HPV - Shouldn't we talk about it?

Just as a note, I AM scared and feel like clamping up my pussy now. :D:p
heh, just kidding, kinda.

Your reaction is a common one and exactly why it's so scary to talk about for people who have an STD. It opens you up for more reinforcement that you are untouchable just when you have gotten the courage up to stop believing that.
 
From what Wikipedia reports on HPV, lots of folks have had it or carry it. I found out I have had it, as any kind of wart is caused by HPV. I used to have warts on my hands years ago--and had no clue those were caused by the same thing that causes genital warts. Apparently, in most instances, the virus runs its course and is gone after a year or so--it's rare that it would remain longer than that.

My son has had a couple of warts on his hands and I know he's never had sexual contact with anybody other than himself. Wherever he picked up the virus, it didn't involve sexual activity.

And I'm glad that to know that the strain I know I've had caused warts. The strains that don't are the ones that cause cancer. Sheesh!
 
I think it would be helpful to have thread that deals with sexual diseases. When I grew up, the basic advise I was given is "avoid AIDS and herpes." All other diseases were ignored or assumed to go away with penicillin. The rules of thumb were basically, "look for spots or sores and if you see none, it is probably ok."

YIKES!!! BOTH of those diseases can be there with no physical signs!
 
I retract the word "catapult," however, this could be a bit of a problem with language also: You do NOT have to be irresponsible, at all, to get a high-risk strain of HPV. You can check histories, tests, and use condoms, you can not even have intercourse, and you can still get it, and it's not even that unlikely.

The same is true for Herpes. MANY people have it and ARE NOT AWARE. It's contagious even if you don't have a sore if it's "active" and often people are in the "shedding" stage-and don't know it-which is NOT where you would see a sore.

So it can (and does) get spread around between people who aren't even aware they have it in the first place.
 
The vaccine for young girls is one of the reasons I bring this up. First, it protects against only 4 of the most common strains, 2 of the cancer causing ones and 2 for warts. Older women are never offered this vaccine. I'm not sure if that's just because it's considered too late (since anyone who's had sex is considered exposed) or if there's some other reason. If it's just the former, then an older woman embarking on a new .... set of choices for her life?... might want to find out if this vaccine could help to protect her.

I was given to understand (when my oldest child was talking with her doc about it) that it's not offered to anyone (regardless of age) whose already had sex. It was suggested that the reason was it was only beneficial to someone who hadn't been exposed. I'm not sure of the technical data on that. But because it became available here LITERALLY weeks after my daughter first had sex-they would't give it to her.
Also-it's not given to ALL girls who haven't had sex, the parents have to agree to it and in many cases have to REQUEST it.
 
These facts, which are pretty much the same in the US, depending on which study you consult- (1 out of 4, one out of 5), are really scary, added tot he fact that 90% of people don't know(or don't say!) they have it, and condoms can be ineffective for herpes type 2, genital herpes as well if the infection site is outside of the coverarage area of a condom, which it frequently is.

Lots of the information out there pairs HPV with Herpes strains, because both are so common, and if you have one, you are more susceptible to the other.

Confronted with this information, it is easy to see why there is so much fear attached and why people who have these diseases have a terrible time both dealing with and talking about their condition.

Of the 300 or so active members on this forum, the numbers would indicate that 75 or so have herpes. Yet the OP is right, we never talk about these things specifically. And I know there are people out there dealing with this, in addition to all of the other special challenges of polyamory.

There are so many psychological effects as well as physical and ethical issues. People who have STD's are treated with revulsion and the stigma is great even though I see that Sunnydee has made the point that the likelihood of contracting these diseases is high for everyone, acting responsibly or not. Just the sheer amount of people that have the diseases that don't know is a huge factor- they may be judgmental toward someone who admits to having an STD, not realizing they may have it too and be asymptomatic.

