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  #1  
Old 12-19-2009, 11:31 AM
Chase Chase is offline
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Default What can I do, what can I tell her ?

I came here when I needed help, and I found a lot of useful comments. So here I am again.

Quick summary of the situation :
I've been in a mono relationship with D. for a few years. A few month ago, we talked about poly and figured it was a nice idea worth giving a try. She currently lives quite far away, but we manage to see each other a few days every month or so. And of course, we use IM and voip to stay together. D now has another boyfriend and seems to like it.

Enters S. She is an amazing woman. The kind of women in which everything makes you want to love her. I regard her as one of the best friends I have ever had. We have built a wonderful friendship, and have long philosophical conversations about happiness, love and life.

I'm deeply in love with her, and she knows.

The thing is, she doesn't believe in polyamory. From what I understand, she believes that the person she loves deserves to have her "wholy", and that she expects no less from him in return. She says that she cannot imagine herself falling in love with anyone else, because that love would necessarily not be as deep as a single love.

And I tell her I believe she is wrong, and she stands her grounds, and the debate quickly stalls.

Polyamory comes to me as such an evidence, that I do not understand what she tells me. It's like she was trying to tell me that circles have four right angles. And it feels that she doesn't believe me either when I tell her it's actually rectangles that have four right angles.

I feel like I have something wonderful to share, yet cannot share it with her because we do not speak the same language.

I've tried to forget this love and let it fade away, but it just doesn't work. I've tried to tell her that love is infinite, and that you can give yourself entirely to two people. She tells me that even if I were right, time isn't infinite, and that the person she loves deserves all her time and attention.

She doesn't see the beauty I see in the plurality of love. And I tell her about it, and she looks again, but still won't see it.
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  #2  
Old 12-19-2009, 01:15 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chase View Post
I came here when I needed help, and I found a lot of useful comments. So here I am again.

She doesn't see the beauty I see in the plurality of love. And I tell her about it, and she looks again, but still won't see it.
Can't change other people. Can only make choices for self.

Lather, rinse, repeat.
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  #3  
Old 12-19-2009, 02:29 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Default Welllllllllll

If these philosophical conversations had been as deep as you assumed they were, it seems some conflicts would have surfaced long before now - not even on this topic.
I'm going to make a wild guess that this girl has some illusions she's attached to yet that life hasn't forced her to abandon & rethink. For example, I don't think she's yet been a Mother !
There is one good example that tends to shatter the illusion you mentioned of giving "ALL" her time (and emotion) to any one person. Writing as a male, I can vouch for that realization as I'm sure most men could after their relationship with their wife/lover makes that sudden turn on appearance of the first child.
No longer are you the one & only in their life, and as a matter of fact you now find yourself in the back seat in some regards (especially time).
But yet that love that exists between you is unchanged ! It just now may need to morph in how it's expressed. It's no less real, no less important in it's role.
I realize that the statement you made about "all time" was a broad, blanket statement and not to be taken literally and if she even used those words I'm sure she didn't mean it literally. But that in itself I think IS one of the biggest fears AND challenges of navigating multiple relationships of any kind. To attach special significance to it because of intimate relations is unfair but still a valid point to be discussed. Hell - we have to balance that in everything we do - work, play, everything ! It's real but all the same often points back to greed & insecurity. If anyone is in a relationship with someone who requires high amounts of time & coddling, it's not going to be easy anyway. As as much as we might "love" that person, at some level, that philosophical part is unlikely to coincide with the reality of day to day living.
To me, it would be a warning buzzer that this person may want & require more overall energy than you have willingness or ability to provide. It doesn't change the love & respect you have for them - only the practicalities of "expressing" it !

GS
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  #4  
Old 12-19-2009, 02:33 PM
Winterfire Winterfire is offline
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S has the right to decide what she wants out of life. You can't debate a person into becoming who you want them to be.

She also does have a point about time issues. A person only has so much time, and if she thinks it would bother her to try to be poly and have to split up the time, then it's probably not for her.

She's also got to wonder, even if things did work out now timewise since D is far away, what would happen if you moved to where D lives or she moved back? If you moved, then S would have to deal with a long distance relationship. If D moved, then S would have to split up her time with you. If she's mono, then she'd have a lot of time to fill where she'd be missing you.
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  #5  
Old 12-19-2009, 05:04 PM
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crisare crisare is offline
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Quote:
S has the right to decide what she wants out of life. You can't debate a person into becoming who you want them to be.
Yup.

