Redpepper's journey

We are all sitting here at the cottage, the place that got built this year and was the result of a lot of tears and work between my parents and me. I love it here, but I am ready to go home. My brother is great, but I don't want to spend this much time with him. His girlfriend is a drag and I could do without her at the best of times. My folks are great, but tired after a week of guests and I think they want some space. We had the best time, just the four of us, when everyone was out this afternoon. I think that goes to show where we feel most comfortable, no? I am glad that we are all getting along though. Mono even let me kiss him in front of people. :)
 
It's really weird how oldest/only children seem to do just fine and actually prefer being alone or with adults a lot of the time. My oldest is like that too. My youngest doesn't know what to do with herself if she doesn't have someone to play with. She's always had another child around and doesn't know any different.

We were doing crafts the other day at the children's museum in Seattle. It's facinating to hear about what's going on in their minds. I love the creativity of children. Nothing is impossible to them.
 
Home

What a wonderful place. Now I feel as if I could build a home in the island cottage too. I have to be careful though, I think. I need to be cautious and not invest quite yet. I am still not fully trusting, this time because my brother's girlfriend has her teeth in the place too much. She's so freakin controlling.

Hm. My brother loves her. His role models of women are my mother and me. What does that say? :D Actually, I do everything in my power not to be controlling, to be easy-going and laid back. People tend to delegate the role to me somehow. Where family are concerned, I would rather not take a leadership role. I think a team effort is best.
 
My friend tried to kill herself over the holidays. Our community is coming together to support her. There is much to do and much to think about. If anyone has any thoughts on how to best support her and move her to action with her life, I would appreciate it. She reads my blog and perhaps a word of encouragement would be helpful also. Thanks.
 
My friend tried to kill herself over the holidays. Our community is coming together to support her. There is much to do and much to think about. If anyone has any thoughts on how to best support her and move her to action with her life, I would appreciate it. She reads my blog and perhaps a word of encouragement would be helpful also. Thanks.

My first thought was. "Thank God it was just tried and not accomplished." That may sound cold, but truly it isn't meant that way at all. Since our daughter's best friend did kill herself in May, I know just how devastating that is.

Without knowing for sure what your friend is struggling with, that made her feel that suicide was a better solution for her than life, it's hard to give advice. All the trite little comments are meaningless when you are hurting that much.

I will say that if it helps at all to consider how much it would hurt the rest of those (like you RP) who obviously do care, then she should try to keep that in the forefront of her mind.

Primarily, something is hurting her TOO MUCH. Whatever it is needs to be stopped. So if there is something you or her other loved ones can do to help her stop that pain, that would be critical.

Good luck and HUGS to you all.
 
I will say, if it helps at all to consider how much it would hurt the rest of those (like you RP) who obviously do care, then she should try to keep that in the forefront of her mind.

When I was suicidal, many years ago, this wouldn't have helped at all. I already felt like I was such a huge drain on my family and friends, that they'd be better off without me. Contemplating how much it would hurt them if I left would have just added one more layer of guilt to everything.

I can tell you that as I was recovering, it helped to have fun things to look forward to. One of my friends set aside every Tuesday night to spend with me as a girls' night. We'd watch movies, scrapbook, whatever. It helped to have that to look forward to. Maybe it'd help her to have something set up with people at least once a week? At the beginning, I'd keep it to something that doesn't require a lot of energy output on her part. It'll help to have something to look forward to and it'll help her know that people really do care if she's there or not.

It's one thing for people to say it, it's another when it's being shown in a concrete way, such as making time for her and making plans, instead of just saying "I'm here if you need me" and then not following through. When I was depressed, I wouldn't have taken anyone up on something like that (an open-ended "call me if you need me"), because I would have felt like I was a burden to them. But if they took it upon themselves to say "I'm free Thursday, I'd like to treat you to a movie (or go out to coffee, or anything)", I would have taken them up on that, because they offered something concrete, instead of making all the action depend on me. I hope that helps, at least a little.
 
When I was suicidal, many years ago, this wouldn't have helped at all. I already felt like I was such a huge drain on my family and friends that they'd be better off without me. Contemplating how much it would hurt them if I left would have just added one more layer of guilt to every thing.

I agree. Not to mention what you need is reasons to live for yourself, not for other people. Personally, I started to resent people who said things like that. I thought, life is a horrible experience for me, I want to make it end, and people tell me I have to keep living through that so they don't get sad? Their potential sadness seems so little compared to how I was feeling, I thought these people were extremely selfish to want me to keep suffering just so they wouldn't feel bad.