The sad thing is- STDs are not viewed as what they are by most people who don't (or think they don't) have them- as a disease, a common, manageable (though highly transmittable!)disease. Because the disease affects the genitals, in our heavily hypocritical puritan society it is unmentionable, dirty, and must indicate poor character.

I am one of the 75. It's very difficult psychologically more than anything. People make jokes about it around you and it makes you feel like an outcast.
People talk about safe sex and misunderstand the large portion of the population that has to confront the fact that they have an STD, and do their best to treat and prevent the spread of the virus.

The fact is, when someone tells you they have herpes and is educated about it, you are actually in a better position than you may be when someone says they don't because there are so many people out there who have no clue. The only way to get clear, whether you think you have the diseases or not is to get blood tests done and determine if you have an STD and what type it is, so you can receive medical treatment.

Thankyou, Sunnydee. I was thinking about starting a similar thread last week but didn't have the guts. It's a big issue for me, especially in considering sexual relationships outside my dyad, and I have been very anxious about dropping the double bomb of poly and herpes on a potential partner. It's very hard to deal with, but I'm glad we're talking.

I don't expect anyone else to "come out" with such a private thing, but even though I am scared to reveal this about myself, I have to change my way of thinking and not play into the stigma. I have to be the first one to reject the notion that this disease is any different from any other. My responsibility is to be educated and manage my disease honestly. My hope is that someone who I've established a connection with that cares about me will not write me off when I share this information.

Congratulations on facing your fear here. That's awesome-absolutely awesome.
Since you are #1, I'll be happy to be #2. I just found this thread and read the first two posts and decided after I read the whole thing I would post my "life truth".

I will do so more in depth at the end of reading! But I wanted to say now-before I keep reading-good job opening yourself up and big hugs to you!
 
I have actually directed one potential to this site in the past, and writing on here means he may find out from this thread.

I have been waiting to discuss it until I am sure that there is a possibility of sexual interaction, not wanting to assume our relationship will get to that point. The rub here is that I want to trust a person's respect for me before I tell them about my disease, but don't want them to feel as if I've been dishonest because I don't want to bring it up in small talk right at the beginning when I don't know where it's going.

I don't feel brave most of the time about this, and always feel like I should speak out more- it's just so hard to expose yourself to the reactions that people have whether they are fair or not.

One positive thing about having herpes is that if you can get through this conversation with someone well, and there is compassion and clarity on the facts to begin with, it is a really profound bonding experience, creating trust, communication and intimacy that few budding romances contain that early on.

YES! It was hell coming out with this trivia with Maca. I KNEW I loved him, I KNEW we were meant to be a couple. But it hurt to even CONSIDER that my oldest child's father cheating on me none-so carefully led to me having to risk my potential future with Maca before we even had time to build it.
I did and I'm glad I did-but it's very hard. Some people REALLY flip out and are not understanding at all. Others-like Maca are kind, caring and considerate and they look at the risks and compare them to the benefits of the relationship to make their decisions, instead of just making a decision based in fear.
 
So the kicker with Herpes is that again-many many people have no clue they have it. They can be contagious even if they don't have a sore.
There ARE precautions you can take and things that make it less likely to spread.

But the biggest issue that comes into play is (like rarechild said) I don't really care to share all the details of my personal life with you until we're friends (no I don't participate in sex with people I'm not close to either).

But at the same time-I don't want to hurt your feelings if YOU get interested in taking things further then friendship and I have to explain this to you but you feel like I "led you on".

It's just a crappy situation all around. And like someone said-it's a disease. I wasn't "running loose" and didn't know I wasn't being careful. I was (as far as I was aware) in a monogomous relationship with one person who I was planning to marry "and live happily ever after" with.

Unfortunately he was lying and wasn't careful with anyone. So he got it and spread it to all the girls he was sleeping with. I say girls-because I was 15 years old. We weren't ladies, we weren't women, we were girls. His theory was if it looked ok and smelled ok it must be ok." (crude I know-sorry).

The problem is-that isn't how it works.

