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  #11  
Old 07-07-2012, 04:46 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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It does look like your relationship with your husband is troubled, and you seek things from your boyfriend that your husband doesn't give you (caring, for instance).

Now, that doesn't really mean anything. I mean, the fact is that you're with both of them, want to be with both of them, love both of them. So work on the relationships so they both make you happy independently.
And if your husband doesn't treat you right, stand up for yourself. Suggesting that letting you cuddle with him is a sacrifice or a payment on his part is outrageous. He needs to treat you with respect.

As for being slutty, I fail to see why it would be a problem (if you want sex and you seek it and don't hurt anyone in the process, how does that make you a bad person?) but in your case you were seeking emotional comfort with your boyfriend, so it's not even about sex and being horny, so I'm really not sure where this comes from.
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  #12  
Old 07-20-2012, 02:22 AM
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Seraphic Seraphic is offline
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Sorry I've neglected reading your responses here... I've been extremely busy--I'm finishing a Master's program this year and have been arduously trying to maintain my 4.0.

I do apologize for the rather dramatic suicidal thought in there... I've just recently discovered I may have clinical depression.

The "one defining moment" in my husband's and my relationship.... y'all will probably laugh at me, but...

We'd only gotten back together for about 4 months when our church dictated that, since we were "living together" (in separate rooms), we had to get married to continue on in the youth leadership positions we had. I was fully ready to step down because I knew no one else wanted my job--that's why I had it. But, the Husband agreed and we drove to Vegas and got married there. HIS WORDS: "We'll get married and tell the church, then we can get it annulled, if you want." That was what I'd consented to.

Three months later, we still hadn't consummated because a) I was still a virgin at that time and b) still wasn't sure I wanted to be married. He decided that it was time for us to consummate, despite protests from me. It was the most painful experience of my life, both physically and emotionally. I cried the whole time, kept saying, "Please stop..." and "No, I don't want to..." but, he insisted. And somehow, because we were married, it wasn't rape.

He says that he's only made one major mistake in our relationship....but that isn't it.

So....there's that. I don't know what my problem is. I don't know why I don't just....want to have sex all the time. He wants it at least 5 times a week...I'm lucky to want it five times a month...but, I give him what I can. He's told me that he appreciates what I do give him, but it isn't what he wants, so he will keep on it until he gets what he wants.

...all I want is a poem or something creative from him. Because he's *really* good it at that stuff...and it's time that he spends thinking about me. But, that's not what he wants to give me... It just seems a double standard to me, but when I say that, he has some sort of logical reason for it not being one...

I dunno. I'm sorry. This is my group therapy. :-( I feel stupid actually *saying* this stuff to people...probably because I think they're judging me somehow. So, I just try to deal with it myself; you can see how this works. :-\

PS: Y'all have made me cry on numerous occasions just by stating things like, "You have worth, dignity, and value" and other such things. Having lived a life of being the uber-geek/nerd and being told your dumb, fat, and ugly have really taken a toll. At least the hubs and the bf both believe in me...
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  #13  
Old 07-20-2012, 02:45 AM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
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I see polyamory as a structure for relationships, not an orientation like gender or a part of someone's personality.
Whereas poly is orientational for me. I've *always* wanted to have romantic connections with multiple ladies since I first began to enjoy the differences between boys and girls. So this is one thing I'm certain about.
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  #14  
Old 07-20-2012, 04:59 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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My dear, I am so sorry. :hug: Again, I apologize if this is hard to hear.

Quote:
I do apologize for the rather dramatic suicidal thought in there... I've just recently discovered I may have clinical depression.
It is NOT overdramatic. Is IS what it IS. Do not minimize your feelings and/or your pain. Please continue to try to seek treatment for your clinical depression side and if at ANY time you get that urge call 911. This is your HEALTH, your LIFE at stake here.