Advice really depends on the situation, but I think that more than advice, what is needed is support. If she does decide to try and keep going, she's going to need all the support she can get. And it can make all the difference, sometimes a situation is so overwhelming that there doesn't seem to be any other (or better) solution, but when other people are here to help with the load, it makes a difference.
Also, help from people who have experience with that kind of thing would be recommended, as they know best how to help her. You might think you can love her pain away but unfortunately it's not that simple either.

Best wishes for the rest and I hope your friend will feel better soon.
 
I understand that won't work as a long term fix-AND that it doesn't work for everyone.
However, it was exactly what worked for me when I was suicidal as a short term deterent from action.
I focused on how much it would devastate my sister and my daughter and the guilt prodded me to A) not take action against myself & B) to take action to solve the issues that were causing my pain.

BUT-as I said to RP-IF it helps her, she can focus on that. If it doesn't help-then by all means, don't focus on anything that makes it worse.
 
True, different people will react differently... Not to mention each situation is unique. Anything that can help is good.
 
Thanks for all this. I appreciate it. Our friend is at Derby's house as of yesterday and I saw her today. I told her that she is loved and that we are their for her.

It's time to find a reason to live now. I agree, some goals need setting. I am willing to be a pillar for her to lean on while she does that. I will tell her that. I can't do it for her, but can do my best to remind her of the track to a healthy life.

I needed goals when I tried to end my life. Once I decided what they were, there was no stopping me. I changed everything, location, friends, school. It saved me to completely turn myself around and look at the options. I think that might help our friend. I suggested she find other friends today, as the ones she has seem to remind her of her loneliness. They are all in relationships and talk shop constantly. :p

I also asked her to think of what we might be feeling. She kept apologizing to me. I asked her if she were in my position what I would be feeling. She agreed that she also would want to help, would want to give as much love as she could, would want to know what to do and how to support.

It's been a long day, and I can't sleep because of it. Mono has passed out beside me. I spent some time with the rest of the family today, but mostly Mono followed me around and I him. We talked at one point today about our sadness. I asked him for support. He is not able to support people sometimes, but will always support me.

I am able to support others and need support also. It trickles down, doesn't it? We all support one another.

When someone falls out of the that support system, it's then that trouble begins for them, I think. He is my rock, as is PN. PN quietly found out some information when I told him angrily I have no answers to his questions about how to help. I told him to go and find out for himself what can be done, and he did. He has been calm and supportive also, in his own way.

I am so grateful that Derby's husband is home for her right now. Derby is an incredible woman with a HUGE heart and is fearless when it comes to someone in need. I admire her so much. Her strength is lessened when her hubby is away, as she needs him to support her, and be strong so that she can be the amazing caregiver she is. I am not able to do that for her like he does. I suck at it, actually. :eek: I can stand by her and help, but I am not good at being supportive to her. I don't know how to be, I don't think. I fumble somehow. I am trying, but my emotions get in the way. :(

Tomorrow's New Years Eve. Big party at Derby and husband's place. Lots of friends there, and lots of support for our friend. Also the women's group is meeting early this month in order to be extra supportive. I hope my friend is willing to allow others to help. I gave her homework before I left. I will be asking her what her plans are and how she is going to move forward from this.

I was really firm with her today and gave her lots of hugs and love. I am not usually good at that, but I have lost one trans friend already, in the same way. I am not going to sit around and be scared of this.

I visited another friend while away, who almost died the same way. I went there just before I left. She is well enough now and made the change to leave her senior's home and move to the country with her daughter. She is content and happy to die there with family around her. She's 87, so who knows how long that will be? But at least she will be happy when she goes.
 
So much going on for you, RP. I am so sorry! Remember to try and take care of yourself while you are taking care of others.

I know for me, I got suicidal when I felt I was a burden to everyone, and that everyone would be happier without me there messing everything up. I can't say what pulled me out of it, but I know I was tired. I was so tired of fighting. It helped when people spent time with me, by making the plans. I didn't have to try to entertain people who were there to make me feel better. They already had a plan of stuff to do, so off we went. It gave me something to look forward to, that I didn't have to put forth the energy on. That gave me the opportunity to use the energy on repairing the damage and working on myself.
 
