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  #11  
Old 08-10-2012, 02:00 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Originally Posted by Cleo View Post
I suppose I would even kind of like that thought.... but as friends, not lovers...
Your replies show very clearly that you're uncomfortable with them getting intimate. You clearly point out what the problem is NOT - jealousy or them talking about you. The two of you talk, you tell him no, he accepts that answer and backs off. Unless I missed it, I can't find the place in your replies where you plainly state the specific reason(s) for your discomfort. The "solution" seems to be telling him no and he accepting that, without finding the real reason behind your discomfort. Wouldn't it be better for all involved to discover the actual reason(s) for your discomfort with it and talk about it, instead of reacting to it by just telling him "no don't do it" and leaving it at that?


In my opinion, you haven't solved this. All you've done is agreed to stop talking about it. Whatever is going on inside of you will come up again and again in different ways until you address it. In the long run, it's always easier addressing it within the current situation, then waiting for the next one.

Last edited by snowmelt; 08-10-2012 at 03:05 PM.
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  #12  
Old 08-10-2012, 04:22 PM
katja24 katja24 is offline
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I agree with GalaGirl- sometimes there are certain roles that you may not want crossing certain lines. I don't think there is anything wrong with that, and probably nothing deeper to it. If you feel like there is something deeper or more unsettled going on (i.e., feeling insecure or jealous that your BF and close friend are going to become intimate), then you might want to take some time to break that down. But sometimes, it really is as simple as having clear relationship boundaries.
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  #13  
Old 08-11-2012, 01:18 PM
Cleo Cleo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowmelt View Post
Your replies show very clearly that you're uncomfortable with them getting intimate. You clearly point out what the problem is NOT - jealousy or them talking about you. The two of you talk, you tell him no, he accepts that answer and backs off. Unless I missed it, I can't find the place in your replies where you plainly state the specific reason(s) for your discomfort. The "solution" seems to be telling him no and he accepting that, without finding the real reason behind your discomfort. Wouldn't it be better for all involved to discover the actual reason(s) for your discomfort with it and talk about it, instead of reacting to it by just telling him "no don't do it" and leaving it at that?


In my opinion, you haven't solved this. All you've done is agreed to stop talking about it. Whatever is going on inside of you will come up again and again in different ways until you address it. In the long run, it's always easier addressing it within the current situation, then waiting for the next one.
snowmelt, I'm not sure I understand what you're saying.. I told C that I would be uncomfortable if he dated my friend, because she and I are so close and I would worry about the friendship and it just seems too complicated.. I also told him I did not like him dismissing my uncomfortableness... do you think there are other 'actual' reasons behind my not wanting him to date her?
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  #14  
Old 08-11-2012, 02:52 PM
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Other than his relationship with you, is your boyfriend single? Is your girlfriend single? Is there a fear that they will develop a closer bond and at some point you will be shut out?
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  #15  
Old 08-11-2012, 03:55 PM
naturegeek83 naturegeek83 is offline
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Default A metamour you trust is a good thing.

I don't have a lot of experience with poly at this point, but the one huge horrible thing that has happened to me was having a hateful metamour. I don't even think she meant to be hateful, but it developed pretty strong, pretty fast, and ended a really great relationship.

Now my husband is dating one of my close friends. I think it's great because I don't have to worry that she will turn all bloody mary on me and try to sabatoge our relationship. I don't have to worry that this random person is getting a lot of private details and judging them, because she's my friend. She has a few years of knowing me and won't immediately judge things wrong, cause a problem in my relationship, or send me weird angry emails. I think close friends are the way to go. Just a thought.
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  #16  
Old 08-11-2012, 04:59 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Hi Cleo,

I quoted and responded to a few things below. The very first thing I want to say is I like to cut through my own issues like a buzz saw. I tend to look, discover and resolve my own stuff fast. That's just my pace. It works for me. It's given me a pretty good life, which in turn encourages me to keep up the pace. This experience has had the "side effect" of making it pretty easy for me to see other people's stuff. You're talking to a lady who is that driver on the emotional issue highway going 100 mph resolving her own stuff as it comes up. I've learned over time that my pace doesn't have to be anyone else's pace.


I honor and respect your pace, whatever that is. I am not here to try to change that. My answer to you is yes, in my opinion there is more going on with your uncomfortableness than you may think. I don't know exactly what it is, but you are giving me some clues that you haven't found what you're really afraid of yet. Why do I think this?