I have lost people to suicide, and I know people battling depression - it is an ongoing daily battle they bravely fight every minute of every day in a war within themselves. It is not flashy courage... it's the quiet courage. But courage all the same.

If you broke up, and then got back together, and then there was the whole railroading you into marriage over keeping a volunteer job angle... when were living together, were you/are you financially trapped into staying there? No other place to go and you ended up in some horrible cage? Please, please be safe. Please seek help when ready, and please read the resources at Speak Out Loud linked in my previous post. You do not sound totally safe there.

And as a youth advisor -- is he after the kids? Are you worried about that? Is there history already of that? Our church background screens for that for ALL people volunteering in church positions but even so... I know there's cracks in any system of volunteers a smoothie can slip in through.

Quote:
Three months later, we still hadn't consummated because a) I was still a virgin at that time and b) still wasn't sure I wanted to be married. He decided that it was time for us to consummate, despite protests from me. It was the most painful experience of my life, both physically and emotionally. I cried the whole time, kept saying, "Please stop..." and "No, I don't want to..." but, he insisted. And somehow, because we were married, it wasn't rape.
It IS rape. You are NOT a slut. You are a struggling person whose first sexual encounter was a marriage bed rape. I do not know if you have been able to articulate that to your depression doc. I hope whoever gave you the clinical depression dx was someone you can trust to share it NOW if you didn't at first. I hope you still have access to medical care. I do not know how free you can be in your world.

Quote:
I don't know why I don't just....want to have sex all the time. He wants it at least 5 times a week...I'm lucky to want it five times a month...but, I give him what I can. He's told me that he appreciates what I do give him, but it isn't what he wants, so he will keep on it until he gets what he wants.
1) Who wants to get it on with their rapist?
2) Depression affects libido
3) Read that sentence again:

He's told me that he appreciates what I do give him, but it isn't what he wants, so he will keep on it until he gets what he wants.

You are being ordered to surrender willing to a softer rape when you do not want it or else -- the threat to get raped anyway just more harshly? How is that for a libido killer? Some choice -- "Softer rape" or "harder rape" -- rape threat is still rape threat! Rape is still rape! So of course you have NO DESIRE here.
This is sex used as a weapon, not loving interaction in a marriage.

If you have to do what you have to do to survive -- no blame there. But on the inside? Speak your truth to yourself. Do not lose the real you. Keep hope alive that you can get yourself to aid when you are ready.

Quote:
...all I want is a poem or something creative from him. Because he's *really* good it at that stuff...and it's time that he spends thinking about me. But, that's not what he wants to give me... It just seems a double standard to me, but when I say that, he has some sort of logical reason for it not being one...
Playing mind games, he has the power and control if he keeps you off balance.

Take highlighter to list, and ID the ones used on you. Note the favorite playgrounds. Destroy it later if you have to, but speak it out loud to yourself if even at a whisper when ready.

I am so sorry you are enduring this. Hang in there. Seek parents, minister, BF, someone you can trust to help get you OUT of this when ready. Call women's shelters -- see if there are openings when you decide you are ready. The leaving time is very dangerous. No blame if you have to marshall yourself together first for a while. You gotta do what you gotta do to survive. But please try to as safe as you can in the meanwhile while you learn things, gather yourself intenally, and so forth. Make ready to make the hard choices ahead when YOU decide. I could understand if you feel too unsafe to do anything just yet.

But I acknowledge and validate to you that you have courage, the quiet kind, to even get this far. You have strength.

Quote:
I dunno. I'm sorry. This is my group therapy. :-( I feel stupid actually *saying* this stuff to people...probably because I think they're judging me somehow. So, I just try to deal with it myself; you can see how this works. :-\
You are not stupid. Nobody will judge you. There are assholes in the world, yes. But there are also many who share your story. I won't out the ones I know, but I know. Rape is horrible.

You can go to postsecret.com and search for "rape" and see how many anon cards are on that. It is a burden many carry. You are not alone even if sometimes you feel you are.

