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  #21  
Old 10-14-2013, 06:15 AM
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Sounds like we can conclude that it's damaging to kids to teach them to hate their bodies, themselves, and everything else. I concur with that.

Beyond that, things start getting a little fuzzier, as it's a question of what to expose the kids to, how, and when.

Yes, I was joking about the permanent damage and stuff. Just throwing those visuals out there for reflection and entertainment.

We have agreed that sex and nudity are different because nudity isn't sexual per se, and because nudity is a passive state of being instead of a kinetic state of interaction.

Except ... we still haven't got complete agreement that (public) breastfeeding is (always completely) non-sexual. We also haven't talked about whether kissing (lips), hand-holding, hand-on-butt, and what have you are sexual and if they are does that make them okay for the public eye (the eye of people of all ages).

If it's sexual but okay in public: Why is it okay in public? What about the same kissing, hand-holding, and hand-on-butt and what have you if the persons engaging in such are also nude? Does that change whether it's good for the public eye? Is subtle (nude) fondling okay? Not-so-subtle fondling?

At some point I think you have to split a hair or two to decide what's beneficial (or not) in public.

Other questions: Can kids be taught to view sex positively even if they're also taught abstinence? Alternatively, at what age is it reasonable for kids to start having/experimenting with sex?

Now does it seem like I'm hijacking? The thread title is, "Why do people make such big deals at certain body parts? Why so much self hatred?" Those questions cover a considerable bit of ground.

What sorts of teachings/exposures/examples engender self hatred in people (from childhood up)? Are certain body parts a big deal? If not, what will best teach people (from childhood up) to calm down about those parts?
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  #22  
Old 10-14-2013, 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted by kdt26417 View Post
If it's sexual but okay in public: Why is it okay in public? What about the same kissing, hand-holding, and hand-on-butt and what have you if the persons engaging in such are also nude? Does that change whether it's good for the public eye? Is subtle (nude) fondling okay? Not-so-subtle fondling?
Any thing that can be legally be done clothed can be legally done without clothes.~

I don't think it's legal in many places to have sex in many public places just because you have clothes on.~ XD

I think if you raise your children with an open-minded view of every thing that leaves out illogical damaging concepts such as 'shame', 'modesty', and 'dignity', while teaching them the natural concept of 'respect' as seen in even the wild animals for example, "Don't touch me unless I say you can or I will hurt you.~" I don't think you'll have as many problems as those who raise children the opposite way.~
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Old 10-14-2013, 07:57 PM
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I think that answers some of my questions.

So, there's a fine line between respect and dignity and the latter is the more artificial, damaging concept to instill in one's kids? I emphasize that in my own words because it seems like a fine line indeed. I hope you'll correct me if I've misunderstood that point.

Here I dreaded sparking more disagreement than I could handle; maybe others are as reluctant to admit their risqué opinions as I am?
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Old 10-15-2013, 04:47 AM
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I think that answers some of my questions.

So, there's a fine line between respect and dignity and the latter is the more artificial, damaging concept to instill in one's kids? I emphasize that in my own words because it seems like a fine line indeed. I hope you'll correct me if I've misunderstood that point.

Here I dreaded sparking more disagreement than I could handle; maybe others are as reluctant to admit their risqué opinions as I am?
You've got everything right and you understand all my points.~

It's fine if you have opinions that are contradictory to my own, but don't expect me to immediately agree with them, to follow them blindly like the blind fools who give all other 'believers in possibly something beyond death' an infamous name, not to challenge them, and not to ask that you explain how and why you believe such things.~
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Old 10-15-2013, 04:52 AM
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You do know I'm an atheist by the way, don't you?

Naw, you're right, it would be no fun (and no use besides) if you accepted my points of view just because they sounded nice. But I'll be honest, I'm trying to avoid stating a lot of point of views at this juncture of the thread. Using lots of question marks instead. Trying to tease opinions out of other people, since I'm too chicken to offer mine.

Not that hitting me with a direct question wouldn't put a chink in my armor, but you didn't hear me say that.
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Old 10-15-2013, 05:46 AM
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You do know I'm an atheist by the way, don't you?

