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  #31  
Old 03-16-2010, 08:37 PM
thunkybunny thunkybunny is offline
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Coded messages:

"I want a relationship...with no expectations" = I don't want a relationship

"...just friends...casual...." = I don't love my friends (I don't have many friends either)

"I don't like drama." = I take no responsibility for the dramas that I create.

"Erring on the side of caution" = I'm waaay too scared to do this thoughtfully, so I'll just default to doing nothing since doing nothing is the safest and most comfortable strategy against adapting to change.

"Going at the pace of the slowest person/the weakest link" = Everybody stop what they're doing while I avoid doing any work to adapt to the new situation. Meanwhile, I'll actively sabotage the new relationship.

"...need time to develop trust" = My partner trusts you, but I don't trust my partner's judgment. I don't love my partner either, but nobody else can be with them.

"...to protect my investment/wife/husband/family" = I see you as a foreign threat, not one of us. I do not value anything you have to offer. I must burn down the village in order to save the village.

"...not ready to be friends..." = I need more time to sabotage the new relationship.

"I want respect...." = But only for the established relationship(s) and partner(s). New relationship(s) and partner(s) do not deserve respect.

"You are the secondary." = Kiss my ass and do what I say.

"I have xx years of experience." = I don't have anything to learn.

"We practice tantric sex." = So I'm melded with my partner 24/7, even when they're in the bathroom.

"I'm Buddhist." = I'm more spiritual than you. I have nothing to learn.

"Personal power" = You have neither the right nor the reason to feel bad about the way I treat you.

"Emotional maturity" = I have mistaken stoicism for emotional maturity. When I act out my emotions, I am reasonable. When other people express their doubts and emotions, they are emotionally immature.

Last edited by thunkybunny; 03-16-2010 at 09:21 PM.
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  #32  
Old 03-16-2010, 09:52 PM
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redsirenn redsirenn is offline
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Thunkybunny -

Do you believe these are accurate translations of these comments (for you, I mean)?
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  #33  
Old 03-16-2010, 10:19 PM
thunkybunny thunkybunny is offline
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Originally Posted by redsirenn View Post
Thunkybunny -

Do you believe these are accurate translations of these comments (for you, I mean)?
My friends tell me that I am too blunt with people, and people who don't know me well mistake that for hostility. I have witnessed other people make the above or similar statements, then act in ways that matched the translations. It's a pickle. Everybody lies, but some also lie to themselves habitually. I don't want to be unkind, but maybe it is best to stay far away from some people who need a sense of hierarchy in order to feel good about themselves. The same goes for conflict avoidant people who are too afraid of rejection to be honest with themselves and others. It's sad really, because hierarchies preclude the possibility of partnerships/friendships. They criminalize love.

Last edited by thunkybunny; 03-17-2010 at 12:29 AM.
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  #34  
Old 03-17-2010, 12:21 AM
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Breathesgirl Breathesgirl is offline
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For me those red flags are:

1. Someone who thrives on drama. If you ain't an actress and actually acting don't bother because I won't bite.

2. I will try to explain this one as succinctly as possible. Someone who gives me a glare when I find the two of them off in a corner and that glare says something to the effect of "ha ha, he's with me now & i'm not letting you have him back!"

3. Someone who can't/won't find a babysitter so you can have an hour or so of adult time instead of dragging all parties, including two kids under the age of 5, to a McYuck's playland to have a poly/BDSM conversation.

4. DADT--YMMV on this one but I don't do them because they feel dishonest to me and it also feels like the other partner(s) are getting the short shrift.

5. Someone who is wanting my guy as a fuck buddy and won't make the child free time for me to ask what questions I need to ask in order for me to feel secure. Orrrrrrrrrr, boyfriends fwb and i do manage an adult night out and she leaves me alone for 1.5 hours in a city an hour from home, dependant on her for transportation home, in a bar full of people I don't know, so she can go have a lap dance.

Sorry, this was, unfortunately, a partial rant *sigh*. i thought I had dealt with this baggage, guess not.

I will also go along with meeting the partners. I INSIST on it. If it doesn't happen within a reasonable amount of time, we don't happen.
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  #35  
Old 03-17-2010, 03:33 AM
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SchrodingersCat SchrodingersCat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thunkybunny View Post
"I don't like drama." = I take no responsibility for the dramas that I create.

"I have xx years of experience." = I don't have anything to learn.

"We practice tantric sex." = So I'm melded with my partner 24/7, even when they're in the bathroom.
re:

- 1st one: I don't like drama, but when I overreact I take responsibility for it.

- 2nd one: I would have to agree with you here... most people I've met who feel the need to boast and quantify their experience generally come across to me as braggers and I seldomly find I have much to learn from them.