With herpes there isn't a cure-but there are suppressant medications and when it is suppressed you aren't contagious. The medications don't guarantee it is ALWAYS suppressed. But they do reduce the risk somewhat. Obviously so does paying attention to your body. There are other symptomst that can clue you in to issues besides having a "breakout" or "sore". Itching, burning (often VERY MILD) or even scaly skin (almost unnoticable) and tingling sensations are all signs you are contagious.
Furthermore-the real kicker is the virus can be killed with soap and water prior to infection-so again-WASH with soap and water is a good idea. It can live off the body for a period of time (not sure how long) and they suggest that towels are a big risk factor.

So in 11 years together-I don't share towels with Maca, I don't participate in sexual activities of any sort if I have ANY possible symptoms and I take my drugs every day. Also-we always take a shower after (seriously). Because those things are all protections. So far he's never shown signs of symptoms. While that isn't a guarantee and of course we tell anyone who might be a possible partner that there is some risk (with him) and I'm clear that I DO have it and am a risk period. But my point is-with precautions-you can lower risk.

Again rarechild-good job on "coming out". I for one am proud of you!
 
I was given to understand (when my oldest child was talking with her doc about it) that it's not offered to anyone (regardless of age) whose already had sex. It was suggested that the reason was it was only beneficial to someone who hadn't been exposed. I'm not sure of the technical data on that. But because it became available here LITERALLY weeks after my daughter first had sex-they would't give it to her.
Also-it's not given to ALL girls who haven't had sex, the parents have to agree to it and in many cases have to REQUEST it.

If you (or your daughter) feel that she should have the vaccine, then you should ask her provider again or find another one. I was offered it after I got married. The issue is that most people that are sexually active have been exposed to HPV, so it becomes less and less meaningful to have the vaccine. That's also why they don't routinely test for HPV until the age of the 30 (note, not PAP smears, but blood tests). Many people would test positive, but often the body clears the infection without the person even knowing they had it.

Also, while it has only been approved for girls in a limited age range, many people of both genders have had it off-label. Dr. Drew from Love-Line is a very big supporter of vaccinating boys and young men. He has said numerous times that he's had his sons vaccinated.

Also, something else that might calm some fears. Most harmful strains of HPV are very slow growing. It takes many months/years in most cases to go from a normal PAP to abnormal cells to cancer. Most providers in the US have scaled back the recommended schedule from everyone yearly to either every other year or yearly for three years and then once every three years if you are in a closed relationship and have always had normal PAP smears before. Obviously, a history of abnormal PAP smears changes the recommendations.
 
Right back at you, L-$

Again rarechild-good job on "coming out". I for one am proud of you!

I love that you concentrated on supporting me when you were doing the very same thing. That was truly some loving radiance.Thank you. I needed that today.

Thanks for sharing your story too- I am really encouraged by your success in managing and containing the disease for so long. Thanks for telling us about how it has played out for you two, especially the fact that it can go well when you tell someone. I don't think it would ever be easy, but I know that the fear can be replaced by education, compassion, and caring for the whole person. I know this because that's how I dealt with it when I was told by the one I loved that he had this disease.

I had actually looked around for a forum devoted to herpes/HPV to try to find some perspective on how to tell someone, but I'm glad to have sought support among this group,- it means a lot more to me to talk to people I already feel comfortable with about this.

So thanks again to Sunnydee.
 
I think you've both shown courage in coming out.

I think that the courage involved in living relationships that rely on honesty and candor can also exhibit itself in candor when dealing with groups. That this group is electronic and fairly anonymous requires a bit more courage to be forthcoming--so kudos to you!
 
I think you've both shown courage in coming out.

I think that the courage involved in living relationships that rely on honesty and candor can also exhibit itself in candor when dealing with groups. That this group is electronic and fairly anonymous requires a bit more courage to be forthcoming--so kudos to you!

