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  #11  
Old 10-21-2011, 03:49 PM
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AnnabelMore AnnabelMore is offline
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?

What's the point of therapy if you hold big stuff back? How can they help you if they don't know the real story? And why pay for a safe space to tell your secrets and work stuff out if you don't actually tell your secrets? That just really confuses me...
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #12  
Old 10-21-2011, 04:00 PM
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He has many good qualities, is smart and funny, and has an interesting way of looking at the world. I never get tired of talking to him. I would hate not to have him in my life in some form.
All the things you mentioned, (in each of your posts, not just this quote.) resonate. I actually love a man like this. I`d never be in a relationship with him again, for all these reasons. There is the side you 'love', and there is the dark, controlling side. They make a very good argument, and love to show you the dotted-line that leads to their thinking. Then everything they say sounds reasonable.

Problem is,.,..no matter what you do, or how you do it, it will never be enough. They will find fault, and they will always want to judge, and control your actions.

You may not want another man in your life now, but can you predict the future ? I guarantee you, he will dump you faster then a uncle-bens-instant-minute if you so much as show interest in someone else. ( Forget my experience, I have seen many other men and women go through this, and been there for them after the shit hit the fan. ) In the meantime, he will count on you being 'exhausted' over your current relationship with him. Explaining yourself constantly takes up a lot of free time.

Last edited by SourGirl; 10-21-2011 at 04:03 PM.
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  #13  
Old 10-21-2011, 05:28 PM
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Anneintherain Anneintherain is offline
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Wow I missed that you said he was jealous if you had male friends. Forget anything optimistic I said. He may have good qualities but bad ones like that don't really balance it out to make any kind of a long term healthy friendship let alone relationship.
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  #14  
Old 10-21-2011, 08:05 PM
cheryl cheryl is offline
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Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
?

What's the point of therapy if you hold big stuff back? How can they help you if they don't know the real story? And why pay for a safe space to tell your secrets and work stuff out if you don't actually tell your secrets? That just really confuses me...
You're right. But even therapists can have some pretty conventional views about love and sex. Last night on TV, Dr. Drew was saying that a relationship involving more than two people was just flat out not healthy.
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  #15  
Old 10-21-2011, 08:46 PM
cheryl cheryl is offline
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There is the side you 'love', and there is the dark, controlling side. They make a very good argument, and love to show you the dotted-line that leads to their thinking. Then everything they say sounds reasonable...

Problem is,.,..no matter what you do, or how you do it, it will never be enough... I guarantee you, he will dump you faster then a uncle-bens-instant-minute if you so much as show interest in someone else.
... In the meantime, he will count on you being 'exhausted' over your current relationship with him. Explaining yourself constantly takes up a lot of free time.
That is exactly how I feel at times. Even if I was single and not living at home, even if we were married and living together, I'm not sure I could make him happy. Theres nothing inherently wrong with wanting more or enjoying other people, but it shouldnt be because no one is ever good enough, or to play one person against another. Still, I do genuinely love him, and hope we can figure allof this out.

I almost wish a male with the One Penis Policy would comment, so I could understand why a man would feel this way. There has to be more to it than just political incorrectness and control issues. He's empathetic and has a generous spirit in many ways.

But my boyfriend seems to think that "men are just different." I think there are bigger differences among individuals then between the two sexes. I know men who I think see the world the way I do, and women I totally dont understand at all. But he's convinced that women dont experience jealousy as intensely, they are more nurturing, less competitive, and that in men, possessiveness is just how nature designed them, it's hardwired and testosterone driven.
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  #16  
Old 10-21-2011, 08:52 PM
Minxxa Minxxa is offline
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Originally Posted by cheryl View Post
You're right. But even therapists can have some pretty conventional views about love and sex. Last night on TV, Dr. Drew was saying that a relationship involving more than two people was just flat out not healthy.
True. But this is why when you go to a therapist you say that you believe in polyamory/unconventional relationships and make sure they are welcoming to it, if not already experienced with the subject.

