Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > Poly Relationships Corner

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-07-2009, 07:00 PM
ABQTrio ABQTrio is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Albuqueruqe, NM
Posts: 1
Exclamation Sincere request for advice and/or links to resources....

Hello Everyone!

What a delight it is to stumble upon this site today. I was doing research for a site like this because my wife and I have been in a polyamorous relationship with another male for about six months and we've encountered a stumbling block we're not sure how to overcome.

A bit of background to level set: Ny wife and I have been happily married for the last 18 years and have a relationship built on love, respect, and communication. A year ago I came out to my wife in terms of having desires for men and through the difficulties in understanding and managing those desires, decided to pursue this together. We went the route of being "kids in a candy store" and experiencing guys, etc. but we are not swingers and empty encounters sans emotion/relationship did not appeal to either of us. We met a man six months ago who was divorced and identified himself as gay. Being presented with this option of us both he would say - he "didn't realize was an option." This being said - over the last six months we have all been able to develop and grow a loving and "in love" relationship between the three of us. It has hads its ups and downs like any relationship - but it has been satisfying and is very real.

So the problem and where I need advice: Our partner is a very loving and conscientious man. He has struggled his entire adult life with his sexuality (i.e. being gay/bi) with his faith as a Bible-believing Christian. Clearly they don't reconcile. As believers, my wife and I have a belief that we love and serve a loving God and that with the level of respect and communication we have between the two/three of us that we are able to live a life with integrity while maintaining our individual character and personal belief system. We are (M-40, F43) and our partner is (M-50). I give our ages because I think it lends itself to the established patterns and lifestyle we have all led for the past 20-30 years. Our partner is having a difficult time reconciling his faith with his own sexuality gay/bi/or poly. We love him enough to let him go so he can be true to himself and ending our relationship would be deeply painful for all three of us. Is there anything out there we can point him to to help him understand himself better - that can help him reconcile his own personal beliefs, etc? We are NOT trying to change him - we just want to support him.

I know this is probably a very typical problem but being poly brings along enough challenges in and of itself - without compounding it with faith. If anyone has any suggestions - they would be sincerely appreciated. Thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-08-2009, 12:26 AM
Quath Quath is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 504
Default

I am an atheist, so take what I say with a grain of salt. There are many ways to try to reconcile polyamory/homosexuality with religion.

One way is to take a liberal interpretation of the Bible. Basically almost every Christians ignores the Old Testament rules like killing girls for pre-maritial sex, working on Saturday, or being a witch. (Though some try to make the Ten Commandments an exception to this.) So that just leaves the New Testament. Jesus never talks about homosexuality; just Paul does. So you can take what he says about homosexuality in one of the following ways: Paul meant that pagan homosexual rituals are bad; Paul was talking about pedophilia; Paul meant that heterosexual males should not act homosexual; or Paul was just giving an opinion that is not part of the dogma like some of the sexist views on women.

Another route is to go with the philosophy of Christianity instead of the concrete rules. This comes about from Jesus saying that people should not be stoned for the working on the Sabbath as God had commanded. This kind of says that the philosophy should be paid attention to instead of the concrete rules. So a person can go with morals based on th Golden Rule; helping the needy; and being self sacrificing.

Another route is to go with different outlook on religion in which God is more about love than hate. With this idea, homosexuality is a way to express love and God would not be against that. It also pushes the question of why would God make people gay and deny them happiness if he was a good deity.

The weakness of this is that each of these are ultimately the "salad bar" approach. It is picking and choosing religious dogma based on desire for it to be true than on any other criteria. Conservative Christians will typically point this out. A rebuttal to this is that all Christians pick and choose their beliefs in a similar fashion. For example, conservatives may turn away gay people but ignore slothful or gluttonous people even though they are all equally "sinful." Another example is that Jesus said the Old Testament laws would not go away until Heaven and Earth pass away. Yet it is very rare to see a Christian try to live by Old Testament laws.

It is tough being comfortable with who you are when you are brought up with years of people telling you different. One question leads to another and it can cause a crisis of identity or beliefs. I think you can only be supportive and be there to bounce ideas off of. Ultimately, each person will have to find their own way.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-09-2009, 10:42 PM
RaleighGuy RaleighGuy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quath View Post
I am an atheist, so take what I say with a grain of salt. There are many ways to try to reconcile polyamory/homosexuality with religion.
If you are an atheist, then that is your religion. The existence of a god can't be proved or disproved, so for someone to BELIEVE, either in the existence of a god, or that there is no god- either way it's a matter of faith. It's just easier to deal with your religion in a lot of ways then with other religions.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-10-2009, 02:43 AM
Quath Quath is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 504
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaleighGuy View Post
If you are an atheist, then that is your religion. The existence of a god can't be proved or disproved, so for someone to BELIEVE, either in the existence of a god, or that there is no god- either way it's a matter of faith. It's just easier to deal with your religion in a lot of ways then with other religions.
Heh... Atheism is a religion like bald is a hair color or not collecting stamps is a hobby.

