Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > General Poly Discussions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #61  
Old 08-26-2010, 12:45 AM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 6,322
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeonKaos View Post
It's also "dismissive" to say that bisexual people can't be attracted to someone with ambiguous gender. "Androgynous" is not synonymous with "extra" or "additional". Androgynous people combine aspects of the male and female genders. It is not a discreet "third gender".
Well, I am suggesting there are/can be 30 genders, not 3!

Men
Gay men
Transmen who ID as men
Transmen
Butch dykes
Drag kings
Soft butch (Chapstick lesbians)
Genderqueer
Genderfuckers
Androgynes
Intersexed
2 Spirits
Asexuals
Drag queens
Cross dressers (transvestites)
Lesbians
Femme dykes (lipstick lesbians)
Transwomen who ID as women
Women

That's about all I can think of.

And I'd like to add, since this is a poly"amory" board, that being attracted to somone of an alternative gender ID is just part of it. Actually loving a transperson is something else. It's not easy, loving a person who is transgender. It's a trip!
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 62) loving Pixie (poly, F, 40) since January 2009, living together since 2013
Seeing Kahlo (polyish, M, 45)
Master, (mono, M, 36), Pixie's Dom/bf for 3+ years

Last edited by Magdlyn; 08-26-2010 at 11:21 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 08-26-2010, 12:45 AM
rabbit rabbit is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 39
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeonKaos View Post
This is basically it for me too. Sorry about yanking everyone's chain. I've been having a bad week and needed to blow off some steam, and besides that, S.Cat is so cute when she's irked by the things I say.

I don't care what anyone identifies as, as long as they are happy and not hurting anyone else and have their pets spayed or neutered.
Love the bolded part

RP, I will try to find some examples on here when I have more time. I kinda get that feel from the thread where everyone is listing their orientation though.

There may be something regional going on too. From the (few) bisexual people I know here I don't think any of them were necessarily excluding anything.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 08-26-2010, 01:23 AM
jkelly jkelly is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 168
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
For the record, hemaphrodite=intersexed... I believe the latter is now preferred by that population?
My bad. I thought that was one particular way of being intersexed, and didn't realise it isn't the preferred term. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 08-26-2010, 02:08 AM
SourGirl's Avatar
SourGirl SourGirl is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: South of an Igloo, North of a Desert.
Posts: 883
Default

I`m keeping that list !


I`d just think they were human beings other wise.
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 08-26-2010, 03:08 AM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,723
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit View Post
RP, I will try to find some examples on here when I have more time. I kinda get that feel from the thread where everyone is listing their orientation though.

There may be something regional going on too. From the (few) bisexual people I know here I don't think any of them were necessarily excluding anything.
I'm not sure if it's regional. I'm not sure if people who identify as bi are excluding. When I identified as bi it was because I hadn't thought of anything beyond the typical sexes. When I was made aware and thought about it and checked in with myself I changed my mind... which I think is a life time journey really. Maybe I will change my mind again.

I just haven't heard any pansexuals ever say that they are radically different than bisexuals. It just sounds like someone might be trying to one up another or show off about it, compete... if that is the case then that is just silly. Who cares what you identify as. Really it should just be a matter of curiosity about others and a way to perhaps understand them a bit more and that is it. It isn't a contest or a debate... its just a way to self identify and define oneself...

I just wondered if you had a personal story to tell about someone trying to say otherwise.... ? hope that makes sense?
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 08-26-2010, 12:03 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
Custodian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: new england
Posts: 3,217
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magdlyn View Post
Well, I am suggesting there are/can be 30 genders, not 3!
Yes yes, I forgot about how "gender" is different from "sex". I should have said "sex" not "gender". I don't deal with the application of these concepts on a day-to-day basis so my working vocabulary is a little rusty.

This whole discussion reminds me of a book I read a long time ago. I'll have to dust off my little "queer library" and bring it with me tonight.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 08-26-2010, 07:15 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 1,443
Default

I think using the term pansexual is a way to a) put the focus on gender rather than biological sex and b) reject the idea of binary gender. (Both a and b combined, I mean, not either-or).
Of course I am straight (I prefer "androphile", incidentally) and feel like there are almost as many genders as there as people, if I'm making sense here. Because we're all unique human beings.

The way I see it, my attraction to people is based on biological sex. Of course it's not just that, but considering I have only ever been attracted, both physically and emotionally, to biological males, I think it's a fair description. That doesn't mean it's impossible for me to fall for a FTM someday, or a genderqueer, or maybe a MTF, or an intersexed person. Just that it isn't as likely, and for the sake of simplicity, I don't mention it.

