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  #11  
Old 06-04-2010, 01:12 AM
groovy9 groovy9 is offline
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Originally Posted by MonoVCPHG View Post
Take it from the person who has done the cheating...it scars you
My wife, who did the cheating, would tell you the same thing. It's been 5 years (read: ancient history) and she still gets emotional about it every once in a while. 'Miserable' really isn't a strong enough word for it.
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  #12  
Old 06-04-2010, 06:58 AM
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I still get miserable and draw a tear and it was about 20 years ago... at a time in my life where I would be forgiven for such a thing as I was young! it's just plain bad news all around except it made me grow up, smarten up and be responsible for how I act and treat people.
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  #13  
Old 06-04-2010, 08:11 AM
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SchrodingersCat SchrodingersCat is offline
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Originally Posted by pyxiegrl View Post
He has even said that another couple would probably be the best of us. I agree. Right now we are trying to wade through all of this, the what ifs, and the rules before we even think about finding another couple.
May I ask what your motivation is for seeking a couple? I only ask because I've seen that blown up a lot, and it's practically a policy of mine to specifically avoid dating couples.

I had a friend recently have her heart broken when she and her partner started seeing this other couple. Her partner and the wife really hit it off, and my friend thought she was hitting it off with the husband. Then when her partner and the wife went to run an errand, he made a move on her and they made out in the car. Meanwhile, the husband was basically breaking up with my friend. Obviously that relationship lacked communication (it eventually came out that the husband was not polyamorous, just trying to go along with it because his wife was poly).

Just seems like dating a couple has a lot more room for complications.
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  #14  
Old 06-04-2010, 10:07 AM
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I'm not completely certain what polyamorous is. If it means sleeping with a man and a woman at the same time, that isn't for me. I think I'm capable of loving more than one woman at the same time. I also think most humans are naturally the same way, that is, can love many of the opposite sex.

I have no idea how monogamy became so popular and so established in society and history. It is equated with morality, loyalty, doing the right thing, being Biblical, being correct, with true love as opposed to being untrue, and all that is good about relationships. And actually none of that is necessarily true. Even the ancient Hebrews took more than one spouse.

I suppose all of this is very nice but doesn't take social realities into consideration? I've lived with my wife for 17 years now, and we're both nearing sixty. I don't have any illusions about finding someone else to love if I leave her. Women are sweet to old men, but treat us like their fathers. I suppose it must be absurd that an old man should want to act like a young man, try to - I don't know. Follow my heart, I guess.
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  #15  
Old 06-04-2010, 04:48 PM
Ariakas Ariakas is offline
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Originally Posted by catbird View Post
I'm not completely certain what polyamorous is. If it means sleeping with a man and a woman at the same time, that isn't for me. I think I'm capable of loving more than one woman at the same time. I also think most humans are naturally the same way, that is, can love many of the opposite sex.
It means knowing you have the ability to love multiple people.

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I have no idea how monogamy became so popular and so established in society and history. It is equated with morality, loyalty, doing the right thing, being Biblical, being correct, with true love as opposed to being untrue, and all that is good about relationships. And actually none of that is necessarily true. Even the ancient Hebrews took more than one spouse.
Blame the catholics...those guys screwed up everything

Quote:
I suppose all of this is very nice but doesn't take social realities into consideration? I've lived with my wife for 17 years now, and we're both nearing sixty. I don't have any illusions about finding someone else to love if I leave her. Women are sweet to old men, but treat us like their fathers. I suppose it must be absurd that an old man should want to act like a young man, try to - I don't know. Follow my heart, I guess.
As a guy into D/s you might be surprised at how many women love older men. There are entire sexual and romantic fetishes built around age difference. There are lots of women interesting in 50 to 60 something men ...you might just have to know where to look.
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  #16  
Old 06-04-2010, 09:02 PM
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AK, it seems he isn't interested in the daddy thing... Or did I get that wrong? I wouldn't put it past me today. I got that he wants to be treated as a young man and thinks that might be impossible. I don't think so personally. It seems age has no bounds in poly. You are the age you act and its more about connection and common interest.

