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Old 06-06-2011, 02:56 PM
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Default Vixtresses' Blog (Mostly Ramblings)

Well, I posted an introduction already, but I've still got stuff bouncing around in my head, so I figured this is a good place to set it down.

One thing that DF and I mentioned with some wry amusement during our discussion about this whole poly (or open, I guess, we haven't really come to any distinct conclusion yet or nailed down exactly what we are yet) thing was that while it would be likely quite challenging to meet and pursue a relationship with someone who's open to the idea of a poly relationship, it would probably be pretty easy to enter into side relationships where the other people believe that we're having an affair with them. We thought that was funny, but really kind of sad, too. We definitely decided that we weren't after an affair, or even a fake affair (that just seems too flaky and dishonest to the other people, even if we were transparent about it with each other).

I was really proud of DF for admitting that he'd gotten kind of bored lately. I know it's not that he's bored with me, or that he thinks I'm unattractive, or that he doesn't want me anymore, it's just... well, it's been same old, same old for years now. He actually told me he'd been struggling with the temptation to just jump into a fling of some kind, just out of a need for something more. It actually sounds kind of bad when I type it out like this, but it didn't sound bad when we spoke, and it didn't and doesn't FEEL bad now, so... *shrug*

I'm not sure what I'll do about this current attraction of mine, though. Right now I'm busy with work and school, so I haven't seen him as frequently as I'm used to. I could just let things progress "naturally", in a physical sense, and just not beat myself up over things like caresses or cuddles and such, and things may or may not even get any further than that. We're already pretty close in terms of our friendship, I care lots about him and he cares lots about me, but we've described it as a brother/sister thing before. He's since modified that to something like "Well, I care about you with the devotion I would have to a sister, but you're nothing like my sister; that would be weird!" I guess I shouldn't have let us get this close before having discussed poly with DF, but I really wasn't planning on us being anything more than friends.

I can't help but think it would be pretty dishonest to my attraction to just let things happen on their own without full disclosure. Like, he would need to know that he wasn't on the way to replacing DF or anything like that. On the other hand, I'm sort of worried I'll kill the flow of things if we have a Serious Discussion like that. Then again, if a Serious Discussion kills things, they probably had better off be killed early anyway. Bah. I don't know. I'm going to have to think on this for a while. I know I'm going to have to talk to him, I'm just not sure what I'll say or how I'll say it.

Another thing I'm thinking about now that DF and I have had a successful conversation about expanding our relationship is a situation from years ago that was somewhat similar to this one. I had a guy friend who I grew gradually closer to over time, and he eventually developed strong feelings for me. I don't think polyamory even occurred to either of us, and I wasn't going to break up with DF (well, DBF at the time, since we weren't engaged), and it was a really painful, messy, long, drawn out situation. We ended up pulling away from each other more than once, trying to weed out these pesky romantic feelings by adding distance. Eventually we had to cease contact entirely, and there was definitely some resentment all around, including on DF's part, since he was not happy that I was finding any kind of emotional fulfillment in anybody else (I think that was more a feeling of betrayal, though, since we were trying to be monogamous). I can't help but wonder if that situation could have been managed better if we'd learned about poly earlier. Maybe it wouldn't have worked out into a V or triad or anything, but at least I would have been able to better navigate the situation without so many hurt feelings. I still feel bad about that, although I am happy that the guy found a spouse and apparently healed.

I guess that's all for today. Well, for now, anyway. I could end up posting another schpiel this afternoon.
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Old 06-06-2011, 03:14 PM
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OK, I guess that wasn't all.

What if I just simply told my attraction that "Guess, what? I was feeling a little hesitant about all our cuddling and spending time together because I wasn't sure about how DF would feel about it, and I talked to him, and he's actually perfectly fine with it!" Without a whole schpiel about polyamory and relationships and stuff... I mean, depending on how he reacted to that, it could come up anyway, but maybe I don't have to bring it up? Or am I just trying to avoid Real Discussions? Gah. I don't know. More thinking.
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Old 06-07-2011, 12:46 PM
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Well, guess I'll just update here as things progress (or don't, however the case may be).

I'm coming down a little from the whole "OMG! Big Conversation!" high from my talk with DF about opening up our relationship. (I'd said "going poly" on the intro thread, but that sounds awfully flippant in my head and I'm not sure how else to put it).

