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  #21  
Old 11-06-2013, 08:33 PM
london london is offline
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Originally Posted by pulliman View Post
london - ha!

Speaking from within a not-yet-triad situation, I can say (based on an earlier comment by london, I think, plus something Natja said) that one of the NICER things, for me, is that I'm not the sexual centerpiece. That whole porn MFM thing? Yeah, not so much.

When reading around, my wife gets irritated by the suggestion that she "became" bi to please me. Yuck - the concept is awful. It doesn't describe her and her "mostly straight" ways. She doesn't see herself as bi or poly, not at all. She has a girlfriend, but even the word "girlfriend" bugs her. AM is part of her life, they make love, are best friends, don't name it, it's just AM. AM feels the same way toward her.

Frankly, neither wants to be associated with "poly" when they see the attitude of conversations on boards like this. It's one reason this thread is interesting to me, seeing the space of responses, but I'm different from the two of them...
Definitely in Fetlife but I think I've seen women here too who readily admit that they aren't really bi but think with enough practice, they will be. Sometimes it will be a kink based relationship dynamic that compels them to attempt this, other times not.
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  #22  
Old 11-06-2013, 08:34 PM
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Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
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Being in...a triad...and also part of what I call an N... I suppose I could talk about either side of this conversation.
... people who write in talking about their personal circumstances (say, starting married and perhaps opening things up in small steps, or enjoying being with couples because they like the dynamic of joining something established) and get pounced on with questions that others seem to not get asked. Have you thought of THIS, have you considered THAT, and so on. Many of the questions imply that the member of the couple or the person joining a couple is a dumb-ass, or self-centered, or rude to the others in the relationship, or lacking in the wisdom that is this forum.
First of all, I like being pounced upon. By cats, kids or a lover! But piled on can be oppressive, which is probably what happens to innocent, naive, downright ignorant unicorns and unicorn hunters, when they come here looking for advice.

...Wait a minute, they are on a board with hundreds of members, asking for advice, and they get ton of it, from well meaning people, and then they feel piled upon! Well, if you don't want multiple opinions, maybe you shouldnt go to a message board. heh. Go read sites like morethantwo, go read a couple books, go find a poly-friendly therapist. Don't ask for advice here and then be mad when you damn well get some. If you just want information and support, see above.

I know the mods here want us to all be gently supportive at all times, and can and do ban members with more abrasive personalities. I know sometimes I am more abrasive than I should be, but shit, these same kinds of people just coming here over and over again, with their unicorn boxes and traps, thinking they are so unique and the exception to the stereotype!

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Which may be true. Yeah, people opening up don't know what people who have lived this way for a while know. But the pouncing is what looks different.
As a former unicorn hunter, with 14 years perspective on THAT experiment (my ex and I opened our relationship in 1999), I speak from both sides. I was the bi wife looking for a woman to share with my straight husband. We found one, and as often happens, she immediately preferred my husband, I got no sex, no cuddles, no romance from her, and he and she were soul mates, in NRE, chatting for hours. He was all twitterpated. Here I'd been his partner through thick and thin for 20 years, and suddenly she had supplanted my place, and I felt, had more attraction for him than I did. Or at least, just as much. It was really weird! I wasn't expecting the tidal force of NRE.

Previous to starting our hunt, my h said I could have veto power. If I was ever unhappy with this arrangement of sharing a woman, I came first, he'd give her up. After giving their relationship several months, I was extremely unhappy (since she wasn't into me, since she was taking so much of his time attention and OUR money, and because I felt he was neglecting our children), I did veto. Then they were both broken-hearted, and he punished me passive aggressively for the veto he'd granted me permission to use.

I became so depressed at our failed experiment and the result of the veto that I got clinically depressed to the point I was screaming/crying daily, couldn't get out of bed, needed Zoloft and 3 years of therapy.

Now, in retrospect I also feel bad for my husband and his gf! It wasn't fair to them either. We all suffered greatly.

So! Excuse me for "pouncing," unicorns, and those that hunt you. I am only trying to save you from the horrific massive depression our hunt produced.
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  #23  
Old 11-06-2013, 08:58 PM
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Natja Natja is offline
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Like Magdlyn I made a disastrous mistake also, I am not really able to talk about it still as it is too painful (really dedicated people can easily find out) but I would never, ever want any one to go through what I went through. I wish people wouldn't cling to this fantasy I really do, because I don't want them to feel that sort of pain, but I DO realise that people have to make their own mistakes also. It is hard to find the right balance sometimes.
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  #24  
Old 11-06-2013, 09:14 PM
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Like Magdlyn I made a disastrous mistake also, I am not really able to talk about it still as it is too painful (really dedicated people can easily find out) but I would never, ever want any one to go through what I went through. I wish people wouldn't cling to this fantasy I really do, because I don't want them to feel that sort of pain, but I DO realise that people have to make their own mistakes also. It is hard to find the right balance sometimes.
I am sorry for your pain, Natja.