I do suggest you do some more reading on here though in order to familiarize yourself a bit more.
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  #17  
Old 06-04-2010, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by pyxiegrl View Post
As I have learned recently sometimes the best thing in life is clarity smacking you in the face. Maybe you just need to be upfront with her and tell her where you see your marriage sitting at. That might be a better route then telling her you want a relationship with someone else. I hope this helps
Thank you pyxiegrl, and to all who are trying to respond to me. You have all been very kind and tolerant, and I'm sincerely grateful.

I know my wife, and am trying to be as generous about her as I can, but I've been upfront with her before, to no effect. Now recently she has suspected that I'm searching for another woman, and it has woken her right up. She is doing the best she can to be more affectionate but reaches a barrier. I don't know how many here are familiar with the women's movement? Darla is this state's treasurer of N.O.W. Was active and vocal for women's rights 40 years ago, marched and shouted for years and years, continues active now.

She sees most of women's problems coming from men. That may or may not be, but she finds it very hard to truly love a man, however much she's motivated. I'm not sure either she or I can win here, no matter if we so want it to work.

I don't know if you nice folks will believe me. I didn't want to go to even these extremes.

-----------------------------

AK, it seems he isn't interested in the daddy thing... Or did I get that wrong? I wouldn't put it past me today. I got that he wants to be treated as a young man and thinks that might be impossible. I don't think so personally. It seems age has no bounds in poly. You are the age you act and its more about connection and common interest.

I do suggest you do some more reading on here though in order to familiarize yourself a bit more.

-----------------------------

Thank you very much for your information, Ariakas, and you too redpepper for advice. I very much want advice, and truthfully don't know if interested in the daddy thing or not. It involves at least one other person and can't be all about just me. It's about being gentle to someone who can be gentle back.

Yes, Moderator, I will read here as you suggest. You folks seem really level-headed. I think love is about that, too. If you really have love, a level head is what you achieve.
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  #18  
Old 06-05-2010, 01:50 AM
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Originally Posted by catbird View Post
Yes, Moderator, I will read here as you suggest.
mmmmmm MM I love an obedient man... you made my knees buckle there for a sec... maybe you need a mistress? instead of being a daddy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by catbird View Post
I know my wife, and am trying to be as generous about her as I can, but I've been upfront with her before, to no effect. Now recently she has suspected that I'm searching for another woman, and it has woken her right up. She is doing the best she can to be more affectionate but reaches a barrier. I don't know how many here are familiar with the women's movement? Darla is this state's treasurer of N.O.W. Was active and vocal for women's rights 40 years ago, marched and shouted for years and years, continues active now.

She sees most of women's problems coming from men. That may or may not be, but she finds it very hard to truly love a man, however much she's motivated. I'm not sure either she or I can win here, no matter if we so want it to work.

I don't know if you nice folks will believe me. I didn't want to go to even these extremes.
My mother was a women's rights activist in Toronto where I started my life. My childhood was filled with rally's, meetings, bra-less women and my mum talking about lesbians hitting on her. A whole lot of smoking I remember too, back in the day when people actually smoked in small rooms with children playing at their feet. Not so common now. I remember some women complaining that we were there, but that was always short lived as my mum was always quick to put them in their place. After all, they were women and motherhood is a huge part of that for quite a few women.

She also equates much of her hardship in life to what men have done to make it difficult for women. Sometimes I think it's hypocritical bullshit. SHE created a lot of it and creates just as much for others.

She pushed my dad the most with her ideals ... and this is where I am triggered by your post. He bore the brunt of her anger and resentment towards men. I think a lot of men did from that generation. I hope it isn't so much the case now, but she still puts the whole, "I am a woman and therefore don't have as much rights as you" thing over his head. She claims he still doesn't get that, but all I see is a way to make him feel defenseless in his argument.