If you are struggling in Stage 1, know you aren't the first and sadly won't be the last - both men and women get hurt and abused and yes... raped.

You may not be ready to act. You may only just be starting to name (just even to yourself) what has been done to you. You may not be ready to tell people in real life. Perhaps you will choose your next baby step to be something not an online forum. Maybe an anon hotline. Maybe send a postsecret of your own. But you have power too. You can have control too. You have power to choose. You can choose when you feel ready to try at a louder volume. You already chose to whisper.

I cannot say it enough to you -- you have quiet courage, you have value, worth, and dignity.

You are not to blame, you are not a slut, you are not stupid, you are not evil. You are a struggling person with a heavy burden.

There is no shame in that. Many struggle in life.

Quote:
PS: Y'all have made me cry on numerous occasions just by stating things like, "You have worth, dignity, and value" and other such things. Having lived a life of being the uber-geek/nerd and being told your dumb, fat, and ugly have really taken a toll. At least the hubs and the bf both believe in me...
You DO have worth, dignity and value.

I acknowledge that enduring emotional tear down takes a toll. *hug* It is sucky.

I don't know how your BF is or how he enters the picture. If he's actually a healthy person in your life or another unhealthy person draining you. I will hope healthy but only you can know. You are the one living your life.

But if this is what DH is in your world, then you are married to your rapist, and he is automatically untrustworthy with your care and well being.

You have been in a situation where you are being torn down and torn up inside. Probably been around the block a few times on the cycle of abuse. You may hope he will decide to change so you do not have to endure any more. But everyone gets to a point where they can endure no more and must act. Sigh.

You may not be ready to speak it out loud in real life, you may not be ready to leave this horrible situation. But please, please take care of you as best you can in the meanwhile, and keep your spark of quiet courage alive inside in whatever ways you can find.

Even if it is only at a whisper volume still -- you've done a lot coming online already to break silence.

But it's a long road, and you will need professional care at some point when YOU choose you are ready, not just internet strangers. But please know this internet stranger sincerely wish you well, and hopes for a better future where you can be free and be better.

You DO have worth, dignity and value. Remember that.


*hug*

GG

Last edited by GalaGirl; 07-20-2012 at 05:25 AM.
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  #15  
Old 07-20-2012, 02:05 PM
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CielDuMatin CielDuMatin is offline
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Seraphic, I would like to apologize for my rather flippant post towards the start of this thread - I was responding to your general questions in your original post and had no clue about all the background stuff that was going on.

This is a truly horrible situation, and it really has nothing to do with love or caring, and everything to do with control and abuse. I have found myself agreeing more and more with various posts that GalaGirl has been making recently, and this is no exception, and I only feel like I can emphasis some of the points she has already made.

The things you are feeling is because you are a victim of abuse. It's not surprising that you do not feel in the mood for sex when your only experience with it has been non-consensual and highly emotionally abusive.

Please follow GG's advice and try to get out of this horrible situation as safely and as quickly as you can. You do NOT deserve this.
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  #16  
Old 07-25-2012, 04:11 AM
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Seraphic Seraphic is offline
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...I feel like I've turned my husband into a monster. He's not evil...we just have different perspectives.

...and sometimes, my feelings of hurt overshadow his moments of awesome.

GG, to your question of harming children, never. He would never, EVER do that kind of thing. He's never physically hit me, but he has thrown my stuff around the bedroom before (ie: my Macbook that he'd bought me as a birthday present the year after we were married.... I "came to bed late" and he was mad about it, so he threw it across the room). He refers to my stuff as "shit," but his stuff is "stuff." He'll remind me of my "promises" (such as my personal commitment to do laundry once a week), but he'll constantly choose not to do something he's promised to do (like dishes) because he works 40 hours a week (I do not...which I'll get to in a few moments).