- 3rd one: well if that's your only experience with tantric practices, major bummer dude... My husband introduced me to tantra and it is utterly amazing, which is why I just picked up a couple books to learn more about it.

These are just my personal reactions... of course, everyone has different experiences, and I'm by no means claiming that everyone who says these things is from a positive perspective. But sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
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  #36  
Old 03-17-2010, 04:49 AM
thunkybunny thunkybunny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SchrodingersCat View Post
re:

- 1st one: I don't like drama, but when I overreact I take responsibility for it.

- 2nd one: I would have to agree with you here... most people I've met who feel the need to boast and quantify their experience generally come across to me as braggers and I seldomly find I have much to learn from them.

- 3rd one: well if that's your only experience with tantric practices, major bummer dude... My husband introduced me to tantra and it is utterly amazing, which is why I just picked up a couple books to learn more about it.

These are just my personal reactions... of course, everyone has different experiences, and I'm by no means claiming that everyone who says these things is from a positive perspective. But sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
Hehehe. Yeah, well the last one was kinda lame as the person saying it was implying that NOBODY ELSE could have private intimate time with HIS wife. Definitely not ready for poly at all.
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  #37  
Old 03-19-2010, 04:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erosa View Post
The biggest red flags I have found are these two;

1) Secretive or obsessed with 'privacy'. Someone who makes the consiquences for talking about 'their' business (even if it's also YOUR business) unbarably emotionally high.
I would like to learn more about what you mean. What kind of a line are you drawing between privacy and sharing, and what kind of emotional consequences are you thinking about?
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  #38  
Old 03-19-2010, 08:38 AM
thunkybunny thunkybunny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erosa View Post
The biggest red flags I have found are these two;

1) Secretive or obsessed with 'privacy'. Someone who makes the consiquences for talking about 'their' business (even if it's also YOUR business) unbarably emotionally high.

2) Someone who doesn't want people to know they are taken. I don't mean someone who is closeted about poly. I mean someone who doesn't want other people to know they are anything other than single.
Privacy needs to be negotiated. Privacy is required if there is to be intimacy. One part of intimacy is information management. Possessive/insecure/fearful people do not allow their partners any privacy (e.g. personal journals/diaries). Excessive need for privacy may indicate a weakness in the relationship where one partner does not feel safe about sharing information either due to past experiences with a partner or a general pattern of anti-love from sharing information (e.g. abusive parents). It is worth investigating the dynamic in a given situation to see whether it is a problem with the relationship or something personal.

'In a relationship' may be more useful a description than 'taken' or 'single' regardless of the life/lovestyle since it emphasizes choice rather than possession.

Last edited by thunkybunny; 03-19-2010 at 05:16 PM.
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  #39  
Old 03-19-2010, 04:57 PM
saudade saudade is offline
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Exclamation My warnings

The biggest tip-off for me that there's a problem is the relationship being really stuck on the same ground, which is a problem for one person and not the others, with no evidence that the stuck person is working on being stuck, or cares that (s)he is. Opening up the relationship doesn't work if one person is giving no ground on the opening-- demanding hardcore restrictions that aren't going to be temporary at all. (It was 'no making out' in my case, and I still get angry thinking about it years later.. clearly I still have healing to do. )

Also, I'd like to defend someone else's side of things. I wouldn't ever be in a 'don't ask, don't tell' relationship personally, but a good friend of mine is "the other woman" in one, and the situation is very stable and loving for all parties. Her lover and his wife have had a DADT policy for their entire twenty-year marriage, with the rule that if she asks, he has to tell-- she just chooses not to ask. She's apparently exercised that right a few times, but not about my friend. My friend actually goes over to their house for dinner regularly, spends a lot of time with his whole family (children included), and is good friends with her lover's wife. They just have an arrangement where they don't discuss the sexual details, and it works very well for them, has for a few years. My point is just that, even if it's a red flag for you, it might not be for everybody... I do suspect what they're doing doesn't work this well often, but I'd rather we not completely write it off.

That's all I've got for now!
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  #40  
Old 03-19-2010, 05:19 PM
thunkybunny thunkybunny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saudade View Post
The biggest tip-off for me that there's a problem is the relationship being really stuck on the same ground, which is a problem for one person and not the others, with no evidence that the stuck person is working on being stuck, or cares that (s)he is. Opening up the relationship doesn't work if one person is giving no ground on the opening-- demanding hardcore restrictions that aren't going to be temporary at all. (It was 'no making out' in my case, and I still get angry thinking about it years later.. clearly I still have healing to do. )
Ugh! Then there's the double standard when one partner has few restrictions while another has many. It's retarded (pun intended).
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