MFF Triad Went Horribly Wrong-Help Needed

[bingshari]

I agree with GG and nycindie. I too am in a triad, and right now the focus is on the three of us and my wife and our third. The relationship with our third and I is close but not as intimate as I would like. I have had to adjust to the wife and third being in the throes of NRE. I learned early on that relationships in triads have to be nurtured and allowed to grow at their own pace. Sounds a bit like your BF and GF are experiencing NRE and acted out with it. I know the fear of being left out or left alone...I struggle with it often. Just keep trying to communicate and express what your wants and needs are. Sometimes there will have to be a compromise. Just be sure to be as clear as possible with each other and be willing to renegotiate things periodically. Negotiation is another crucial piece of the triad, in my opinion.

Best of luck!

[AutumnalTone]

Originally Posted by butterflieluv

The overlapping reason from both of them is that they both didn't tell me what was happening because they didn't want to hurt me emotionally and didn't know how I would react.

I'd say that's so much bullshit. That's a rationalization for them not caring about your feelings in the slightest and doing what they damn well wanted to while hoping to not get caught.

Until they own up to choosing to do what they knew would hurt you, I don't see much hope for your relationships.

[butterflieluv]

@Galagirl- I understand and agree on what you are telling me on the heart garden. @snowmelt brought up a good point that I lot of this in the beginning was fear.

1. Fear my bf and gf would replace me(meaning they would decide they want a monogamous relationship with each other without me) and I would no longer be wanted/needed, etc.

2. Fear I would lose my best friends, both of them, and my primary relationship me-bf, and my new gf-gf relationship all at once.

3. Fear that because my gf has never been with a female before and she has told me multiple times "I don't think I am into girls, I just am into you because it's you", and when I tell her I don't understand what she means by this, she has no explanation, she just says "i don't know"

I now know this fear is because:

a. my gf has not been with any other female, she told me yesterday she has never had a best friend- this makes me feel as if she has what I call "virginity love" for me. Not sure if this makes sense but I feel that because NOW after talking to her about the events that have occurred, the present, and how we can move forward on the duo and trio from her perspective, she is so wishy washy on what her wants/needs/limits are.

I am specifically telling her "I would like to know your wants, needs, limits, regardless of whether you think I agree or not. I am not going to get upset, I want to work on communicating and knowing 100% the real you."

I asked her again about her "not being into girls, but being into me" and she says she still cannot explain what she means by that. I asked her if the emotional bonding is the driving factor between us or the new sexual experiences. She told me both but then proceeds to tell me that if she had to choose which gender to be with, it would be a male.

I don't know how to make sense of this, because at this point, I cannot make that determination. For me, its 50/50. For her, she says its 49-female/ 51-male. She also told me being 100% honest is not an "on, off switch" with her, its something that she has to work on.

She also says she wants to ONLY focus on being with me, and to pretend bf doesn't exist for now. But long-term, she knows she does not want to be in a V relationship because she wants 100% of me, not 50%.

Question: how do I respond to this because I don't see it as giving her 50%. and if she feels this way, does this mean that she is also thinking I can only give her 50% in a triad as well. Or is this valid for her to say?

b. me-bf, I have known from the beginning that bf was attracted to the fact that I was bi. We met at a swingers club- we were both working there part-time. We never discussed prior to meeting gf about poly relationship primarily because we both never organically hit if off with a female long-term.

bf told me yesterday that he is attracted to the relationship trio because he felt that all his wants and needs were met (over last 8 months) and his temptation to be with other females went to 0%. (sounds like he is still thinking with his 3rd leg)

He then told me he all of a sudden wants to get married and have a baby. This is something that we have casually discussed over the last 5 years, but never moved forward on it. Bf says he wants to focus on our duo and be friends with gf, but then he also said he is attracted to being in a trio and would like it to work as a trio.

So now I am basically at an ultimatum from both of them.
-Gf: be with me and tell me that over time it will just be me and you
-BF: let's have a baby and get married, but I want a poly relationship regardless if it works out with current gf
-me: I just want to be able to feel emotionally safe and work out all the communication issues right now. I don't want ultimatums that didn't exist, or weren't expressed prior to strike 1 events.