I'm maintaining a 4.0 in a Master's program with plans to start a doctorate in March of 2013. I work about 10-20 hrs/week for a real estate agent. It's not what I enjoy and it's not consistent hours or money (but, hey! I'm, apparently, not qualified for anything....so say the hiring people). He doesn't understand why I can't just get a job (I can't even get work at a fast food joint because I'm over-qualified) and reminds me of such, periodically. He's not evil. He just wants what he wants and is under his own stress at work.

The BF is actually... everything I've ever dreamed a guy would be like (mostly... we have our issues...like him NOT letting me know he's not going to be around. It's an LD relationship)...when he holds me, I feel safe. It's kinda dumb, I guess. But he's got a "White Knight" complex--which is both blessing and curse. We've had long discussions of how he'll drop everything for everyone else, but not me. He's working on that. No one's perfect, right?

...least of all, me...

I'm sure I'm the most horrid wife ever. I don't fulfill his wants/desires/needs. Perhaps I am functioning in a learned helplessness capacity. I dunno...I read those descriptions and it scares me, at first, then I logic it out and rationalize...it's likely just my emotions and my hurt that is causing the problem....

I'm sorry, I'm probably frustrating you all and making you all want to choke me. I'll look through the forums and find other things way more positive and happy to think about. I'm not always this negative....
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Last edited by Seraphic; 07-25-2012 at 04:32 AM.
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  #17  
Old 07-29-2012, 08:31 PM
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Arrowbound Arrowbound is offline
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Originally Posted by Seraphic View Post
...I feel like I've turned my husband into a monster. He's not evil...we just have different perspectives.
No need to backpedal. You haven't turned him into anything; you've just been honest. Sometimes that's all it takes -- laying it out on the table plain as day in front of your own face so the truth isn't hiding somewhere beneath the folds of excuses.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphic View Post
GG, to your question of harming children, never. He would never, EVER do that kind of thing. He's never physically hit me, but he has thrown my stuff around the bedroom before (ie: my Macbook that he'd bought me as a birthday present the year after we were married.... I "came to bed late" and he was mad about it, so he threw it across the room). He refers to my stuff as "shit," but his stuff is "stuff." He'll remind me of my "promises" (such as my personal commitment to do laundry once a week), but he'll constantly choose not to do something he's promised to do (like dishes) because he works 40 hours a week (I do not...which I'll get to in a few moments).
The bolded? Not okay. It doesn't matter if he hasn't tried to choke you out. Throwing objects because he's mad? That's what my toddler son (almost 3) does, almost daily. My toddler son, who I'm assuming is much younger than your husband. Don't excuse this. Don't accept it either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphic View Post
I'm maintaining a 4.0 in a Master's program with plans to start a doctorate in March of 2013. I work about 10-20 hrs/week for a real estate agent. It's not what I enjoy and it's not consistent hours or money (but, hey! I'm, apparently, not qualified for anything....so say the hiring people). He doesn't understand why I can't just get a job (I can't even get work at a fast food joint because I'm over-qualified) and reminds me of such, periodically. He's not evil. He just wants what he wants and is under his own stress at work.
Stop excusing this man. I get it, y'all are married. But he just wants what he wants? He is acting like an overgrown child. Coddling doesn't help. Kids "just want what they want" and often don't think of consequences.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphic View Post
I'm sure I'm the most horrid wife ever. I don't fulfill his wants/desires/needs. Perhaps I am functioning in a learned helplessness capacity. I dunno...I read those descriptions and it scares me, at first, then I logic it out and rationalize...it's likely just my emotions and my hurt that is causing the problem....
You're sure? Do you believe that?
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  #18  
Old 07-30-2012, 11:02 AM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
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Originally Posted by Seraphic View Post
...I feel like I've turned my husband into a monster. He's not evil...we just have different perspectives.
He raped you. That IS evil.
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When speaking of various forms of non-monogamy...it ain't poly if you're just fucking around.

