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  #11  
Old 04-25-2014, 10:53 PM
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Inyourendo Inyourendo is offline
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There is a huge difference between dadt and requesting your partner not to go l on and on all day about every new person they are talking to or casually dating. If someone isn't a permanent fixture I don't really want to become invested. I wouldn't even subject my friends to that
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  #12  
Old 04-25-2014, 11:18 PM
sparklepop sparklepop is offline
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Hi Magdlyn,

I'm sorry to hear that you are feeling fried as a result of Ginger's activity. I can tell from your updates that you are hurt and angered by all of this.

If it helps, I have been where you are and I will no doubt be there again, so I can absolutely, entirely relate. My GF is a manic dater. However, it used to be hell on me, but it's gotten better. I hope I can offer some help.

Having a partner that is a manic dater can be an exhausting rollercoaster of emotions; constantly watching your partner mope, scream, shout, get excited, get dumped, have sex, move onto the next one, go back to the last one, get sucked into drama, etc. It can be an absolute whirlwind. It can be a stressful way of life for someone who is more measured. It can also be just plain horrible to be on the shit end of a partner's NRE. NRE should be enjoyed, but it shouldn't be abused. We are not single people; we are polyamorous people. We have others to think of. That's my view.

However, we can also put ourselves in the middle of the hurricane.

In brief, the two things that helped me were: 1) pulling *myself* out of the hurricane and drama by hearing less and setting boundaries; and 2) accepting my GF's dating style as a part of her and learning to appreciate it.

It can be difficult to move away from being a partner's confidant on every issue, because we can fear losing intimacy, or being 'out of the loop'. For sure, the less we know, the less we might be aware of (Are they fucking? Are they in love? Is this going to affect me?). However, details can be torture, whether it's jealousy or simply because we're sick to death of the topic. Nobody wants to hear someone else belabor on and on about the same thing, no matter the topic.

One technique we've used in the past is to offer a 'blabber away' moment each day, as strange as this sounds. Whenever we're ready to listen, we would set up to an hour to chat about other relationships, if needed. It helped to put a more fun spin on things (i.e. a venting game), keep us connected without overburdening, and allow us to be emotionally available to listen without getting sucked dry.

Also, letting go of the need to control or judge how a partner dates can really be a breath of fresh air. Not only that, but addressing what needs of theirs are being met through their behaviour. Genuinely, doing this and learning to laugh about / love it has really helped me to let go. The less I try to force her to fit my mold, the better. The same works in return, of course. It's a constant compromise, but it seems to be helping.
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  #13  
Old 04-26-2014, 02:35 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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But then he'll say, "I am sad. I havent got my surgery date yet, and I feel sad that Carla and David need to work things out, worried our relationship will never get anywhere."
Mirror?
"Yes. I see you are sad. Yes, you have not gotten your surgery date yet. Yes, I see that you are sad Carla and David need to work stuff out. Yes, I see that you are worried that you and Carla's relationship will not go anywhere right now... that does not mean NEVER. Take it one thing at a time. "
Then bring it on BACK to the task at hand.
"She's doing her thing with him there. YOU are doing your thing here with me. To help clear the way so Carla and you can get to lift off. So... let's get it there on your end of it so it's that much closer for you.

So... behavior done/not done? Have you done ____? "
and see where he's at with the behaviors you both agreed he'd do to meet your needs.

Quote:
So what am I supposed to say then? It's a struggle to not get all sarcastic and say, "Oh, poor baby, wants to go fuck someone and her hubby wubby won't let you. Poor poor baby."
I think that kind of stuff in my head all the time. "Waaaah! Cry me a river!" but I try hard not to say it out loud. It blocks communication. It's ok to feel hella frustrated and let it out on the side to other people though.

It stinks that you want some empathy, stability, and balance and he's shaking it all up with his behavior. And it stinks that in order to get some understanding from him you have to be jumping through some hoops. But someone has to go first -- I don't think the Asperger dude will go first. He's in lala's from the sound of it.

Shortest route to me seems to be apply some empathy in his direction and then redirect to evaluating with him the behavior done/not done.

