Lies, lies and more lies.

[bassman]

I'm new, dont have any advice, but I am reading this thread with interest and wish you both well. I hope you can work it out.

[Podunk]

So, this thread is evolving and will be moving to the Life Stories and Blogs forum. In the interest of seeing it off to a good start in it's new home, I'll share my poly pondering for the day. It isn't a poly blog, but it's author is a poly dude with many years of experience.

Having new words is the first small but critical step towards changing the culture. We have had the term compersion, for quite some years now, but most polyamorous folx are still taking baby steps when it comes to appreciating their lovers other lovers, much less being excited about them or feeling really good about them. - Paxus Calta http://paxus.wordpress.com/

[nycindie]

Originally Posted by Podunk

She spends a good bit of time romanticizing another potential fuck buddy, Bob. Has she learned nothing from all of this?

What you really said is that you felt "the exact same thing" you have with me. Really? You thought I would be amazed by that? Excited even? You talked to some random dude for a couple of hours and found exactly what we have built over six years? How cheap is what we have?

I actually thought about this when I woke up this morning. Since it is the dishonesty that you felt was her biggest offense, how is it that she should've learned not to honestly express her feelings about another guy? Obviously she wasn't saying that she and Bob had the exact same love she shares with you, but that there was the same "kind of" thrill, spark, and excitement, which she recognized. Feeling that taught her something about how to know if there is something more substantial to pursue. But that is now an offense to you, too? Do you want her to discover these things about herself or not? You remarked that his overt declarations about what he wanted to do with her sexually is even more of a reason to think that the weekend would have been a disaster all around with him, too. This is a big "tell" on your part, about what's really bothering you.

I wonder if you would rather have had VC come home from that weekend without any sexual experiences or romantic feelings toward anyone at all. She would still have been this shy, insecure woman you get to "nurture" into becoming enlightened how you see fit, somehow. I think it would behoove you to explore at a deeper level how you really feel about opening up the relationship both sexually and emotionally. It sounds like that's an idea that appeals to you but the reality does not.

[Carma]

Sundance and I have both been trying to fling blame on the other; each of us wants to be seen as "the victim" if we really do split (and have to explain it to others ). I'm trying to stop the circle, and say, "Hey, let's just be roommates for a while." Not make some big break-up decision, not tear the family apart. This has been such a wild roller-coaster ride for us, we need to just COAST for a while -- no rolls! No one's abandoning anyone, no one's leaving. No one's to blame for this, it's the course of our life, and we can look at some new "soulutions" (I loved that, Dinged) and see what our possiblities are in the future. For now, I am hoping we can be decent to each other. Maybe not "best friends," but at least not stalking and pouncing on one another for everything. We've been HYPERsensitive. It's exhausting. I need to take my kids for a walk, without thinking of this shit all the time. Maybe play more board games as a family. Things that don't include: who said what, who lied, who loves who, who fucked who in what specific way.... There are so many little joys in life. I have lost sight of a lot of that. My kids deserve better. The sun is shining today and there is too much to be grateful for; I can't sit around and mentally masturbate all day long! I just can't, for my own sanity. I'm trying to let go of the resentments, because they are eating me alive.

[Podunk]

Originally Posted by nycindie

I wonder if you would rather have had VC come home from that weekend without any sexual experiences or romantic feelings toward anyone at all. She would still have been this shy, insecure woman you get to "nurture" into becoming enlightened how you see fit, somehow. I think it would behoove you to explore at a deeper level how you really feel about opening up the relationship both sexually and emotionally. It sounds like that's an idea that appeals to you but the reality does not.

Cindie, you're beating a dead horse on this. Your take on our relationship is so far off base, neither of us responds to it, but still you persist. Sorry, but repeating these ideas over and over and over is really not helping anyone.

[Podunk]

Originally Posted by Carma

The sun is shining today and there is too much to be grateful for; I can't sit around and mentally masturbate all day long! I just can't, for my own sanity. I'm trying to let go of the resentments, because they are eating me alive.

