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Old 08-21-2010, 03:03 AM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Default Trust vs Fear

So... I'm trying to grasp if Bud is having just a fear or if it is a trust issue that he is having with me. I'm hoping I can throw it out there to yall so you can run with it and maybe shed some light or it just make for an interesting conversation.

Last night Bud asked me last night if his best friend could come over and hang out in the morning because he wanted to be somewhere other than his home. I said okay, but I planned on sleeping in and I may do that and he could have the house to himself. I talked to my fiance (who is currently hours away) last night but I had a busy day and didn't think of mentioning it at the time. (my mistake in communication) Later, Bud talked to be about his fear of me falling for another. We are poly fi now and he has made it clear that he cannot handle another, but he wouldn't stand in my way of pursuing anything. I explained to him that I cannot say that I'll never have feeling for another, but that I would like to be able to open up to him if it were to ever happen so I could deal with it and move on. I know my limit. I can handle no more nor do I desire anymore... That doesn't mean I can't fall for more. It was a great conversation that we both felt better for having. He said that his friend coming over while he is at work would be a good chance for him to face this fear and cope.

Fast forward to this morning. His friend is a no show. Little did I know that Bud was texting my fiance at the same time I was. Bud was talking to him about his friend coming over and his fears. I was talking to my fiance about how I was relaxing and attempting to fall asleep to a movie. My fiance thought his friend was here with me and I was hiding it. Which created a huge ordeal. Then I find out that his friend felt weird being alone with me and that's why he bailed. In the end my fiance and I were both all nerves. I felt I have 3 men in my life that felt like I couldn't control my vagina and I felt completely caged in. My fiance stopped talking to me which I got upset about and blamed Bud for. He wasn't very understanding and I blew up and then he left and turned off his phone. I was stuck alone feeling like those I care about think so low of me when all I wanted to do was sleep in this morning!

It all got cleared up eventually. His friend is probably uncomfortable to hang out with me for the same reason I am... Bud's fear and/or trust issue. His fear is that if I fall for someone I won't say anything and I Will act upon it behind his back.

So... To finally get to the point... Is this really just a fear as he says it is and hope that he will work on it and it will fade in time or is it that he really does not trust me. Fear I can understand. Trust I can understand because I came into poly the wrong way, but after almost a year of communication and complete openness on my part I feel I've redememed myself. I feel I learned my lesson and the way a simple visit from a friend blew up in my face this morning really stung. To feel that eeryone threw me out into the cold at the drop of a hat... Okay not the point.

Is this fear. Is this trust... Or on some level is it all the same thing.
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Old 08-21-2010, 05:48 PM
jkelly jkelly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
Is this fear. Is this trust... Or on some level is it all the same thing.
Yes, on some level it is the same thing.

I hope that I'm missing some part of this story. Had you expressed interest in Bud's friend at some point, or was Bud's friend interested in you? If not, this scenario strikes me as involving some pretty odd behaviour on Bud's part.

I get why your fiancee was weirded out by the thought that there was someone staying over that you hadn't mentioned in spite of the fact that the two of you were talking. I'd shrug that one off as just a mix-up.

But what's Bud's deal? He thinks that having his best friend come over to crash at your place is part of facing his fear... so he's afraid of people staying at your place? Presumably his actual fear is that you'll get romantically involved with some new person. He seems to be operating from the assumption that you're likely to do that with anybody who walks through the door. In fact, he and his friend thought that was so likely that his friend decided it was too big a risk to even show up. That's a pretty strange assumption about how you handle your love life.