Quote:
I think the Aspie bit is getting "locked in" to something. He's locked in to her now and it gets a bit obsessive. ? Tough shit. Their "love" overrides all else. NRE for the win!
Yup. It's the "bee in a bonnet" thing. Can't hear anything but the buzz in there.

It's probably going to vary with how he is on his Asperger things....

But I just say "I'm done listening. Time to talk about something else. We can talk about it again ____." That usually works. If it comes up again I just say "Nope. Used up the time today on that one. Not again til ___. " Lather rinse repeat til 3 strikes. Then I just go home/hang up/stop talking. Blunt, but there it is.

Sometimes it has to be the method of the talking. "Nope. Not up for face time on that today -- I'm not processing ears well. You can email it though -- eyes are fine." Sometimes I don't want to get in an oral circular conversation in person. Making them write it out in email means I can put off responding and I don't have it so in my face.

I don't know if that helps any.

Hang in there!


Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 04-26-2014 at 02:48 AM.
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  #14  
Old 04-26-2014, 04:53 AM
london london is offline
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Originally Posted by GreenAcres View Post
Well, if he's diagnosed Asperger's, there's some definite possible issues. By definition, they cannot feel empathy. He cannot put himself in your shoes emotionally They do not generally do well with suggestions or hints, and while no one is a mind-reader, Aspie folks are even less so. They usually have difficulties with facial expressions, body language, tonal implications, etc. It's not that he's overlooking your emotions, desires, etc. It's that he literally doesn't know they exist, and will have difficulty prioritizing them once he does. Not because he's a bad person, but because that's his hardwiring.

The upshot is that it's likely you'll just have to be very, very direct and blunt, which is what most Asperger's folks find the most comfortable form of communication.

Honestly, it's also worth exploring whether poly is something he'll be able to handle overall. Many folks with Asperger's have significant issues maintaining healthy romantic relationships with even one person, because they lack some of the hardwiring that NTs (neuro-typical folks) have to help them manage relationships. The best explanation I've heard for how stressful relationships can be for those with Asperger's: imagine you had to do trigonometry in your head from the moment you woke up to the moment you went to sleep, without a calculator or even pen and paper. Now add the stress of having never had a trig class. Now pile onto it that your entire relationship, and your entire life, hinges on you getting the right answers.

I am not saying stop the poly, just that it is worth considering he may have challenges that may make it more difficult than it otherwise might be, and that addressing those head on in plain, direct ways as soon as possible might help.

(and yes, there's a background as to why I know all this, but I can't really go into it without revealing much more personal information than I am comfortable)
That's completely untrue that people with Autism lack empathy. What we do lack is the ability to understand why something that wouldn't upset us, upsets you. Things that we think are irrelevant or petty will always be irrelevant and petty regardless of how distressed they make you. We'll just think you have some issues. However, if someone did something that would upset us, regardless of whether it upsets you, we'll be bloody outraged on your behalf.

As for being unable to have healthy relationships, that's another form of the stereotype neurotypical folk have tainted us with. We can have healthy relationships. Most of us do. Some of us choose not to have relationships. A whole host of us haven't had the intervention we needed growing up to chisel off some of the traits that make relationships a little harder.

Luckily, the OP knows that a lot of the stereotypical slander given here about people on the Spectrum just doesn't ring true for her partner. It is these misunderstandings that cause the stigma against autistic people and the reason why we get ostracised due to our "lack of empathy" and things like that. There are ways around our "differences" and skills you can learn which aid the average autist in communicating positively with their NT peers. It's what most autistic people learn to some degree anyway.
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  #15  
Old 04-26-2014, 04:57 AM
london london is offline
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Back to the Op. I've said before that until you stop meeting Ginger's needs, he will not take a critical look at how he is managing things. It's completely true that even when you do stop, he might just carry on and you guys will drift apart. However, this issue is affecting you so badly, it seems you're coming to a decisive point anyway.

