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  #31  
Old 03-18-2010, 03:44 AM
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Okay. Poor GG! I mean really. The man is cornered it sounds like. Knowing his history as I do and perhaps others on here, I totally get why this is a struggle for him. He has known these guys for 14 years? They are his peeps! Just as you and maca are LR.
He's had 14 years of knowing them (he's known me for 17) to make this right, and he hasn't even tried. In point of fact, he and I were lovers before they came in the picture, and he allowed it. I don't really sympathize much with him on how difficult it is. When I committed to being his friend, I committed to protecting his honor. When Maca and I started dating one of the things I told him was that I had 3 relationships +my daughter that if he "crossed" them, he would be out-and one of those was GG..... I never would have allowed ANYONE to be close to me and talk smack about him as he's allowed these guys to do to me.

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He is also in a tough spot as I see it. Know doubt he is not so stupid he doesn't know it. He is being asked to do some major shifting and changing in his life this year as becoming an official boyfriend to you, an official family member to your whole family and now he has to face his friends and risk losing them at such a tentative time?!
Not fair I think.
He's been accepted by everyone (not just our household) as an official family member here longer than Maca has.... seriously.
AND he hasn't had contact with any of these guys (barring one, whom we all get along with, because the guy CHOSE to try and be a part of GG's life and so he got to know us) in YEARS, because he got sick of their bs, but was too chicken shit to actually confront them, so he just stopped hanging out with them.
Suddenly the one we all get along with decides (he still socializes with the others) that he REALLY wants to "make a peace and bring GG back into the group". So here we have a drama...

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Can that not wait? You are asking him to trust his position in the family enough to possibly chose you all over what sounds like his only other support system.
I didn't chose the timing-his other best friend chose it.
And no, I'm not asking, yes I am DEMANDING that he trust his position with ME enough to chose me over them regardless of what happens between he and Maca.

In point of fact, if he can't, he will destroy our friendship, not only our romantic relationship. I'm not the kind of person to take the kids away from him, but yes RP, if he is unwilling to stand up for me with the guys, he will lose me as his girlfriend, and his friend.
14 years of putting up with their abuses because he wasn't willing to say anything is long enough.

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I totally get this sucks for you. Believe me, I have been there with nerdists friends. They thought I was a repeat of his last girlfriend (controlling and bossy) . I had to earn their trust by getting involved. Talking with them, calling them up and asking them to take nerdist out because I knew he felt torn between me and them and because I knew that his friends thought I wouldn't let him out. They were impressed and had no other alternative than to give me a chance. I charmed them basically. Otherwise, as Eugenepoet said, they would call me a bitch for being angry and frustrated.
I did that, the only one who would even acknowledge that I existed, much less the effort I was making was the one who wants to make the peace (an effort I commend actually). He and I get along fine, as do I and his wife.
The others are juvenile. There is no "ex" to compare me to, I was GG's first. I was the one all of his girlfriends were compared to and the truth is-I came out on top in every case. BUT if they were to acknowledge that, they'd have to also acknowledge that while they were all playing house, I was already raising a family, holding down a REAL job, taking care of responsibilities that they hadn't even IMAGINED yet. They don't want to see that I might have value to GG. They want to keep enjoying the childish position of "she's a girl, therefore she's a worthless piece of shit" and frankly-I'm too old to want to play the game, AT ALL.

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Why? Because he trusted his place in my life by then. He felt secure and safe within that.
If GG doesn't trust his place in my life, if he doesn't feel secure and safe in our relationship at this stage, he probably shouldn't be dating me. I understand that in new relationships there is a need for time to gain that sense of trust, security and safety. BUT-as I said before, we have a CLOSE relationship that has lasted 17 years. Our first sexual experience together was damn near 16 years ago. I've defended him and held him close all of that time. I was point blank that if he wasn't AT and IN my wedding-I wouldn't marry Maca. This isn't a situation where he's wondering "well is she going to boot me out" or "I'm ONLY a secondary in this relationship.." or "a third"... He and I have had a deep, loving relationship since prior to Maca and I starting to date. He knows damn well I'm not going to send him packing-EVEN if he fucks this up, I won't date him, but I wouldn't send him packing.

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I would suggest, for many different reasons, GG doesn't feel safe enough to leave the security of his friends yet. Or challenge their behaviour. He doesn't agree with them. You know that LR.
It's long past time he figure out how to find his safety then RP. Because I'm done being their scapegoat.


