The Struggling Mono Thread

Hey tonkpaws…I know that's not the outcome you wanted deep down, but in the long run, I think this is the right decision. Your partner has been honest with you about what she has to offer, and I think it was great that you spoke up clearly about what you need too. I think you need to keep honestly looking inwards at what you need and want as you make this transition to either f-w-b or straight up friend. It seems to me like it would be very difficult, if not impossible, for a monogamous person to ever really be content in a poly relationship if they are not primary/co-primary. This is a total generalisation, but unless you've got a whole lot of non-sexual/relationship stuff happening in your life (intense career, close familial connections, serious hobby pursuits, etc.,), or have one of those fiercely independent personality types where you actively enjoy a lot of time on your own, you will often feel as you have done: frustrated that you don't get to see more of your partner, lonely at times, confused about how you see your future with that person developing.

Be careful that your love and affection for this woman doesn't blind you to, or cut you off from meeting others who are potentially more compatible for you relationship-wise. I know a lot of mono folk do enjoy f-w-b arrangements, but they are typically transitory affairs, whereas poly folk like your partner may have in mind something more long-lasting. Be sure not to give her false hope that this is what you want long-term, and be sure not to settle for a f-w-b that is just going to prolong your feelings for this woman. The mono-heart processes love one at a time. If hanging onto love for her cuts you off from having love with another, I'd say you are better off letting this transition to a friendship, as painful and unappealing as that might seem to you now. Think it over, and try to see the bigger picture. What are your goals, relationship-wise in life? What will make you happiest? If this (f-w-b) is compatible with that and not interfering with your long-term happiness, then embrace it. If it's not, then be honest and communicate with her about that. It sounds like she wants the best for you, and understands that sometimes it's better to let things go.
 
. . . we came to the conclusion of being friends with benefits. I think this will ease the pressure of a relationship for her while easing my anxiety about things.

I think this sounds like a good solution. She will not feel pressured and you can let go of expectations and just enjoy it for what it is. Placing expectations on people who are unable to meet them or who crack under pressure really is the best way to fuck up a relationship, so I think you two reached a good compromise.
 
tonkspaws:

I'm glad you guys are communicating and "calibrating" better. What you need, what she can provide, what kind of relationship is possible, forming realistic expectations, boundaries, etc.

Once you guys finish ironing that out I think you can both relax and enjoy what you have. Gaining clarity is a good thing.

Galagirl
 
My belated input ...

Re (from monomom):
"I've asked if I could just be left out of it, he does whatever he wants when he's on the road and just not involve me in it, and apparently that's 'DADT' and *not* acceptable in poly circles."

Some polyamorists forbid DADT, but not all. I personally consider it to be something that doesn't work in most cases, but does work in some cases. You don't have to be most cases. You can decide your own personal boundaries and what works for you.

Re (from monomom):
"I know poly is supposed to be one big happy family, everybody likes everybody and gets along, but I still want nothing to do with my husband's lovers if we get there. I don't want to know or interact with them or know what they do together. When I talk about 'poly ways,' this is one of my needs that I know is pretty much against poly policy."

Some polyamorists think that there is a poly policy, but not all. I personally don't think poly needs to be one big happy family. I don't think everybody needs to like everybody, nor get along (beyond being courteous). There's no rule in my book that says you have to have anything to do with your husband's lovers. You don't need to know or interact with them or know what they do together.

Re:
"How can I protect myself and set boundaries around my relationship with my husband while allowing him to do whatever when most poly people won't engage in a DADT situation?"

You just do it. You don't obligate yourself to follow the rules that any polyamorist (even guru Franklin Veaux) prescribes. You follow your own rules. Other people may complain, but they're not the ones who have to live your life.

Re (from monomom):
"So should I go [on the 'double date']?"

Yes -- if (and only if) you think you can stand it.

"What the hell am I supposed to chat with them about over dinner?"

Nothing, unless something springs to your mind. Heck, why can't they start the conversation topics?

"And how do you handle a meal with your spouse and someone he's confessed to having romantic and sexual feelings for without going batcrap crazy?"

