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Old 05-13-2012, 10:48 PM
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KitWalker KitWalker is offline
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Default Going with the flow

This is a repost of my intro, so as not to retype it:

http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22603
Quote:
I have been aware of polyamory for a long time. It's hard to be a geek and/or go to sci-fi conventions and not pick up at least a passing knowledge of it's existence. I just never thought that I would have anything to do with it. Well, up until relatively recent times I haven't thought that. I've been married to an absolutely amazing girl for... Heck, I don't know, I'm bad with time. Close to 15 years, I suppose... Never occurred to me there was room in this for anyone else. Don't get me wrong, we could always talk about a pretty girl or guy we saw. It was always on the level of aesthetics, not romance, though.

A few years ago we made a new friend. I took a liking to her, did little favors, got small presents. At one point, I noticed that I am paying more attention to her than to other people, and I asked my wife if she had any problems with this preoccupation I seem to have developed. She said she didn't. We've been getting more and more friendly. Then, the three of us met for coffee, took walks, held hands...

After a little while I took stock of the situation and realized I have to be honest, with myself first and foremost. I love this girl. I also love my wife more than ever. The two of them also have quite an attraction to each other, as well. The weird thing is, my wife was less surprised by this development than I was. Go figure...

We've been taking it kinda slow, seeing how things go and what develops, ever since. Essentially, I'd say we are dating. And so, I'm here.
More to follow
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Old 05-13-2012, 11:00 PM
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Now, I've been mostly lurking around here. I did have some questions, mainly whether we could be going too slow. Just as I was gathering thoughts to post, we seem to have collectively stepped off of a cliff. No, scratch that. It's more like we got shot out of a cannon and are floating on air.

So, we have been meeting irregularly. Coffee, walks, girls make out, some of that for me, then we go home. Nights like that usually resulted in hours-long bed conversations with my wife and the usual roll in the hay. We talked about our girl, where this was going, what could be... Everything. She had some apprehensions. Not abut us, our relationship could not be any more solid. We are a single entity, we are part of his one thing. Heck, we're even dating a girl as a team. No, she was worried about our girl. Our girl has had some horrendously bad relationships in the past. She is not known to be poly. So, my wife was worried that she may be looking for a "regular partner" and we might be keeping her from that.

Now, my position on this was that she is a big girl and we are not insisting on anything. We aren't even asking, beyond the normal social invitation. If we all wind up wearing the same lipstick every time we meet that kinda tells me she is in it as much as we are. She isn't very talkative and we are not orderly planners, so there wasn't a planning session with a flowchart for this relationship. We all just did what we felt was right.

And then my favorite part of the year rolled around.
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Old 05-13-2012, 11:06 PM
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What I mean by the favorite part of the year is that there is a yearly project that we all work on. This is a good time for me because it means we all get together more regularly. I'm a selfish jackass that way. Being together clearly makes the girls happy, and them being happy makes me happy, no matter what actual action I get. Don't get me wrong, the action part was there in my mind, I am a live male, but it's not the most important thing.

And so it goes. We meet, we kiss, we spend time, we talk, we take forever to say goodbye, stay up past our bedtimes...

And then...

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Old 05-15-2012, 05:07 AM
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That's so sweet! I love hearing tales like this.
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Me: female, bi, (formerly hinge of a vee)
with FirstBoyFriend (FBF)(moderately long-distance)
and no longer with CurrentBoyFriend (CBF)(who lives in the apartment building next door)
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Old 05-15-2012, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KitWalker View Post
Now, I've been mostly lurking around here. I did have some questions, mainly whether we could be going too slow.
This has - according to your next sentence - radically changed, but I'm going to comment on it anyway... partly for the benefit of other readers, who might be doubting about their own situation. There is NO poly-tically correct timetable. Never feel that you're "letting the side down" or you're "not poly enough". Do what you're comfortable with, push your limits, if you like, but not painfully. Which brings me to my next point:
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Originally Posted by KitWalker View Post
No, she was worried about our girl. Our girl has had some horrendously bad relationships in the past. She is not known to be poly. So, my wife was worried that she may be looking for a "regular partner" and we might be keeping her from that.
Respect other people's feelings. This woman might want to be "just" friends - with a bit of kissing thrown in. And that's fine, friendship's a wonderful thing. But you shouldn't pre-empt her desires. If she's been burned in the past, that doesn't mean that she'll be burned even more by a poly relationship. If you or your wife's feelings about her are "Hey, I'd like to get into her knickers!" or "What a turn-on it would be to watch while she's getting it on with my partner!", if - in short - you're interested in her as a plaything... then, please, do leave her alone. Because that WILL burn her.