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He just needs time I think and needs to be encouraged and helped, not told he isn't a man because he doesn't do things like maca does.
I didn't, and wouldn't tell him that. In point of fact what I told him is that I love him-and that isn't going to change. He needs to decide what is best for him. BUT he also needs to know-that I won't put up with being treated this way for him OR ANYONE ELSE any longer. So if he CAN'T stand up to them, then he will HAVE to give up our relationship-because it's damaging to me.
I also told him that my kids are sure as HELL not "hanging out" with people who can't respect me as a person. No if's, and's or but's.

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He doesn't have the same sense of security maca does.
That would be hysterical if it weren't so completely the opposite of true. GG has a MUCH stronger sense of security in his relationship with me (and the kids) than Maca does. So much so that I can't even begin to describe the difference.

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With all due respect and possibly not knowing all the details, have patience and find ways to help him with this. That is what my version of family is, to help those I love by sucking up my hurt and facing diversity with a big smile and be a gracious host sometimes. Bake them some cookies and give the biggest and baddest a call and tell them you are so glad they are GGs buddy because he needs them to be supportive.
I can't. I'm not allowed to have their contact information. The only one I do know how to contact, I do.
Quote:
This is no issue for a dom. This is between you and GG. Maca should be sitting back and supporting both of you by just being an active listener in my opinion.
Maca's trying-but he can't sit back and watch them destroy me emotionally. He hasn't vented on GG, only on here-and GG hasn't been on here in MONTHS. It's not like he hasn't seen it before. They are a key reason why GG's parents won't have anything to do with our family, specifically their granddaughter. Because she's MY daughter and his brothers talked so much smack that they painted a picture of me that is faulty.
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Last edited by NeonKaos; 03-18-2010 at 11:59 AM. Reason: fix quote formatting
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  #32  
Old 03-18-2010, 03:47 AM
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As for the update,

Maca decided he wasn't going. He let GG know-he told him why.

Maca and I drove GG into town, dropped him off. He confronted the guys (we weren't there, so I haven't a clue what was actually said) and they agreed that they would no longer be on my case and that they would make an effort to get to know GG in his REAL life (with us).
I do know he didn't bring up poly or that I was his girlfriend, but that really wasn't the topic or my concern.
My BEING his girlfriend, I expect that he should be willing to defend my honor so to speak, but I don't really care if he tells them I'm his girlfriend or his best friend, it makes no difference.

Not sure where things stand completely-because there's too much going on with my medical situation to deal with it right now.

I do know that it's been made clear that the kids are not to be around these guys unless I am present, and since my surgery is scheduled for next Tuesday-followed by 6-8 weeks of down time, that won't be happening any time soon.
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  #33  
Old 03-18-2010, 04:43 AM
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Ok....

As I said before " my tounge hurts from bitting it for weeks now". I havent "gone off" on GG as of yet. Im trying to be patient and understanding. But really ? I mean LR and GG have been "together" for years before it was offical. I would think that if LR was willing to risk her marriage to me in order to be with GG behind my back then it stands to reason she isnt going to bail on him. As a matter of fact it was me that had to choose if I was going to stay in this relationship not GG.

As for his talk with his friends, IMO from what he told me he said to them, all he really did was say " cant we all just forget about it and move on"? WTF thats not dealing with 14 years of bashing someone you say that you love. Dont get me wrong I hope that all of them can work it out and move on. But its been years and its high time it got handled.

As far as the " its not a Dom thing its between GG and LR ". I would agree in the fact thats its somthing that GG needs to deal with for the piece of miund for LR. But as far as the D/s part, we are a 24/7 D/s relationship and as such for 24 hrs 7 days a week she is my charge to protect and care for PERIOD. I could never take her at face value when she says that she trusts me if I stand back and listen and dont take action. I REFUSE to do that to her.

Im realy not trying to bash on GG. Im planning on taking him out for a drink tomorrow to try yet again to show him what he is missing and offer way to help him. I was planning on getting my frustration with him off my chest but ...... Im not sure i thats the best course of action. Talking with LR about what Im dealing with and being able to write it out here on the board has helped me work through alot of it.

RP you know I love and respect you and I know you are trying to see things from all sides and I know you want only the best for all of us. As always I will take your words and reread them and think them over . You are a very wise Woman and I value your thoughts.


Peace and Love

Maca
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  #34  
Old 03-18-2010, 06:57 AM
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Well there you go. I said I perhaps didn't know everthing and that has been proven.