Even if there was some interest in Bud's friend on your part, I don't think this reflects well on Bud. I don't know how much this has to do with your vagina, as you put it, as opposed to your heart, but I'd suggest that you should make it clear to Bud that creating drama in your lives like this is not okay, and that he needs to get a better handle on who you are as a person instead of this fantasy version of you that seems to come from a soap opera script. For his sake too, as it cannot be fun to be involved with someone who, in his opinion, can't resist temptation for the sake of the relationship.
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Old 08-21-2010, 06:45 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Niether I or his friend have shown interest in each other. I guess he thinks that one on one time will eventually lead me to love and that I will try to pursue something behing his back because I know that he will back away from our relationship if I try to add more. If I were to want another he would back out he says because he doesn't want to restrict me. I am happy where I am. I am happy with who I have. I can't stop myself from having feelings for another, but I can surely not act on those feelings. He's hoping that with time this fear will fade. He says he trusts that I wouldn't hide anything from him, but I don't know if I believe him. I agree it can't be fun being with someone you don't trust. It's not fun being with someone who can't trust you. It's a weird feeling to see people... Idk running around scared of what the freak is going to do. I feel like less of a person to him at the moment. I don't want my emotions to get in the way of nipping this in the bud quickly.

I really want to figure where to go with this because we are both scared his turning into the monogamonster. I don't want to feel confined or worried about what's going on in his head if I speak to anyone. I don't want him stressing and festering everytime I speak to someone. Ya know?
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Old 08-21-2010, 08:24 PM
jkelly jkelly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
I guess he thinks that one on one time will eventually lead me to love
Does he think that everyone is always prone to falling in love with anyone they spend one-on-one time with, or does he just think that about you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
and that I will try to pursue something behing his back because I know that he will back away from our relationship if I try to add more.
Yeah, that's an unfortunate result of insisting one's partner not have other partners. This shouldn't be any more a problem in your case than any other other closed relationship, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
I don't want to feel confined or worried about what's going on in his head if I speak to anyone. I don't want him stressing and festering everytime I speak to someone. Ya know?
Right, it's going to be hard to have a normal life if you can't spend any one-on-one time with another human being without your boyfriend freaking out.
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Old 08-21-2010, 08:57 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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I'm on my phone and quoting is hard so...

Answer 1) He thinks this of me because I am poly and I fall for friends. He was my best friend when I was a teenager. He is still my best friend.

Answer 2) That is a very good point and I will bring it up with him. Unfortunately a year ago I failed at this. I was with my fiance when Bud came back into the picture after 10 years. I never stopped loving him and it grew even stronger. I had an emotional affair with him and I drove across state lines to meet him and take it farther. I ended up kissing him and couldn't go farther. A couple of weeks later after soul searching and alot of research and the help of this forum I came out with the affair and that I was poly. ( I never knew there werw others like me. I thought I was a freak of nature! Thank you polyamory.com!!!) So I spent this past year learning, growing, healing those I love. My fiance trusts me fully now. Bud, does not.

He said he hopes that by me spending time woth his friend alone that it will ease his fears... But if his fear is that I will hide something from him.... How is that going to ease him? After a talk his friend is willing to play guinea pig... I am not. I feel like I will be put in front of the firing squad so to speak if it makes his fears/trust issues worse. I'm not really sure how I'm suppossed to gain his trust. I feel that I need to. He says it's just something he's got to overcome within himself.

3) I've actually isolated myself today because of all of this. Today we went to a dog show and took my daughter for ice cream. It was great! Then as we are pulling up at home his friend calls and they made plans to go play tennis tonight. He came to me after and asked if I wanted to go. I declined and said it feels like I'm being let out of the cage when he is there to spotlight me and I'm too uncomfortable after yesterday to socialize with the same friend as yesterday. This is just too weird for me. I guess it's me making a stand that I am not willing to play guinea pig if he freaks out on me. He can open the cage door, but I don't have to leave it so to speak.

I really wish my fiance was here to help through this. Maybe once he gets here I would be willing to do this with my boyfriend. But I just moved to a new state, with my daughter, without my fiance, to live with Bud for the first time ever. I've been without a job for 3 weeks. My whole world is turned upside down and I already feel alone and isolated being in a new place. I'm dealing with alot of emotions and I don't think I can handle him freaking out right now.

For a more positive note, I finally got the job I've been working on since before I moved. After not having one for 3 weeks I realized I need one for more than just money!!! I swear the walls have been closing in on me. Me getting a job also means it's one step closer to my fiance moving out here!
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Old 08-21-2010, 09:39 PM
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fleurisseur fleurisseur is offline
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Smile quite interesting

no doubt, you have a strong energy.. that "needs to be transported" by a "cupper fiber", a conductor : your fiancée...

