How Much Sex is Enough Sex?

amberleaf

New member
Ok, attention-grabbing title... ;) My question is actually related, I promise.

Background
I am part of a polyamorous V with my wife and her girlfriend, who has lived with us for the last 4 months. I've been with my wife monogamously for 15 years and she met her girlfriend just over a year ago.

Our sex life is pretty good, but we do not have it as often as I'd like. My wife is a Domme and I tried becoming a sub... but i'm not all that kinky. Maybe once every two weeks on average. Sometimes every week, sometimes a longer gap. We have a toddler and this definitely is part of the issue too.

Another barrier is the addition of my wife's girlfriend - obviously there's only so much sex my wife can manage. Don't get me wrong though; she's great and I deeply care for her. I don't resent it. But it makes me worry about one thing.

How much is enough?
My wife is now ready to have an extra regular sexual partner, outside of our poly family. She's met one guy twice and wants to sleep with him in a couple of day's time. She needs a submissive male and I understand that. Her girlfriend is also a Domme and so she can't get that element from her either.

There seems to be the general idea from her that she would like to sleep with him once a week. That's what she's told us. Then maybe a couple of casual extra partners once a month.

She said that it might be the case that she has sex with him more often than either of us, simply because she is able to go out on a date with him, with no toddler, and set aside time for that. I said that if she's going to make time to have sex with someone else... we should be making time for the same in our marriage, first? Have a weekly date night, or something?

I hope this doesn't sound selfish... but I'm worried about how to balance my needs with hers when this happens. I'm already struggling, because we don't really have dates. I sometimes feel neglected.. not just sexually, but in other ways as well.

In terms of my wife... she'd be having sex with me, her girlfriend and her extra partner. Since she only has sex with me about once a fortnight, her girlfriend once every 1-2 weeks and wants to see her new person every week.... that makes me worry that I'll get pushed back even further...

Questions
I wonder if anyone has any advice?

Do you have a set amount of times a week, in general, you see secondary partners?

If your primary partners are feeling neglected, do you skip a week with your secondary?

Do you have less sex with your primary than your secondary, and if so, does that work ok for you?

Do you think it's acceptable for my wife to actively set time aside to go on dates/have sex with a play partner on a weekly basis, if she is not making time to have dates with us? Like I say, at current, her and I hardly do anything together without our daughter. When my wife goes out, I look after our daughter.

Thank you for your help and I hope I don't sound like a complete sex-obsessed @asshole... :-s
 
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Our sex life is pretty good, but we do not have it as often as I'd like. My wife is a Domme and I tried becoming a sub... but i'm not all that kinky. Maybe once every two weeks on average. Sometimes every week, sometimes a longer gap. We have a toddler and this definitely is part of the issue too.

Ugh, parenting. Does put a ding in sex life -- you become like weekend warriors or something. I get that. (Does GF take a turn babystting so you guys can have a date night or alone time? Do you babysit so they can get alone time?)

But "sex" -- make sure it's expanded enough, ok? Not just all about PIV. Sometimes we're too tired for full on PIV or a full on scene. Mutual masturbation will do. Or shoot, just WATCH while I drive and fly solo. It's time for sexual intimacies as opposed to time for specific sex acts like penis-into-vagina.

There where times with a newborn that the urge was there but the exhaustion of parenting killed the energy. We'd lay in the dark and just talk/think dirty. "Oh, you better PRAY to the skies and thank them I'm this pooped. If I wasn't so tired you'd be in SERIOUS trouble! I'd grab you and..."

It was fun sexual intimacy and bridged the gap to the next interlude where hopefully energy was a bit better. The babies and toddlers will grow up and it will get better on the night time parenting so you don't have to keep getting up to tend to diapers and things. Hang in there.

I said that if she's going to make time to have sex with someone else... we should be making time for the same in our marriage, first? Have a weekly date night, or something?
Yup. Not fair to add more partners if needs at home are not being met.

GG
 
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It seems to me that the priorities at home need to be straightened out before other partners are added. And yes, you guys most certainly need to schedule regular dates!
 
