Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > General Poly Discussions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 11-03-2009, 04:32 AM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,634
Default

You really need to take a breath my friend. The poor woman will not be able to think if you keep carrying on the way you are. I understand you are frantic but your reaction to this is not making it easy for her and she may react by saying, "forget it, I'm done with you!" You are breaking your trust with her at this point, in my opinion. She trusts you to stand by her in tough times, when tough decisions need to be made. You are her best friend and need to act like one. This to me is what marriage is about, putting ourselves aside for one another so that we can be there in full attention, love, compassion and empathy. Regardless the issue.

With all due respect, if you want to keep her in your life, give her some breathing room. Cut the man some slack give him some room too and quite with the "he broke trust" thing! I don't see how he broke trust. He has just as much right to make sure he is okay as you do. He has invested in your wife now and things have changed. If you don't start going with it and figuring out what is behind these feelings you have for YOU, you will lose her because you're whining, storming around and ultimatums will not make her want to stay. She needs you to stand up and fight for the love you have and fight for yourself in it.

I'm sorry if this seems harsh. I'm not meaning it to be, it is meant to be a kick in the butt, because I would hate to see you lose everything.

I say it also out of what I would want as her in the same situation. I would need my man to be strong and fight for what we have regardless of the changes.
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 11-03-2009, 05:39 AM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,634
Default

My husband and Mono think I should clarify what "fight" means.

It means to me that you should be standing TOGETHER on this, not AGAINST one another. The issue is "separate" from both of you, not a part of you. The emotions you both feel are not "you," but part of "the issue." You know that you are good together because you married each other and have built a life together. You haven't always been walking around with these emotions. They don't reveal something fundamentally wrong with your relationship, they are aside from that.

Yes she needs to make some choices, but to do that it would be more helpful and to your benefit if you gave her and him space to think and come to the right decision for what is best for everyone. Hopefully thinking of the higher needs here, "what do I need?" and "is there a way I can fulfill those needs while others can fulfill theirs also?" "How can this situation benefit everyone?" "what boundaries and rules do we need to do that?"

Do you understand why this bothers you so much? It could be it has nothing to do with your wife being in love with someone else..... thinking about the core (as I said before) of the situation would be helpful. Not bandaging the thing with demanding she decide.

Okay, I will be more specific, did you have a picture in your mind of the boundaries you had, has this fallen outside of that? Did you talk about boundaries? Did she agree not to fall in love? Was it even discussed that she might? Did you discuss what to do about her falling in love ahead of time? Was there room for change and fluidity with these boundaries? What are the underlying feelings that make you want her to chose and why do you feel that way?
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-03-2009, 05:42 AM
LovingRadiance's Avatar
LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Alaska
Posts: 5,086
Default

Good job explaining your meaning RP. I think you did a good job. And I agree with you 100%.
I wish I could meet your husband. The man really impresses me and I never spoke one word with him (mono impresses me too as do you!)
__________________
"Love As Thou Wilt"
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-03-2009, 06:02 AM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,634
Default

He's always here, in the background,,,, gets really emotional about the forums, so he talks through me sometimes...

I got hit by a car tonight, so he is speaking through me a lot tonight as I sit with my head spinning. I'm doing my own fair share of whining tonight.

“Problems cannot be solved by the same level of thinking that created them.” Einstein quote he just thought might be useful in this thread....
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 11-03-2009, 08:25 AM
NightDragon NightDragon is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 12
Default the outcome

Well I am leaving for Florida in just a few hours. I do appologize, I can't read everyones post right now. I'm to raw.

I will say, the poly relationship isn't what caused Dragonfly to want to leave me. I did! I came here through pain to talk about what I felt this site was about... Poly relations. What I did not say was...

Me and DF have had a unstable marriage for quite some time. The reason being is because I refused to see that there was anything wrong with me. I wouldn't see that I was depressed and codependent. I just blamed it on everything else. My job, other people, even DF. It wasn't till Monday that with a huge talk with a 3rd party, that something long ago has broken me and I have not dealt with it or any of the other things. I just boxed it up and said I'm stronger then that, stay in the fucking box and don't come out. Well I didn't see the sludge was leaking out the bottom and I was standing in it and becoming poisioned.

