Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > Introductions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-13-2015, 05:24 PM
DragonMan's Avatar
DragonMan DragonMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11
Default New to Forum, not new to lifestyle.

Hello all,
My name is Doug. I am happily married to a wonderful woman with six adult children, all but one living on their own.
R and I have a great relationship that has included 'encounters' with others over the years.
My first issue, in brief:
As a good looking and outgoing female, my wife can pretty much get the attention of any man she fancies. Such is the nature of men.
As the male (confident and not ugly), I have found it extremely difficult to convince another woman that it is 'okay' to spend time with me and see how things progress. Such is the nature of women in general.
This is causing a very one sided situation since a few years ago I agreed to let R go solo with her interests.
This has resulted in a situation where recently I have actually had to put the brakes on the whole 'experiment' of our polyamory.
I have long ago come to terms with my issues of jealousy....in fact, I am happy and excited for her when she gets the opportunity to share her affection, for she is an awesome women and has much love to give.
But I can't help feeling that, because of the nature of man and women and the differences mentioned above, that this arrangement is becoming very unfair.
Any help would be appreciated.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-13-2015, 06:36 PM
FallenAngelina's Avatar
FallenAngelina FallenAngelina is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,870
Default

I'm curious to know, if jealousy is not the issue here, why you must put the brakes on her? MUST? Marriage is not about doing everything the other person is doing. If your wife found enormous success in her career would you then feel compelled to make her quit if you were not at the exact same income level? Of course not. You would never require her to reign in her joyful experience of something just because you did not experience the same joy, just to keep things fair. Your situation is typical - poly women find male partners much more plentiful than poly men find female partners, but life is full of inequities. That doesn't mean we should prevent other people from enjoying their successes. Attempting to go down the poly path hand in hand seems to cause couples much more anguish than joy. Why not just be two individuals who are open to enjoying other individuals?
__________________
~ Karen

Last edited by FallenAngelina; 04-13-2015 at 06:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-13-2015, 07:34 PM
DragonMan's Avatar
DragonMan DragonMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11
Default

Angel,
Fair questions.
Perhaps an expansion of your work analogy might explain the unfairness that I feel I am experiencing.

Let us say that both her and I started a company....a partnership. Each brought their skill set to bring success to the partnership company.
But I pay myself alll of the profits/perks, and she recieves no compensation for her effort.
Would you still consider this a simple situation of, as you put it, "but life is full of inequities"?

Any healthy relationship is a loving partnership.
I truly wish to make my partner as happy and successfull as possible.
I do believe she feels the same....otherwise I would not even be with her.

The real question ( might be....I am not sure....that is why I joined this forum ).....should not both/many/all in the relationship get something positive from the polyamorous arrangement?

Isn't that the whole idea?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-13-2015, 08:04 PM
kdt26417's Avatar
kdt26417 kdt26417 is offline
Official Greeter
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Yelm, Washington
Posts: 13,126
Default

Greetings Doug,
Welcome to our forum. Please feel free to lurk, browse, etc.

Re: arrangement unfair due to the nature of men and women ... is a common problem that comes up often here. I don't think there's a way to fix it per se; the best you can do is look for ways to improve your own odds.

Have you tried OKCupid? other poly-friendly dating sites?

Have you sought out local poly groups in your area? If you build platonic friendships in a poly environment, one or more could grow into a romance later on.

It can also help to mingle with fringe groups that are more likely to be open-minded about polyamory. BDSM, Ren faires, indie concerts, etc.

FWIW, I'll note that I'm one of the males in a hetero MFM V. I only have one partner, whereas she has two. So one could argue that the arrangement is unfair towards me (and towards the other man). But, I've gotten used to it, and don't feel shortchanged. The lady of our V is very evenhanded.

Sincerely,
Kevin T., "official greeter"

Notes:

There's a *lot* of good info in Golden Nuggets. Have a look!

Please read through the guidelines if you haven't already.

Note: You needn't read every reply to your posts, especially if someone posts in a disagreeable way. Given the size and scope of the site it's hard not to run into the occasional disagreeable person. Please contact the mods if you do (or if you see any spam), and you can block the person if you want.

If you have any questions about the board itself, please private-message a mod and they'll do their best to help.

Welcome aboard!
__________________
Love means never having to say, "Put down that meat cleaver!"
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-13-2015, 08:51 PM
GreenAcres GreenAcres is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Virginia
Posts: 571
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonMan View Post
Angel,


Any healthy relationship is a loving partnership.
I truly wish to make my partner as happy and successfull as possible.
I do believe she feels the same....otherwise I would not even be with her.