Answers to your questions:
-We have decided on"check in times" of once a week right now where we re-discuss everyone's wants, limits, needs, and feelings
-All of the apologies you brought up have been made, on single, duo, and trio levels
-The framework/ conflict resolution part is where we are still struggling because right now it seems everyone is in the air on what they want individually. What kind of framework do others in a triad have that has been successful?

[butterflieluv]

@LovingRadiance- thank you for your thoughts on this and I like your idea. I am planning on trying to put this into action.

And you are right, feelings change over time, and I am starting to realize slowly that there is hope on the other side.

[butterflieluv]

Originally Posted by nycindie

Did you also have a rule that you and your bf could not have sex alone behind your gf's back? And did you ask your gf what sex acts she didn't want your bf doing with you before forbidding him from going down on her?

Yes and no, I did discuss with about me-bf not being intimate behind her back for a short while, while we were trying to figure out how to work as a trio. Gf response was "i don't care if you are intimate with bf without me, this is not something i have preference on" I now know this response was because she was being intimate with bf without me, and neither of them discussed it with me that this is something they wanted and it was time to re-assess boundaries.

I did not ask my girlfriend what acts she did not want bf doing with me. And our boundary of him not performing oral on another female was a boundary we have had between me-bf before we even met gf. (5 years). He told me he was okay with this, and never bothered to bring it up that he felt differently now or anytime over the last 5 years. My bad is I never bothered to think about it anymore until it came up with the situation at hand.

[butterflieluv]

Originally Posted by bingshari

The relationship with our third and I is close but not as intimate as I would like.

This is something I can identify with. Both gf and bf have told me that they love me in soulmate way, but gf-bf say they love each other in a friend way?

Is this what you mean by "growing at its own pace". -in your triad, what do you do to help the relationship with the third become move emotionally intimate, because in my case, I love both of them in a soulmate way.

[butterflieluv]

Originally Posted by AutumnalTone

That's a rationalization for them not caring about your feelings in the slightest and doing what they damn well wanted to while hoping to not get caught.

Yes, I agree with you. Because they have owned up to this fact that at the end of the day they did not do the honorable thing and communicate with me ahead of time, my primary question for them was, when was the time going to be right to tell me? When you did tell me, would you have told me this has been going on for x weeks/months, or acted as if this is something we want now (leaving me to believe it hasn't happened before)

Each of them separately say they blame themselves, and know they were wrong and knew they didn't tell me because i explicitly said i wasn't comfortable with them being intimate without me yet. (and yes I did not set a time limit- me being unrealistic and naive and new)

I do count this as strike 1, and that for bf-lie of omission, and gf-blatant dishonesty (because I have specifically asked her if she wanted to be intimate with bf without multiple times, has this occurred, and her response was always "this is not something I want right now, and I wouldn't do that to you (lie and then do it anyway), and I don't even know when we would have the time and opportunity to be intimate without you anyway"

I am still trying to understand the forms of non-monogamy and what it is I want for my future so I can communicate this on all tiers.

Thanks for your response and giving me your perspective.

[SNeacail]

Originally Posted by butterflieluv

my gf has never been with a female before and she has told me multiple times "I don't think I am into girls, I just am into you because it's you", and when I tell her I don't understand what she means by this, she has no explanation, she just says "i don't know"

This I get! She has feelings for you so it's easy to imagine, want, or need to be sexually intimate with YOU! While she prefers sex in general with men, she also enjoys sex with you because it's with YOU. Just accept what she's saying and don't keep brow beating her to explain it over and over again. There may never be an explanation you fully comprehend. That doesn't change the fact that it just is and that's part of what makes her special.

[LovingRadiance]

side note--

my boyfriend is straight. He has no interest in men sexually and never has.
But-he loves his best friend and has said on occasion that if he were going to be with a man-that's the only man he could be with.

Similarly, I know others in the LGBT community who identify as straight or gay-and are actually in relationships that don't fit their identification because they fell in love with THAT PERSON-even though that person wasn't their sexual preference. They are sexual with that person because they are in love and have such an amazing connection-but that doesn't change their identification.