Naw, you're right, it would be no fun (and no use besides) if you accepted my points of view just because they sounded nice. But I'll be honest, I'm trying to avoid stating a lot of point of views at this juncture of the thread. Using lots of question marks instead. Trying to tease opinions out of other people, since I'm too chicken to offer mine.

Not that hitting me with a direct question wouldn't put a chink in my armor, but you didn't hear me say that.
You're a brave wonderful man to admit that.~ ^_^
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  #27  
Old 10-15-2013, 06:35 AM
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Just for the record I don't hate my body (not saying that I couldn't be in better shape and lose 10#). I'm not ashamed of it and I actually think I look better without clothes (clothes tend to make me look shapeless - you can't tell there are actually little curves and things under there).

Even when I am free to wear, or not, whatever I want I still tend to wear some clothing most of the time - for temperature regulation and protection from the elements...and because I don't like random bits of stuff (dog hair, bits of grass and leaves, dust, etc.) sticking to my squishy bits.

For me it is mostly about comfort.

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  #28  
Old 10-15-2013, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by JaneQSmythe View Post
Just for the record I don't hate my body (not saying that I couldn't be in better shape and lose 10#). I'm not ashamed of it and I actually think I look better without clothes (clothes tend to make me look shapeless - you can't tell there are actually little curves and things under there).

Even when I am free to wear, or not, whatever I want I still tend to wear some clothing most of the time - for temperature regulation and protection from the elements...and because I don't like random bits of stuff (dog hair, bits of grass and leaves, dust, etc.) sticking to my squishy bits.

For me it is mostly about comfort.

JaneQ
Duly noted, thank you for sharing that!~ ^_^ *hug*
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  #29  
Old 10-15-2013, 06:41 PM
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Good points, JaneQ.

Little curves and things under there? Now you've got my attention.

Okay ColorsWolf and all other participants and would-be participants on this thread, I have yet another riddle that I'll let you guys solve. Nudity = all natural, it's just a state of being. But wait, what if some poor fellow wants to be a naturist, and finds that his junk is starting to get excited? Is it time for him to cover up? Is it sexual? Is it just natural? It's not like he's *doing* anything to cause the spectacle, is he?

On a smaller scale, I suppose we could apply the same riddle to nipple arousal. Once again, the person's not doing anything to cause it, it's just happening. Okay to overlook it? Does the person need to cover up? Just playing the devil's advocate here again, questioning that fine line between sex and mere nudity.
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  #30  
Old 10-16-2013, 01:59 AM
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Originally Posted by kdt26417 View Post
Good points, JaneQ.

Little curves and things under there? Now you've got my attention.

Okay ColorsWolf and all other participants and would-be participants on this thread, I have yet another riddle that I'll let you guys solve. Nudity = all natural, it's just a state of being. But wait, what if some poor fellow wants to be a naturist, and finds that his junk is starting to get excited? Is it time for him to cover up? Is it sexual? Is it just natural? It's not like he's *doing* anything to cause the spectacle, is he?

On a smaller scale, I suppose we could apply the same riddle to nipple arousal. Once again, the person's not doing anything to cause it, it's just happening. Okay to overlook it? Does the person need to cover up? Just playing the devil's advocate here again, questioning that fine line between sex and mere nudity.
Please re-word your phrasing of the male genitalia as that is highly insulting.~

Why should he cover up?~

I'm not sure Humanity is ready for a beautiful positive sex-everywhere all the time with no problem-every-day sort of thing.~

Until then, let us stick to non-sexual nudity.~

If he is not physically pleasuring himself in order to make himself physically aroused, then this is a every day occurrence kind of thing that can happen for any number of reasons.~

As a healthy natural bodily function with the above conditions met, there is absolutely no reason why he should cover himself up.~

This is also why I don't like to associate with many who would call themselves 'nudists' because many of them are hypocritical in following their own philosophy only when it suits them.~

Last edited by ColorsWolf; 10-16-2013 at 06:23 AM.
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