I think the timing of this could have been better somehow. Right now I'm still stuck with my attraction to the other guy (OK, I was trying to avoid borrowing abbreviations, but OG works quite well, so I'm going to use it), and while DF and I have discussed poly, we haven't said "OK we're doing it now!", so I guess DF is just processing things. He still seems gung-ho about it. He keeps mentioning finding a girlfriend, and I think he wants for us both to end up starting our additional relationships around the same time, although we both feel that's a bit unrealistic.

What sort of sucks is that now I'm STILL not sure what to DO with my attraction to OG. I haven't discussed anything with OG since we had the conversation about our mutual, accidental states of arousal last week, and we haven't been in that situation since then (although that could just be because I'm swamped with school and haven't spent much time alone with him since then). We went for coffee last night and met a couple at Starbucks, and mostly just talked and laughed about random crap. I feel like there's less tension between us (or maybe it's mostly on my part) after having told DF about my attraction to OG, which I think is a good thing. So less beating myself up over "how could you go and let yourself get attracted to someone else AGAIN?!" and more "OK, let's just let this be".

I guess I'm in a hurry because I do have this pre-existing attraction to someone, and DF does not, which is unfair. I guess ideally I could have come to the conclusion earlier that I would like to try being open to the possibility of poly relationships, and discussed that with DF BEFORE becoming actually attracted to someone. I guess I don't really start thinking about the possibility of having feelings for more than one person at a time until I am actually in the situation.Years ago I became very attracted to another friend of mine, although it happened quite gradually. I remember wondering if it was possible to love two people at the same time, because it seemed to me like I did. I hadn't really heard anything about polyamory back then, though, so I didn't even know how to start discussing it with DF (then DBF), and besides that, we were a younger, newer couple and didn't have the stronger foundation of communication that we do now.
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Old 06-07-2011, 09:04 PM
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Anybody out there?

*crickets*

Well, I'm getting views, at any rate. Guess that's something.

So we talked (again) (DF and I, that is) about the poly thing today a few times. I'm trying not to be pushy about it, as I don't want to be like "ZOMG we have to start this NOW cause I wanna get it on with OG!!!1!" and freak him out. Plus I don't know where I stand with OG anyway, since I've pretty much agreed with DF to put that on hold until he's made a decision about this whole poly thing.

Well... He's still wanting me to hold on, but he's already looking. He just doesn't expect to find anybody anytime soon, if at all, so he doesn't think that the fact that he's looking means we should actually *start* "being poly".

Erm...

I guess I'm going to have to talk to him again, because I'm not sure how I feel about him being out there and looking, while I have an interest that I can't pursue. I mean, I guess it's what I "deserve" for finding someone I have an interest in before even bringing up poly as a possibility, but I wasn't out there looking for anybody in the first place - an interest just sort of happened. I don't know.

All the same, though. He was awfully cute today when he was getting ready for work - you could tell he was putting in that extra effort in his preening. His hair was gelled and combed nicely, he wore his favorite sunglasses. He's on the prowl, and I think it's adorable.

But darnit, I wanna prowl too! I just happen to have a particular target in mind.

Oh, well. I guess I just need to be patient. Despite all appearances of everything being perfectly fine, it IS really soon after I brought it up. I don't want to rush him. I don't want him to feel insecure. I want things to go as smoothly as possible, so I'm going to try and be patient and not get ahead of myself.
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Old 06-07-2011, 09:41 PM
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Hello!

Are the two of you dead set on becoming involved with others simultaneously? Trying to coordinate a seamless transition for you both will likely be anything but seamless. Building relationships is not like putting the potato salad in the fridge until the chicken comes off the grill. Either I missed it, or you didn't state directly the reason for the simultaneous start up (though I likely just missed it). Is this to avoid jealousy issues if one has an SO and the other doesn't? If so; what happens if you manage -by some miracle- to coordinate meeting people and it doesn't workout with one of you? Would the other one have to cut it off and start over? Maybe I read too much into it and this isn't the case, but this approach will present you with many hurdles.

Trying to get one relationship timed and following a schedule is unreasonable, two is just impossible. It would be great if we were that predictable (well, not really) but the odds are stacked heavily against you.

Just my $1.00 - 98%.

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Last edited by polychronopolous; 06-07-2011 at 09:43 PM.
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Old 06-07-2011, 09:55 PM
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Hi! (OMG a person! In my blog!)

Nope, the two of us aren't dead set... but it's an idealistic hope of DF's. I don't know if he's dead set on it or not, but since we only talked about it yesterday, and I was the one who brought it up, it's a little soon to be insisting that I can just jump right in.