But - as I never tire of saying - poly isn't [just] about sex: it's about Love. And Love includes respect, caring, nurturing. OK, it could be real love and she could end up getting burned again anyway. That's a risk we ALL run. There are no guarantees. But freezing out in the cold can be as damaging as getting too close to the fire. And, as you say,
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Originally Posted by KitWalker View Post
she is a big girl and we are not insisting on anything.
Having said all that, I'm still not ready to shut up. There's this:
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Originally Posted by KitWalker View Post
my wife was worried that she may be looking for a "regular partner" and we might be keeping her from that.
It might be useful to you to do a tag search on "cowgirl". It's far from my intention to imply that this woman is being calculating, and I really do hope that it works out for all of you [in whichever way is best], but for people unused to poly, there is always the danger of remaining beliefs of "there is ONE perfect love out there for me", and some people go into poly relationships with an agenda (sometimes even unkown to themselves) of winning someone else' partner for "me alone". The programming most of us went through when young was strong. If you're going to go poly, ALL THREE of you must be open and clear from the start: this is NOT a fast or slow baton-change. If she's uncomfortable with that, best to leave it on a friendly basis.
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If I can't dance, I want no part in your Revolution.
- Emma Goldman Anarchist and Polyamorous par excellence
The person who says something is impossible should not interrupt the person who is doing it.
- old Chinese proverb
And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.
~ Anais Nin
I'd rather have a broken heart / Than have a heart of stone.
- from "Boundless Love (A Polyamory Song)" by Jimmy Hollis i Dickson
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Old 05-15-2012, 07:32 PM
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Good points, Mr. FFR. Let me address some of them before proceeding.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
There is NO poly-tically correct timetable. Never feel that you're "letting the side down" or you're "not poly enough". Do what you're comfortable with, push your limits, if you like, but not painfully.
My doubts had very little to do with that. On one hand, the problem solver in me wanted to sit down and have a direct conversation laying out just how I feel. On the other hand I was deathly afraid of making our girl uncomfortable in any way, not because I might miss out on some good times, but because I really care about her. In the end, slow was correct, and it was really just my impatience that was unsettling me.

Quote:
Which brings me to my next point:Respect other people's feelings. This woman might want to be "just" friends - with a bit of kissing thrown in. And that's fine, friendship's a wonderful thing. But you shouldn't pre-empt her desires. If she's been burned in the past, that doesn't mean that she'll be burned even more by a poly relationship. If you or your wife's feelings about her are "Hey, I'd like to get into her knickers!" or "What a turn-on it would be to watch while she's getting it on with my partner!", if - in short - you're interested in her as a plaything... then, please, do leave her alone. Because that WILL burn her.
Funny you should say that. This pretty much mirrors a conversation I had with my wife. She literally said "she is not a toy". We agreed on that. We care about her. Which is why we didn't push, prod, or have meetings which might make her feel obligated.

Also, let me throw this in. I was prepared for this to not happen. Because we were going by intuition rather than a bulleted list we couldn't be sure of what was in her mind. And I was ready to stay friends. Not because I don't care, but because I do. I am not a teenager anymore, I can manage feelings, although I'd rather not have to.

Quote:
But - as I never tire of saying - poly isn't [just] about sex: it's about Love. And Love includes respect, caring, nurturing.
You know, I've had dreams and fantasies over the couple of years it has taken for this to solidify. They weren't about inserting tab A into slot B. I wanted to have tea together. I wanted to do her dishes for her. Not because I like doing dishes, or because I am some sort of submissive with a housework fetish, but because it's something she hates doing and it would make her happy.


