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  #11  
Old 01-28-2010, 02:33 AM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
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I've found in issues of marginalization, it's generally more useful to talk to the people who *aren't* at the table rather than the people who who do feel included.

So it might be useful to ask the question, "How can we bring more people to the table to talk about it?"
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  #12  
Old 01-28-2010, 02:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceoli View Post
I've found in issues of marginalization, it's generally more useful to talk to the people who *aren't* at the table rather than the people who who do feel included.
Good point, Ceoli - I was hoping that this forum had a broad cross-section that different voices could be heard. But you are right - maybe some feel disenfranchised from this forum.

Quote:
So it might be useful to ask the question, "How can we bring more people to the table to talk about it?"
Good - any ideas on this? You made the comment in the other thread about the marginalization - so presumably you know some who feel that way - maybe you could invite them to this thread? Or maybe gather a summary of their views, if they don't feel comfortable posting, so that we can all get a better understanding of this issue.
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  #13  
Old 01-28-2010, 03:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceoli View Post
So it might be useful to ask the question, "How can we bring more people to the table to talk about it?"
Generally, I find it useful to flat-out ask. Like this:

Hey, Ceoli. Are you feeling marginalised? If you are, would you be willing to share your experiences with us?
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  #14  
Old 01-28-2010, 04:17 AM
quila quila is offline
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I've met a lot of young people who brag about "how mature" they are due to some life circumstances that have forced them to "grow up" fast... And inevitably, I find them to behave much less mature than those who admit to their immaturity.

I used to be a very active member of my city's BDSM "community" and I found exactly the cliquism GS was talking about. They also had an online forum, and I always found that any new people who didn't meet their criteria was ostracised and made to feel like a freak. That's exactly what you don't need when you're coming out of the closet and you already feel like a weirdo.

For the record, that's not the feeling I've gotten here.

As far as the age-marginalization goes, I think that's one of the benefits of the internet. To the extent that people are judged on their maturity, it's for how old they behave, not how old they are physically.

At 27, I'm right in the middle of the 18-35 range, and I don't feel marginalized at all. I don't feel the need for any special treatment. If we young people have any special issues or concerns, I'm sure that an open, welcoming community such as this is perfectly equipped to handle them...
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  #15  
Old 01-28-2010, 04:23 AM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovefromgirl View Post
Generally, I find it useful to flat-out ask. Like this:

Hey, Ceoli. Are you feeling marginalised? If you are, would you be willing to share your experiences with us?
Nope I'm not, but I have experienced marginalization in the past. But I'm pretty sensitive to issues that may marginalize people, so I tend to try to pay attention and continually ask questions and challenge assumptions that create such marginalization.

I'm not clear exactly what community this thread is aimed at either. If we're talking specifically about this board, that's one thing. If we're talking about poly communities in general, then that's also a rather large question with many aspects to be addressed. Different dynamics exist in different mediums.

Plus, experience has taught me that just asking a marginalized group without doing the groundwork of self-examination often just results in marginalizing that group further. Basically, if a person generally feels uncomfortable or unwelcome in a group, they're not always going to be so forthcoming when just flat out asked what their problem is. (Just to be clear, I'm illustrating a dynamic, not a synopsis of how everyone may or may not react.)

I find that there must be steps made to show that a group is seriously looking to address the issues before people feel that their marginalized views will be listened to.
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  #16  
Old 01-28-2010, 04:34 AM
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Originally Posted by GroundedSpirit View Post
So when I see such talk and proposals as you've spoken of here, i.e. the Under 35 group of polys and what 'entrance criteria' there should be (the questionnaire you mentioned etc) I just shudder. Think there's any chance of 'marginalizing' anyone else here? Is this a competition or retaliation ? Etc etc YIIKKEEESSSSSSSS
Even if I was in the designated target group - no thanks !
JUST TO BE CLEAR AGAIN, since people seem to be forming opinions about a particular group's policies without the actual information about what the group's policies are, this is a group that is AIMED at 18-35 year olds, BUT OPEN TO ALL WHO ARE OVER 18. The "entrance criteria" being mentioned are two VERY BROAD QUESTIONS that are NOT age specific or designed to weed out people of one culture or another.

It is not uncommon for online forum communities to require questions when joining. The biggest purpose of such practices is to weed out spammers, who usually won't bother to spam a board if they have to do that much to join it. The other purpose of it is to be INTENTIONAL about the kind of community that's being build on that specific forum.

Again, that is NOT the same as being exclusive.

Last edited by Ceoli; 01-28-2010 at 04:37 AM.
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  #17  
Old 01-28-2010, 05:05 AM
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Redpepper and I talked about this thread a little today. I started thinking about it from a different and more basic angle.

I'll be very specific instead of attempting a witty example. If a group of younger people did want to include age as a factor in potential member's attempting to join something that they created, than I see nothing wrong with that. Why would I think that young people would really want to include older people,such as myself, in something that may be intended to linking like minds, attitudes and bodies LOL!

Hopefully this is related to the topic
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  #18  
Old 01-28-2010, 06:45 AM
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Just so you know I took my post out as I don't think it related other than I think I was marginalizing by giving my opinion.

I will let people who feel marginalized do the talking as I feel Ciel has asked them specifically and my voice has no place in answering the question.

For the record, if people who feel marginalized want to start their own forum, or whatever, then so be it... I just want them to have a voice and a platform with which to speak.
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  #19  
Old 01-28-2010, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
For the record, if people who feel marginalized want to start their own forum, or whatever, then so be it... I just want them to have a voice and a platform with which to speak.
I'm not sure who these marginalized people are supposed to be, but this whole thread reminds me of whenever my professors give the class lectures about being responsible students (homework on time, etc), when most of the irresponsible students are skipping the lecture anyway... IOW, if they feel so marginalized, chances are they've already left the forum and aren't here to see the thread.

As for starting one's own forum because one feels marginalized, it seems to perpetuate the problem. Although I will say, at least it doesn't feel like when the men come into the women's centre and say all sarcastically, "Why isn't there a MEN's centre?? We have issues too, you know" and I'm like "well what, do you need the women to start one for you??"
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  #20  
Old 01-28-2010, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quila View Post
if they feel so marginalized, chances are they've already left the forum and aren't here to see the thread.

As for starting one's own forum because one feels marginalized, it seems to perpetuate the problem.
I had thought of that first statement and then also the second, but really I see no end to the topic really, so I am not sure of the point at this point...
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