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Old 05-24-2014, 03:03 PM
LogicalThinker LogicalThinker is offline
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Default She feels ignored?

Ok I will openly admit im emotionally tangled up right now so I'm hoping to untangle and reset and get back to our happy place and hopefully my primary partner and my undefined partner.

Lets start with some back ground first. Warning I have next been good with time lines.

My primary my Wife J. J and i had a long history of flirting as kids but we lived to very different walks of life. I went away to collage and a failed marriage then another failed long term relationship. She walked into my life again well atleast into my shop anyway. A pizza and a great time with her and her son and it was High school twitter pated all over again and still am to this day. Even well dating I was well aware of her Bisexual need/nature. About a 6 months into our committed relationship I began to incurage her to explore it. At the time it was understood I was not to be included. It latter was when we found the idea of poly and of the unicorn triad (now understand how bad an idea this is). lets stop here and come back.

Undefined Partner B. B and J worked together and as women tend to do hated each other tell they became Friends. Latter on I found B easy to talk to and during J's pregnancy with our second child a major help to my sanity. We had breakfast often and developed a great friend ship. It was soon after this we started talking poly and then triad. J and I began to imagine B as that unicorn I in text behind J's back started sexual innuendos that latter, after a 3sum would be discovered by J and cause major trust problems(I Messed up and work hard to fix it). Another learning to be poly lesson B was in a failed relationship but still had not left him.

Now back to the story. A massive heart break for J and I. followed by J feeling betrayed(Justified I messed up) and B Happy to act as if nothing at all had ever happened.

A few months latter J started to look back into poly and met A. A was a nice soft person and easy to get along with. A has a daughter that would latter come into play. They dated (more kind of hung out) and it turned sexual. I dont totally sure how it happened but they asked me to come to bed with them one night and a 3 sum latter(started by J and A) and we were a triad the next morning. This traid would latter break down after a few months for one big reason. Poly lesson learned again Parenting is a big deal breaker. We could in no way find common ground with A on parenting. Other leasons learned in the realm of Jealousy and for the secound time and big wakeup call by J to me that we get tunnel vision and forget the other is there and ignore them. J has done a far better job in fixing the tunnel vision problem then I have. Things with A broke down fast for me I cut her off and moved on. J and A broke down also but not broken up and still maintain a touchy friendship.

After this J moved on to have a rekindled relationship with a man who could not place her as important in his life as she needed to feel. So they went back to just a friendship. Followed by an overnight relationship with a dedicated lesbian that left her feeling used and hurt and worthless no matter how much I and all her friends supported her.

This is now were B comes back into play. She Breaks up with the abusive BF and comes back into our life. I have never hid the fact I like her and J becomes supportive of me. A night of drinking and a 3 sum this time started by me and a few talks latter about B is straight and its fine for her and I to have our own relationship. Originally based on a kind of no strings attached thing do to the recent breakup. As she has started to get passed the abusive BF she has become far more openly cuddly with me. And we have start to act more BF GF. Now up tell this point J has been full supportive. But this is were my tunnel vision problem comes back in. J began to feel ignored and latter violated by me when I called B "Little one" a phrase that i have used for any female I care about or am protective of my whole life(little sister, both grandmothers, all my sisters friends the list gos on). In J's defense she has asked me in the past to only use it with her and my family. This creates a confusing point for me as both are kids see B as their aunt.

This has resulted in a big blow up in wich I screamed at her "I just wish you would support me as openly as I support you". The words were said and cant be brought back the damage was done. Now J feels ignored and to top it off Feels like I dont care if something is bothering her. I broke her and dont know how to fix her
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Old 05-24-2014, 06:48 PM
LogicalThinker LogicalThinker is offline
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I'm sorry I should have stated im looking for advice. Aside from the fact I need to fix my tunnel vision.
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Old 05-24-2014, 10:19 PM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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Wow -- that's a lot. I hope you feel a bit better for airing out some. I'm sorry you struggle.

Let me try to lift up the highlights. Correct me if I am wrong ok?

BACKGROUND
  • I am married to my wife J, who is bisexual.
  • She is my primary.

DATING PAST
  • Initially I was encouraging but not involved in my wife's exploring her bi side and dating others.
  • Then we started polydating.
  • We tried a threesome and attempted triad with B first. We broke up with B. During this time B was also with her bad BF.
  • We then tried a threesome and triad with A, but could not agree on parenting things. I broke up with A, but my wife continues to see A.
  • My wife also has tried dating a guy (didn't work out) and a lesbian lady (didn't work out.)