While polyamory, open relationships, and swinging are all distinctly different approaches to non-monogamy, they are not mutually exlusive. Folks can, and some do, engage in more than one of them at a time--and it's all good.
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  #19  
Old 07-30-2012, 02:17 PM
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SunsetMan SunsetMan is offline
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Seraphic,

I'm a 37 y.o. male who was in a sumilar situation. For years, she always said that she wouldn't put up with phyiscal abuse from me, if I hit her even once... she would be gone.

That's fine, I'm not a physical guy in that respect.

But what's NOT fine is that she would manipulate me, try to prevent me from seeing my friends (One, literally on his deathbed), stop me from being an independant person and once, yes, she had nonconsentual sex with me. (I woke up in the middle of her performing the act.... heavy sleeper, I guess.)

It took me years to realize that not all abuse is about throwing punches. Domination of another in ANY way is all the same thing when it comes down to it. No, I didn't have bruises, but I was constantly put down, negleted, nagged at and was expected to work 40h, come home, cook all the meals, clean up AND take 100% care of the kids in the evening because being a stay-at-home-mom was SUCH hard work. The beginning of the end happened when I realized that she had no respect for me.

He's controlling you and manipulating you for his own agenda. And manipulators never change because they don't understand. He has no respect for you.

HE is the reason why you've had suicidal thoughts. HE is the cause of your depression.

Get out. Do it safe and do it fast.
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  #20  
Old 07-30-2012, 11:35 PM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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Seraphic:

Quote:
it's likely just my emotions and my hurt that is causing the problem....
Yep. But when ready... keep digging that thought down to the bedrock.

WHY are you having these emotions burble UP in the first place? Because you experience WHAT stimulus? At who's hand? Your own? Or your husband?

If you constantly are told you are terrible, you will constantly tell yourself that too. I affirm to you that you are not terrible. You are mixed up. That is ok to be at this time, at this place. That does not negate your value. You have dignity, value and worth. Even if poorly treated, you are STILL a valuable human being.

Throwing computers and calling your things shit? That's not normal husband behavior. I affirm this to you.

*hug*

You are in a mindspace that is hard to be in.

I read you as a Stage 1. You will wibble to and fro. It pains you to think things. So you don't. This is pre-contemplation. This is not yet action. That is totally fine.

You may not even want to CLICK the links I give you. But that's alright too. I left the trail and you can always come back later to click when your eyes feel ready to go there.

You have done A LOT and just enough in just trying to reach out here. This isn't exactly the right place, but it will do for now if you need to light one candle in the darkness SOMEWHERE so you know people somewhere are listening and reading. I hear you. I see you. Your words reached my eyes. (And others!)

Maybe start a blog or something -- a safe space to vent? And start tracking your time and the things that happen to you by date/time in case you ever need some kind of record?

I have faith in you that you will do what you need to do for you at your own speed, in your own time, in your own place.

I just cannot repeat enough to you -- you are worth it. You have dignity. You have value. You have power. WHEN you choose to wield it.

And I will keep on encouraging you to be careful, and seek LOCAL pro care as soon as you are ready to go there so you can be safe in all your buckets.

And if you are not ready yet, I understand.
And if you have unspoken obstacles you cannot name here -- I understand.
And if you are not ready to be ready to think about being ready, I get that one too. Sigh. I totally understand.

So I can only give you a compassionate ***HUG*** for now. I suppose across Internet Ether to help warm your soul/heart buckets.

And a wish for you to still be shining the light that is you in the world tomorrow. Over and over and over. Until you are in a better place in the mind/heart buckets. I hope your body bucket is safe and ok enough for now. Sigh.

So you can move this thing FORWARD to get yourself FORWARD one day. Don't lose hope on "one day."

So the MetaYou in ALL your buckets -- Seraphic in mind, heart, body, and soul -- can be at peace and joyously ALIVE, and SAFE, and LOVED.

Namaste.

GG

Last edited by GalaGirl; 07-30-2012 at 11:47 PM.
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