Valium? I don't know. You handle it one bite at a time. Don't work yourself up into a panic over the whole thing all at once. And don't expect yourself to feel great. It's not a great situation.

Final note: It is my impression that polyamory is ruining your life, or at least ruining the perfectly good marriage that you had. I hope you are able to find words (actions?) that will convince your husband to recommit himself to monogamy and to you, and to forget about this poly fantasy of his. I don't know what those words are, and I don't know what to advise if he remains unconvinced no matter what. I'm sure you are perfectly well aware of what your options would be. :(
 
Well, I declined the dinner date. I'm not ready for that as I swing between deep sadness and sobbing and extreme rage and anger. I'm not sure, short of thorazine, how I can maintain a "normal" happy facade.

We're in therapy and not being greatly successful. Neither one of us understands the other's feelings and needs and it's incredibly frustrating to go from what we had to this mess. I can't get him to understand why I'm not deliriously happy at the prospect of watching his joy and excitement in becoming involved with a woman who isn't me. He can't understand all of the things I "feel/think" I'm losing, and I can't understand why he can't acknowledge the loss is real. I understand this is something he's probably felt and suppressed our entire marriage, lied about; and I have no doubt that he'd be much happier with other women than he's ever been with me. It hurts to my core, but I can't deny it's the truth. And he can't understand why I can't just accept this like a job change or moving to a new town, as just a different aspect of our life changing, and fall happily in line.

We did hire an executive assistant, she's smart and a wonderfully calm problem solver. She's also happily married and absolutely not interested in extramarital activities. I know it's probably petty of me, but I needed that reassurance. I was giving up something that's been my baby for a long time, something that in personally involved with my husband, and it felt like I was walking away from a part of who we are together. When I made his travel and lodging reservations, I wasn't making them for "Mr. A", I was making them for the man I love with attention to his comfort and enjoyment. It was my way of "taking care of him long distance." Now someone else is doing it, and it feels like a loss. The Accounts Payable/Receivable aren't missed at all. I have enjoyed the extra time and have learned some things about myself: I hate spas and massages and facials, and I have a certain talent for archery.

I'm working on personal things like open communication (not holding everything in anymore) and seeing myself as a desirable woman and partner (finding out the man you love wants other women is brutal to self-esteem and confidence). I'm also working on trusting him again. Right now, every compliment or kind gesture feels wrong, like he's doing it because he thinks he should, not because he wants to. Every "I love you" is suspect. I shut down so much, and shut him out, opening back up is terrifying. We haven't had sex in weeks, I just can't get there and I know it's driving him further away. If I believe him again, he'll just end up hurting me again. I really don't feel like he loves me, but he loves what I do and doesn't want to lose that, so he'll do/say whatever it takes to keep it. This is a huge argument between us because he feels I should take him at his word. I'm his solid ground, his "Old Reliable", which is extremely unromantic and unsatisfying. I guess I feel undesirable as a woman to him. He really doesn't understand why I feel disrespected and discarded, and I'm running out of ways to explain it. It really does feel like we're complete strangers from different planets and no common language. And that hurts. I know he's hurting, too, and if I could wave a wand and change how I feel and what I need, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

So more counseling, and I guess continuing pain.
 
Hello Everyone,

I'm new here, and before I ask any questions I wanted to make sure I'm in the right place. I'm monogamous and in a relationship with a poly male. We're long distance. Am I in the right place to ask for help?

Thank you,
MorningStar
 
You sure are. Ask away. :)
 
I will cut to the chase. I am monogamous. My mate is poly, his other girl is monogamous. I feel as if I'm at an impasse. She is not accepting of me and has caused a variety of problems. He is working on what he sees are issues but the fact is, she exudes a lot of negativity. I have reached out a few times to bridge the gap. So far it hasn't borne any fruit.

There is a mountain of issues, but he and I have been working on these things. It's slow going but it's going.

What might seem black and white to you is pretty foggy to me. I care for him and he cares for me and wants me in his life permanently. I'm also only two years into this lifestyle and I'm still very vanilla. I never expected to fall for a poly male but you can't help who you love.