It hurts a lot when a person you love doesn't love you back in the same way. But that's life sometimes. It happens and it sucks and you move on.

Maybe someday things will be different for her. Maybe they won't. But for now this is what she wants, what she feels, and what she believes. Talking her into being different isn't going to make either of you happy.
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  #6  
Old 12-19-2009, 06:11 PM
constlady constlady is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chase View Post
She doesn't see the beauty I see in the plurality of love. And I tell her about it, and she looks again, but still won't see it.
This is not a choice on her part - as using the word "won't" indicates you view it - anymore than your inability to see the beauty that she does in monogamous love is a choice for you.

Simply put, no matter how much you try to convince her that your way is the "better" way, it won't work. That's because while it may be the right way for you, it is not necessarily the right way for her.

We aren't more enlightened because we believe in our ability love multiple people; monogamous folks are not somehow lacking something we have found either.

To me, you are missing out on one of the wonderful benefits of being polyamorus. You can still have a deeply loving relationship with this woman without the worry that your other partner will not accept her presence in your life due to fear and insecurity. The exact form of that relationship may not be your ideal but if you truly love her, you will respect her right to determine how she loves and just enjoy the connection that you do share.
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  #7  
Old 12-19-2009, 07:12 PM
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MonoVCPHG MonoVCPHG is offline
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Originally Posted by constlady View Post
just enjoy the connection that you do share.
ditto
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Playing the Game of Life with Monopoly rules.
Monogamy might just be in my genes

Poly Events All Over
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  #8  
Old 12-20-2009, 09:33 PM
Chase Chase is offline
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Thanks a lot to all of you. You basically said what I already thought, but reading it from otherr people gives it so much more weight

Quote:
Originally Posted by GroundedSpirit View Post
If these philosophical conversations had been as deep as you assumed they were, it seems some conflicts would have surfaced long before now - not even on this topic.
Actually, there are points on which we totally disagree. We discuss them, and come to the conclusion that we have very different opinions on the subject. But there have been no conflicts. We simply accept each other's right to have a different opinion.

Quote:
I'm going to make a wild guess that this girl has some illusions she's attached to yet that life hasn't forced her to abandon & rethink.
There is some truth in this. But she knows what she wants to reach is unreachable, and decides to go as close to it as possible. Maybe she will rethink it someday, but I believe she might have the willpower to live all her life like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfire View Post
S has the right to decide what she wants out of life. You can't debate a person into becoming who you want them to be.
Indeed. But sometimes, you do change people. People I know have changed me in ways I would never have thought possible. I'm not saying you control someone else, but I do believe sometimes people will decide to change because of what you tell them.

Quote:
She's also got to wonder, even if things did work out now timewise since D is far away, what would happen if you moved to where D lives or she moved back? If you moved, then S would have to deal with a long distance relationship. If D moved, then S would have to split up her time with you. If she's mono, then she'd have a lot of time to fill where she'd be missing you.
This is a good point I had not thought about. I tend to be pathologically optimist and assume everything will be ok. I think this deserves quite a lot of thinking from my part.


Quote:
Originally Posted by crisare View Post
It hurts a lot when a person you love doesn't love you back in the same way. But that's life sometimes. It happens and it sucks and you move on.
I think this is really what it all boils down to. It sucks, it feels totally unfair, and since I percieve it as unfair, I want to do something about it.

Quote:
To me, you are missing out on one of the wonderful benefits of being polyamorus. You can still have a deeply loving relationship with this woman without the worry that your other partner will not accept her presence in your life due to fear and insecurity. The exact form of that relationship may not be your ideal but if you truly love her, you will respect her right to determine how she loves and just enjoy the connection that you do share.
I do. And although that connection is not of the sort I wish it were, it still brings me joy.

The thing is that, although I am happy that there is that connection, I can't help but hope for more. And I fear that, as time passes, this hope might turn into grief as things never change. And I just don't want that to happen.


Thanks again for all your answers, you're really awesome people.
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  #9  
Old 12-21-2009, 12:53 AM
Lostkeysintro Lostkeysintro is offline
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Imo the only way your going to be able to be with her is to be mono with her. She is not going to change her morals/views anytime soon. I see it as you have two options 1. Forget about her. 2. Be mono with her.
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