The way I see it, "bisexual" is like me, but for both sexes at once.
"Pansexual" focuses on the idea of "everyone" rather than "both". "It doesn't matter what you identify as, I might be attracted to you."
I can also imagine that you can be bisexual but only attracted to "traditional" people, that is men who look like men and feel like men and women who look like women and feel like women.
If you want to specifically say that you aren't like that, using "pansexual" can make sense too, although it doesn't mean that "bisexual" implies it, either.

In a way, for me it also gives me an indication of the person's background. "Bisexual" means to me "transgendered and genderqueer might be included, but I'm not really part of a community where that's likely to come up", while "pansexual" means more "transgendered people and genderqueer people are part of my everyday life or likely to be".

Of course, that could simply be my own interpretation there.

In the end, it's a matter of point of view I feel. A bit like I prefer "androphile" to "heterosexual". I feel "heterosexual" is convoluted (step 1: what is my sex/gender? Step 2: what is the sex/gender of the people I'm attracted to? Step 3: are they the same or different?) while androphile is much more straightforward and to the point (unique step: what is the sex/gender of people I'm attracted to?)
Also, I like the "phile", which focuses on feelings rather than sex. I know the "sex" of "hetero-/homo-sexual" is biological sex, not the activity, but still, sex comes to mind, and I want to put my feelings first.

But in the end, I'm both heterosexual and androphile. In my case, they're both the same. Still, I favour the latter over the former.
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 08-26-2010, 09:19 PM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 6,322
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonberry View Post

The way I see it, "bisexual" is like me, but for both sexes at once.
"Pansexual" focuses on the idea of "everyone" rather than "both". "It doesn't matter what you identify as, I might be attracted to you."
I can also imagine that you can be bisexual but only attracted to "traditional" people, that is men who look like men and feel like men and women who look like women and feel like women.
Yes, I've met some bisexuals who only like manly men, and femme women. They wouldnt be attracted to a effeminate man or a butch woman.

And I have a transgendered friend who is only attracted to butches and femmes, but it doesnt matter if the butch has a penis or the femme a vagina. They are not attracted to androgynes.

Some so-called bisexual women, or straight men, would even be appalled if they found out the very feminine woman they are on a date with, was a post-op transwoman. "OMG, you USED to have a cock?"

This is a difference between bi and pansexuals.

Quote:
In a way, for me it also gives me an indication of the person's background. "Bisexual" means to me "transgendered and genderqueer might be included, but I'm not really part of a community where that's likely to come up",
Or not, as above.

Quote:
while "pansexual" means more "transgendered people and genderqueer people are part of my everyday life or likely to be".

Of course, that could simply be my own interpretation there.
I agree with you there.

Quote:
In the end, it's a matter of point of view I feel. A bit like I prefer "androphile" to "heterosexual". I feel "heterosexual" is convoluted (step 1: what is my sex/gender? Step 2: what is the sex/gender of the people I'm attracted to? Step 3: are they the same or different?) while androphile is much more straightforward and to the point (unique step: what is the sex/gender of people I'm attracted to?)
Also, I like the "phile", which focuses on feelings rather than sex. I know the "sex" of "hetero-/homo-sexual" is biological sex, not the activity, but still, sex comes to mind, and I want to put my feelings first.

But in the end, I'm both heterosexual and androphile. In my case, they're both the same. Still, I favour the latter over the former.
That's a cool explanation.
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 62) loving Pixie (poly, F, 40) since January 2009, living together since 2013
Seeing Kahlo (polyish, M, 45)
Master, (mono, M, 36), Pixie's Dom/bf for 3+ years
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 08-26-2010, 09:38 PM
SourGirl's Avatar
SourGirl SourGirl is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: South of an Igloo, North of a Desert.
Posts: 883
Default

I think, once upon a time I was in this thread, so I am going to ask something,

Magdyln, Can you elaborate on 'So-Called bisexuals' please ? Other then someone who is doing something, they truly do not want to do.

I am having a hard time, seeing that applying to anyone else.

Also,..is there anyone here who actually has intimate, sexual relationships with people who are transgendered ? That`s who I`d want to hear from.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 08-26-2010, 09:44 PM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 6,322
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit View Post
Sorry for using the wrong word. So is genderqueer the best word for someone that does not identify with either gender?
Well RP said she knows a couple people who are OK with the "genderless" term. Most people in the trans community that I have met prefer genderqueer, or gender fluid. If they are the outgoing rebellious sort, they might ID as genderfuckers. Like, "Look at me, people on the street. You cant tell how I ID just by looking at me. Go ahead and try and put me into a box. You can't. Fuck you."
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 62) loving Pixie (poly, F, 40) since January 2009, living together since 2013
Seeing Kahlo (polyish, M, 45)
Master, (mono, M, 36), Pixie's Dom/bf for 3+ years
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:19 AM.