It's like making sure your doc has the right specialty!
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  #17  
Old 10-21-2011, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by cheryl View Post

But my boyfriend seems to think that "men are just different." I think there are bigger differences among individuals then between the two sexes. I know men who I think see the world the way I do, and women I totally dont understand at all. But he's convinced that women dont experience jealousy as intensely, they are more nurturing, less competitive, and that in men, possessiveness is just how nature designed them, it's hardwired and testosterone driven.
Well good luck with that.

Many of these types start out wth only a OPP. It does graduate.

I remember my ex initially had only a problem with 'just men'. He said everything else was cool. No biggie right ? Why did I need more then my husband and my boyfriend ? I figured that was a fair compromise.
He was so good, giving, and game in so many other ways.....such a 'sweet' man.
Well, one day he made a nasty comment about a girlfriend of mine. Piped up with ' Oh, well I guess if you fuck women, I should get to fuck new women too !' He then went out and did things I had never done. Trying to tell me, it was my fault he did that. He was just trying to 'keep-up' with me, afterall.
Then he made snide comments about friends....then it graduated to anyone who came near me, I must want to fuck.
Or, I MUST be doing something behind his back, because you see,..he 'knew' I wanted more. I had said so in the beginning of the relationship. So poor HIM had to constantly deal with the fact that he knew he was never enough for me.

' Excuse me dear, while I go fuck my wife, and my live-in girlfriend. You go chew on the fact that I must deal with the pain, of not being enough man for you.'
'Men are competitive.'
' Men have territorial-needs women can't comprehend.'

Oh, please. Blah, blah, blah, Blabbedy-Blah. The translation is ' I have fears that I would rather keep, then actually have to do something about. I will use my manhood to convince you of this, as it is all I got.'

...and if you fall for it ? You are feeding the monster.

I loved him as a friend before we ever dated, before I saw the dark side of him. So I am sorta stuck with that love. Love doesn`t mean being in a relationship though. There are lots of better people to love, who are actually worth my time.
If you choose to be in a relationship with this sort, just realize you will never 'win'. Your desires, needs are always second. Whatever jealousy, imaginary scenarios, problems he comes up with, will always reign the relationship, and drain you of yourself.

Enjoy.
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  #18  
Old 10-22-2011, 08:54 PM
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nycindie nycindie is offline
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. . . I do genuinely love him, and hope we can figure allof this out.
Yeah, well..."what's love got to do with it?"

Seriously, we can love people who are totally wrong for us. Just because you love someone doesn't automatically mean you can have a healthy relationship with him, especially if he sees love as a reason to possess and control you.
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  #19  
Old 10-24-2011, 12:49 AM
cheryl cheryl is offline
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After this weekend, I think most people would just rather have affairs.

Politically correct or not, I decided to accept my boyfriendís OPP, because I canít see the logic in getting mad, just out of principle, about someone denying you something you donít want anyway. I could go out and sleep with someone else to even the score, only to end up feeling bad about myself, or starting a another ,relationship I donít even want, and disappointing yet another person.

So, okay, let's do this, I say, this triad or vee, or whatever it is. Sheís too busy with work, I have a daughter, you need more. Maybe youíre right, maybe you need two women. I stop throwing a jealous tantrum, have coffee with the girlfriend. Everything seems cool. And what happens? They start fighting. She gets jealous because I am at his place, goes out partying until 5:30 in the morning. She tells him the next day about all the guys hitting on her and how it wouldnít have happened if he had been there to protect her. She says she wanted him there, but being around me, is just too awkward. He spends the day being mad at her, jealous, and taking it out on me.

