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  #461  
Old 06-05-2013, 04:09 PM
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If I am truly poly, why am I adjusting to this so easily and letting it become my new normal?
Because we as humans are incredibly adaptable and will do what is necessary to do whatever is necessary to meet our goals/needs. Who's to say how you may feel about things 2, 5, 10, 20 years in the future. Also, don't discount the fact that you did need to be poly in the past. Would you be as strong today without your past?
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  #462  
Old 06-05-2013, 04:46 PM
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Because we as humans are incredibly adaptable and will do what is necessary to do whatever is necessary to meet our goals/needs. Who's to say how you may feel about things 2, 5, 10, 20 years in the future. Also, don't discount the fact that you did need to be poly in the past. Would you be as strong today without your past?
I guess that is what I am struggling with. I am not sure I ever really needed it. I think I wanted it more than needed it. Was it something I could live without? Yes. Was I trying to stick it to society or say to hell with the normative that society preaches? No. At 15-16, I did not give a damn about society. Some people act like poly is something they need to breathe, and if forced to be in a mono relationship, they would die because of misery. I do not feel that way. I do not feel like I am missing anything or even in need of anything. I am genuinely happy and content with everything in my life.

The way some people describe monogamy is like it is the most evil existence. It took me awhile to adapt and adjust to not living by a schedule, but I am finding that life on "the other side" is not bad. In fact, I KNOW I would be happy like this. Short-term and long-term. I am not sure I want to go back to living life on a schedule like a custody arrangement. Seriously, I felt like a child being bounced between parents. Messed up way of thinking, and sure, I had control of who I went with or how I spent my time. SMT -- he had me. On Wed -- she had me. Th/Fri -- up in the air. Sat -- with him. Sunday -- him, her, and family. I am beginning to think that no matter how the schedule is arranged, I am not sure I would ever want to live like that again. I think I am being too hard on myself, but I cannot keep them in limbo forever. I just feel like I need to commit to one or the other. Right now, I am simply confused.

I probably would be this strong. Strength is sexy to me.
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  #463  
Old 06-05-2013, 08:32 PM
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Some people associate monogamy with dysfunction, possessiveness, or barbarism. I don't necessarily agree with that association. Furthermore, I personally don't subscribe to the either/or model when it comes to deciding whether one is monogamous or polyamorous. I think most of us are a portion of each (and the percentages may change over time). Maybe you're 50% monogamous and 50% polyamorous. Heck, maybe right now you're 80% monogamous and 20% polyamorous, and might stay that way for awhile, or swing even further into the monogamous realm.

I guess my point is, I don't think it's necessary to stress over whether or not you are poly (orientation-wise -- your current situation is 90% or 100% monogamous). Actually, I am 99% sure Matt will never be okay with poly, and if my guess is right, then it's just as well if you adapt yourself to monogamy and leave it at that. You don't think you'd leave Matt, do you? Assuming that's a big huge "No," monogamy is in your future, and I see no reason why you shouldn't adapt yourself to it.

I hope we on Polyamory.com haven't pressured you in any way to be poly (or at least be torn up about it). I just encourage you to be yourself, and immerse yourself in the life that brings you happiness.
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  #464  
Old 06-05-2013, 09:04 PM
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Some people associate monogamy with dysfunction, possessiveness, or barbarism. I don't necessarily agree with that association. Furthermore, I personally don't subscribe to the either/or model when it comes to deciding whether one is monogamous or polyamorous. I think most of us are a portion of each (and the percentages may change over time). Maybe you're 50% monogamous and 50% polyamorous. Heck, maybe right now you're 80% monogamous and 20% polyamorous, and might stay that way for awhile, or swing even further into the monogamous realm.

I guess my point is, I don't think it's necessary to stress over whether or not you are poly (orientation-wise -- your current situation is 90% or 100% monogamous). Actually, I am 99% sure Matt will never be okay with poly, and if my guess is right, then it's just as well if you adapt yourself to monogamy and leave it at that. You don't think you'd leave Matt, do you? Assuming that's a big huge "No," monogamy is in your future, and I see no reason why you shouldn't adapt yourself to it.

