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  #11  
Old 08-07-2017, 01:49 PM
icesong icesong is offline
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Originally Posted by MsEmotional View Post
He's so fucking logical! ... I think I see stress as an indicator of healthy realism -- and so in the absence of stress I assume he isn't being realistic. But maybe he is just realistic in a more chill way than I am.
My Knight is like that - he just doesn't expend a lot of emotional energy on theoretical situations or worrying. Think of it as a nice balance to you doing the worrying... ;-)
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36/bi/F, married to TheKnight (together 21 years)
Partnered with AnotherArtist (3 years)

Other Dramatis Personae are detailed in my blog.
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  #12  
Old 08-09-2017, 01:47 AM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Posts: 373
Default Maybe baby?

I think Ponytail really wants to have a baby.

He brings it up at kind of random times, but he is more certain ("I need to have a kid. I just need to find someone willing to have a kid with me.") than before ("I don't have any good reasons to have kids, so I don't know.") This feels like kind of a sudden change to me and I don't know how to talk about it. I mean, I can't just say "ok, well, don't worry about finding someone because I'll have a kid with you if you want." Because (a) I don't know that that's what I actually want and (b) I don't know how that would work with the rest of my family commitments.

I try to just joke and say, "ok, sounds like a plan, but you are always welcome to hang out with my kids in the meantime."

How do you navigate this? I feel like in monogamy people who have kid-related goals and are kind of on a timeline for getting those kid-related goals met are pretty up front about it. "I am looking for a partner who wants to have kids in the next couple years. How do you feel about kids?" If they aren't interested in the same goals, then you politely part ways and look for a different partner early on.

But with poly, it's not so simple. When he tells me he wants to have kids, and that he needs to find someone to have kids with, I feel like I am supposed to do something with that information but I don't know what. Am I supposed to say, "OK, let's take a break from our relationship so you can concentrate on finding a nesting partner." Or am I supposed to say "Ok, let's make a deal that if you still want kids in 2 years and we are still together and going strong, you can impregnate me."

I know that the simplest way to deal with this is a frank conversation, but I am not sure how to start that conversation.
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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  #13  
Old 08-11-2017, 01:33 AM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Posts: 373
Default Clarity Hurts

So Ponytail and I had a good conversation and cleared things up. Apparently he wasn't trying to suggest anything at all about us having a kid together or about me needing to back off so that he can find someone to have kids with.

I had a conversation with Glasses, though, because I recognize that I might want to have a kid with Ponytail someday and that we might decide to do that eventually. How would that look? What would we need to consider?

Glasses is terrified of that prospect. He is uncomfortable with the idea of my time being divided between two families. He is anxious about becoming a stepparent to a child when he's done having kids.

This morning I had an epiphany -- what if it were financially feasible for me to stay home? I could have a baby with Ponytail and Ponytail could keep the baby at his house (he and his parents live together and his parents are retired and his mom is baby-crazy, so I gather that they would be okay with that) but bring me the baby in the morning so that I could spend time with the baby during the day. Then at night when Glasses is home, the baby could go back to Ponytail's house and so Glasses wouldn't have to worry about the sleepless nights of having a newborn again. Win-win, right? Ponytail gets a baby and support with raising the baby, but I still get to be in the baby's life so that the baby knows its mother too...

I brought the idea up with Glasses, just to see if that would alleviate some of his fears about the idea of me having a kid with Ponytail. Not intending to do anything about this soon -- just brainstorming.

Glasses freaked out. The idea was truly horrifying to him. How could I be so careless with the life of a child? How could I imagine being a part-time mother to this hypothetical baby? What about our kids? Wouldn't they be upset and confused about why their sibling didn't live with us?

I tried to explain that there are all kinds of blended families, that it didn't strike me as odd at all to have a sibling who you don't live with, but we had a big fight. He was really angry with me that I would even consider it. And I was really angry at him for getting angry at me for communicating an idea.

Then his sister came over for dinner. And I didn't want to be crying in front of her, so I ran off to Ponytail's house. We went for a walk in silence and then he made me food. I couldn't tell him why I was so upset because I know that he's already anxious about feeling unwelcome and it's definitely not Ponytail's fault that I brought up a crazy co-parenting plan that upset Glasses.