I was thinking of GG's family past rather than your past together. I understand the differences between my experience and yours. He has been in your life longer than they have LR. That makes a difference for sure, as does trying the fake smile root already and it not working. Maybe they are just chauvinists that will never change?

I guess I wonder what is going on for him behind all this. What is making it so difficult? It sounds like he has made an attempt, but not a good enough one for either of you. Has he said anything about what is going on for him? What his feelings are and what comes up for him? Maybe the whole thing triggers him in some way.

Go GG, get the job done! I hope something more satisfying comes out of the whole thing for you. How frustrating! You totally don't deserve to be treated badly. No one does.
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  #35  
Old 03-18-2010, 07:27 AM
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Just an aside about dominance. Sometimes for me being dominant means seemingly stepping aside in order to appear to have no invested interest in terms of what goes on for my men. Smiling, being humbly grateful, saying it like I see it in a nonemotional way and baking cookies is actually a way of being dominate for me. I was protecting by creating a way for there to be no choice between nerdist chosing between me and his friends. Protecting by making it so it became obvious that I was the better chose because they continued to be idiots and I acted maturely and with every confidence that I had the upper hand in the situation.

I'm not saying you should do as I do LR, just making a point that dominance isn't always about aggressively or assertively taking action. It can be about standing back after creating a situation that will reveal the true nature of those involved in a situation. Nerdists friends could make the choice then, not nerdist. If they had chosen to continue bad mouthing me then nerdist would chose me. Because they chose to accept my hospitality into the life we were creating together nerdist kept his friends as well as me. They got to look like the good guys for being so accepting and I got to get rid of a head ache. All good.

I don't doubt you want to be there for LR 24/7 maca. Of course you do, I hope you realize this post was all about me and how I was personally more dominant in my relationship with nerdist at that time. Rather than this is how YOU should dominate. I just do things differently it seems sometimes.
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  #36  
Old 03-19-2010, 12:53 AM
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You know we love you RP.

I don't really know where GG is emotionally in all of this. Becuase he's being VERY VERY quiet about all of it.

We did (FINALLY) talk some today-10 minutes... seriously, TEN MINUTES. That's it. We didn't get too far.

As he see's it he's changed his method of dealing with them, but can't prove it until everyone spends time together. I'm not sure why-most of the nastiness was done behind my back, so what difference does it make? I'm not sure.

I can't say that what he's done so far is NOT enough... I don't know if it is or not.
To me it's MUCH more about how he acts, and less about what they do because of it.
If he (going forward from here) chooses to stand up and walk out (or tell them to stop or whatever) instead of just letting disrespectful behaviors towards me to be ignored and to continue-great. If not-welllllll then I have to stand up for myself and that means stepping back from him.

I did tell him about this thread-he hasn't chosen to log in. He also hasn't written me back (I wrote him) or talked to me until today for a few minutes before he went to work and I went to (yet another) dr. appt.

My GUT instinct is that he's feeling defensive and guarded. His NORMAL reaction to ANY type of conflict with ANYONE is to give in to the request so that it stops, if that can't be done or doesn't work, then he will walk/run in the opposite direction in order to escape it.
Unfortunately, that simply doesn't work well in terms of relationships and families. There is a certain amount of responsibility to care for your family that comes into play.
He's never really had to "worry" about that-because I am ULTRA protective of the kids (no one else really has to be because I am THAT on top of it) and I never asked that he be protective of me.
BUT he's watched for 17 years how I am that way with him and everyone else in my life... so it's not like the concept or idea evades him. He simply would prefer to say "ok play nice everyone" and then turn a blind eye to any infractions. With all of the medical issues that I've had in the last 9 months I've become MORE aware of my own fragility and weaknesses.
While I can respect that he's not ANYTHING like Maca-and actually I LIKE that-I also recognize in myself that I need him to be committed enough to our relationship-whatever he wants to refer to me as-that he's willing to protect me from unwarranted attacks-be they emotional, physical, psychological, sexual, whatever. ESPECIALLY if those attacks are coming from people HE is bringing into my life.


If these were a group of guys who became friends in school (presumably single) and had a close-knit relationship, then they started getting girlfriends/wives and were struggling to figure out the new dynamic-I might be more sympathetic (emphasis on MIGHT).
But he and I were close BEFORE they came into the picture. We already had an intimate connection.