Thank you seventhcrow. I have to admit-that my stomach did flipflops because I feel like I have made some "friends" on here and I know other people who are aware I talk on here and could easily identify me by my log in.
But the truth is the truth and it's long past time that as a world we get on track with the truth. So here we are!
 
I love that you concentrated on supporting me when you were doing the very same thing. That was truly some loving radiance.Thank you. I needed that today.

Thanks for sharing your story too- I am really encouraged by your success in managing and containing the disease for so long. Thanks for telling us about how it has played out for you two, especially the fact that it can go well when you tell someone. I don't think it would ever be easy, but I know that the fear can be replaced by education, compassion, and caring for the whole person. I know this because that's how I dealt with it when I was told by the one I loved that he had this disease.

I had actually looked around for a forum devoted to herpes/HPV to try to find some perspective on how to tell someone, but I'm glad to have sought support among this group,- it means a lot more to me to talk to people I already feel comfortable with about this.

So thanks again to Sunnydee.

That my dear is simply me. I don't believe in focusing too much on myself. If I focus on the care and loving of others-it seems to always work out better in the long run. But you are welcome. I read your first post and smiled a huge smile because I had already decided to "out" myself-but suddenly felt less "alone" in doing so.

It's not easy to share that information with people. I know especially in a poly life-it's difficult because you have to protect everyone that you come in contact with. That makes building a relationship a little harder-because so many "chances" fall away. But the other side of that is that you don't waste time in as many relationships that wouldn't work either.

Both Maca and Green Gecko have managed to survive my having herpes and still fall deeply, madly in love with me. Both have stood by me and stand by me. It's nice to know there isn't a "secret" hidden between us!
 
Thanks to all of you for sharing. I feel truely honoured that you would feel safe to do so in light of the fact that there is still stigma around which you speak. Anyone who reads this should feel honoured too I would think. You have helped me understand and that to me means more acceptance. Acceptance brings people together to have more love and compassion. It all spreads and positive change happens because of it. What a gift you've given!

(I sound so flakey! And should be in that "spiritual awakening" thread, or whatever its called, but this is what that thread talks about! Sorry, I do mean it though :))
 
HPV Update

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnydee
My original post: The vaccine for young girls is one of the reasons I bring this up. First, it protects against only 4 of the most common strains, 2 of the cancer causing ones and 2 for warts. Older women are never offered this vaccine. I'm not sure if that's just because it's considered too late (since anyone who's had sex is considered exposed) or if there's some other reason. If it's just the former, then an older woman embarking on a new .... set of choices for her life?... might want to find out if this vaccine could help to protect her."

I was given to understand (when my oldest child was talking with her doc about it) that it's not offered to anyone (regardless of age) whose already had sex. It was suggested that the reason was it was only beneficial to someone who hadn't been exposed. I'm not sure of the technical data on that. But because it became available here LITERALLY weeks after my daughter first had sex-they would't give it to her.
Also-it's not given to ALL girls who haven't had sex, the parents have to agree to it and in many cases have to REQUEST it.

I just talked to my doctor at length explaining that I am embarking on a polyamorous journey and that I have not previously been exposed to very many partners, etc. Because my education only began about HPV because they found irregular cells that they were concerned about, I've now been tested and now know that these were not caused by HPV and there is still no high-risk HPVs present.

She agreed that polyamory put me at a higher risk and that my history and tests made the vaccine a good idea for me. According to her, the only reason that they don't give this to older/experienced women routinely is that they have no studies showing it's efficacy for women over 26 and it's expensive and U.S. insurance probably won't cover it. It will cost $500 before I'm through with it, but I think it's a good investment for my particular situation. She says that there is no harm in it, it's not a live vaccine, and it may provide additional protection against HPVs that are similar to the 4 it contains. Protection starts immediately, though it's not considered complete for six months and three injections. I'm pretty happy with the results of this experience for me and hope it can be of use to others.
 