I hope we on Polyamory.com haven't pressured you in any way to be poly (or at least be torn up about it). I just encourage you to be yourself, and immerse yourself in the life that brings you happiness.
No pressure from anyone but myself. I cannot even say I am receiving pressure from Matt or Si. They are patiently waiting for me to get myself together. It is me feeling like I am keeping two people in limbo. I am not sure I can commit to monogamy with him, but I am not sure I can commit to a relationship with her again either. I loved being with her, but I do not want to live by a schedule/calendar again. I love the spontaneity that we have now, but I am still in love with her. I miss her, but I also only like being accountable for one person's needs. I never thought I would ever want to be someone's one and only, but I am getting accustomed to him being that for me. There is always a "but," and in my mind, that is a problem. He has nothing to say on it for now. That might very well change. We are going to our first session with the new therapist tomorrow, so the week-long poly discussion ban might be lifted temporarily.

I know some of this is expected after a shake-up and changes. There is a high chance Matt will never be okay with poly again. Despite the first several years flowing fine, the last five years of bad decisions probably did him in. Our therapist and someone on here pointed out something, too. She said that for those first eight years, my two lives never intersected in more than a social setting. He was never adversely affected by my relationship with her. My issues with her did not carry over into our marriage. It had certain characteristics of a DADT model, but I could talk to him about my relationship. He gave excellent advice many times over. He was respectful towards her. I doubt that he cared about my intimate life with her. The only time it was even brought up was my no bed-hopping boundary. He consented to the relationship and had no problem as long as it did not impede our marriage or affect him in some way. It never bothered him because it did not affect him. When the two started crossing and it did take a toll on our marriage (the parenting situation, lessened quality time, absence from home, etc.), that was when the problem came in. I am not even sure a model like before could be duplicated. That just happened naturally, and it was the shape that it took on.

Last edited by FullofLove1052; 06-05-2013 at 09:09 PM.
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  #465  
Old 06-05-2013, 09:23 PM
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I am thinking that the entrance of kids into the picture was what changed everything. It is easier to be spontaneous without kids you're responsible for. Once kids are in the picture, a calendar becomes necessary. Heck, that is probably true in monogamy as well (to a lesser extent), and will probably become more true as the kids get older and have more events at school and stuff.

Plus of course the entrance of the kids was when the parenting conflict started. It's possible you may not be able to consider poly again until the kids are grown up and have places of their own. Doesn't seem fair to keep Si waiting that long, but she should at least know what's on the table.

From what I know so far, poly is simply not an option for you at this time (not realistically). That may change in the future. We will know more after there have been some more counseling sessions with Matt. You have to know how he feels about poly before you know whether it's something you can consider.

In the meantime, I would just sit back and enjoy the perks of monogamous life. Tell Si you do not know what the future holds, that it's likely Matt will never say "okay" to poly, and that you don't expect her to wait for you. I know it sucks to have to tell Si that, but that's kind of the reality of the situation.

I suppose you can still be friends with Si, even if nothing romantic ever recurs in that area. Sorry, I know some of this is probably not quite what you'd want to hear.
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  #466  
Old 06-05-2013, 09:53 PM
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A calendar is going to be necessary. We just joined the Parent Association yesterday. They recognised us when we went in to order our daughter's uniforms. They have a full calendar of events, meetings, and all kinds of activities. Plus, my daughter wants to continue ballet. With her new school, she will be learning a foreign language and taking music lessons. There is a good chance the music lessons will not only be during school hours. We will find out more in the coming weeks. Something tells me we have not seen anything, yet.

My youngest will be 1 in exactly three weeks. 17 more years until he is off to someone's university or whatever he plans on doing after 18. 13 more years until she is off to university or at least of a legal age. It would be outrageous to expect someone to wait that long. True love may never die, but hope should after that much time. That sucks to think about.

I keep telling myself it is not a feasible or realistic option. I have worked this equation many ways, and the answer remains the same. I know some of how he feels, but it is not enough to work with at this point. Little bits and pieces are coming out. He has confided in me over the past few days. I do know that right now he is not particularly fond of the idea, but he is not completely shutting it down. Rightfully so. We agreed to do a check-in of sorts in x amount of time. I am okay with that. The last thing I need is anything taking my energy and attention away from the rebuilding process. We have come a long way, but we still have plenty of work to do. Once we are back on solid ground, there might be a shift, and we might be able to meet on common ground and compromise.