My friend finally went back to the hospital after a couple of days at Derby's house. She admitted that if she were at home she would've tried again, so Derby took her in. Derby came over afterwards to have a glass of wine and debrief. I drove her home, where she was to be the host of the New Years party she was having. Crazy fun night :D

Today my friend was sent home! Alarming and no one is quite sure what to do with that. Sigh...:(

My ex-wife has been here all week. I took LB to visit her parents yesterday, to have tea with them. I have known them for almost 20 years and they were never comfortable with me. Yesterday I think we reached a turning point. They could see how important LB's Auntie is to him and me. I made a point of telling them that she is family to us and therefore, so are they. They looked confused, but accepting. They aren't used to people being as honest and open as I am. :D But they didn't hate me for it as they did in the past. They just looked resigned.

I was particularly honoured that I received a book from my ex's father. He was so mean to me and treated his daughter poorly also, throughout his life. I could see he was trying and made an attempt to meet him halfway by telling him I was honoured. It was a moving visit all around and continued to deepen the bond our families have with one another, in terms of my ex and all of us.
 
My friend finally went back to the hospital after a couple of days at Derby's house. She admitted that if she were at home she would've tried again, so Derby took her in. Today my friend was sent home! Alarming and no one is quite sure what to do with that. Sigh...:(

That constantly happens with my daughter. It's incredibly frustrating and scary.
 
I shouldn't wait so long to catch up, I tell ya. Seems like you hit a mild snafu coming into Christmas but you recovered, like the Goddess you are.

I'm glad that there has been, seemingly, very cut and dried clarity between you and Leo and his relationship with his wife. It seems that you are in a good place with it.

As far as your suicidal friend, as mentioned before, it's really a case-by-case analysis. We don't know her or the circumstances that drove her to the attempt. So you would have the best insight about how to approach her in an attempt to offer support.

It is really a Catch 22. In my experience, you consider suicide because you don't want to be a burden to others and/or hurt them. On the other hand, you hesitate in committing suicide for the same reasons. So, you can say it can be viewed as selfish and selfless all at the same time.

The most important aspect of it all is this, though, only the suicidal person knows what is affecting them; the suicidal person is the one who has to live that life and endure those challenges. So no amount of 'forced consideration' is going to relieve them of that. That is something that more people on the outside looking in should consider, as they ask a suicidal person to stay or consider everyone else around them.

I mean, at that point in that person's life, there is something of substance missing in those relationships. We have to help them find that substance in whatever way best works for that individual. I've had three suicide attempts and my mother would always comment on how I should consider how she would feel if someone called her to tell her I had killed myself. Coming across to a suicidal person, I viewed that as selfishness which, really, made my desire to die even stronger because it would alleviate that emotional burden permanently and she'd never again have to sit up and worry about me and my well-being.

So, as I said, it is a unique situation for each individual. Really knowing that person helps point you in better direction regarding recovery. I have had several close people in my life commit suicide, and no matter what I attempted to do, I always felt helpless. Ultimately, I wish your friend all the best.

Your statement about kids being a little slice of heaven and hell is so accurate. I persevere everyday for my children, even though, my now 17 year old son is pushing me closer and closer to the edge quarterly. Alas, I couldn't see myself without their spirits in my life in the same capacity.

My daughter is a preteen and is being raised between me and her dad's family, so we're preparing ourselves.

I've discovered so many amazing things about myself throughout the 18 years of motherhood with my own children and children of my partners and/or family members whom I have raised at various intervals. It's also allowed me to live vicariously through their childhoods, since mine was a bit mature and traumatic. Now that my kids are older kids, I find myself desiring that connection with younger children, so much so, that I am currently seeking volunteer opportunities with children (hospital, orphan, or shelter).

I am glad that you have been surrounded by love, RP, and have been able to openly express yourselves to those inside and outside of your circle.

May the new year bring you much more happiness, growth, and love. *hugs*
 
Many hugs to you and your friend. I hope she pulls out of this downward spiral & becomes a whole new better and improved friend!

If your friend is reading this: may your life do a complete 180. May you find comfort and support at every turn. May you find love and happiness, from others and in yourself, in this brand new year. Many hugs going out to you. Lots of healing thoughts and energy are coming your way.
 
There is so much going on right now, it's hard to get here to update.

My friend is okay, I think. I texted her just now and she hasn't answered. That isn't unusual, though. We had a lovely women's meeting, 17 women. She got a lot of support. There was a lot of complaining about the system and how it doesn't work that kind of made me feel like I was at work, but I suppose people have to vent. I just kind of block it out now and find the root of what can be done. I don't think there was much interest in that though, so I have backed away and will check on things every now and then. Other people have stepped in that want to listen and be there, so I don't feel I am needed so much and so intensely.