Now I am home again. And miserable. I don't even know what I want. But the fact that Glasses reacted the way that he did makes me feel foolish and reckless. Maybe it is a terrible idea, but I feel like I am being stripped of my agency by the fact that he was so upset and offended. He didn't even ask me clarifying questions, he was just horrified and instantly judgmental. I feel so hurt and ashamed.
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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  #14  
Old 08-11-2017, 03:10 PM
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Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
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Location: Metro West Massachusetts
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Default kids and poly

Kids and poly is complicated and everyone is going to have a different way of coping with the various issues around it.

You were upset with Ponytail when he was too calm around your pregnancy scare. Now you are upset with Glasses because he was too upset at the idea of you having a baby with Ponytail and brainstorming about how to share custody.

Maybe you could just let each man voice his concerns or lack thereof, and let them own their initial feelings around this or that scenario, and let them be? Don't borrow trouble. Cross each baby-making bridge when you come to it. You've only known Ponytail 2 months, so it's way too soon to worry about having babies with him.
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Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 62), dating... again!
Pixi (poly, F, 40) my darling nesting partner since January 2009
Master, (mono, M, 36), Pixi's Dom/bf since April 2013
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  #15  
Old 08-13-2017, 01:50 AM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Posts: 373
Default Communicating Helps

So the other day I was feeling awful. I had hurt Glasses, I felt trapped and unable to meet the needs of my loved ones...I felt like I couldn't tell Ponytail what was going on with Glasses without making him feel insecure and worried that he was going to get vetoed.

But then I just gave in and told Ponytail -- via text -- what was going on with me and Glasses. And he was so understanding and sweet about it. He reacted so calmly and I felt SO much better after getting it off my chest. It was like a huge weight had been lifted. Ponytail was really understanding, and asked whether it would help if he refrained from talking about his reproductive goals. I said that it would -- that it would help me stop fixating on that and planning for the future and allow me to just enjoy being with him. He reiterated that he wouldn't/couldn't stop wanting to have kids, but that he would try to stop talking about it all the time.

I am so lucky. He is so considerate and understanding. Things started going better with Glasses as soon as I confided in Ponytail too -- I think getting it out on the table with Ponytail helped me process the whole situation and focus on what was going on with Glasses. I am at peace again and I have been able to communicate with Glasses better about all of this. We are on the mend.
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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  #16  
Old 08-15-2017, 05:37 AM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Posts: 373
Default What the hell have I gotten myself into?

Today I kind of felt like I was in poly hell.

First, Ponytail and I went out together and a former student (yes, I am a teacher) spotted us and came over to say hello. She also said that she had seen me and Ponytail together last week and she had wondered if he was my husband and now, yes, it appears that she was right! I quckly corrected that he was a friend. But then things got even more awkward as she quickly tried to backtrack and say that she must have seen me with someone else last week, etc.

It was the first time I have been unexpectedly spotted in public with Ponytail and it was totally confusing and uncomfortable to experience.

So then we went to go eat and during dinner Ponytail started telling me about someone he has been texting with who propositioned him with sex. This is someone he had previously dated, and it hadn't ended very well, and so I am feeling pretty protective and insecure about the whole thing. Ponytail explained that he was okay with her not being a good fit for him long-term or even with it ending badly again, that he was just looking for something casual to fill the time that he had as a result of me not being available to him as often as he would like.

I am totally unable to fathom having casual sex, so I was struggling to understand his mentality, while also telling myself "you don't have to understand it because it's not about you. Focus on your own needs and your own relationships."

And so, of course, while I am struggling with this is when I get a text from Glasses asking me to give him a heads up about when I am coming home because there are likely to be makeouts happening at our house between himself and the person he was out with this evening.

So now I am dealing with insecurity in both of my relationships. And I am really afraid that I am just not cut out for polyamory -- and since it seems that both my partners are much more inclined toward it than I am, it means I am going to end up heartbroken on all fronts.

So Ponytail and I talked about this all at length and Ponytail didn't really understand any of my fears and just kept saying that there was nothing I could do (within the realm of behavior/intentions that he can imagine from me) to make him not want to be with me, so he couldn't understand why I was afraid of everything getting screwed up. Which didn't help because it's not about me wanting to be with him or him wanting to be with me, it's about being able to handle the situation that we are in.

So then it got really late and so Ponytail drove me home. At home, Glasses and I talked and it came out that he and his date had had sex. I mean, technically they didn't have intercourse because Glasses wasn't able to maintain an erection, but that's neither here nor there....they had made the decision to have sex and that's the point.

This last part didn't bother me as much as I thought it would. My husband, for the first time since we began a relationship together, kissed someone else...got undressed with a lover....these things don't actually make me feel jealous. What I feel instead is just utter dispair about my skills in handling this situation.