The thing is, the darn innocent or stubborn unicorn hunters that come here, maybe even after going through several women already, but still wanting to find "the right woman," they don't know it's the form of the relationship, not those women they rejected (or were rejected by) that is at fault.

Sharing a woman does not prevent jealousy!!! It can actually increase it. For example: Imagine a 3way where the husband is so excited to be with this new hot woman, he spends most of the so-called 3way focusing on her, while his wife is off to the sidelines waiting her turn. Finally it's her turn! He comes to fuck his wife, gets his penis in her vagina, and.... it wilts. Imagine the wife's humiliation! Imagine his dismay at his NRE-craving cock. Or imagine him not being dismayed, getting off his wife and getting back to fucking the gf.

(Something similar happened to me in a 4some a couple years back. My gf's ex (from 10 years ago) came to town, she was a swinger, we decided to have a 4some, with my young male playpartner. He was so excited to be with someone new, he fucked her 5 times in the course of the evening and into the next day. In that time period, he tried to fuck me once, and wilted.)
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  #25  
Old 11-07-2013, 04:27 PM
FullofLove1052 FullofLove1052 is offline
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I really do not have a problem with triads. I also could care less about those single women who seek couples, or those couples who seek single women.

My only grievance is with those that want this perfect woman to fit into a box. It is like they miss the part where the woman has a personality, thoughts, a voice, style of communicating, wants, and needs of her own. She has a high standard to meet even before the first day. These couples usually have been together for years, well-established, and they just want someone to tagalong to the well oiled machine. She is just automatically supposed to be gung-ho about three-way sex and all this togetherness. She is usually not allowed to be alone with the husband. The wife may or may not be bisexual. Sometimes she is just exploring that side. She might have to be okay with babysitting, disrespectful little brats, and never being allowed to have children of her own--specifically if it is poly-fi, and the male has either had a vasectomy, or the wife is not okay with said woman having children by her husband or any other man for that matter. (Last time I checked, women control their vaginas and right to reproduce.) Sometimes the woman even has to be in the closet because the other two loves of the triad are unwilling or unable to come out. Second class citizen is too good for these women. Some are treated like less.

It sounds awful, so I cannot imagine how it feels for the newly added person in these situations. I forgot the best one of all...they tell this woman that she must date both, and if the relationship ends with either of them, the whole thing is kaput. Nevermind that she will be left heartbroken and homeless if they invited her to live with them.

Admittedly, I have posed questions to those singles and couples alike. It is out of curiosity and wondering why. (It is no different than if I were to ask a mono woman why she prefers tall men with muscles and sandy brown hair or a man who makes six or seven figures a year.) Never to demean them because the truth is this one right here could not give a fuck what they do with their lives. I am not losing any sleep, and my quality of life is not being reduced, so it just does not matter. I am curious because I have no preferences, as I do not experience primary/sexual attraction, so it is interesting to find out why people seek what they do.

I would be an epic fail if I was single and seeking a couple. I hate three-way sex. I had one threesome last year and never again. I barely liked having sex with two people, and I was a-okay when my second relationship transitioned to non-sexual. So the odds of me falling for both people in that couple and loving them both? Hell would freeze over first. I would have to experience that special connection, and it has only happened five times in the years I have been dating. Very rare. The last time was when I met my ex-girlfriend...in 2000. Since then, nothing. I have only been sexually attracted to one man in my life, and he is the only man I have ever been intimate with: my husband. I am not a candidate for a triad from either side. I respect those that are.
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  #26  
Old 11-07-2013, 08:33 PM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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Originally Posted by pulliman View Post
l