Shrug-I agree with Sneacail on that.

[GalaGirl]

I think you are making progress. You are getting more information out of BOTH. Call it a success enough for now.

Don't worry too much about WHAT to DO with the information received. Esp since it is emotional information. How you feel today? May not be it tomorrow, in a month, in a year, in a decade. People grow and change.

Just establish communication channels. And thank them for sharing more openly.

Don't press for hard limit answers if they limit is not known. Even YOU haven't got all your hard answers, right? And if they aren't good at articulating wants, needs, and limits like bam, bam, bam -- they need time to LEARN IT so it comes like bam, bam, bam.

Clear and assertive. Not aggressive mean. Not passive wishywashy. Just... here's my dealio!

But the point is to keep on communicating so we all keep track of our trio's temperature checks on things and not get too blindsided while at the same time growing these important skills so they get sharper and not so dunderhead clunky.

So now I am basically at an ultimatum from both of them.
-Gf: be with me and tell me that over time it will just be me and you

Maybe you Answer: I want to be with you know, in a triad. I do not know what over time will bring. I cannot answer that part right now. But if pressed to answer, I want you both. If that is a dealbreaker for you, then we need to address it now rather than later.

-BF: let's have a baby and get married, but I want a poly relationship regardless if it works out with current gf

Maybe you Answer: I don't want a baby right now or marriage, but I'm touched you would ask. Thank you. Yes, I want to be in a triad right now with GF. I do want to try to work it out. If it doesn't, we will reassess. But I don't want to think about future polyships when we are IN one right now that needs tending.

-me: I just want to be able to feel emotionally safe and work out all the communication issues right now. I don't want ultimatums that didn't exist, or weren't expressed prior to strike 1 events.

Maybe you Answer: Thank you both for trying to break down the elephant with me and own bits of the puzzle. I want to feel emotionally safe with you both and doing this work helps a lot. Let take time to sit with things, and maybe check back in next Friday? (Whatever the weekly check in day is. ) We can learn these skills together, and get better at it in time.

Don't get tempted to RUSH through all your processing of things. Need times to chill and just BE together in between. That in of itself is reassuring -- that even in conflict resolution time, nobody is leaving the party. Daily life carries on and everyone is committed to BEING HERE and seeing this thing thru. Go rent a movie and eat pizza. Chill. Friday check in appt will come and you will do a bit more work on it. Elephants are big, it is OK if they take more than one session to solve!

But take note you are ON YOUR WAY! That's great.

-The framework/ conflict resolution part is where we are still struggling because right now it seems everyone is in the air on what they want individually. What kind of framework do others in a triad have that has been successful?

Not a triad but a "V" -- here's mine.
http://www.polyamory.com/forum/member.php?u=49794

Conflict resolution -- I haven't written one out here yet but it flows very much like this.

AFTER I have the 1 hr crazy lady time. I need to wave my hands in the air and do a totally unreasonable brain dump/emotional vomit thing. Like I unload all the GRR to the air. He doesn't try to fix anything. He just listens to me yammer and hands me tissues if I need them (to cry in or shred to pieces). Then I calm down and can behave like a logical, reasonable person again. But if I don't get the dumping time, it just makes the healing process that much longer because my eyes still see RED and UGH and GRRRRR.

Do you know how to do a life priority wheel? Maybe that can help your polyship pees articulate what their wants, needs, limits are. It's done like spokes of a wheel. You give each "stick" a label -- career, friends, whatever.

Maybe in your case you want to label it with your polyship tiers. And talk with the people in your group how much time needs to be spent in each tier for the people to be happy there. It does not have to be equal like everyone gets 2 hours in that tier a week. Maybe some tiers are happy with 1. Maybe some need 3.

But it can give you another way to get a handle on it?

Or maybe you want to give each stick issues names -- communication, honesty, quality time spent with GF, quality time spent with BF, emotional safety, body safety, mind safety, spiritual safety -- whatever is on your mind.

Then in a month or 3 mos you can all do it and see if things have changed/gotten better.

http://www.mindtools.com/pages/article/newHTE_93.htm

Dunno if that helps.

GG