Well, first of all, for me I find that sexual desire/need isn't a gauge that gets filled when I have sex, no matter the partner. Having a new partner won't make me want less sex with existing partners, and actually might make me want my existing partners more.
Why? Because sexual desire for me is based on trust, on how well our relationship is going, on how in love I feel. And for my partners to be fine with me having a new partner makes this existing relationship more precious, with more trust, and more love.

While I can't know if she works the same way I do, it's a possibility, and in that case "your" sex wouldn't be cut down, but stay the same or possibly increase.

That's the first thing. Now, for the date, I don't think it's fair of her to want regular date with a new partner, but dismisses the idea of having them with you. Obviously, if she has time she does, so she should have time for you, too. It's possible she wants regular dates with him and not you because of NRE, but still, I believe dates with just you and her would be very good for your relationship and add to your intimacy, regardless of whether sex happens or not. I definitely think she should take care of established relationship as well, not just the new one.
You need to maintain the romance and the love, and dates are important even when you are parents, maybe even especially when you are parents, so you can get out of the house and the stress linked to parenting... Provided someone can take care of your kid, of course.
 
Thank you for all the help so far.

Since my wife's girlfriend moved in, four months ago, my wife has done a lot of things with her because she wanted to show her around the new city and also probably a bit of NRE (even though they've been together for over a year, they had a LDR until now).

During that time, my wife's girlfriend has offered very openly to look after our daughter. She is like a second mom to her and truly wonderful.

However, my wife says that she doesn't want to 'force' time with me and wants it to be natural.

In terms of sex, my wife's girlfriend has literally at times said "I'll look after baby - just seriously go and have some fun in the bedroom".

I said that I'd ideally like the following situation for my wife:
- One date a fortnight with me
- One date a fortnight with girlfriend
- One date a fortnight with sub boy lover

Every week would be great, but obviously we aren't all made of money and time, so it might be overkill.

She basically thinks that a date with her new boy once every fortnight is not often enough. She wants to train him and work with him in terms of BDSM and craves D/s sex that cannot be offered at home.

So let's say it comes to this... she's seeing him every week. Sleeping with him 4 times a month.

She sleeps with me 2 times in that month. And her gf maybe 3 times.

When I tell her that for me, that isn't how I feel our primary relationship should be, she tells me to consider the love and intimacy we have, that surpasses sex.

So I wondered how you guys manage it and if in general, you at least balance the date nights out?
 
Sounds like you have a nice meta-rship with you wife's GF. That's good at least.

However, my wife says that she doesn't want to 'force' time with me and wants it to be natural.

We MAKE the time. We do not "force" what happens in that block of time -- could be a nice talk, watch a movie, sex, whatever. But in real life? We have to BLOCK OUT the time on the calendar. You MAKE the time. It doesn't magically appear out of the skies. It's called making priorities and time management.

When I tell her that for me, that isn't how I feel our primary relationship should be, she tells me to consider the love and intimacy we have, that surpasses sex.

And since there is no time blocked out with just you, exactly when is the air time that the "love and intimacy" channel is playing on?

Every week would be great, but obviously we aren't all made of money and time, so it might be overkill.

She basically thinks that a date with her new boy once every fortnight is not often enough. She wants to train him and work with him in terms of BDSM and craves D/s sex that cannot be offered at home.

So find the happy medium and negotiate that. You could change your definition of date so it's not costing money. Have an indoor picnic, play naked monopoly while GF takes care of kid. Whatever. The "date" just has to be a block of TIME. It doesn't have to be spendy in terms of money. It has to be spendy in terms of time and attention.

And if she wants a weekly date with sub, well then? Spend a weekly date with hubby and GF!

Mon -- DH
Tues -- family time, home care
Wed -- GF
Thurs -- family time, home care
Fri - Sub BF
Sat -- family time, home care
Sun - day of rest for all, church, whatever.

Hell, do two if the home care is up to par.

Mon - hubby
Tues - GF
Wed = Sub BF
Thurs = hubby
Friday = GF
Sat = Sub BF
Sun = day of rest for all, church whatever

Talk it out. Negotiate however your pattern works out best as your sweet spot in the polyship so that all needs (not just HER need for D/s) are being met at the happy medium. We all would LOVE the happy stellar stupdendous, but we can all be content at the happy medium. And that is ok. In fact, it can be great.