I so feel you on this Carma. We worked all morning and afternoon together on a renovation project. There were no rude comments, no discussion of our situation. It was pleasant. I so wanted to hug her, but could not. She was somewhat aloof and disconnected, probably for fear of starting something. For a minute I could see what we had just a few weeks ago. At first I just allowed myself to feel it, but by the afternoon it had started to wear on me. It is so very broken right now, and the pain couldn't be kept away for long. The late afternoon was kid-filled and fun as always. I got out for the evening, with a friend I haven't seen in a while. Best day in the past week for sure, but still a big empty spot.

[nycindie]

Originally Posted by Podunk

Cindie, you're beating a dead horse on this. Your take on our relationship is so far off base, neither of us responds to it, but still you persist. Sorry, but repeating these ideas over and over and over is really not helping anyone.

I'm not beating a dead horse, nor persisting about anything. There are two threads, you know. One is addressed to you, the other VC. It was simply a suggestion on something to look at. No need to get all defensive. If you don't think some more inner exploration about what you want or expect from poly is necessary, then don't do it.

[Podunk]

Originally Posted by nycindie

I'm not beating a dead horse, nor persisting about anything. There are two threads, you know. One is addressed to you, the other VC. It was simply a suggestion on something to look at. No need to get all defensive. If you don't think some more inner exploration about what you want or expect from poly is necessary, then don't do it.

You have made multiple posts here with the same. Your snide remark at the end of this post is just more of it. I appreciate the time invested and some of the things you had to say, but don't see anything else positive coming from it. I moved my thread to the blog section for a reason and would prefer you just leave it alone for now.

[Podunk]

Originally Posted by Podunk

I don't prefer swinging. You could count our swinging dates on one hand. It's not the deeper connection that hit me, it's the LIES AND BROKEN TRUST!!!

There would have been a lot to process here, that much is obvious. It was our first real poly experience, our first solo experience, it was 400 miles away and for 8 days! Add to that our personal histories. Outside of our few swinging experiences, each of us could count our romantic and sexual partners on one hand as well! How many people have come on here all broken up over a simple first date? This was a lot bigger than that!

And anyone looking at the situation would have known that, right? Who would have expected it not be an emotionally complex situation? Only person I know who saw it that way was veganchick. She was WRONG! Even more than me, SHE wasn't ready to handle this situation!

That is what led us to where we are today. I never had a chance to accept her week with Paul for what it was, never had a chance to process it in any reasonable or rational way. All I got was a huge shitpile of lies, deceit and broken trust and was left to figure it all out in the midst of that.

I wrote the above yesterday as a response in veganchick's thread, but I decided to share it here too. I don't have much to add to it right now. The words above led to a middle of the night discussion. We ended up back in the place of hurt, lies, deception and pain. We emotionally beat each other up all over again. We parted as anything but friends.

That said, a funny thing happened. I immediately sent veganchick a message telling her simply that I love her. Veganchick didn't get that message right away, she was busy coming to my defense in her blog. Will things grow from that? Will we ever find the courage to be kind and loving again in person? It's too hard right now, when I look at her it hurts. When I look at her, I see the beautiful amazing woman who is my wife. Then the pain of the lies and broken trust surfaces. The two things are so contradictory. I don't know if they can ever be reconciled.

[SNeacail]

Hugs!

This sounds all too familiar. One minute you are just sad, because you realize that you really do love this person. You want things to be fixed, but don't know how to get there. Then the next minute you can't even see straight because you feel so evicerated by the lies. It will take time and it can feel like the end of the world in the process, but you can recover if both of you want to. Small steps are good.

I too found that the revelation of being lied to trumped everything. I could understand mistakes, things done in anger, in thoughtless abandon, etc, but finding out the person you loved knowingly lied and set out to deceive you is harder to get over and for many reasons, hurts more and deeper than anything.

Basically, your house is in the process of getting temporary supports installed, because the foundation cracked and needs to be repaired. Once the supports are in place, then you can work on permanantely fixing the foundation.