It is not that I disbelieve in God. I just have no evidence for me to believe in one.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-10-2009, 02:51 AM
RaleighGuy RaleighGuy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21
Default

I could provide you with a long list of brilliant thinkers/philosphers who would point out the errors in your thinking. But your knee-jerk defensive posture tells me that would be a waste of time. Atheism is a religion, exactly like Christianity, or Islam. If you don't BELIEVE that there is no god, then you are not an atheist, you are just a "doubter".
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-10-2009, 03:11 AM
Quath Quath is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 504
Default

Atheism is treated as a religion in the legal sense as a statement about belief in gods and the supernatural. However, in the philosophical sense, it is just the lack of belief in any gods. The lack of belief is not a belief in itself.

I would probably be more correct in labeling myself as an agnostic atheist. I have no belief in any gods, but I can never be 100% sure that there are no gods.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:04 AM
StarGazer StarGazer is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 30
Default

http://christianglbtrights.blogspot.com/ is a blog for christian LGBT rights

http://www.rainbowbaptists.org/christian.htm seems to have a list of queer-friendly resources for christians.

http://www.libchrist.com/bible/polygamy.html For christians on poly. The whole site (http://www.libchrist.com/) is good.

I'm not christian myself, that must be difficult for him. There's a lot of resources on the web, though.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pearl S. Buck
The lack of emotional security of our American young people is due, I believe, to their isolation from the larger family unit. No two people - no mere father and mother - as I have often said, are enough to provide emotional security for a child. He needs to feel himself one in a world of kinfolk, persons of variety in age and temperament, and yet allied to himself by an indissoluble bond which he cannot break if he could, for nature has welded him into it before he was born.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-10-2009, 07:42 AM
alphafour alphafour is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Southern California
Posts: 45
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ABQTrio View Post
So the problem and where I need advice: Our partner is a very loving and conscientious man. He has struggled his entire adult life with his sexuality (i.e. being gay/bi) with his faith as a Bible-believing Christian. Clearly they don't reconcile. .
I had my spiritual epiphany in 2004, and became a Christian ( and a legally ordained minister). In 2006, I abandoned Christianity and held on to my epiphany. In 2007 I came in contact with the spirits, and in 2008 I became a Shaman. My epiphany has held through all of the trials, and my knowledge of the actual quotes and parables of Jesus has grown as well. I cannot reconcile my epiphany, my understanding of the Bible, and Christianity. I do not believe, and never will believe in the Trinity, which is a fundamental and required Christian belief. I personally witnessed a Mormon Bishop weeping during a testimony meeting in front of an entire assembly because he had been accused of "not being a Christian." He was not a Bishop at the time, but became one shortly after. Mormons do not believe in the trinity but follow Jesus as if He is God and feel slighted when accused in such a manner.

My Jesus is not God. He was a wise man, for sure. He communicated with the spirit, for sure. He might have been the "begotten Son of the Living God," but I cannot prove that, and avoid the expression without the disclaimer (the expression is a hearsay exclamation). I am not a Christian. I can read the Bible without some person trained in black arts telling me what it means.

Christianity is so strange. There are 100 or more denominations which will tell you that they are the "one and only true" Church. That makes 99 out of 100 preachers "trained in the black arts." My odds work out considerably better if I forego the training and read the Bible directly and pray to the Father directly.

I am not Gay, but I do not believe that Jesus ever intended to deprive any person of their dignity and choice when it harmed no other human. If Jesus had ever intended to deprive a man of his dignity and choice in such manner, do you think He would have said;" Do unto others as you would have done unto you?" and "On these commandments hangs all of the law and all of the prophets?" Go in peace, when you find it within your heart to do so.

Last edited by alphafour; 06-10-2009 at 08:26 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-10-2009, 04:39 PM
Mark1npt Mark1npt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Sunny FL
Posts: 344
Default

Alpha, nice to see someone else with the same doubts and experiences. My never ending search has been for who gets to make claim to be the "one true church".......what a load of crappola!.....as soon as the mothership lands I'm gonna have them go on the loudspeaker and set the record straight! lol,lol,lol.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-10-2009, 04:41 PM
Mark1npt Mark1npt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Sunny FL
Posts: 344
Default

In all seriousness...if there really were a God, wouldn't he be happy that we were living our lives responsibly, helping and loving our fellow man(woman)? Isn't that what it's supposed to be all about?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
christianity

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:18 AM.