PRESENT DAY
  • B broke up with the abusive BF and comes back into our life.
  • Me, J and B share sex in a threesome.
  • B & I begin to date casually with J's blessing. It grows more (BF-GF) than (no strings attached FWB) over time.
  • In the past, both J and I struggled with tunnel vision -- getting wrapped up in the new person and neglecting each other.
  • J feels jealous when I start calling B "Little One" -- a term of endearment I use for loved ones. She asked me not to use it with B.
  • This has resulted in a big blow up in which I screamed at her "I just wish you would support me as openly as I support you". The words were said and cant be brought back the damage was done.
  • Now J feels ignored and to top it off feels like I don't care if something is bothering her.

UNSPOKEN (But I guess they are there....)
  • I would like to be free to call B (a pet name? Whatever endearment I choose?)
  • I would like J to be more supportive in my dating separately since I've been supportive of her dating attempts. I would like her to show her support by.... (even been articulated?)

I think you and J could benefit from reading

http://www.kathylabriola.com/article...u-in-poly-hell

I think you could apologize for screaming at J. That's not the best way to do conflict resolution.

Does B even care what pet name you call her? Do you really care what pet name you call her? If it doesn't matter much to either you -- could change the pet name then, and leave "Little One" for J if that is special to her if it is no skin off either of your noses. Because you are not in relationship only with B, but in relationship with J. In your polymath there is also the tier of (J <--> (You + B)) where J is dealing with you guys as a couple. Not just as individuals. Make it easier on her and in turn (B + you) by bending where you can bend.

If the name IS important to you? If you want to call B "Little One" call B that then. But perhaps not in J's hearing initially? And dial down the public displays of affections around J? Could spend some time reassuring J that you value her also. How would she like to be reassured? You could ask J. this.

Ultimately I don't really much think this is about pet names, but about J feeling safe, loved, and treasured, TOO. Especially since historically you guys have a hard time with NRE "tunnel vision."

Quote:
big wakeup call by J to me that we get tunnel vision and forget the other is there and ignore them. J has done a far better job in fixing the tunnel vision problem then I have.
Ask J what she might need to feel safe enough, less stressy. Ask her what she needs from you so she can feel not on the outside of your "tunnel vision" -- some behaviors you can do/ not do so you can pick some things from a list to work on with her.

So far she's only asked for you to stop using the term of endearment -- that's one single "do not do." She's not giving you any behaviors to "do" that she would like. Maybe you both can talk about what other behaviors could be on the table for you to choose from and actually negotiate some kind of plan to address her connection needs. Can she articulate what those might be specifically? Maybe circle from list?

Because having one option of "Don't call her little one" isn't much on the table to work with. Depending on how J brought it up in the argument -- could leave you feeling bristly like she's making demands rather than asking for help or making requests. Then the defenses go up and the odds of a blow out increases.

Maybe reading about jealousy might help:

http://www.practicalpolyamory.com/im...ed_10-6-10.pdf
http://www.kathylabriola.com/article...ousy-first-aid
http://www.kathylabriola.com/article...-relationships

HTH!
Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 05-24-2014 at 10:40 PM.
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  #4  
Old 05-25-2014, 12:36 AM
london london is offline
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firstly, just because you start a relationship with someone, you don't start parenting each other's children. The fact that you parent differently doesn't have to be a deal breaker. It might simply be an acknowledgement that co parenting isn't a healthy possibility and that usually means you can't share a residence. You can, however, spend time with one another and your families. The fact that I parent my child differently from my friends and family doesn't mean we can't spend time together, for the most part.

Secondly, you know going behind your wife's back was wrong. Not going to go on about that because I'm pretty sure you know. I think you really need to look at what commitments you already have and want to keep and what you have left for new commitments. What can often happen with New Relationship Energy is that you create new expectations and commitments that you cannot maintain without taking the resources you have invested into your pre existing commitments. Sometimes, New makes us happier and getting rid of the Old is beneficial. Other times, the optimal situation would be for you to have the Old and the New. The problem occurs when you've neglected the Old and even though the New is really nice, only having the New isn't preferable to only having the Old. Old and New aren't necessarily people, mind, they are simply commitments that require finite resources like time, energy and money.

Now, to fix things, I suggest you sit down with your wife and work out what you need to do to maintain your relationship with her. You need to know what she needs from you. Once you know this, you can work out what other commitments you have generally, such as parenting, work, friends, family, hobbies. You can also look at your wife's needs and see whether you can meet those and meet your own needs. You can work out what finite resources it will take to maintain the commitments you have decided to keep. You can work out what you have left.

Once you know what type of commitment you really have the resources to maintain, you need to have a objective look at whether your relationship with B exceeds these limitations. If it does, is this something you want? Even if it means you have to scale back some of your optional commitments which, believe it or not, maintaining the romantic relationship between you and your wife is some thing you choose to do.