I'm not using this as an excuse. I hurt DF. I've been hurting DF for a while now. And I don't deserve her or her love. I do love her. She has been that one bright shining star out of my entire life and I don't want to loose her. Well maybe after I go, seek some theripy, get help, and heal myself. Maybe she can find it in her to still love me. Maybe even still want me. But now I must go.

All I can do is hope and take 1 step at a time.

1st step: get some help!
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 11-03-2009, 03:27 PM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,634
Default

Wow, what a brave first step to a better life. Good for you. Happiness is obtainable my friend. Withs a lot of hard work, ambition and self love. I hope you feel proud of this first step towards a brighter future. You should!

Lots of hugs and warm wishes along your way.
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 11-03-2009, 04:12 PM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: London, UK
Posts: 900
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NightDragon View Post
"Here let my son live here on our sofa and lets support him cause he moving here without a job, a vehicle, or any money."
For what it's worth, if you replace the word "son" with "daughter" that pretty much exactly describes what happened to me and the current situation I'm in (and that includes the state of Florida in that). It's not as bad as it seems.

Last edited by Ceoli; 11-03-2009 at 04:16 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 11-03-2009, 04:14 PM
Mark1npt Mark1npt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Sunny FL
Posts: 344
Default

RP, you're explaining the "fight" was right on! We all have to fight together to make this lifestyle work for all. I know we have done our share, as you are well aware.

It now certainly appears that ND has other issues which need addressing. (which we all do at times), but my overiding concern in this whole mess is....."how can one enter into the poly life, without expecting ourselves or our spouse to fall in love with someone else?" Isn't that what polyamory is about? More loves? How can that be "out of bounds?"
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 11-03-2009, 07:04 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Louisiana... Go Saints!
Posts: 179
Default

So, I think its time for me to step out of the shadows. I wanted to wait just a few more days actually before I did my update. My fiance and my friend and I are supposed to be meeting on saturday. Anyways, quick update, we are all taking baby steps towards a poly relationship.

I just had to comment on this because we went through something similar yesterday and I need to say my side of it. So my fiance springs the fact that he cannot accept that I love another man on me yesterday. He says that he can't accept it, but he wants me to be me. The thing about that is I love him dearly and I brought this into our home. I understand that in life and love sacrifices (if you want to keep that life and love) must be made when compromise cannot happen. My friend also understand how much my fiance means to me and said that if it ever comes to on or the other to choose my fiance. That he would make it and easy choice by cutting me off if need be.

So here we are at a point where no compromise can be made and my fiance hits me with the ultimatum. Him or Us. I should also mention that my fiance did not want my friend knowing about this conversation. So yes... Ultimatum. I choose my fiance because I love him and need him, because I know that my friend will always be a part of my life in some way, and because that's what my friend wants me to do. This happened while I was at work. my fiance dropped me to my knees and ripped out my heart and all at the same time telling me how much he loves me and is so grateful I chose him. I wasn't angry at him. I understood, but I'm trying not to cry at work... failing miserably. Trying to make everything seem okay to my friend because I didn't know how to break his heart and I sure as hell wasn't about to do it while he was at work. I felt like a part of me was slowly dying inside.
So my fiance takes it back when he realizes how much he has hurt me. He said that he thought he would feel better knowing that I chose him and only him, but it didn't. It hurt me, he hurt himself by hurting me, and all around it just wasn't what he expected to get out of it. I didn't make it all go away. I didn't give him the security he thought he would get... because nothing he can ever do will change the fact that I love my friend. Its something that is mine that he can't touch and it drives him crazy.

So about 30 minutes after he says our meetup is still on.... he goes back to feeding into his doubts. and at that point I get pissed.