Frankly, neither wants to be associated with "poly" when they see the attitude of conversations on boards like this. It's one reason this thread is interesting to me, seeing the space of responses, but I'm different from the two of them...
My guys feel the same. They became so disgusted with the behavior in the "poly communities" they encountered-and the conversations on this board; that neither have anything to do with any "poly" talk, groups, social arenas etc.
They just live our life and socialize with whoever wanders into their life and goes from there.
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  #27  
Old 11-07-2013, 10:27 PM
london london is offline
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@FullofLove Weren't you in a triad where you had certain restrictive expectations of your girlfriend concerning her baby making? I'm sure I read an old thread recently. That's not to say your feelings didn't evolve over time if it was you, just you'd have more insight into someone who does have those expectations and how they feel perfectly reasonable at the time, at least.
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  #28  
Old 11-07-2013, 11:07 PM
FullofLove1052 FullofLove1052 is offline
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@FullofLove Weren't you in a triad where you had certain restrictive expectations of your girlfriend concerning her baby making? I'm sure I read an old thread recently. That's not to say your feelings didn't evolve over time if it was you, just you'd have more insight into someone who does have those expectations and how they feel perfectly reasonable at the time, at least.
It was not really a restriction. I am more inclined to believe it was my own red flags going up screaming red alert. I had just had a baby months prior and a very difficult pregnancy. It was a lot of stress and health issues surrounding my pregnancy and even after his birth. My hormones were batshit crazy, too. Never suggest something ludicrous to a sleep deprived, stressed out, second time mum. I will tell anybody I was not even remotely a-okay with the idea of another child. It could have been the Virgin Mary herself at that point, and I would have been like, "Bitch, have you lost your mind, and more importantly, do you need help finding it?" Different person and different circumstances back then? Who knows? Everything has changed, so that is not even in the realm of possibility. All I know is my ex? Not a chance in hell.

So yes, my feelings have evolved, and now that I know what my ex is about and what her intentions with that situation were, thank you God it did not happen. That poor baby would have been leverage in her sick and twisted game. This was by her own admission. She was a good person, but she does not need to be anybody's mother. Thank heavens she knows it. The day my daughter asks, "Who," when someone asks her about my ex will be a wonderful day. I want her to forget that nightmare.
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  #29  
Old 11-08-2013, 03:17 AM
RiverDwellers RiverDwellers is offline
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Now I find this enlightening, all this talk about triads and "unicorn hunters". So many terms for me, a newbie to learn. But what I come away from this, is that everyone just wants to make everyone else feel loved in the relationship. Isn't that the way it is supposed to be? I mean, when someone in your circle looks at you, don't you want to feel loved, wanted and respected? It seems to me that open communication is always the key and you should never do what you don't want to do or be "pushed" into being anything you don't want to be. We haven't found our "other" and don't know who it will be, whether its a man, woman or a couple. We aren't in any hurry and if it happens, it happens.

Personally, though, I hate titles and just think you should be free to love, like, feel affection for anyone you choose.
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  #30  
Old 11-08-2013, 09:32 AM
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SchrodingersCat SchrodingersCat is offline
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As for the labels, they bug me. "Unicorn hunters" and "swingers" are looked down on, who gets to decide this?
I acknowledge that I have some contradictory opinions when it comes to labels. On one hand, I want nothing to do with them. But on the other hand, everyone gets really attached to theirs, and they don't want me to take theirs away.

The challenge is that labels are only useful in conversation if everyone agrees with the language. If I pick up a bottle on the grocery shelf and the label says "ketchup" then I know what my hotdog is going to taste like when I pour it on. I shouldn't have to write to each manufacturer to make sure that all the bottles of "ketchup" are basically what I expect them to be. Within the label of "ketchup," I expect to find variations in seasoning. I don't expect each brand of ketchup to taste identical, but I expect them all to "taste like ketchup."

That's why I get so pedantic about language and labels. If someone calls themselves a unicorn, that word has a meaning that is generally understood in the context of "unicorn-hunters."

It's important to understand the order of events. First, there were people who looked to "complete" their relationship with a very specific type of woman with virtually unattainable characteristics. Often, they disrespected the autonomy of the woman they're seeking. Who gets to decide that disrespecting someone's autonomy is deplorable? I do. And I'm in good company. So first these people were out there doing this thing. It was only when they reached a critical mass that other people went "Wow, this is really a 'thing.' Let's give them all a name so that we can refer to them more easily. They're looking for something imaginary. Unicorns are imaginary. Let's say they're hunting unicorns."

It simply wasn't the case that first there were these women out there looking for couples to date, and they were like "Hey you know who else likes to date couples? Unicorns. So I'm going to call myself a unicorn, because that means someone who likes to date couples." No. Unicorns are just horses with a magical pole sticking out of their forehead.

Someone called me out for all of this contradicting my tag. I don't believe that it does. You see, labels ARE sticky. They come with connotations and assumptions. When you define yourself with labels, you inherit all those assumptions, like it or not. So if you're going to slap a big sparkly sticker on your forehead, it's probably a good idea to do some research first and make sure you really understand what that sticker says, and how others will interpret it. Because when you find that out after the fact, you'll realize that it's left glue all over your skin.
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