I really do not have much of a choice but to enjoy this. I have pretty much told her that I do not know what the future holds, and she is free to move on, if she so desires. With my blessing and all. She has expressed no interest in doing so right now or any time soon. Her choice. I barely know what 12 hours will hold, so I am not going to stop her future.I am just going with the flow of the currents in the harbour of life. I intend on keeping our friendship. She is very special to me and very important in my life. No, it is not what I need to hear, but it is my new reality and something I think about every day.
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  #467  
Old 06-05-2013, 11:35 PM
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Well, if Matt eventually finds he is okay with some kind of poly compromise, and you are also okay with that kind of compromise (as it will surely include a calendar), then that is great, you can re-start something with Si if you want. Sigh, we can always dream, right? It's great that Si is patiently waiting for now. She certainly has a right to change her mind later and move on.

I think everything must remain in a holding pattern until there has been some more counseling (and some more negotiation). Heh, that's just my point of view though; I am certainly viewing the situation from afar.
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Old 06-06-2013, 12:48 AM
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You are right. Therapy is going to be our nearest and dearest friend. We are all going to be in counselling for awhile. I get the feeling those two will be in therapy for years. They have to start from scratch and learn the basics for how to communicate with one another. Every one's communication style is different. His approach is respectful but direct, and people sometimes get offended. It is not his intent, but he is just blunt. Such as the case when they got into their argument.

The good news is Matt and I are breaking free of the chains that are binding us. Those bad habits? Those are chains. I have broken free of quite a few. Bad decisions and horrible judgement calls? Chains. Fear of trusting me? He is breaking through that. I know he trusts me more. I no longer have to wonder. One by one, we will break free. I never thought the sound of chains falling would be music to my ears and my heart, but they are.

Yes, we can dream. I admire her patience. Even in her position, she is somehow finding it within her heart to be understanding and supportive of my decision to work on my marriage and my indecisiveness over my future with her. All the while, she is not rushing me to make a decision and patiently waiting. If anything, I love her more for that.

My life, my life, my life.
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Old 06-06-2013, 01:03 AM
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  #470  
Old 06-09-2013, 09:29 PM
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Default 13 weeks later...where are we now?

Hello, hello, hello.

We are back in the UK after about 19.5 hours of travelling. We left a bit before Midnight on 9th June, and we flew to SIN. That was 7 hours, and it arrived early. We had a four hour layover, and we got on our flight to Heathrow a bit after 9:30 AM yesterday morning. With all the time zones and changes, we arrived at Heathrow about 3:40 this afternoon. We had to drive back in to London, and fortunately, traffic was not ridiculously heavy. We have already unpacked. I cooked dinner, and we ate as a family. Matt's in his office working on something. My children are sleep. It was a fight to keep them awake until it was their normal bedtime.. I want them to wake up on our time tomorrow morning. Whirlwind weekend.

It has been 13 weeks and 3 days since everything in my world fell apart. That is wild. The past week has been wonderful on so many different levels. We did reconnect, and we bonded. He finally opened up to me 100%. Full disclosure. I am thrilled for that. We saw our new home, which is almost complete. We explored the city and quite a few surrounding areas. We got in touch with nature on Friday. We saw kangaroos, emus, cockatoos, wombats, and we had lunch at this winery and bought chocolate galore. He was sampling chocolate covered insects. Gross. We completed the 1,000 steps at Kokoda. It was easier going back down, but we talked going up and down. After, we headed back to Mel to get ready for our counselling session. All in all, it was a perfect week. I loved every moment that we spent together. I am on a happy high. I loved not living by a schedule and just kind of going with the flow. I loved laying around, cuddling, and eating ice cream. I loved the many talks we had. I loved spending time with him and not having to worry about where I needed to be or was supposed to be. It was really quite wonderful. I cannot explain how relaxed I am.

My MIL and I had a heart to heart. She opened my eyes to some things. Matt was taking the steps needed to start divorce proceedings. She talked him out of. That surprised me. I knew Matt was fed up and close to the edge. I had no idea that he had already taken steps like checking on the validity of the pre/post-nups, consulting with legal counsel, and days within filling out the paperwork. He had already started the process of looking for another place. Like I told someone earlier, she humbled the fuck out of me. I knew it was bad. He had it in his mind that as soon as he touched back down in London, he was walking away from our marriage and moving out.