Leo and I are struggling. He and his wife are doing well.

(My partners and I are doing well, as a result of some work around communicating and setting boundaries around that and other things. But there is lots left to do.)

He and his wife communicate differently than I do. That is where the struggle is. I think it's important that everyone be involved when there is a love interest of any kind between two people that have other partners. I think that it works better, and have experienced it. It just seems to work better to talk to everyone and be sure that everyone has had the space to talk, even if they don't want to/need to. Leo and his wife do not think this way. Then again, they haven't had an experience that has led them to think differently, because they have been hanging out with swingers.

They think that they should talk together and then, if something comes up, Leo will let me know. I don't need to talk to his wife and furthermore, he would prefer (or she would prefer, not sure which), that I don't. It makes him feel uncomfortable that I am uncomfortable and he wonders if I trust him. I do trust him, but that isn't the point. I don't trust her because I haven't heard from her, even when I've reached out and sent an email. I know she has been jealous. I know that she has struggled with me at times in the last two years. I would like to think that she would be open to working on that, but she isn't interested, or scared, or, I don't know what, because she doesn't want/feel the need to talk about it.

I think it is going to keep me at a distance from him, actually. He told me that he tells his wife everything we say and do and that makes me uncomfortable also. I like some element of privacy in my relationships. I don't think our relationship is her business, at least not every detail.

I tell him some really private stuff about myself and I don't want it repeated. I have noticed that when I see him again after talking to him about things that are private, that he has formed an opinion and pushes me in such a way that suggests that he has talked about it, I suspect with his wife. I know how his mind works enough to know that what he says later might not have entirely come from him alone. Does that make sense?

It just seems that he is very new to all this. I tried to explain last night that in poly it isn't about a couple that goes out and does poly. It's about people going out and doing poly. They may have partners that mean more, or that they rely on more for specific reasons. But "the person" is an individual. He has been used to swinging, where it is couple-centric and everything comes from that and returns to that. I am asking for something entirely different. I really don't think he gets that or understands it.

Part of me wonders if he thinks it's worth it, if we aren't going to be so close that sex is involved. I wonder that too. No doubt everyone else does also. I am so unsure where the lines are, because every relationship I have had like this has ended up being bonded with sex. I feel that bond for him, but without sex it almost feels like the commitment to it isn't there. I can't commit to the longevity of it.

I am curious to see what happens next, but I am rather frightened. I am getting in deep with him in a connected way and really fear being hurt. He says that he loves to be with me, loves everything about me and the sex doesn't matter. He is in it for the long haul. That is who he is. So is this something I trust blindly? That is a lot of trust for a woman that is used to being in control and dominating that relationship dynamic to a certain extent. He is asking that I submit to him, I think. At least, it feels very submissive. I am uncomfortably curious about that, at this point.

I don't know if my heart could stand to be broken again, after so many times I have trusted and made myself vulnerable. But what else can I do? I don't live a life that keeps me sheltered from things like this. I never have. I will severely regret it if I don't allow myself to just trust and keep positive.
 
RP, what about giving Leo and his wife that space for a time? The couple-centric part might be what they need to reach comfort together. Their pace has been dual for so long. Breaking that could really hurt one or the other. The couple part is a common ground to work up from, not necessarily the end goal. How many poly people started as couples and worked their way to independence? :)

I don't know how long you have given, so this may be moot.

The intimate discretion is something that can be fixed, I believe, regardless of their couple-centricness. This shouldn't be tied, imo. Privacy in a relationship is important. :)
 
The intimate discretion is something that can be fixed, I believe, regardless of their couple-centricness. This shouldn't be tied, imo. Privacy in a relationship is important :)

This is what I was going to say, too. It should be up to you who gets to share in your life and how much. I think you have every right to ask for what you share to be kept between the two of you. She doesn't have the right to know anything that you're not willing to share with her yourself. It also seems one-sided that she gets all this blow-by-blow info about you, and on the other hand, doesn't want to open up to you at all.
 
Very good point, Derby. I will mention that to him. Although he tells me lots about her, so it is kind of even.

Thanks, Ari. Derby mentioned that yesterday and I think it's an awesome idea. I had already backed away, but sometimes just someone suggesting that makes me realize that I'm doing it and that is the best bet.

Thanks! I appreciate the input. I have been really stumped.
 
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