Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > Poly Relationships Corner

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 05-30-2013, 03:07 PM
AnnabelMore's Avatar
AnnabelMore AnnabelMore is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,285
Default

I feel like veto power makes sense before a relationship starts, as in "this person really sketches me out, I wish you wouldn't start dating them." But after a relationship is underway, that's a terrible thing to have hanging over your heads, the thought that what you're building could get yanked away at any time for reasons thay don't have anything to do with what either one of you wants. As such, I'm very much anti-veto power for established relationships, I think it's corrosive and cruel. It's also sometimes called the "nuclear option", because it's likely to cause great harm to his marriage if it's invoked... how could he fail to resent his wife for taking away someone he loves? It's really just no good for anyone.

That said, even if an explicit veto power gets taken off the table, implicit veto power will remain, in that it's only reasonable to think that if his marriage is on the line he will almost certainly choose to save it. That's not a rule, just a reality. So, I would ask that the rule be dispensed with for your peace of mind, but with the understanding that the reality is still the same. It's just something to come to terms with.

Are there any other rules, explicit or implicit, that are bumming you out?

As for his busy schedule... nothing to be done about that except to 1) get really good at squeezing time in here and there, and/or 2) see if you can be a bigger part of the rest of his life. My gf and I only have dates about once a month right now, but we stay connected because we see each other much more often than that... I come over to help watch the baby, I join her for exercise classes, eat dinner with her and her husband, we go out to events together. In addition to strengthening my relationship with her, it also strengthens my friendship with her husband (which helps deal with the already very, very small fear that he would ever try to invoke some kind of veto) and helps me feel like I'm adding to her ability to successfully manage her busy life rather than taking away (if I couldn't do that I might well feel very guilty dating someone with a toddler to take care of!).

On the other hand, it sounds like you're very busy too so maybe spending more time in his world isn't feasible for you. Obviously his wife would have to be okay with it too, which could take time.

I think your rationale in being exclusive with him for now makes sense. I'm glad that you recognize that you will need more and that that's ok, and that, if you're willing to wait for the right person who's either already poly or who is open-minded, finding someone new doesn't have to mean losing him (if you both thought it did, it would be giving your future partner a sort of preemptive veto power... just something to consider).
__________________
Me, 30ish bi female, been doing solo poly for roughly 5 years. Gia, Clay, and Pike, my partners. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler.

Last edited by AnnabelMore; 05-30-2013 at 03:14 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-30-2013, 03:50 PM
Hetaera Hetaera is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Northeast
Posts: 66
Default

More on exclusivity...

Why do you want to be exclusive to your lover?

For now at least, I don't feel like I want another man inside of me for whatever reason. I know this will change in the future though. I'm am totally open to being with another woman though. Also, no matter how careful one is with "safe sex" practices, condoms can break (I've known a few experienced condoms users that have had failures). Since this man is married & has a wife with a young one who is still being nursed, I feel especially obligated to be safe. I realize that there are safety concerns with women as well.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:38 PM
Vixtoria's Avatar
Vixtoria Vixtoria is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 306
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hetaera View Post
What should I call myself then? I'm open to suggestions!
Girlfriend, boyfriend, lover. they all work. DC calls himself secondary sometimes, but mostly just boyfriend. HE chooses to not have a more serious relationship. Just today we were talking and he said he likes being boyfriend, not really interested in more. Some people use the terms anchors instead of primary and secondary.

Most of what seems to grate is people assuming the level of love is the definition. When someone says DH is my primary it has nothing to do with level of love and more to do with the fact that our lives are so much more intertwined. Living together, shared finances, children. When discussing our future, it's pretty connected. DC is connected as well, but not as directly. He's looking into a career that will have him moving around a lot and does not expect that we would move with him but that he'd be able to visit more often.
__________________
Me: 40 pansexual poly.
DH: My husband of 21 yrs and father of 3 teen girls.
DC: LDR of +9 years/former
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:48 PM
london london is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: UK - land of the free
Posts: 1,635
Default

Quote:
in that it's only reasonable to think that if his marriage is on the line he will almost certainly choose to save it.
I don't think that's always the case. If someone discovers that ethical non monogamy fulfills them more than either monogamy did or cheating would and their primary partner is unable to cope without a monogamous relationship, I think that a lot of people would choose ethical non monogamy over the other options. Especially if they started their primary relationship with the intention of it being non monogamous and/or they have other relationships which they are committed to.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-30-2013, 09:39 PM
Hetaera Hetaera is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Northeast
Posts: 66
Default

I'm working on arranging a meeting with the wife...we're thinking of doing it one weekend when I have my kids so we can all meet each other. I think it'll go well. I have shared some of the suggested reading with my lover regarding "secondaries" & I have no problem standing up for myself.

The one problem is that I think his wife just thought he was going to find another woman to have sex with, but we have already developed a very strong emotional bond. I hope I can develop a bond with her too since we love the same man & I want everyone to be happy & feel good about this arrangement.
__________________
Me- Bi-female-early 40s- Single Mom to 2 young boys
Exploring & having fun for the time being after a long & unhappy marriage

There is no failure. Only feedback. -Robert Allen
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-07-2013, 12:49 AM
Hetaera Hetaera is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Northeast
Posts: 66
Default

AnnabelMore- Thank you for all the kind words! I like you!

This is all pretty new so we'll have to discuss the veto power thing. We have already decided that we will end the physical part if she can't handle it but she can't veto our friendship.