All those questions you have are the same ones running through my head, but I don't want to bombard him all at once with questions. I guess I'm afraid it'll come across as pushy and demanding.

He did mention that he thought it would take a really long time to find someone he clicks with who would be OK with getting into a relationship with an engaged man.

I think that yeah, it's to avoid jealousy issues and to try and minimize one of us being stuck alone at home while the other is off enjoying NRE and fun times with someone else.

And what if OG might have been interested in a relationship, but because I waited, he finds someone else?

Meanwhile, DF has OK'd maintaining the status quo with OG, which is basically, we can spend time together, cuddle, give eachother backrubs.

I guess I need to talk (some more) with DF... I just don't know what to say that we haven't already said. He seems open to it, but I wonder if his restriction that we wait until he's found someone means that he's really not OK with it?
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Old 06-07-2011, 11:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vixtresses View Post
Hi! (OMG a person! In my blog!)

Nope, the two of us aren't dead set... but it's an idealistic hope of DF's. I don't know if he's dead set on it or not, but since we only talked about it yesterday, and I was the one who brought it up, it's a little soon to be insisting that I can just jump right in.

All those questions you have are the same ones running through my head, but I don't want to bombard him all at once with questions. I guess I'm afraid it'll come across as pushy and demanding.

He did mention that he thought it would take a really long time to find someone he clicks with who would be OK with getting into a relationship with an engaged man.

I think that yeah, it's to avoid jealousy issues and to try and minimize one of us being stuck alone at home while the other is off enjoying NRE and fun times with someone else.

And what if OG might have been interested in a relationship, but because I waited, he finds someone else?

Meanwhile, DF has OK'd maintaining the status quo with OG, which is basically, we can spend time together, cuddle, give eachother backrubs.

I guess I need to talk (some more) with DF... I just don't know what to say that we haven't already said. He seems open to it, but I wonder if his restriction that we wait until he's found someone means that he's really not OK with it?
Well he does sound pretty open to it considering you only suggested it yesterday. Keeping it low pressure is a good idea too, but it sounds like the two of you have lots to talk about still. It is not the sort of thing you want to meander into, hoping you both "get" each others intentions through it all. Are you hoping for a LTR? Is DF? How deep are your desires for this kind of relationship, does he share your views?

I know it was only yesterday, but a lifetime is a long road. It pays to understand where the other is coming from. If jealousy could be an issue with DF, are you prepared for it? What if your relationship progresses more quickly than his or vice versa? Of course you are not going to reinvent the wheel overnight, but knowing where you stand is everything.

Either way it sounds like he is open and pretty comfortable so far, this is good. That he is receptive to your current level of interaction with OG (Work on those acronyms, LULZ!) Just keep communication open, very open. I would suggest that both of you do a lot of reading on this forum. There is a wealth of information on questions you may have, and probably lots you haven't even thought of yet.

And yes, there are lots of "real people" on here

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Old 06-08-2011, 12:21 AM
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On second thought, it was actually Sunday. Still feels like Monday to me. So not just yesterday, but still, very recent.

He's really excited to explore his options. We were both really clear with one another that we would be looking for relationships, not casual sex or flings, and that like any relationship, these may or may not work out.

I'm pretty prepared for jealousy, I think. It's definitely a possibility, almost an inevitability, really. We have lots of experience with jealousy from when our relationship was younger. We weren't as open and honest with one another as we are now, and there was this whole period of time where we were either dancing on the edge of cheating or dating other people during "breaks". There was this whole on-again-off-again phase. We made a lot of mistakes, but we worked hard to rebuild when we finally came out on the other side. We've got over four years, maybe closer to five years of stability under our belts since then, but the history is there, and we did address that during our conversations (i.e., "Remember when this was going on, and you told me X, but then you did Z? Do you think that could be a problem again? What makes it different now?").

Honestly, given our history, even though it's long past, I'm very pleasantly surprised that he IS being this open and apparently comfortable.