Quote:
OK, it could be real love and she could end up getting burned again anyway. That's a risk we ALL run. There are no guarantees.
That's also a pretty close mirror of the conversations we had. There are no guarantees, we will do what we can and take the rest as it comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
There's this:It might be useful to you to do a tag search on "cowgirl". It's far from my intention to imply that this woman is being calculating, and I really do hope that it works out for all of you [in whichever way is best], but for people unused to poly, there is always the danger of remaining beliefs of "there is ONE perfect love out there for me", and some people go into poly relationships with an agenda (sometimes even unkown to themselves) of winning someone else' partner for "me alone". The programming most of us went through when young was strong. If you're going to go poly, ALL THREE of you must be open and clear from the start: this is NOT a fast or slow baton-change. If she's uncomfortable with that, best to leave it on a friendly basis.
I did the search. Valid concern. However, I doubt that is the case here. You wouldn't be able to tell how valid my opinion is from what I have written so far, but I am not publishing every minute detail. Maybe things will get clearer as I expound more.
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Old 05-20-2012, 02:47 PM
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And then...

Actually, before I get to that, there is something I should mention. Many of our meetings/dates/whatever were in bars with a few drinks thrown in. Alcohol definitely has the effect of making people go easy on the brakes in their behavior and speech. That said, both me and my wife always remember what we said and did, so we can't have the plausible deniability. "I was drunk" doesn't cut it with us. It isn't an excuse we either give or take.

One day we invited our girl for tea. Strictly tea, no booze. We spent the evening talking, and at the end when she was leaving the girls shared a long and sweet kiss. My wife then told me later that night that it was a sort of a test for her. She wanted to see if things would be the same with their perceptions unclouded. They were.

Having her head screwed on straight is yet another reason I love her so much.
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Old 05-20-2012, 08:53 PM
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On with the show.

After our grand project was complete there was a celebration late into the night. Our girl spent the party quite literally in my wife's lap. This, by this point in time, was hardly unusual. They really do have quite an attraction for each other.

When the party was breaking up we all left together, as our girl didn't bring her car. The scene in the back seat was, to put it mildly, distracting. Figuring it was not the time to break up the party we drove to our house.

Once there the girls went to bed. Since we haven't actually discussed anything up front I wasn't sure if I was getting a spectator seat or if I was going to be a gracious host and go sleep on the couch. Apparently, I was wrong on both counts. It turned out I was invited as an equal participant. What followed was nothing short of amazing, even despite being dog-tired.

The best part? Breakfast together and cuddle afterwards.

The most surprising part? Complete and total lack of awkwardness. It's like we've been living that way forever.

Since then our girl has stayed overnight some more. We still have things to talk about for hours. We still go out. We still take forever to part ways.

The only downside is that we do have to part. I'm doing my best to keep myself from grabbing a shovel and breaking ground on an addition to the house (our place is tiny). I am at least that well grounded in reality.

I don't know where this road is taking us, we'll see when we get there.
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Old 05-25-2012, 05:05 PM
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Yayyyyyyyyyyy! Dreams do sometimes come true! I'm happy for all of you... But don't expect that everything's going to be 100% easy and painless from now on. ALL relationships need working on. Best of luck!
__________________
If I can't dance, I want no part in your Revolution.
- Emma Goldman Anarchist and Polyamorous par excellence
The person who says something is impossible should not interrupt the person who is doing it.
- old Chinese proverb
And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.
~ Anais Nin
I'd rather have a broken heart / Than have a heart of stone.
- from "Boundless Love (A Polyamory Song)" by Jimmy Hollis i Dickson
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Old 05-28-2012, 09:37 AM
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Heya I've liked reading so far and wish you the best of luck. I've recently fallen into a triangle-y situation myself with one of my partners and his new girlfriend, and the lack of awkwardness was joyful to discover for me too

Quote:
my wife was worried that she may be looking for a "regular partner" and we might be keeping her from that.
I have had this worry with others before. I think it's a fair point to some extent. When you're in a relationship, you sometimes don't have the same energy/inclination/ease of finding another partner (this is obviously not always the case, but in general). It can be a bit like having a job while trying to find another one. The first can somewhat get in the way of the second.

But yeah, as you say, "she's a big girl"... Everyone in any relationship needs to weigh up for themselves whether it's worth it. All you can do is be kind, considerate, honest, loving... sounds like you and your wife are definitely all these

Quote:
... there wasn't a planning session with a flowchart for this relationship.
WHAT?!? You three are screwed

Quote:
We all just did what we felt was right.
Amen to that. And if you manage to navigate through things that feel wrong as/when they come up, you're sorted! Bon voyage... or should I say bon appetit? Ah, there should be an apt Italian phrase for the start of poly triads
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