GG
 
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I have just worked out a schedule with my husband and boyfriend.

Week one and three...

Mon Hubby/home
Tues Hubby/home
Wednesday Bf with overnight stay
Thursday with bf before work.. Home with family afterwork
Fri Hubby date
Sat Hubby date
Sunday Hubby/home

Week two and four

Mon Occassional overnight with Bf during summer
Tues Hubby/home
Wed Hubby/home
Thurs Hubby/home
Fri, Sat, Sun At the bf's house 2 out of the 3 days.

I was having issues between hubby and myself about time spent away from home with my boyfriend. But when I wrote it out a schedule on paper for him. He realized that even though he felt like he has a short end of the stick this past week that he actually has me most of the time. My bf feels like that he is being heard too with his schedule.
 
I think the "forcing time" thing is kind of a cop-out.
I get it: you've been together for a while, you have a kid. There isn't as much excitement as there used to me. There is a routine. There might be less intimacy.
But it's a vicious circle. The less you date, etc, the less she'll feel like it. She's waiting to feel like she wants to do it with you, but she won't until it happens. I remember reading a study saying that while it's agreed people who are the closest years into their marriage still date regularly, they're close because they still date, not the other way around.

If she doesn't want to plan something, see if you can plan it with the GF and surprise her. Go to dinner and a movie, or even a show, or a class for something you both like. Try to spend time together in a non-matrimonial context. It's important for your relationship.

About the amount of sex, I believe it's not a competition, and sexual desire is unique. It just may be that with you, for your relationship, she feels twice a month is the right amount. Then forcing more would be a terrible idea, and preventing her from having more sex with other partners is probably a bad idea too. So I think I would focus on the quality of the sex instead. Try new things, or go back to doing things you did when your relationship was new. Could be sexual, like a sex act, could be romantic, like a massage or a bath together, you name it.

In the meantime, it seems contact helps a lot with intimacy. If she's not touch-repulsed, try and hug her often, caress her hair, arm, etc, kiss her... these little things can go a long way towards feeling appreciated.
 
The problem I had when I was in that situation was ...a) having to mention it... b) the forced dates....or obligatory dates....ok I'm here what do you want to do ... Wait hold that thought I just got a text....reading reading ..giggle giggle...ok what were you saying.

So my point is a schedule could help carve out time but that doesn't drive desire, excitement.....and its exsitents is to simulate equality.

Why not find a gf of your own .....the thought that by her adding partners will improve the frequency of you getting laid is crazy. In your opinion you're are already dissatisfied with that was that the case before opening up the marriage or after the gf? Either way it's not going to get better ...time is finite. 15 yrs of that.

Have you considered this option?
 
I feel that every married couple, poly or not, needs to have a weekly date night. It is crucial!

Sex doesn't have to happen during every date, but there needs to be time spent together where the two of you are focused on each other and not paying bills, parenting, or doing chores, etc. AND in polyamory, it's quite necessary that the spouse who is not going out and getting jiggy with other partners not be left at home with only scraps of romance tossed his or her way when the more active partner happens to squeeze in a little time.

I understand her wanting to keep things spontaneous with you, but it seems that right now your wife may not realize that she is treating you somewhat carelessly and taking you for granted. After the first couple of times you and she do go out on a designated date night, both of you will look forward to it every week and will really want to keep it going.

Note that one thing about date nights with your spouse is that it's an important rule they do not get broken or rescheduled except for a family emergency. A partner should not be swept aside for another, just because something really cool is coming up on a planned date night with someone else. Treat it as sacred - no texting or calling other partners when you're together. Crikey, your wife can get her jollies six other days a week.

I dated a married poly guy last year. Sunday was his day of the week to be with his wife and I respected that, never called him on Sundays. In addition, one major rule he and his wife had was that for every amount of time spent with a lover, they each had to spend equal time with each other. One week, after he had spent time with me, and she had spent time with one of her boyfriends, they got together and had a picnic in the woods, staring up at the stars in the back of their pick-up truck. He said there was a moment when they both looked at each other and sighed, "Yeah, this is what it's all about." They connected again, after a hectic week of socializing and, frankly, fucking other people. And it was the connection they needed as well as sexual intimacy.