Your very own words tell me you're still reacting to whatever it is you're afraid of:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleo View Post
because she and I are so close and I would worry about the friendship and it just seems too complicated..
This is a very generic conclusion. Your words here are talking about the uncomfortable feelings that RESULT from the core fear inside of you. That tells me you haven't found the core fear inside yet, in part because these words don't get to what that fear really is. They orbit around it, so to speak, but these words don't turn directly toward the fear they are orbiting around to see what you are really afraid of.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleo View Post
I also told him I did not like him dismissing my uncomfortableness...
Your uncomfortableness is actually about you, so it's not his job to do anything with it (dismiss, accept, etc.) other than listen to you tell him you are uncomfortable. By saying this to him, you are attempting to hold him responsible for whatever the fear inside of you is. That means you are attempting to tell him how to act to minimize the amount of your own fear that you feel. This is adding stress to the relationship you have with him. It is your job to look at yourself and see what is going on with you to cause your discomfort. I'm not saying address this now or you'll all be miserable. I am saying at the very least you'll limit the happiness you can experience, and you will encourage him to limit the happiness he can experience WITH YOU.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleo View Post
do you think there are other 'actual' reasons behind my not wanting him to date her?
The fact that you put the word actual in quotes tells me you think there may indeed be something under your discomfort that you need to look at. You're trying to look in that direction to see if there is fear there, but your still very cautious about looking - like someone squinting and using their hands to try to make looking at the sun easier.


The reason for my reply is to encourage you to look at your fears. I'm not trying to get involved in the decision about whether you're ok with him being intimate with your friend. In my opinion, when you discover what you're really afraid of and talk to him about it with your heart open, both of you will be happier (instantly) and more able to make this decision together, because the conversation will be between two hearts that are more open. Right now the conversation is one sided, because that is what your fear wants it to be.


I hope something I said helps in some way. I wish you well.

Last edited by snowmelt; 08-11-2012 at 07:20 PM.
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  #17  
Old 08-11-2012, 06:59 PM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowmelt View Post
In my opinion, you haven't solved this. All you've done is agreed to stop talking about it. Whatever is going on inside of you will come up again and again in different ways until you address it. In the long run, it's always easier addressing it within the current situation, then waiting for the next one.
This.
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  #18  
Old 08-11-2012, 08:52 PM
Cleo Cleo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowmelt View Post


I honor and respect your pace, whatever that is. I am not here to try to change that. My answer to you is yes, in my opinion there is more going on with your uncomfortableness than you may think. I don't know exactly what it is, but you are giving me some clues that you haven't found what you're really afraid of yet.
snowmelt, thank you for taking the time to address all this. I think you are right, I haven't really found what I'm afraid of. I will try to arrange some of my thoughts about it.. it will be like thinking while I write, so forgive me if this is a bit rambling.

I found myself slightly emotionally withdrawing from C about 2 weeks ago. I felt less connected, more absorbed in my own life. In a way I think this was good - after a very intense first 7 months of NRE, a little reassessment of time and energy was bound to happen.
So this slight withdrawal had started before our last date, which was the night when he met my friend.
The withdrawal is now even stronger. I feel quite detached from him. I don't feel bad about this for myself, personally. I think the fact that he expressed interest in my friend made it even more clear to me that in fact he is looking for another love. (What is maybe confusing about it to me is that I thought he would look for a primary, not another woman who is already in a relationship).
I do feel guilty about the withdrawing. I feel guilty towards him often: because he is single, I am married and have another lover besides him, and a lot of friends, and a very busy social life.

Now about the night this happened. He is a very subdued and quiet guy. He met some of my other friends and while all meetings were relaxed and nice, there was never a real spark. Same thing with my friend... she and I did a lot of the talking, she asked him some questions, he did not ask her a lot. I had NO CLUE that he was interested in her (and I'm usually pretty good in picking up vibes like that.). She's married and has a BF who had just broken up with her, so a lot of the talk was about that break-up.
Somehow I feel that he wasn't really that attracted to her as a person, but more to the situation. Meeting a woman who's open to poly is of course not something that happens every day. And maybe its a very good reason to be interested in someone. And again, how stupid of me to assume all this. Maybe he was wildly attracted to her.
But I felt... looking for the word here ..I think I felt a little used.