Recently she had a big blow out and claimed that she hasn't loved him in years and that she only stayed because of us kids and for his money. He chose to ignore it and chalked it up to what he has always heard... very sad. I was livid, she has no reason to stay for us and hasn't since I was 16 when I left home... it's bullshit. It's bullshit what she created from man hating as a younger woman... there is no equality in it at all. All I see is the same kind of imbalance.

On that note I have not considered before that this might be a psychological issue. Has your wife talked with anyone about how she has had trouble loving? Perhaps if you were both to go to see someone about it, it might bring you closer together? If a primary relationship is not strong before bringing in new lovers it can cause the primary relationship to burst apart. There is nothing like poly to bring up issues that are easy to keep under wraps when there is just two. It might be in your best interest to work on the two of you first.
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  #19  
Old 06-05-2010, 10:55 AM
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Wink redpepper

redpepper, you have been a very nice person. Yes, a mistress is what I'm looking for! Aren't you guys at this site telling me that's a bad idea?

No, I knew you were making a joke. I love a woman with a smile or grin that won't quit, and hope very much that you're female.

Yes, the days that you're describing were bad old days in some respects, and for many who weren't born yet or didn't live through them it would be difficult to persuade them of what it was like. Down here in the states the whole country was up in arms over Vietnam and the draft, people were losing their heads completely over politics on one side or the other, or the other, or the other, etc.

You may not believe this, but my wife has a graduate degree in psychology. She's resistant to counseling, or has been in the past, I think because she thinks she's immune to emotional problems because she studied! Isn't that something?

If I were in your shoes I would think, "OK, catbird is just bullshitting now, he's saying anything to keep his thread going." Nope. And I'm not trying to deride my wife either, it's just that mental immunity is a little hard to know how to approach. I keep my heart open to her and remember that my love for her isn't over and shouldn't be over. My idea isn't to turn away from people here, not to leave her or anyone in the cold.

The idea is generosity. And the idea is also to be generous to MYSELF after I've been generous to everyone I know. God, I sound really sorry for myself don't I? Uh, you know what? I haven't had a hard life, not a truly hard life, but it has been a really interesting life, in the Chinese sense of the word. I'm not sure what I'm writing about here. Don't really know my own heart, because if I did it wouldn't keep springing surprises on me.

So you're into obedience, Ma'am? I never willingly obeyed in my entire life that I recall. I wasn't born a rebel but was made so. I'll bet you are achingly compelling! catbird
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  #20  
Old 06-05-2010, 03:15 PM
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Haha, yes I'm female catbird. Female and dominant for sure. Mono is enough of a sub for me at the moment however. Well him and a couple of others in a casual way.
I like what you say about being generous. It reminds me of the "relationship theory" thread. Maybe you will find it useful?

I understand what you are saying about your wife thinking she is emtionally immune. My mother has in the past also. We had a huge blow out this past fall when we came out to her that has moved her out of that a bit. She realized that she is not a good communicator as a result and is now looking to us for books and chats about how to communicate. We have been studying and practicing "non-violent communication" (lots written about that in the communication thread).

My mum is a social worker and thinks that our lifestyle is harmful to our child. She still hovers over us waiting to say "I told you so." lots written about that on the "redpepper needs help" thread.

I hope some threads will help (sorry they all relate to me, there are many other really good ones if you do a search) in terms of helping your wife understand how sometimes closing ones mind off from change leaves you in the past when everyone else is in the future.

My mum struggles right now to catch up to what has been happening in the world as far as relationship dynamics are concerned. The light bulb went off when we came out, or shortly after when we weren't talking to one another, and now there is no way but learn and grow or stay in the past and feel like an old woman who is out of sync. Her new growth is making her feel young and vibrant again as she has learned from those that are younger and benefitting from her hard work as an activist.

We all have so much to learn from one another don't we, no matter what the age.

Because I hardly ever hear appreciation for those who have gone before in terms of the work they have done to make life easier for me and more just, I just want to say thank you to all the women, and right now your wife, who have put themselves out there the best way they knew how. *hugs* *cheers* and thank you.
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