Met the wife, it went very well. The only problem is that he doesn't have a lot of free time & they live 1.5 hours away. We'll see how it all works out. I've actually offered to come to their house & help them work (they have a farm & I love farm work) just to spend more time with him & his family. I would love to get to know his wife better & their baby. I'd gladly watch the baby so they could have some time to themselves or get work done.

I only referred to myself as secondary as a means of communicating the dynamics of the situation. He calls me his girlfriend (or whatever ridiculously silly thing he comes up with), I say he's my boyfriend or lover. It's funny that I'm in love with someone & can't tell certain people in my family mostly. Luckily, most of my friends can handle my unconventional lifestyle for the most part even though they find it hard to believe that she's ok with it. I have a date tomorrow with a very interesting woman & am hopeful that we can spend some time together as well.

I am free to be with whomever I choose, the exclusivity thing is about me enjoying the special feeling I have with him. He makes no demands on me being exclusive even though he enjoys it.
__________________
Me- Bi-female-early 40s- Single Mom to 2 young boys
Exploring & having fun for the time being after a long & unhappy marriage

There is no failure. Only feedback. -Robert Allen
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 06-07-2013, 10:57 AM
Hetaera Hetaera is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Northeast
Posts: 66
Default

The Ethical Slut is an eye opener & just b/c you aren't one or don't get it means it isn't useful. Sex at Dawn isn't about polyamory per se but it is very interesting & explains human sexuality in evolutionary terms & explains why poly- & bi-sexuality make complete sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisplove View Post
Hi Loving Radiance, I've been lurking and reading A LOT. I also just started reading The Ethical Slut, and, my goodness, what an eye opener.

What other books would you recommend for someone just getting into this? Is there a recommended reading thread?

I've done some reading on morethantwo.com. However, it assumes that you already know that you want to be poly. I'm still sifting and learning about a whole new world of relationships. I'm a neophyte.

Thanks for the rec:-)
__________________
Me- Bi-female-early 40s- Single Mom to 2 young boys
Exploring & having fun for the time being after a long & unhappy marriage

There is no failure. Only feedback. -Robert Allen
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 06-07-2013, 03:43 PM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 6,275
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hetaera View Post

The one problem is that I think his wife just thought he was going to find another woman to have sex with, but we have already developed a very strong emotional bond.
Well, that is a HUGE renegotiation on their side then. She may never be OK with him loving another. She just wanted him to have casual sex? It's a common problem. But it's not polyamory if there is just fucking around going on.

2 loves. Now what? That is between them. Work for them to do. Hard work.

Quote:
I hope I can develop a bond with her too since we love the same man & I want everyone to be happy & feel good about this arrangement.

Well, now. First she has to get behind her h loving another, now you want her to "love" you too? A lot to ask. Slow down! Maybe being a good friend with you would help her. Maybe she'd just rather be cordial and polite, but not hang out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hetaera View Post

Met the wife, it went very well. The only problem is that he doesn't have a lot of free time & they live 1.5 hours away. We'll see how it all works out. I've actually offered to come to their house & help them work (they have a farm & I love farm work) just to spend more time with him & his family. I would love to get to know his wife better & their baby. I'd gladly watch the baby so they could have some time to themselves or get work done.
Again, slow down. Does the wife WANT you in her territory, with her animals and equipment and sitting HER kids? You might think you're being helpful, but give her time. You've only met her once. She might not want you all up in her space like that yet, or ever.

Quote:
I have a date tomorrow with a very interesting woman & am hopeful that we can spend some time together as well.
Good luck on your date.
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 62) loving Pixie (poly, F, 40) since January 2009, living together since 2013
Seeing Kahlo (polyish, M, 45)
Master, (mono, M, 36), Pixie's Dom/bf for 3+ years
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 06-07-2013, 04:37 PM
YouAreHere's Avatar
YouAreHere YouAreHere is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: SoNH
Posts: 1,341
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magdlyn View Post
Again, slow down. Does the wife WANT you in her territory, with her animals and equipment and sitting HER kids? You might think you're being helpful, but give her time. You've only met her once. She might not want you all up in her space like that yet, or ever.
THIS! A thousand times this!

My inner Momma Bear kicked in big time when my metamour said she wanted an Auntie-like relationship with my kids. I know she just wants us all to be closer, but it will be what it will be, and wanting something with my kids when I'm not ready for it, period, only serves to make me dig in my heels more and get into protective mode.

My space (including the space of my kids) is mine (or theirs) to give, not anybody's to take. And certainly not anybody's to complain about not having.

(Sorry, it's a sore spot of mine, since my metamour and I just recently went around in circles on this and FINALLY seem to have ironed it out)

Last edited by YouAreHere; 06-07-2013 at 04:39 PM. Reason: Clarity
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 06-07-2013, 04:54 PM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 6,275
Default

Also, in rereading your OP, I see where you say you don't want to lose yourself in another relationship, but here you are wanting to get onto their farm, work on the farm, babysit their kids. Beware. Seems you're doing something you were set against in the OP.

Seeing someone once or twice a week is plenty for someone who wants some distance and just a FWB. Seems you're of two minds, eh? 2 failed marriages, many failed relationships, other gfs getting jealous of you?

Time to apply your school smarts to your own life. I advise you to back off on the meetings and the texting and let his wife get used to the idea her man has another love. I hear you say you never fall in love so fast, you never fuck on the first date, you never O on the first sex. So, that is all thrilling. But be careful, be respectful of his wife. You do get to make your needs and desires known, but so do they, and it's all got to be negotiated.
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 62) loving Pixie (poly, F, 40) since January 2009, living together since 2013
Seeing Kahlo (polyish, M, 45)
Master, (mono, M, 36), Pixie's Dom/bf for 3+ years
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:07 AM.