The real question ( might be....I am not sure....that is why I joined this forum ).....should not both/many/all in the relationship get something positive from the polyamorous arrangement?

Isn't that the whole idea?
If by "something positive" you mean shouldn't both partners get equally as much attention from other people, then no. Polyamory isn't a game of tit-for-tat or things being equal. It's about forming more than one loving relationship. Penalizing her for getting more attention is kind of juvenile.

There are many positive things that can come from polyamory that aren't simply how much attention you get outside your marriage. Examples include, but are not limited to:

- A chance to meet and connect with new people, whether you end up in a relationship with them or not.

-A way to explore things you may not otherwise have explored, to meet people or as dates.

-A happy, fulfilled spouse who is meeting his/her needs, which helps them also meet yours.

-Time on your own to do things you enjoy that your spouse may not like to do.

-The opportunity to grow as a person, based on the experiences you have with others. It's easy, in a relationship, to get complacent about things like attending social events, finding or continuing hobbies, etc.--the things that make us interesting. It's also a good opportunity to view yourself through the eyes of someone not your spouse, and see if there is internal or external work that would help you become a better person, but which your partner hasn't mentioned because they don't mind so much or are simply used to.

-Sometimes, better and more frequent sex (especially for women, getting sex begets wanting more sex)

If you are actually mono, then that is one thing. But, if you're poly and just mad that things aren't going your way so you're going to take your ball and go home, that's very unfair to your wife. Rather than penalize her for her success (and, if you must see it this way, for the "differences" in men and women--though, I can tell you as a bi woman, I've gotten almost exactly the same reactions to poly from men and women, especially after dating them for a while, when the "casual" dating phase is passed), perhaps, as Kevin suggests, put more effort into upping your odds. Join a dating site, go to meetups, find groups where the lifestyle is more prevalent, etc.
__________________
Bi Female in VA with a passion for outdoor adventure, cooking, reading, health and fitness, and adventure!

Relationship saturated, and not looking for additional partners.

Last edited by GreenAcres; 04-13-2015 at 08:57 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-13-2015, 09:06 PM
GreenAcres GreenAcres is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Virginia
Posts: 571
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonMan View Post
Angel,


Let us say that both her and I started a company....a partnership. Each brought their skill set to bring success to the partnership company.
But I pay myself alll of the profits/perks, and she recieves no compensation for her effort.
Would you still consider this a simple situation of, as you put it, "but life is full of inequities"?
This doesn't work as an analogy, If the "company" is your marriage. Your wife has a responsibility to be present in your marriage, contribute, treat you with respect, etc. If she's doing that, then she's giving you all the "perks and profits" of a marriage.

What you're doing would be each your and your wife trying to independently acquire additional companies on your own, then telling her to give up the company she succeeded in acquiring because your acquisition didn't go through.
__________________
Bi Female in VA with a passion for outdoor adventure, cooking, reading, health and fitness, and adventure!

Relationship saturated, and not looking for additional partners.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-14-2015, 05:09 AM
DragonMan's Avatar
DragonMan DragonMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11
Default

Green acres,
It is not about, as you put it, a tit-for-tat issue.
I also can meet new and interesting females.....but when the subject of any possible relationship comes up, women will pull back ( usually judgmental/horrified/flabergasted that a married man would even consider such a thing, and god only knows what they are thinking about my 'poor' wife ) and that will be the quick end of that.
Whereas my wife can meet new and interesting males, and if she shows a bit of interest to take things further....well....let us say that almost to a man, they will not only consider, but continue the line of interest with little or no regard for some husband or boyfriend.

The analogy described by Angel that I responded to is completely fair and logical.
What you described is not a PARTNERSHIP ( relationship ), but a competition between two INDIVIDUALS ( independent of each other or not working together toward the same goal ) who may have little in common other than sleeping together.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-14-2015, 05:33 AM
DragonMan's Avatar
DragonMan DragonMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11
Default

Official Greeter,
Thanks for the warm welcome.

Too bad I live in such a remote and conservative part of Oregon or I could take some of your good advice....
BTW - Have been through Yelm....nice area.

Your V relationship sounds fulfilling to both you, your other and your others lover.
My wife and me have had some very good experiences ( and some bad ones to be sure ) with this also....one of her ex-lovers is actually a very good friend of mine to this day.

