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  #81  
Old 01-03-2010, 03:06 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Originally Posted by CielDuMatin View Post
I have got very confused as to the distinction between the two.

So jealousy would be when your lover showed attention to someone and you are in fear of that negatively impacting your own relationship with your lover, while you could be envious of someone else who has a relationship which you perceive as better than your own in some way (even though you don't want to have a relationship with either of them).
Yea - basically right Ciel.
"Jealousy" is coming from a place of fear - some perceived threat.
"Envy" is coming from a place of "want"

Wants are much easier to set aside, to get a more realistic perspective on.
Fear is a different beast ! Reactions to fear are often disproportionate, clouded with emotion etc, especially for those without some history and background on how to handle it productively. Fear is an important component of survival but it can't be allowed free reign, or the consequences can lead to what the alarm was for - failure to survive.

GS
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  #82  
Old 01-03-2010, 03:14 PM
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CielDuMatin CielDuMatin is offline
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"Jealousy" is coming from a place of fear - some perceived threat.
"Envy" is coming from a place of "want"
Ah yes, this helps.

So someone else who says they are jealous of what I have in my poly relationship is actually envious, and I can help them by working out what they want in life (if they don't know already) - in other words, help them find way to get what they want (or realise that they don't really want this).

When someone says they are jealous it's worth taking a step back and working out whether it truly is jealousy or envy, which results in different approaches in how to work with the issue at hand.

Nice. This was very useful! Thank you!
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  #83  
Old 01-04-2010, 07:39 AM
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What I find interesting is envy amongst "v" members about how much time and lack of connection because of lack of time. It's so important to keep tabs on that and find a balance before that envy raises... envy can rise about perceived thoughts on how much the others are having sex, or date time, or amount of time together...

all such a delicate balance.
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  #84  
Old 01-04-2010, 07:45 AM
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What I find interesting is envy among "v" members about how much time and lack of connection because of lack of time. It's so important to keep tabs on that and find a balance before that envy raises... envy can rise about perceived thoughts on how much the others are having sex, or date time, or amount of time together...

all such a delicate balance.
I never thought of that? I don't feel it honestly....hmmmm I think this is do to my feeling very appreciative of any time I get with you...like it is a gift from you and your husband. Your time is a privilege for me...interesting how I feel nothing of fear, envy, jealousy or possessiveness toward your primary relationship. And yet the thought of other situations makes my brain melt. I've explained that in other posts though I believe.

Does anyone else feel like this?
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  #85  
Old 01-04-2010, 09:08 AM
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I never thought of that? I don't feel it honestly....hmmmm I think this is do to my feeling very appreciative of any time I get with you...like it is a gift from you and your husband.
Well then, we know who feels like this sometimes...
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  #86  
Old 01-04-2010, 09:09 AM
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Well then, we know who feels like this sometimes...
yeah
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  #87  
Old 01-04-2010, 06:29 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
What I find interesting is envy amongst "v" members about how much time and lack of connection because of lack of time. It's so important to keep tabs on that and find a balance before that envy raises... envy can rise about perceived thoughts on how much the others are having sex, or date time, or amount of time together...

all such a delicate balance.
Hi Red,

yea - it IS a delicate balance and I think it's one of the most challenging aspects of living poly day-to-day. There's a couple of issues here.

1> Limited time & resources. This is just real - is what it is. Have to be careful of spreading ourselves too thin between work, family, loves, personal time etc. Truly is a balance and not easy to achieve even if you didn't have multiple loves added to the picture. But EVERYONE should be equally aware of this and not add more to it than already exists.

2> Neediness
I think in some relationships I see some who are just more ....."needy" than others. For lack of a better term. This is one reason I speak out frequently about the dangers of this and striving for us all to be as independent as possible. The more the time we spend together is driven by desire rather than need (or competition), the more special those times truly are. I'd much prefer to only spend 4 hrs/wk with someone who was really cherishing that 4 hrs than spend 4 days with someone who was so insecure that they couldn't function without my presence.
Does that make sense ?
Obviously people's insecurities play a big role in this. You really have to believe you are fully capable of standing on your own two feet and practice doing it whenever possible.

Being too "needy" and "smothering" is a sure way to put stress on any relationship. Then the time spent together starts to become more of an obligation that a heartfelt desire. Part of loving & compersion (?) is to acknowledge people need sufficient space to gather themself in, to better understand who they really are. The better they are to bring their true selves into the relationship.
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  #88  
Old 01-04-2010, 11:18 PM
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Jealousy is sometimes a very hard thing to process, especially when you're trying to figure out the ROOT of the jealousy.

I'm gonna go back to something you said in the original post. You said he lay as far from you as possible on the bed. Maybe one of the reasons you're feeling nauseous is that you didn't get your usual cuddle time before sleep.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting that. Tell him, if that's one of the things bothering you, about it and work out how you can still get that cuddle time even when he has been with someone else.

One of our rules has always been that I'm ok with his being with other people as long as I get my fair share. This may sound a little unfair to him until you know that his sex drive was nearly non-existent for four years so if he did have sex with someone else i would not only have to wait the usual 2 weeks after the last time WE had sex I would also have to wait the 2 weeks after he had been with someone else.

Why did I tell you that? As an example of stating your wants & finding a way to get them met without anyone getting all bent out of shape over it.

One article I have found very, very helpful in dealing with my own jealousy issues is on Xeromag. Franklin (the site owner) has a unique way of putting things that helps even those of us who are sometimes as bright as a burnt out light bulb to understand some of the more complex issues & jealousy is most definitely complex!

This part is to anyone: is it ok to post links to other sites on here? I would love to post the Xeromag link but I don't want to do something verboten.

Robin
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  #89  
Old 01-04-2010, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Breathesgirl View Post
This part is to anyone: is it ok to post links to other sites on here? I would love to post the Xeromag link but I don't want to do something verboten.
These kinds of questions can be easily answered by reviewing the Site Guidelines.

Xeromag and plenty of other poly oriented resources have been linked, especially in threads such as this one.

So absolutely feel free to link away as appropriate...and in accordance with the Site Guidelines if you please.
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  #90  
Old 01-05-2010, 07:35 AM
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time spent together starts to become more of an obligation that a heartfelt desire. Part of loving & compersion (?) is to acknowledge people need sufficient space to gather themself in, to better understand who they really are. The better they are to bring their true selves into the relationship.
yes, this is what Nerdist and I have been working on. We seem to have come to a new idea and that is that we need to spend 20-30 minutes a day connecting in the form of talking and doing something together. Even if it's just having tea together. When it's over we will move on rather than feel like we should be hanging out.

Quite often I get no me time. I take it rather than have it. To me it's my right to have my own time. My right has been taken away as of late and it does not make for my happiness.

We will try our new idea out... day 1, it was hard to end the 20 minutes and Nerdist hung around too long for my liking. We will try it again tomorrow and continue to work it out. Part of it is he is in need of going out and socializing more. He says he feels as if he lives in the shadow of me most of the time.... that isn't my fault. I can't do anything about that, he can though.

It has been a crazy fall and we are just now trying to balance again. Thanks for the thoughts. Much appreciated.
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communication, compassion, compersion, emotions, envy, feelings, jealous, jealousy, monogamy, poly, polyamory, possessiveness, relationship dynamics, relationship structures, relationships, respect, self esteem, unconscious

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