She also told me about just how hurt he really was. I do not think I fully grasped it, but she put in another perspective. She admitted that she had some ill thoughts about me and things she wanted to do to me. She said, "You do not understand. When you are a mother and someone hurts your child, you go into protective mode. No matter how old that child may be. I went in to lioness mode, and even you being the mother of my grandchildren was not enough to prevent me from wanting to hurt you." She asked me flat out, "Are you going to repeat the same choice again?" I just kind of sat there, and I finally said, "Well, to be honest, Mrs. x, I am considering getting back with my ex." Her eyebrow was raised to the Gods. She said, "You just do not get it. I know you are intelligent, but you are lacking common sense. You hurt him once, and he took you back and forgave you. Now, you are going to do the same thing again? Have you learned nothing, child?" All I could respond with was, "No, ma'am." Truth is, she is right. I hurt him, and I am looking to do the same things that caused that hurt again. What happened to lessons being learned?

The relationship with my MIL has always been strained. When she found out I was in another relationship, she went off on me. She said that I was not good enough for her son and that I needed to quit slutting it up. She said I should have never gotten married if I could not honour the vow of faithfulness. She was a bitch to me. Matt defended my choice, and it cost him their relationship. He told her that if she could not respect me and my choices, then, they had nothing further to discuss and that meant losing him. Before that even happened, she blackballed my ex. As one of the heads of the family, she poisoned every member of their family. My ex was not allowed in their homes. Christmas and any holidays like that? She needed not to travel with us because she would have been stuck in a hotel room the whole time. I chose to let my MIL have a relationship with my children. She has never mistreated them, and I was not going to deprive them the chance to have a relationship with their grandparents. It would have been a fight to the death with Matt if I had even tried to stop them from having a relationship. I did not have a relationship with my grandfather until he was on his death bed. As long as she is alive and well, there is no reason for me to interfere.

We went to our first session with our new therapist, Dr. L., on Friday evening. She dived in head first. I love her style and approach. She asked Matt what he would need to even consider the idea of poly again. Boy, oh boy. It was a list. Everything from no more than one overnight a week (the night he works overnight at one of the hospital's 24 hour clinics) to weekly check-ins/schedule exchanges to family holidays to the demand for protected sex to specific time frames to wanting to spend 1 hour with me before I leave for this overnight and 1 hour with me when I return in the morning by the given time.

He had it spelled out to the letter. Out of the things on the list, nothing is over the top or ridiculous. He is being more generous than I would be in his position. I would not even be willing to consider it. The biggest and most surprising things for me were that he does not want to be out after we move. Matt caught hell in the form of severing ties with his mother, who he was really close to, his family in general, and some former friends. Being out cost him dearly, and I am okay with not being out. In addition to that, one of the things he had on the list was no PDA in front of our children. In addition to that, he does not want them exposed to poly. Especially now that our daughter is older and at a formidable age. What I see with his list is that as long as my outside dealings do not infringe upon our family time, does not lessen the amount of quality time between us, and does not lessen the quality of our marriage, I am free to do whatever I want. Remember those are the very things that happened over the past five years.

This model is similar to what we had. He and my ex have been talking. He told her what it would take, and I guess she had no objections. I am still not at the point where I am even considering poly again. We have quite a bit of work to do. Every day, we are improving and getting better, but I am determined to focus all of my energy on healing and rebuilding our marriage. It is nice to have that "option," but I am happy right now. They are getting along and start therapy next month. He and I are doing really well and much better. We are back in counselling. He finally trusts me. Not completely but he is not doubting my every word. I am slowly beginning to trust my own judgement again.

I know that if I so desire, I can and will be able to get back in a relationship with my ex. However, I am happy with how things are now. I am still rebuilding my marriage and honing basic relationship skills that will prove beneficial to both relationships if that time comes. I am in no rush to move out of this stage. I am just kind of chilling and enjoying the view.
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anger management, bisexual female, blame, break-ups, breaking up, changing loyalties, children, co-parenting, competition, coupledom, demanding partners, divorce, forgiveness, from poly to mono, healing, making excuses, married and polyamorous, poly co-parenting, poly to mono, primary/secondary, therapy, triad fallout, trust, vee dynamics, vee vs. triad

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