My friend "isn't up to our afternoon talk" and all in all I feel like my feeling are not important to anyone and my abandonment issues from my childhood rear their ugly heads and start biting everyone in the ass. Im hurt and raw and exposed and everyone walked away as I lay in the detruction and the onlything that ran through my head was what the fuck just happened.
So I said and I quote "If I hear one more whaa whaa out of someone I am going to snap. And everyone and their emotions can kiss my ass till the morning." I needed time to lick my wounds and I still am not done. I'm taking todday to heal myself and reflect on my own issues because I feel like a piece of used toilet paper.

I say what happened yesterday not to hijack the thread, but to show what I went through before I start making my points because I think everyone needs to hear the poly person's side of this.

So my points are this, ultimatums are rash, and selfish and destructive to everyone involved. You run the risk of losing everything when you give one out. You make get what you wanted, but then you have to deal with the fact that you hurt the person you love and it could change your relationship forever. It can result in a lot of resentment towards you and you probably won't want to own the damage you have caused which will eventually destroy all trust.

Secondly, just because I am poly doesn't mean that I don't have rights as a human being. It doesn't mean I don't have feelings. I can't always be the strong one. I still need to be care for when I am having weak moments. I need to trust that the ones I care for will be there for me when I need them to. I need to know that if I am having a breakdown that my loves can put a pause on their emotions to take care of mine. Basically, I need to know I recieve what I give.

Another thing, You chose me. For better or worse. Well right now its worse and all I ask is that we see it to the otherside. we work on the issue at hand don't pile more wood on the fire. Don't add more hurt because you are hurting. fuck Poly. Its not about poly. You... the person I love should have enough respect for me to not be passive aggressive. to try to hurt me because you are hurting. no matter what the issue is. U wrongs do not make a right. When the going gets tough and you leave how can I trust you ever again? Me being who I am is not meant to hurt you. Im not doing it on purpose, but you intentionally trying to hurt me because you are hurting is vindictive and unacceptable.

Another point, I know that there will be a roller coaster of emotions. I know that it is my responsibility to ride that ride with you. To hold your hand and reassure you that its okay to feel the way you feel. But the ultimatum roller coaster is unfair and wrong. It ignores the issues and is a cowardly way out of the problem. and it doesn't work... because you might be able to stop my actions and wrap me up in a pretty bow and tie me to it.... but inside.... I still love him and nothing you do will ever change it and you know it.

So yeah, that's all I got for now. if its full of typos im sorry. Im writing this from my phone.

Also, I think I should mention an article that think is great. its on xeromag.com Jealousy and the broken refrigerator.

I hope no one is offended by my rant... I'm still licking my wounds at the moment.

Oh and as for the outcome. we are all talking about what happened and why... and the biggest issue is the fear of the unknown... and that's part of life. We are going to get through this. I have faith in our love... But if we don't I want to atleast be able to say that we didn't the best we could to make it work. I don't want to look back and see people intentionally destroying it because of fear and uncontrolled emotions.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 11-03-2009, 07:25 PM
MonoVCPHG's Avatar
MonoVCPHG MonoVCPHG is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: In Redpepper's heart
Posts: 4,742
Default

Ultimatums cannot work in these cases because they only have the potential to change how someone acts, not how they feel. Who wants to be with someone who is acting?? What it comes down to is the people offering the ultimatum simply need to make the hard decision for themselves. If you don't want to be there...get the fuck out.

I get it now...it is unfair to force someone to choose between two loves. It is ok to ask and present your reasons though. If the choice is not what you can be healthy in...leave; be an adult and simply fucking leave and find some one who wants to love the same way you do.

Each person has the right to change everything. If someone says it's done...it's done....no begging, whining or pleas to keep working at it. If some one needs something that precipitates that, then live with it...make your choices and accept the consequences...that's what grown ups do for fuck's sake.….and don't even pretend that you can have everything…get you head out of the clouds and be real.

If you are going to put an ultimatum out there be prepared to follow through. Don't tell me I'm going to bed without supper and then let me have something to eat because whatever I did, I'll fucking do it again because you don't follow through.
__________________

Playing the Game of Life with Monopoly rules.
Monogamy might just be in my genes

Poly Events All Over

Last edited by MonoVCPHG; 11-03-2009 at 07:31 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:04 PM.