Theyíve been having this three way relationship since July or August. Iím the only one who didnít know I was in one. Theyíve had plenty of time to adjust to the situation Ė they instigated it, they worked around it. Now suddenly, my just knowing about it, and everything being all out in the open, has thrown a monkey wrench into the works. Why are people less jealous when they are sneaking around, than when everyone knows? Maybe I screwed up. Maybe i was supposed to get mad and fuck off, but no, instead, like an idiot, I say, okay, maybe this could work. I've even researched polyamourism on the internet! People say you can love more than one person and share. People say you can get over jealousy and possessiveness. Hell, she claimed she wasnít jealous of me at all, so it shouldnt be a probelm. It was only my delicate feelings they were supposedly so worried about, and that was why everyone had to lie.

So after he took me home, picking a fight with me the whole way because he wanted to drive off mad, heís at her place tonight, patching things up, and Iím sitting here, trying not to feel jealous and alone, knowing they are having crazy make up sex.

The only reason i posted anything here is that I was looking for advice on how to handle my own jealousy. I want to know how to love someone, appreciate everything about them, and not care who else they love, or worry if they love them more than me. Mono, triads, vees, quads, or any other combination one of you are in, I was hoping someone here could tell me how to do this.

Are you guys really sure about all of this polyamoury stuff? I mean, can you love someone unselfishly, enjoy your time with them, and be a part of their life without worrying that they love someone else more? Can you live day to day, sharing the person you love, their time, their thoughts, their body, without keeping score? Can a person be so secure in their own identity, to give and not worry what they are getting back, or what somebody else is getting? Or is the only way to not feel jealousy, to not care and to not get hurt, to just simply force yourself not really care about them or yourself, all that much?
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  #20  
Old 10-24-2011, 01:45 AM
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AnnabelMore AnnabelMore is offline
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After this weekend, I think most people would just rather have affairs.

...

Are you guys really sure about all of this polyamoury stuff? I mean, can you love someone unselfishly, enjoy your time with them, and be a part of their life without worrying that they love someone else more? Can you live day to day, sharing the person you love, their time, their thoughts, their body, without keeping score? Can a person be so secure in their own identity, to give and not worry what they are getting back, or what somebody else is getting? Or is the only way to not feel jealousy, to not care and to not get hurt, to just simply force yourself not really care about them or yourself, all that much?
Um, so you're judging by their craziness that poly doesn't work and that "most people" would rather just have affairs? Has it occurred to you that maybe your bf and his girl are not "most people" but are just dysfunctional human beings? I know that sounds harsh, but look at their behavior. Guess who acts that way all the time, usually in MONO relationships? Drama-seekers, folks with issues they haven't worked out (i.e. dysfunctional people), and teenagers.

It's not a pretty truth, but you are NOT dealing with an emotionally well-developed person... not because he can't deal with poly...lots of people can't deal with poly, they're monogamous by choice or by nature and that's just fine... but because he *says* he wants poly when he's clearly not ready to:
- disengage from partners who explode into fits of drama for no reason
- treat partners who *are* managing their shit well with any respect at all
- deal with his jealousy at ALL

Are we sure about this polyamory stuff? Can people really love more than one person healthily? Read my blog. Read Phy's blog. Read Mya and Rory's blog. Read Redpepper's blog. I could go on. I've been with my gf for more than two years now and I feel so incredibly happy and blessed. But all the folks I just mentioned? We date people who are sane, strong, and *actually* ok with poly, not just saying they are like your bf's gf is, and definitely not just using it as an excuse to get whatever they want, like your bf is.

We all struggle with communication, boundaries, difficult feelings... just like mono folks. And, if we're lucky and willing to work at it, we manage to build a life that makes us very very very happy... just like mono folks.

No advice we or anyone else gives you will help unless your bf is willing to seriously reconsider his ways of handling things. I guarantee you, even if it was just you and him, he'd be finding some reason, sooner or later, to throw tantrums and treat you like crap. I know you love him and you want to believe that poly is the problem, not him. But honey... it's him.
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.

Last edited by AnnabelMore; 10-24-2011 at 01:47 AM.
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