I am resurrecting this thread because a close friend of mine just found out this weekend that she's been exposed to herpes. She's bumming big time about this. Her doc told her there are antibodies in her blood that show she's had it. She is very upset about it, says she's never had symptoms. I really don't know much about it but said I would help find info for her. She works long hours and doesn't have much time to research on her own.

She's trying to figure out when this infection could have occurred, and her doc told her it could have happened many years ago. We are both wondering how soon after an infection the antibodies can be detected. She uses condoms with her boyfriend.

She knows she has to inform any potential partners of this, but should she say that she actually has herpes? Is that what she now identifies as? A person with herpes? Or do she just say that she was exposed to it? It confuses us both that that is how her doc told her -- not that she has herpes, but that she was exposed to it. To add to the frustration, the doc also said that no test is 100% accurate, but it's probably wise to warn any current and future partners and get them to test themselves to see if they are at risk. I think what the doc told her is that if a potential partner also has antibodies, then my friend doesn't have to be so careful -- but for those who have never been exposed, I guess she can infect someone even if asymptomatic. But since no test is 100% accurate, it seems to me a good idea that she be tested again with maybe a different test for corroboration.

More info on the medication would be great. And as to the soap and water comment, I got confused. It kills the virus before infection? Meaning you should wash after sex before it has a chance to infect? If anyone has any knowledge to share, would be very grateful. Thanks in advance.g.

Earlier in this thread:
there are suppressant medications and when it is suppressed you aren't contagious . . . the real kicker is the virus can be killed with soap and water prior to infection-so again-WASH with soap and water is a good idea.
 
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If you have antibodies-that means that you are a carrier of the herpes virus-which means you have it.

The majority of people who have it-have no symptoms or don't realize the symptoms when they do have them (itching is a symptom and it can be MILD itching).

Soap and water kill the virus PRIOR to infection-but once you are infected, the virus "resides" near the base of the spinal cord and there is no cure.

You do need to tell anyone who you are going to be sexually active with that you have the herpes virus.


COMPLICATION-
There are TWO herpes virus's-there is a test that can say WHICH one you have, but without knowing that it is possible to GET one and THEN get the other. Which means someone with type 1, can get type 2 and vise versa.

I.E. my husband has type 1, so it is "safe" for him to be with someone else who also has type 1, they both have it. But if he were with someone who had type 2, he could end up with that also AND they could end up getting 1 also.

SO it'd be nice if you could find out which type you have.

A LOT of people ASSUME that symptoms in one location or another will tell you which type it is, but that isn't true. You can get type 1 or 2 on the mouth (cold sores) OR in the genital area AND IN FACT you can get break outs ANYWHERE on your body from either 1 or 2.

There is more info on:

www.herpes.com

http://sfcityclinic.org/stdbasics/

I particularly like that second link. They have a great wealth of info that you can cross reference various ways.

Also-thread on safe sex that has info:

http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1190
 
Hi LR,
Thank you - I did find some info about the tests on http://www.herpesdiagnosis.com/blood.html and she did find out which test was done and her doc told her that the test shows HSV2. I also just found this site and sent her the link: http://www.herpesite.org/index.html

I will check out your links, too.

Since my original post, my friend realized she has had outbreaks - on her butt! Never anywhere else but there. It seems that on some websites, they call that sacral herpes. Every now & then it would flare up but she says it was always pretty small, so she never thought it was herpes. She just thought it was a rash, and doesn't understand how it never showed up in exams before. She thinks she's been tested for it.

The relationship with her boyfriend is pretty new, so she feels terrible and embarrassed about having to tell him.
 
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I haven't read all the replies so I may be repeating, but there is a vaccine out. I know it was market for teens so I am not sure of any age restrictions. I have not used it and I am not sure if it is still on the market but I was excited to hear about it a few years back.
 
I haven't read all the replies so I may be repeating, but there is a vaccine out. I know it was market for teens so I am not sure of any age restrictions. I have not used it and I am not sure if it is still on the market but I was excited to hear about it a few years back.

I think the HPV vaccine is available for women until age 26.
 
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