He told Maca that it was different before, because he didn't know if I was going to stay in his life.....
I think that's b.s.
No one KNOWS if another person is going to stay in their life FOR SURE. We have to take our chances. But if we want someone to stay in our life-generally speaking we need to treat them with care and respect if not love and kindness-AND we need to NOT cultivate an atmosphere where they are mistreated, abused and disrespected by OUR OWN FRIENDS AND FAMILY....

Then there is the whole "friend" thing....

I was the one who was there moving him into my home when he ended up living in a crack house (no he wasn't a participant-long story). Not ONE of them was there, not ONE. THEY lived in the same town as he did-I did not.

I was the one who kept up with him no matter where he lived, moved, worked etc.
They have NOT. No phone calls, no visits, no emails.

They treat me like I am a burden in his life-but the truth is I have been a HUGE support for him in his life, living his life HIS WAY even when it wasn't something I would do or something I thought was right or good or whatever. I didn't tell him who to keep as friends or who to live with, or who to hang out with, where to work, what to do, who to date etc etc etc. I accepted him as he was, for who he was. I loved him-as is.

Anyway-I am going to go take a bath with my husband.... ok, nevermind-I'm not.... I guess I'm going to try to catch up on reading the threads then.
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  #37  
Old 03-19-2010, 04:11 PM
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"His NORMAL reaction to ANY type of conflict with ANYONE is to give in to the request so that it stops, if that can't be done or doesn't work, then he will walk/run in the opposite direction in order to escape it."

Yah. That's my personality type exactly. I learned how to do confrontation when I have to, though.

Here's a metaphor for GG: You need to carry two playing cards in your pockets, the one-eyed jacks. The jack of hearts is the one you nearly always play. He's the one you identify with -- he stands for love, friendship, amity. The jack of hearts is always face up in your world.

But you always have the jack of spades available. There are times you will need his coldness, his cynicism, even his ability to hate with clarity and intent.

I had to teach myself to use the ability to confront even though I dislike doing it and feel badly afterward. When a group of engineers tried to make me do a week's programming to implement a badly-conceived control schema that no operator would ever use I spent hours on the phone and in person telling them, in veiled language, to go f**k a lamp-post. It was a difficult psychic effort but I won. And it feels damned good now.

IMHO, GG needs to learn this. He needs it for his own personal development as well as for this particular situation.

Maca, I continue to admire you. It sounds like you spoke with force but forbearance. I hope the cabal's promise to stop talking smack was genuine. I wouldn't be surprised if there's not some backsliding on their part. But I very much hope the outcome is good.
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  #38  
Old 03-19-2010, 08:13 PM
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Default Difficulty in an OLD dynamic

My thanks to all of you for your help, encouragement and advise for LR/ Maca/ I.

I know I've been a spectre in this forum and because of that, I leave many wondering. My apologies. I haven't for a few different reasons. None of them are purposeful tho, IMHO.

I would like to say a few things on the veried topics from this thread. Maybe it will help clearify a few things:

What I allowed in the past with my friends was wrong. I've admitted that to LR and asked for her forgiveness. I've admitted that to Maca, and asked his forgiveness. I've admitted that to my friends, and asked their forgiveness, and probably will again.

I've stated my views and made my stance with my friends regarding my priorities. I've made it quite clear where my loyality lies, and what my intentions are should a situation arise that conflicts with those priorities.

The only thing left for me to do is to show with my actions my sincerity and honesty and guall.



I have 2 best friends. 1 is LR who has been in my life for 17 years next month. The other... we'll call him Getsueh. I've been friends with him for 14 years. He is from the group of friends that didn't like LR.
Years later, they are still my best firends. The others.... are not hardly friends at all. It's true what LR said about them not keeping in touch, or calling or visiting. I've always been the one to do that with them.

I'm hopeing for a renewal of friendship, now that time has passed and experiences have happened. I'm hoping for an understanding....

sorry I have to cut this short... duty calls. More later~
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  #39  
Old 03-19-2010, 09:02 PM
EugenePoet EugenePoet is offline
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"The only thing left for me to do is to show with my actions my sincerity and honesty..."

There it is, then! It may be hard to do but you know that already and you've decided to do it. Good on yer.
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  #40  
Old 03-21-2010, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by GreenGecko View Post
I've admitted that to LR and asked for her forgiveness. I've admitted that to Maca, and asked his forgiveness.
~
I need to retort here and let everyone know that I made a mistake here. I actually haven't asked Maca for his forgiveness, I've only offered and aoplogy. If Maca believes I need to be forgiven, I'll allow him to decide that himself.

Just wanted to make that clear.
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