And you are "clever" building a solid base : job = money...

All the best... Whenever you pass by Paris, I offer the coffee to all of you.
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Old 08-22-2010, 03:07 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Exclamation

After the I made that last post, Bud and I spoke of our feelings. I've already explained mine on here. Basically everything that I have felt from this is the exact oppossite of what he wants me to feel. I don't know how else I should feel... I started out being completely open and understanding of his fears. Then that bad day happened and it brought out all of these negative emotions for me. I'm trying to get back to being understanding so we can get past this fear/ trust issue of his. We both know that if this isn't solved it will be the end of us.

So we basically put everything to the side. Spoke of the communication issues we have had through this. He has been trying to control my communication through this which made be very angry because I either had to be forceful in an attempt to be heard or walk away. He didn't see that he was doing this. Looking back he does and he is going to work on that. After we got that out the way we spoke about what do we want the outcome to be. The answer is the same for both of us. For me to be trusted and for me to be able to have friends with out fears. This is the goal.

We ended up all going to play tennis. We took turns playing in the park with my daughter while the other played tennis with his friend. For my turn we had a talk about what happened. He said he trusts me and he trusts himself. That he chose to cancel coming over because Bud's fears are making him uncomfortable. That is had nothing to do with me.

This made me feel better. I'm so worried about finding friends out here and I'm worried about my daughter finding friends. Our neighbors all know that Bud and I are together or they assume so. My fiance has yet to move out here and on the weekend he came to visit most were out of town! They are all really nice to me... Right now. I'm not sure about when they find out. This is a very religious city. My worry about this is not for me. My neighbors all have children that my daughter goes to school with and friday evening I got them all together for a swim. One of the girls came over for a playdate yesterday. They really like each other... What if she will no longer be allowed to play with my daughter? Worries of a Mom I suppose. We will find out soon one way or the other.
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Old 08-22-2010, 06:11 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
Is this fear. Is this trust... Or on some level is it all the same thing.
I tend to think you are closer to home with this statement. It seems it's a fine grey line between the two - they tend to feed on each other I think.

Trust is SUCH a huge thing in relationships. If it's broken it may, in many cases, be impossible to rebuild completely. That being said, that doesn't mean you can't have an ACCEPTABLE level of trust that all are comfortable. For myself at least, if I have ever broken someone's trust, or let them down in some other way, I would never EXPECT them to have complete faith in me again.
And I think this point can become more of a rub point in relationships than it deserves. There's some sentimental attachment to a desire to have COMPLETE trust in someone else. I'm not so sure that's possible and by holding it out as a condition, it may be unrealistic.

People are people (our limited processing capability), and I feel everyone is capable of blowing a call under the right conditions. Life's complexities contribute to it - we're not always as focused on the moment - and that moment's decisions - as maybe we should be. Expecting 100% trust seems to be close to expecting perfection. We all try I think to shoot for that high standard but to think we'd discard someone for making a mistake seems.....unfair and unrealistic.

My thoughts anyway.........

GS
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Old 08-22-2010, 07:22 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Thanks for this GS.
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:35 AM
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redpepper redpepper is offline
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Really a year is not that long to get over an affair. This is why they are so risky. One takes a huge risk when they mess with someones trust of them I think. I think he really needs more time and opportunity to trust you. That isn't such a bad thing. It sounds like you have the common goal of getting there, but some more effort needs to happen and more work. Surprise! The work never ends ESPECIALLY with an affair under your belt. That creates a whole world of issues that never would of been there if it hadn't happened.

It sounds like it was a learning experience and that he was faced with seeing how he felt. That sucks for you in that it makes you feel caged and like he doesn't trust you can handle yourself; but then how else is he going to test out what you tell him and trust you again? At least he is facing his fears and finding out if he can rise above them! I think that is awesome. Ya he got a little wiggy on the way, but then these things don't always run smoothly. If it were me I would give him a big hug now and thank him for at least making an effort to rise above his fear...that you are grateful that he has given you a chance to prove yourself as words mean nothing until proven with actions. All this even if it makes you crazy. At least that would be a show of good faith I think.
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