Where do we all go from here? Am I doomed to always feel weird and uncomfortable with the idea of my partners seeking other partners?
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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  #17  
Old 08-15-2017, 05:20 PM
Reverie's Avatar
Reverie Reverie is offline
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Posts: 1,562
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MsEmotional View Post
Am I doomed to always feel weird and uncomfortable with the idea of my partners seeking other partners?
It gets better. Stuff that helped me so far:

- All the poly books
- Books/podcasts on meditation and letting things go
- Self-help books on your particular childhood issues (everyone has them; I really needed "Adult Children of Alcoholics")
- Therapy, if you can afford at least a few visits
- Cultivating a rich life with other friends and hobbies
- Figuring out which ways you need your partner(s) to help you feel secure, and then asking for them
- Getting experience in all the relationship roles: incoming partner to an established relationship; loose-end arm to a succession of Vs; hinge; trying out having FWBs and other casual relationships
- Having some kind of "carrot" to keep you motivated toward growth; for me, the new boyfriend has proved to be my most effective one yet
- Posting here, both journaling and advice-request threads
- Time

Also, you might find your level of comfort varies from partner to partner based on history and individual characteristics of the person. Like, at this point I'm 100% comfortable with my husband doing pretty much whatever, but I bet I'm going to experience some (hopefully manageable) jealousy if/when my boyfriend starts dating someone, because it's newer and less solid, and he's not as poly-experienced, so it's sure to be a wilder ride. I have so many better coping and soothing strategies now, though, that I know that even if things go completely off the rails and I get my heart broken, I'll still be all right.
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  #18  
Old 08-25-2017, 10:04 PM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 373
Default Happy!

Things are going well. I was really struggling earlier this week when both my husband and boyfriend had dates on Monday. That evening I asked that we all sit down together and talk and we did and it was really rewarding I was able to be emotionally vulnerable with both of them and not have it be a "YOU'RE making me jealous!" thing but instead, "these are some of the mindsets that I struggle with when it comes to polyamory." Anyway, it was really rewarding.

Then last night came the big news! I came out to my mom! She handled it in stride even though I know she was really caught off-guard. I am so happy that she knows now. I feel like I can fully be my authentic self.
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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  #19  
Old 08-26-2017, 09:33 PM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 373
Default

Today my mom and my sister met Ponytail. We went to the park with our kids and Ponytail met us there. It was really nice. We all got along and it wasn't too uncomfortable.

I can't believe that these big steps are happening so fast, but at the same time it just feels so wonderfully right!
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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  #20  
Old 09-03-2017, 02:20 PM
MsEmotional MsEmotional is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 373
Default How long is this going to be sustainable?

I am so happy.

And so tired.

On Friday Ponytail slept over and on Saturday morning we took the kids to breakfast. Then all of us (Glasses, Ponytail,the kids and I) went to the zoo together. It was really nice. We had a lot of fun.

Then in the evening Glasses went to spend the night with his other partner. Ponytail went to a party and then came over around 10 and spent the rest of the night with me.

This morning Glasses is still at his OSO's house and I am hanging with the kids. Tomorrow I am going to meet his OSO and I feel generally okay about it.

Everything seems to be going well.

Except that I am so exhausted.

How long is this sustainable? The emotional energy that I am expending seems really difficult to maintain. If this was it -- if I didn't have a job to contend with -- I would be really happy. But I have a life outside of my relationships. A life that I can barely keep up with. My job requires a ton of work from home, so although I feel fairly competent at my job when I am there, I am having trouble focusing my energy on it when I am at home. Also, I am so tired that when I spend time with Glasses I don't even know what to talk about -- our "dates" are really just conversations about how poly is going for us. Is that normal? Is that just kind of the stage our realationship is going through right now?

Does it get easier? Will it always be so tiring?
__________________
Me: 34, F, Bicurious

Amours
Glasses: my husband of 8 years --> 35, M, Queer
Ponytail: my first-poly-date-turned-boyfriend --> 35, M, Pansexual
Laptop: my (not-so-platonic?) poly friend --> 31, M, Straight

Metamours and Others
Ginger: Glasses' partner --> 30ish, Transgender (FTM)
MsPolitical: Glasses' ex and potential new romantic interest --> 35ish, F
LadyLaptop: Laptop's wife --> 30ish, F
Giraffe: Laptop's FWB --> 30ish, F
Glitzy: Ponytail's interest --> 35, F
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