If I were you, I would insist on weekly dates. If she doesn't want to give you that, she needs to pull back on spending so much time with other people. Otherwise, she's really not playing fair and that comes across as really bitchy, IMHO. You don't need to feel used and unappreciated. After you get a few more responses, you should invite her to read this thread.
 
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OK, others have covered sex, intimacy, scheduling dates, tiring toddlers.

I want to address the BDSM aspect. I think it might be key. You say your wife is a Domme, and that you 2 have been together 15 years, but you don't enjoy subbing.

Has she always been into D/s and yet put that aside to be mono with you? If so, she must be feeling desperate to play that way! Are you also a Dom, or strictly vanilla? Has adult playtime with you become stale?

How does she feel about being a mom, does she find it overwhelming? Does she just want to get away... have her "me time" with the new sub no matter what, and forget about child, husband, and her other domestic partner? Or can she respectfully negotiate to share time with all 4 of you (husband, gf, child, new guy)?

Poly isn't about just going and scratching your itch with anyone any time you want. It's about LOVE. And love means respect and caring for everyone's feelings and needs.

...I'd love it if she were to come here and tell her side. I suspect she might paint a different picture...

Personally, I wouldn't do poly with a young child or 3 in the house. Kids take so much time and energy, I could barely get it up for my husband, much less spread it around to any others, back when my kids were young. Mine didn't sleep thru the night reliably til about age 5 though... Since I had 3 kids in 5 years, the sex life with hubs was pretty slow until the youngest hit age 5. (That's 15 yrs of little sex, if you do the math!) I was just too tired and distracted. NYCindie recommends a set in stone weekly date, but we had a hard time finding a sitter to watch the kids, and didn't live near family to get them to do it. I didnt like leaving young toddlers with a teen sitter for bedtime, it threw the kids all off. But yeah, you've got a live-in sitter, I don't know why your wife won't take advantage of that!
 
Speaking for myself, I can never have enough sex. Maybe I have lot's of energy, but I'm never too tired.

Do you have a set amount of times a week, in general, you see secondary partners?

Yes, our week goes like this.

Week 1.

Monday.......Nathan (My primary)
Tuesday......Scott (Overnight stay)
Wednesday....Nathan
Thursday.....Scott (I go home to Nathan at 10.30P.M)
Friday.......Nathan
Saturday.....Nathan
1st & 3rd Sunday...Nathan 2nd & 4th...Scott (Overnight stay)

On my Sundays with Scott, I spend the whole day with him, and also bring my Son. We drop him off at Scotts house, and his wife looks after him, and Nathan will pick him up at about 8pm. Scott and I will then spend the night together.

So far it has worked very well, although Scott wants us to meet up on a less regimented basis. What he means by this is, that he wants to keep our arrangement as it is, but also see more of me. He wants to be able to come to our house, and for me to go to his also, when we get the urge. I dont think that this will happen.

If your primary partners are feeling neglected, do you skip a week with your secondary?

I try my hardest to make sure that Nathan never feels neglected, and he has never said that he does. If he was to tell me that he was unhappy with something, I would stop, as he is the most important person in my life.

Do you have less sex with your primary than your secondary, and if so, does that work ok for you?

Probably more with my secondary. Nathan and I will have sex everyday when I'm not due to be with Scott, so that's Mon, Wed, Fri, Sat and every second Sunday. I spend a lot less time with Scott, but spend more of that time having sex. So yeah, probably more with Scott I guess. It works well, I get to have the affectionate loving sex that I have with Nathan, and the more orgasmic sex that Scott gives me. It's great.

Do you think it's acceptable for my wife to actively set time aside to go on dates/have sex with a play partner on a weekly basis, if she is not making time to have dates with us? Like I say, at current, her and I hardly do anything together without our daughter. When my wife goes out, I look after our daughter

Most of the things Nathan and I do together tend to include my Son. We are a family unit and the three of us enjoy this very much. Nathan and I do set time aside to go out by ourselves though, and I love spending time with him, more so than with my secondary. If your wife is not setting aside time for you and your child, I dont think that's fair on the two of you. She needs to find a balance. Nathan and I have worked hard on this, it's not easy sometimes as there is not enough hours in the day. I am also spending time during the day with Scotts wife, and also the four of us get together. Everyone wants it to work, and it does.