I think what I would prefer is a long term relationship, but I know there's no way of predicting how long any relationship will last. I am fluttery over OG (yes, I need to pick a better nickname, LOL!) right now, but I think regardless of whether or not he turns out to be a good fit for me within the context of my relationship with DF, I'll be glad to have the freedom of knowing that if another attraction to somebody does arise, I don't have to squelch it deep down inside me somewhere, feeling guilty for even thinking about it. I'm not looking to hop in bed with anybody (OK, maybe OG. Someday. Maybe. OK that's the flutteries talking! Ignore! Ignore! ), but to have the potential for meaningful interactions that may lead to something more long term.
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Old 06-09-2011, 12:51 PM
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OK, so latest and greatest:

Not a whole heck of a lot is new. DF and I talked a bit about the improbability of our being able to somehow coordinate both of us finding additional love interests at the same time. So far, I'm still on hold as far as OG (still working on another nickname for this guy... I really suck at naming things! It took me like two months to name my cat!) goes. DF is still doing OK as far as feelings and stuff. I asked if he had any specific fears or uneasiness about this whole thing, and emphasized that it's completely OK and I want to know if there are any. So far, though, nothing. :shrug:

I think it's got something to do with the fact that I've been making sure to pay extra attention to him since I brought up this whole thing. I mentioned that to him and said that it is probably not going to stay that way by default, that if I get sidetracked and distracted he needs to let me know if he needs me. He agreed to do that, and told me that as of right now, he's very happy with the amount of time we're spending together and the level of communication.

Another point I brought up was that while I understand that he needs time to process this whole thing, since it's one of those Major Life Change or Paradigm Shift type of things, I was probably going to get antsy about staying "on hold" about the whole OG thing. I don't even know if the OG thing is going to go anywhere, but staying on hold is likely to get old. I'm trying to give DF plenty of space and time and TLC and such in the meantime, though.

So far, this seems smooth. I know it's not going to stay this way, but I hope it stays as smooth as it reasonably can. I guess part of what helps is that DF was already reaching a point on his own where he was fantasizing about being with other people, so he's not in a place right now where he feels staunchly mono. I know that doesn't necessarily mean he is naturally inclined to be poly, or that he's not going to have any jealousy type issues later on, but I think it helps for the moment, if that makes any sense.

Last night I went to OG's place for a massage (this is part of the "on-hold", maintaining the status quo agreement w/DF. Massages were already a part of my friendship with OG). I went home first to shower with DF and make sure that he wasn't having doubts about me spending time with OG now that my attraction to him is in the open. So far, so good.

At OG's place, even though we're not DOING anything different than before, I still noticed I was much more at ease talking to him than I was before DF and I discussed poly. I was more talkative (much like I was before I realized, no, admitted to myself that I was attracted to him), a bit more giggly, and generally more at ease. I think I had started to get awkward recently, sort of questioning every little thing I did or said to try and make sure I wasn't anywhere near cheating on DF. It's definitely a better feeling now that everything's out in the open with DF.

On another note, I was totally checking out a cute guy in class yesterday. I think he caught me. We ran into each other in the hallway outside of the classroom and did one of those awkward little dances where each tries to get out of the other's way and both end up just stepping side to side together instead. He smiled at me. I'm sure I blushed. Busted!

ETA: Oh! And OMG, my back feels so much better today. I had the most ridiculous knots all over the place from stressing out too much about a stupid group project. It's a little sore now where there was one particularly stubborn knot, but at least I can twist at the waist without hurting now. OG needs to become a professional masseuse already. It's clearly his true calling.

Last edited by vixtresses; 06-09-2011 at 05:37 PM.
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Old 06-09-2011, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vixtresses View Post
What if I just simply told my attraction that "Guess, what? I was feeling a little hesitant about all our cuddling and spending time together because I wasn't sure about how DF would feel about it, and I talked to him, and he's actually perfectly fine with it!" Without a whole schpiel about polyamory and relationships and stuff... I mean, depending on how he reacted to that, it could come up anyway, but maybe I don't have to bring it up? Or am I just trying to avoid Real Discussions? Gah. I don't know. More thinking.
I actually rather like your phrasing right there. It leaves the whole 'what is this, this thing we are not having atm?' question aside, and leaves room for his response, whatever that might be.

Quote:
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I guess I'm in a hurry because I do have this pre-existing attraction to someone, and DF does not, which is unfair.
Well, life often is. Your attraction to OG happened, and you want to explore that, and rather than put that on hold for who knows how long a time while DF is prowling, you need to work out a plan/schedule on how are you going to progress. Continuing to hang out with him with no foreseeable future will only place you in temptation to cross boundaries and eff up the good start you're having.

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Originally Posted by vixtresses View Post
Well... He's still wanting me to hold on, but he's already looking. He just doesn't expect to find anybody anytime soon, if at all, so he doesn't think that the fact that he's looking means we should actually *start* "being poly".
Erm, him looking means you have started . It's a two-way street, after all.
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