall into, and this is good because now you know what to look for.

Think of life like a mountain, with a road winding around and around it, which we must take to reach the top. At some point during our travels, we find ourselves on the same hillside we were before, just at a higher level.

Inner bitch - haha, I love it! That can be the fuel to get up the mountain road!
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An excellent blog post on hierarchy in polyamory:
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