I honestly believe that he thinks your concerns are a mixture of jealousy and simply being controlling. I don't but until he comes to the realisation that you probably have a point, he won't stop. I wouldn't stop.
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  #16  
Old 04-26-2014, 11:26 AM
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Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
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I'm overwhelmed with gratitude by all your empathy and advice, london, GG, sparklepop. You guys are great. I've been feeling so lost and upset, it really helps to hear some more opinions on how to deal with this.


I should mention that beside me, his gf of 2 1/2 years, Ginger has his wife as a partner, and also my gf miss pixi as a FWB. It took me about a year to adjust to her and him having an attraction for each other, cuddling a lot, kissing a lot, and occasionally having sex, either with me as a 3some, or sometimes one on one. So, my first year with Ginger, I had to deal with sharing miss p with him.

But he didn't date anyone else that first year. So, now that I've finally come to terms with the emotional weather and sexual attraction between those 2, now he's hungry again and wants even more lovers! That is what I mean by him being polysaturated. A wife in good standing, a gf who he gets to fuck/date several times a week, a FWB right in his gf's house, and he still wants more? It just starts to seem greedy, like a child that wants ALL the candy.

I start to feel faceless, just another pussy in the pussy parade. Or just part of a harem, which offends my feminist sensibilities. I've been asking him why he wants even more women. He's got 3 already, and isn't fulfilled or content. I've got 2 wonderful lovers and gave up on trolling okc for more. I am tired of dating because the huge majority of men I've dated end up being inappropriate and frustrating. Ironically, Ginger recently stated he found the fact that I find him so fulfilling to feel oppressive, like pressure. !!

I hear the general consensus here is for me to learn to ask for less details on this or that new relationship of his. Yes, we are used to being each others' dating confidants. He loves to hear about my dates, the good the bad the ugly, doesn't matter. He gets vicarious pleasure and entertainment from it. But I can't offer that much anymore. I am not going to go on these useless dates just to entertain my bf!

So, I will try this new policy of not asking him questions about his progress with Carla. He's been suggesting that as well. He says he's worked out how much detail to tell his wife about his gfs and dates, and he is trying to figure out how much to tell me so I don't feel completely out of the loop, but not overwhelm me with the details about his desires for another, their flirting, and their eventual actual in the flesh relationship. (...should David get on board with that. And think he will. I think Carla wears the pants in the family, so to speak.)

It feels very very odd to contemplate letting go and be OK with big chunks of his day being off limits for me to know about. The time he spends chatting her, flirting her, even perhaps cybersex and naked Skype, who knows, and then finally, the actual dates and sex. I am feeling distant from him already, vaguely disgusted, and have gone from seeing him every other day, to only wanting to see him every 5 days or so. Even my voracious sex drive has nearly died, I am so depressed I don't feel sexual, for him or for miss p.

And then of course, as I mentioned above, I do enjoy going to the drum circles with him, and was somewhat interested in kirtan, but Carla is one of the founders of the drum circle, it's her realm, she's literally partly in charge of it. Same with kirtan. She and Willy's usual dance partner, Sally, practice kirtan with each other every week and lead one for the group once a month. I feel a sense of loss of doing those activities with him, when going with him would require me to witness him and Carla, yearning for each other, while I sit in the corner or dance alone. Awkward!
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Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

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  #17  
Old 04-26-2014, 12:58 PM
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Inyourendo Inyourendo is offline
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Originally Posted by london View Post
That's completely untrue that people with Autism lack empathy. What we do lack is the ability to understand why something that wouldn't upset us, upsets you. Things that we think are irrelevant or petty will always be irrelevant and petty regardless of how distressed they make you. .
I'm not even an aspie and I think that way. Gets me in trouble other Nate all the time because I assume if it's no biggie for me then it shouldn't be for someone else .
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  #18  
Old 04-26-2014, 04:39 PM
TiagodaCruz TiagodaCruz is offline
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Red face Foccus on yourself and let it flow

Hi... I am much younger than you, another gender and lack your life experience. However, my experiences are different from yours and perhaps something I write hits a button that helps you.