I accepted her from the beginning, when he and I were just friends, but she has never accepted me. I don't want to live a life of stress or having to watch my back. He claims she 'isn't' who she has shown herself to be to me. Clearly, she is exactly who she has shown herself to be. I do understand her jealousy and fears. I never expected myself to be in this place either - sharing a man - but she went into it knowing he was poly. Yet, she formed a monogamous picture in her mind and when he made clear to her that he was serious about me she had a meltdown.

I'm an empath and go back and forth between, 'she has been in this lifestyle for over a decade. she accepted he was poly and should know better' and then the other side of 'I feel so bad as if this is my fault and if I leave it will heal the hurt', because I really don't want anyone to hurt and that includes me.

SO, I'm here to educate myself and hope that you will all be as kind as possible. I'm serious about learning how to navigate my way through this dilemma. I believe in leaving no stone unturned - that way, if it doesn't work out, I can walk away knowing I did everything in my power.

I'm all ears. :)

Thank you
~m
 
@Morningstar,

I know you don't want to hurt anyone. But this isn't your problem. It's your partner's problem. I know it 'bleeds' into your relationship - that can be unavoidable to a degree. But you can't fix this problem and you didn't cause it (no, really - it would have been some other woman that your metamour would have reacted to if you had not been in the picture). You going away won't solve anything. She will just another similar reaction to the next person he dates.

But you do have every right to decide not to stay in a relationship where you don't feel safe, where it is too drama-ridden or just too stressful for you. If you are actually scared of her and fearful for your safety, get out now. Don't wait around. No one should put up with that.

You can ask your partner what he can do to keep the drama in his other relationship from affecting yours. This is a reasonable thing to ask for at this point. They can go figure out their stuff while not dragging you into it. I realize as an empath this is hard for you. You feel their pain and want to fix it. You can't. The best you can do if you stay in the relationship is to make some boundaries that their business is their business and your relationship is your relationship.

You also have every right to set a time frame for how long you are willing to deal with this situation, particularly if they are incapable of keeping it to themselves. A year? Two years? Five? That is up to you. But don't set it at 'forever'. That's just setting yourself up for pain and disappointment.
 
Hi MorningStar,

I am thinking that you and your mate's other girl should have as little contact with each other as possible. If you are living in the same domicile as her, I would move out as soon as possible. She is determined to be your enemy and any time you spend around her can only make things worse.

I take it you don't object to polyamory itself, it's your mate's other girl that's making things difficult?

@ monomom ... it's good to hear from you again, I'm sorry it couldn't be under better circumstances. In reading your latest post, I sensed a lot of bitterness, anger, and pain. Poly has turned your husband into a stranger who you can barely stand to be around, even though he was only ever all you wanted in your life. How many counseling sessions have you had so far, and what has your counselor had to say?

I suppose that to justify the existence of a poly community, I ought to have some answers for you as far as how to fix the situation. I tell you, I know for a fact that polyamory does not help everyone. I have heard stories where it nearly or completely wrecked people's lives.

I hope you'll keep us updated, and maybe there'll be some good news eventually.
 
@opalescent,

Thank you for your input. I never looked at it the way you mentioned, that it was my partner's problem. I think because I'm a troubleshooter, I automatically thought it was up to me to bridge gaps.

She isn't new to sharing him. He had someone else in his life when I met him 2.5 years ago. The other female treated the person he's with now poorly. She's doing the same thing to me that was done to her. I would have thought understanding would be in place. I have made a lot of changes in my life to accommodate everyone. My growth has been fast while theirs slow and I'm just very tired. I know it sounds selfish. I don't mind doing the work, I just don't want to be the only one doing so.

Thank you again.

@kdt26417, It's kind of sad - don't you think - that it would come down to she and I have as little contact as possible. I had envisioned 'family' and growing together. I'm not idealistic. My first experience was during our first 3 way talk and introduction. Prior to this I was given high expectations of who she is by him and I believed it until she burned me right after our first meeting. I didn't know for 2 weeks that what I thought was the beginning of a harmonious family was her faking her friendliness. That started a downward spiral.