Now the weird thing about all this is that I already felt less attached to him. I was starting to notice some things that were annoying to me. The constant travelling for our dates (he lives about 2 hours away) was beginning to feel tiresome. Yes, I would definitely say that NRE was wearing of. I have been very jealous of potential love interests of his in the past. I would not feel that kind of jealousy now. So why would a relationship with my friend bother me?

What is the fear here?

I could say, and a month ago this would have been true, that I am afraid to lose my special place in his life. But I can't really reconcile this with the need to withdraw I've been feeling lately.

So another thing that could be happening is that this incident somehow worked as some sort of accelerant, and made me realize there are issues between me and him, that maybe I'm not as happy in the relationship as I was before?

Sorry, I don't think any of this makes a lot of sense. Maybe I'll have to sleep on it and think about it again tomorrow.
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  #19  
Old 08-11-2012, 11:00 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleo View Post
this incident somehow worked as some sort of accelerant
Yes! I will draw you the picture I see. You have a very active social life and you like to get to know the people in it very well - to the point where you can predict their behavior. Your comfort zone revolves around predicting the behavior of those in your orbit. I use the word orbit because it describe those who revolve around you.


You like to maintain your comfort zone. To maintain it properly, changes that happen with those in your orbit are allowed to happen, but you prefer to be the one who initiates the changes so you can clearly see how those changes benefit you. Your NRE for him faded. That change was fine, because it followed the rules, because you initiated it. That change had the effect of putting emotional distance between you and him. Again, that was fine because you initiated it.


Then you find out the rules of your comfort zone were not working as well as you thought, because he became attracted to her without you knowing about it first. This had the effect of putting MORE distance between you and him, because as your attraction to him fades (your doing), his attraction to your friend grows (not your doing), and she has a change going on in her life (not your doing) that could make her more emotionally available to him.


All of this ACCELERATES the distance you feel from him MORE than your nre fade could by itself. The fact that two thirds of everything that is going on here violates the rules of your comfort zone because you did not initiate it or see it coming ( double whammy) makes you want to reach out your hand like a traffic cop and say: Hey you two, STOP! Slow down so my comfort zone can catch up with you, and I can decide what I want all this to mean to me!


Your fear is that people in your orbit will do things without involving you. That fear inside you wants to tell you that if the people in your orbit do things without involving you, that really means they are telling you you're not important to them anymore. You believe this. When you're not important anymore, the very people making you unimportant (by doing things without involving you) must be using you when they do things without involving you. Your comfort zone has been in place to make sure you feel important.


What to do about it all?


Embrace and honor your shift away from nre. Flow with that shift, where ever it goes. Let go of your boyfriend to whatever degree your nre fade wants you to. Be intentionally present with yourself to "check in" as often as you can. Letting go of him, as your nre wants you to, will help you open your own awareness of who you are right now. Much easier to center yourself and find that contemplative place where many of the answers to the question "Who am I now?" are waiting for you to discover them.


Your energy is shifting. Going with the flow of the shift is like a swimmer diving off the high diving board with proper body posture - fingers pointed straight ahead and head in alignment with the body. She hits the water with minimal interruption of the water surface, and moves quickly through it. For you, the water is the change you are experiencing. Your journey through it can be this smooth if you let it.


Or, you can let your comfort zone tell you how to move through this change (Hey, wait for me!!). Instead of the swimmer in proper form, just haphazardly do a cannonball of the high diving board. That will send the water everywhere, make quite the drama, and you'll move through the water much slower. Both of these examples seem totally different, don't they? The truth is, both have the same person, the same direction of movement (down) and the same water. The only difference is how the swimmer moves through the water (through the change).


A question I think is interesting to ask you:

What would your life become if you dropped all the rules of your comfort zone? Instead of looking at this question so seriously, I encourage you to have fun with it.

Last edited by snowmelt; 08-11-2012 at 11:07 PM.
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  #20  
Old 08-12-2012, 04:28 AM
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LadyKane LadyKane is offline
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Quote:
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Your fear is that people in your orbit will do things without involving you. That fear inside you wants to tell you that if the people in your orbit do things without involving you, that really means they are telling you you're not important to them anymore. You believe this. When you're not important anymore, the very people making you unimportant (by doing things without involving you) must be using you when they do things without involving you. Your comfort zone has been in place to make sure you feel important.
This is amazing. *shakes head* I know I'm not involved in this situation, but I've got a similar one going on in my life, and it's like you looked right through everything and read my own issue out loud to me. I have a lot to ponder. Thanks for posting this.
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