Good luck to you and your wife.
 
dingedheart writes:

The problem I had when I was in that situation was ...a) having to mention it... b) the forced dates....or obligatory dates....ok I'm here what do you want to do ... Wait hold that thought I just got a text....reading reading ..giggle giggle...ok what were you saying.

Dinged is correct.

I think scheduled time with spouse is critical. But if the person is not going to be fully PRESENT and share time together in that block, then it is just lip service to the rship. It's fresh to be checking email/phone during a date.

OSOs respect the date time and do not call or text in that time block shy of it being "OMG, in ambulance going to hospital! My leg got chopped off!" level emergencies. Because you'd do same when it's their date time.

There's a basic level of respect and I'm not reading you get that here from wife right now. Is she just caught up in NRE with the new sub? How young is the toddler? 1? 2? Is postpartum depression a possibility? Her "running away from home" being "running away from being mom" and the demands of kids? Is she checking out of her relationships (you and the GF) but not in a hurry about it because then she's got people on the homestead dealing with the kid, income flow, etc?

Because if the person is on the checking out ride, let's just face it head on and not string people along. That's just not honorable.

What the heck is going on here?

Basically got to get together and have the talk. And if she's not wanting to talk... that's telling you something serious. :(

GG
 
Thank you for all the replies so far.

I definitely agree that there are two sides to every story. So I'll try to offer a little of hers.

She had a wild time in her twenties. Slept with about 60 people, friends of boyfriends, boyfriends of friends, was a little self-destructive. She'd been in to BDSM and had a couple of sub boys.

We married and were vanilla and monogamous. I didn't know anything about her BDSM until years into the marriage.

We went through financial difficulties and yes - she experience post-p depression after the birth of our daughter, who is now 3.

When we first became poly two years ago, she went wild. She didn't have sex with anyone, but did the typical things like lots of online partners who she spent all day and night with, an escape from the home life, and kissing random guys in front of me when we went out.

Her GF came along and was a good, calming influence. Her GF seems to teach her that there is a balance between being free and being a considerate poly person.

She definitely has BDSM needs that neither of us can fill. Her GF switches from time to time to help her out. They always have kinky sex, even when neither takes control. My wife won't switch for her. I'm still figuring out what I am.

I have overheard my wife tell her GF that she is the best lover she's ever had. They seem to have amazing sex. However, my wife struggled to come to terms with being bisexual and this sometimes effects their sex life.

It's definitely true that my wife is wanting to break away from the, as she calls it, 11 years of oppressive marriage. I have OCD and have smothered her in the past. I'm in therapy and have made a lot of progress.

She definitely needs to go out, get away from the house, our child, our marriage and feed her BDSM needs. I am no saint - I can be difficult to live with.

Maybe the answer is staring me right in the face. I know her GF feels that my wife might just need BDSM sex, full stop, more. I think that our sex is stale and unfulfilling for my wife and sex between GF and wife is amazing, but wife generally prefers men, craves hetero BDSM sex more. The way she put it was "If there were two people in front of me that I loved, we both had amazing, kinky sex, I'd pick the male one."

Since my wife is only just embarking on having a fully sexual BDSM relationship, none of us know how it's going to pan out.

Her GF says that she wants her to be happy and if it ends up being the case that wife really only wants D/s sex, with a guy, then she will have to accept that reality and see where that leaves us.

Her GF has no problem finding other women, but still wants the majority of her time and sexual encounters to be with my wife.

I don't want to force a square peg into a round hole. But I did want some ideas (which you have all given) as to what is fair for me to ask for and what I might be able to expect.

It seems like the general consensus is that it's more about quality time than sex. So if she dates sub boy once a week, myself and her GF should have equal time. If there's not enough time for three dates a week, she should cut down on sub boy time. Sitting at home watching TV is not quality time.

I'm going to show her this thread, and any replies that come after this. My guess is that she'll still think that it's ok for her to see sub boy once a week, even if we only have dates twice a week. She'll say that because we live together, we get to see each other all the time. Let's see....
 