If it isn't something you want, then you have to explain to B that things have got out of sync and lay out what you can offer her in terms of time and energy. She needs to then decide what her needs from you are and you both see if you can negotiate to fulfill these expectations of each other as well as maintaining prior commitments and having the space to meet any other needs. Bear in mind, this may be something different to what she has been led to believe you could offer her thus far and she may opt out.
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Old 05-25-2014, 12:59 PM
LogicalThinker LogicalThinker is offline
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Thank you for the responses

GalaGirl: Your Highlight chart is close enough it gets the main points right. Thank you for the break down it really helped me get a better grasp of things!

london: Lets leave the parenting thing to the wind. I have 2 kids that act far above their ages and cant stand a 4 year old that wines and cryies more then my 18 mounth old that can make his own bowl of cereal in the morning.

Well last night after 2 weeks of J faking happiness in front of B and going back to hating me the moment she left the room or house. J started a heated debate loudly with B in the house able to hear. Then when B walked in the room stormed out. I hit my last straw and began a loud enough for conversation with B for J to hear about EVERYTHING! No hold bared it was all going on the table. They then left to go out dancing for the night. But just before they left B came back in. "Are you OK" I said "I have been here before the look she gave me is the look of divorce. Its all or nothing now I will not live this way"

They left
The cell was silent Facebook had no posts from them. I took a shot of tequila and drank a glass of white zine and layed down on the couch. At 1:15 I was awoken and asked to come to bed by J with B smiling over us. She said she loved me and finally understood.
We talked more in the morning and she left to help A with something. I closed the conversation with it was her choice to see A but that problems in that relationship had to stop coming home.
B and I kissed and found our comfort we needed from each other.

Its a new day time to start over.
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Old 05-25-2014, 01:47 PM
london london is offline
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Yeah, you should probably date people without kids altogether. Good luck with your stuff, dude.
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Old 05-25-2014, 02:21 PM
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Inyourendo Inyourendo is offline
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Wish my 18 month old could make her own breakfast, all she does is shit in her diaper
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Sue, openly in a vee with Nate (polysexual, many fwb) and Sam (Mono)
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Old 05-25-2014, 04:15 PM
LogicalThinker LogicalThinker is offline
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thank you Inyourendo. But it seems to be at a price. He is mechanically so smart it would scare you. But he has a vocabulary of less then 10 words. His comprehension is in the hundreds but little to no speech.

J came home about an hour ago and seems back to her old self kind of 80%. She now admits we have a long road ahead of talks and getting used to being in a V with me as primary to both rather then a triad.

B and i had a VERY strait forward talk about NRE and my tunnel vision. Resulting in her admitting she had seen me do it. I follow that up with a strong emphasis on her needing to put me in my place about it. This seemed to brake the ice for her and she opened up about a few things she needed from me and talk about baby steps to let her get comfortable fully before coming out to everyone. Concern being her abusive EX under a protection order he has already violated.

Again I want to say thank you!
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Old 05-27-2014, 02:58 AM
LogicalThinker LogicalThinker is offline
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J and i are back to normal. The "little one" thing has been leveled out and understood as me being a protective male. Further talk about a name that no if ands or buts is JUST her and she is happy. We talked about me keeping her and B separated and 2 individual relationships.

We spent today at B's Parents. We have been on baby steps and so coming out to them is not an option yet. I could tell she was wanting to hold my hand or cuddle as we normally do at my house. J stepped in twice to defuse Mom and Dad as I have taken to making it ovias that I care for her but not blatant. I have decided we are at a point that she needs to decide if this life is what she wants or just a way to move on past her EX. Her parents seeing us and how she reacts or acts in the near future will decide.

Do to my Primary job being very public and my secondary job being even more public. I have lived in fear of coming out. But at this point for some reason I fear more what if anything it would do to B then what it would do to me. J has always been an open BI so no one notices if that makes any sense.
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Old 05-29-2014, 12:28 PM
LogicalThinker LogicalThinker is offline
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I'm not totally sure how I feel about a few things so decided to write it out and see if im centered in the end.

J and i had made an agreement to put more focus on us and B and I to stay on baby steps. B agreed to this and life was cool.

But then it seems almost out of no were J declared she wanted to go on a feeler date with John a guy she had just recently met and is a close family friend of B. A first meet was setup rather hastily. I chose to take this as a sign I could take the next step with B and asked her out on a reel date just us on the town Friday. Well John canceled on J last night but I think it was just pure bad timing. In the past J has let things like this taint the idea of me dating. So far she seems different this time and is almost to supportive of B and I going out friday.

I dont think J and i are fully healed maybe 80% on the other hand I trust B and she says John is a good man. I also think J needs something or some one to focus on as I focus on B. I have made it clear I want a reel relationship and not to be a rebound to J and plan to have that conversation with B on fridays date.

Any advice is welcome and always appreciated.
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