The girl I live and share my life with, 10 years now, also has time when she talks and talks about the girl she is with (I have a hard time with "my" "her" property applied to people) - specially the problems, uncertainties, frustrations cause by the other (or the relationship). I mean talk for anything from 3 to 12 hours round and round. Sometimes I lose so much energy just listening an trying to help that I literally start falling asleep. However, this is happening less and less because she too is learning (emotionally) to do what I do, and the need for this is reducing. She stated meditation (start with one minute, research on the net or buy some books - she did) and she says its been very helpful. Reconnective healing, hypnosys and such have also helped her find her centre, deal with and even solve some of her problems with her relations. Perhaps these help you with your and your health

If these things bother you... perhaps looking at what he is doing will l not help you if it is not in your hand to change it...

Look into yourself. Find out why these things bother you. Accept things until you are able to let them flow away from you. Usually works for me. Soon after the crisis passes I feel fine again.

Also... perhaps you can tell him you are not that interested in the other person's problems, at some point. Like: -"Its a shame she has those problems but I would really like to do something other than talk about that right now." Or: -"You have already told me about that and honestly there is nothing I can do about it so I would rather speak/do of something different." - whatever works for you guys. The tone is key, of course.

As for his behaviour... its really up to him... the same for your girlfriend, I guess. If you need their support in this time of physical pain ask for it, the rest is up to you to make it stop bothering you. I always talk about my issues with "my" girlfriend and my friends. Things must always be clear. However when we can't change that which bother us we either leave of learn how to deal with it.

Good luck and "may the force be with you", sincerely.
Cheers and much love.
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  #19  
Old 04-26-2014, 07:37 PM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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Hey Mag-
I don't know if this would help, but it did help me so I thought I would mention it. You sound tired.

When Maca was caught up in NRE (with someone it was obvious to EVERYONE else wasn't going to work out); it was just overwhelming.

I asked to limit discussions on the topic of other lovers, to one specified time a week.
That way it wasn't every day, but it also wasn't me thinking things were at point A, when they had progressed to X.
It also didn't make it a "not allowed to talk" topic, but it gave some regulation to the topic, so it didn't become all-consuming.

Also; We specified a few things I needed in order to not feel like I was just another pussy as you put it.
For example; we quit having phones by the bed. So once we were in bed, it was us time-no interruptions, same for our date times.


You sound like you need a hug and a break. I hope you get both.
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  #20  
Old 04-26-2014, 08:13 PM
graviton graviton is offline
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Originally Posted by Magdlyn View Post
I'm overwhelmed with gratitude by all your empathy and advice, london, GG, sparklepop. You guys are great. I've been feeling so lost and upset, it really helps to hear some more opinions on how to deal with this.


I should mention that beside me, his gf of 2 1/2 years, Ginger has his wife as a partner, and also my gf miss pixi as a FWB. It took me about a year to adjust to her and him having an attraction for each other, cuddling a lot, kissing a lot, and occasionally having sex, either with me as a 3some, or sometimes one on one. So, my first year with Ginger, I had to deal with sharing miss p with him.

But he didn't date anyone else that first year. So, now that I've finally come to terms with the emotional weather and sexual attraction between those 2, now he's hungry again and wants even more lovers! That is what I mean by him being polysaturated. A wife in good standing, a gf who he gets to fuck/date several times a week, a FWB right in his gf's house, and he still wants more? It just starts to seem greedy, like a child that wants ALL the candy.

I start to feel faceless, just another pussy in the pussy parade. Or just part of a harem, which offends my feminist sensibilities. I've been asking him why he wants even more women. He's got 3 already, and isn't fulfilled or content. I've got 2 wonderful lovers and gave up on trolling okc for more. I am tired of dating because the huge majority of men I've dated end up being inappropriate and frustrating. Ironically, Ginger recently stated he found the fact that I find him so fulfilling to feel oppressive, like pressure. !!
As poly practitioners it is not defensible to dictate or decide how many partners is too many. That is up to the person having those relationships. It is up to you to decide if it adversely affects you too much to stay. Remember every mono would claim any more than one is too many. To them, once you have crossed the boundary of more than one, what's the difference between 2 or 5?
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