Sitting at home watching TV is not quality time.
Well, it can be quality, but it certainly is NOT romantic sexy time (unless you're fucking on the couch with the TV on as background).

. . . She'll say that because we live together, we get to see each other all the time.
Yeah, well, that's a crappy defense. Folding the laundry together doesn't count as sexy date time either (unless you get her up on top of the washing machine and...).

My point is any time spent together can be quality time if both people make an effort, but it sounds like she's not into making effort for anyone but herself. Poly goes haywire when someone is just thinking all me-me-me and not putting enough energy into making sure their relationships work for ALL their partners.
 
Well, it can be quality, but it certainly is NOT romantic sexy time (unless you're fucking on the couch with the TV on as background).

Well it depends, Nathan and I spend a lot of time cuddling in front of the T.V, or reading together. This will often lead to sex, but not always. I love that side of our relationship, it is romantic and affectionate and loving, it doesn't always have to be about sex. It's not something I have with my secondary, or any other man I've been with. It's something that I really love sharing with Nathan, I think it means a lot.
 
Since I had 3 kids in 5 years, the sex life with hubs was pretty slow until the youngest hit age 5. (That's 15 yrs of little sex, if you do the math!)

Sorry to nitpick about that, but... If you had three kids in 5 years and it was slow until the youngest hit age 5, surely that would "only" mean 10 years from the birth of the first one to the third one turning five.
 
Sorry to nitpick about that, but... If you had three kids in 5 years and it was slow until the youngest hit age 5, surely that would "only" mean 10 years from the birth of the first one to the third one turning five.

Oops! You're right! I guess it just seemed longer. heh Anyway, once my youngest turned about 4 1/2 my sex drive came raging back. Not just for my husband, but everyone. Seeing cute people on the street did nothing for me while my kids were young, but then all of a sudden, wow.
 
We married and were vanilla and monogamous. I didn't know anything about her BDSM until years into the marriage.

Ohhh, that is unfortunate! Now, here you are, with shared finances, home and child, and suddenly you find out your sexual/sensual drives don't match up. Eek! I feel bad for both of you.

We went through financial difficulties and yes - she experience post-p depression after the birth of our daughter, who is now 3.

Has that abated now?

When we first became poly two years ago, she went wild. She didn't have sex with anyone, but did the typical things like lots of online partners who she spent all day and night with, an escape from the home life, and kissing random guys in front of me when we went out.

Hmm, that doesn't sound like polyAMORY, but just kid in a candy store. They can overlap, but... how did you feel about her kissing these random guys?

Her GF came along and was a good, calming influence. Her GF seems to teach her that there is a balance between being free and being a considerate poly person.

She definitely has BDSM needs that neither of us can fill. Her GF switches from time to time to help her out. They always have kinky sex, even when neither takes control. My wife won't switch for her. I'm still figuring out what I am.

You do have a learning curve in front of you, if you want to keep her and have her interested in sex with you, feel fulfilled and satisfied. It might mean a time of letting her explore her kinky side. However many kinksters can fully enjoy "vanilla" sex. (I like both, as long as it's intense creative vanilla, not just 10 mins of missionary wham bam thank you ma'am.)


It's definitely true that my wife is wanting to break away from the, as she calls it, 11 years of oppressive marriage. I have OCD and have smothered her in the past. I'm in therapy and have made a lot of progress.

She definitely needs to go out, get away from the house, our child, our marriage and feed her BDSM needs. I am no saint - I can be difficult to live with.

OK, good for you for being self aware and getting help with your medical condition. You probably had a high need for reassurance, a temper, and perhaps a suspicious jealous nature? No wonder she's seeking other partners. Do you feel she still wants to be with you for loving reasons, or just as a babysitter so she can go out and cat around?

I know her GF feels that my wife might just need BDSM sex, full stop, more. I think that our sex is stale and unfulfilling for my wife...

This needs work.

It seems like the general consensus is that it's more about quality time than sex. So if she dates sub boy once a week, myself and her GF should have equal time. If there's not enough time for three dates a week, she should cut down on sub boy time.

Well... if you're boring and oppressive, demanding more time with her might be fruitless. You 2 need to find healthier sexier ways to relate. I hope you can!
 
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