Perhaps things will work themselves out....there is more to my current story but that is for another post.
Later.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-14-2015, 05:10 PM
opalescent opalescent is offline
Spaminator
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: US
Posts: 1,985
Default

Yes, a man in a poly relationship with a woman may well have trouble finding other women partners even as his partner more easily finds other male partners. Women have more to lose when engaging in a sexual or romantic relationship so we - very broadly speaking - tend to be more conservative and risk averse. There's the risk of violence, the risk of pregnancy, the greater risk of STI's (it's far easier to transmit a STI from men to women than vice versa), and the greater risk of social disapproval. (A man who has sex with lots of women is a stud. A woman who has sex with lots of men is a slut and that's not a compliment in most circles.) But this isn't inherent to women or men - it's how our society is organized and it is not set in stone. (Difficult to change, I will give you, but not impossible.) If you think of it as not somehow inherent in gender - because it's not, it's a rational response to current social structures - it may be easier to accept and think about ways to get your needs met. Long story short, if you work to make the world more accepting and safer for women to be openly sexual, you will help along your own desires to meet women open to dating you, a married poly man.

Ok, so that's a long term perspective. What to do in the meantime? Consider changing your perspective. Other folks have commented that, essentially, fair, equal, and balanced does not mean everyone has exactly the same thing. 1 boyfriend for her! 1 girlfriend for you! 2 boyfriends for her! 2 girlfriends for you! Sounds kinda silly written out, doesn't it?

Here's what I would like you to consider. You clearly love and value your wife. Do you want your relationship with her to make her less than who she is? Or do you want your relationship with her to help make her be the best possible version of herself?

Putting the brakes on experimenting with polyamory because you are not getting the same opportunities with women that she is with men makes her be less than she is. You are cutting off her opportunities to grow and learn because you don't have those same opportunities. It's not fair to try and force our partners to be less than they could be because of our fears and envy. You are experiencing envy of her opportunities. Demanding she stop exploring those opportunities is likely to cause resentment, even if she agrees. Dealing with your envy by making her stop doing what causes you to feel envy isn't a solution. It's just outsourcing an internal problem you are having with your lack of opportunities. And that's not fair to her, or ultimately to you. You are putting the brakes on your own opportunities for growth and learning out of envy. Don't make yourself less than you could be too.

It's really hard to live with someone who is getting all the fun stuff you would like to have too. My ex-boyfriend is younger than me, more outgoing and just more in demand than my middle-aged self. It was often hard that he had way more opportunities to date than I did. I felt jealous, envious and not as 'cool'. It was not fun. But the solution was not to make him avoid these opportunities. Sometimes I just had to accept that I was feeling envy, that it was ok to feel envy but that I didn't have to *do* anything about that feeling. It wasn't pleasant but feelings tend to move along on their own. Doing something about my envy by making him change something about himself would have been trying to make him into someone he is not. And that would have been unfair. I learned how to cope a bit better with envy. We did break up but not over envy - our paths in life just weren't compatible after a while.

If you noodle about here, you will find many threads that touch upon this pattern. (Try tag searching for 'dating' to start, or just read through the Poly Relationship Corner section.) Reading how other men addressed this issue - and it comes up A LOT - may help you as well.

Good luck!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-14-2015, 07:32 PM
DragonMan's Avatar
DragonMan DragonMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11
Default

opalescent,
I totally agree that the male/female availability issue is cultural/societal more than anything else.
You make valid points and I agree with much of it.
Don't get me wrong.....I have done much soul searching regarding my own feelings about our situation.
Am I being selfish?
Am I hindering someone whom I love from fulfilling their own potential out of, as you say, fear and/or envy.
I did not ask her to stop without delving deep into my own state of emotional being.
Again....this is why I joined this forum....after reading many posts, the community here seems very knowledgable and capable without being overly judgemental.
Perhaps I am not prepared to share anymore? Mono. ( Controlling? )
Am I envious because of no fault of my partner?.....it is a possibility.
Are my feelings valid?.....right or wrong, this is my current emotional state.

My partner and I share everything and we are infinitely entangled....a true partnership where we love and support each other as well as any other couple that I have known.

We have too much to lose in every category if something should come between us and our relationship.
We do have rules.....we do have trust.

One of my biggest fears is that in asking my partner to stop, that she may be tempted to continue her relationships in secret, breaking all trust and disaster would ensue.

I do not think it is unreasonable, given our deep involvement, to ask my partner for a break, or even termination, of involvment in others.

I have read some on this forum call this 'abuse', and others saying that it is okay to take a break if things get rocky.

It is interesting that I have only heard the female side of counter argument. ( excepting of course for the Greeter. )

Again....any advice will be considered.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:00 AM.