I am not poly. I 'did' object to his way of living in the beginning. Look where I'm at now. :) Love does strange things. I accepted her from the beginning when he and I were just friends.

Thank you as well for your comments.
 
No problem, I hope it helps.

Re:
"It's kind of sad -- don't you think -- that it would come down to she and I have as little contact as possible."

Yes, it is. :(
 
Well, I declined the dinner date. I'm not ready for that as I swing between deep sadness and sobbing and extreme rage and anger. I'm not sure, short of thorazine, how I can maintain a "normal" happy facade.

Good - no sense in putting yourself through something you know you're not ready for.

We're in therapy and not being greatly successful. Neither one of us understands the other's feelings and needs and it's incredibly frustrating to go from what we had to this mess. I can't get him to understand why I'm not deliriously happy at the prospect of watching his joy and excitement in becoming involved with a woman who isn't me. He can't understand all of the things I "feel/think" I'm losing, and I can't understand why he can't acknowledge the loss is real. I understand this is something he's probably felt and suppressed our entire marriage, lied about; and I have no doubt that he'd be much happier with other women than he's ever been with me. It hurts to my core, but I can't deny it's the truth. And he can't understand why I can't just accept this like a job change or moving to a new town, as just a different aspect of our life changing, and fall happily in line.

It *is* tough to understand each other when you're coming from vastly different places. I wouldn't want to move in a direction counter to the therapist, but maybe it's okay to back off on the understanding (for now), and just work on accepting that you each feel the way you do, and how do you move forward from there?

Being understood is huge, but being stuck in the mud while you try to *gain* that understanding isn't helpful, either.

Good on you, BTW, for hiring the executive assistant. I know it's a change, and there are definitely things you'll miss, but the stress isn't one of them. And archery is badass. :)

I'm working on personal things like open communication (not holding everything in anymore) and seeing myself as a desirable woman and partner (finding out the man you love wants other women is brutal to self-esteem and confidence).

This will be huge, and I'm glad you're doing it.

I'm also working on trusting him again. Right now, every compliment or kind gesture feels wrong, like he's doing it because he thinks he should, not because he wants to. [...] I really don't feel like he loves me, but he loves what I do and doesn't want to lose that, so he'll do/say whatever it takes to keep it. This is a huge argument between us because he feels I should take him at his word.

Your trust has been injured. You *need* more than his word at this point.

While, at some point, you can't fix broken trust without beginning to trust again (and making yourself vulnerable), getting through that gate without some reassurance is nigh-impossible. Although he's upset, so are you - is he willing to compromise like you are, in the hopes of fixing your relationship?

Continuing to hope for the best.
 
Welcome, MorningStar :)

I never expected to fall for a poly male but you can't help who you love.

Sing it, sistah! ;)
I'm over three years into my relationship with Chops, and I still have my moments (some of them still big), but it's chugging along nicely. It can be done! :)

I accepted her from the beginning, when he and I were just friends, but she has never accepted me. I don't want to live a life of stress or having to watch my back. He claims she 'isn't' who she has shown herself to be to me. Clearly, she is exactly who she has shown herself to be.

This. 100% correct, but also 100% a realization that *he* will have to come to. If you're being mistreated, his putting his head in the sand is simply enabling that treatment, and that action (or inaction) is on him.

SO, I'm here to educate myself and hope that you will all be as kind as possible. I'm serious about learning how to navigate my way through this dilemma. I believe in leaving no stone unturned - that way, if it doesn't work out, I can walk away knowing I did everything in my power.

Great attitude. I'm sorry you're going through this, and I hope your partner is able to see the reality of the situation. And welcome to the crazy train! Free engineer caps and wooden train whistles! ;)
 
She isn't new to sharing him. He had someone else in his life when I met him 2.5 years ago. The other female treated the person he's with now poorly. [...] It's kind of sad - don't you think - that it would come down to she and I have as little contact as possible. I had envisioned 'family' and growing together. I'm not idealistic. My first experience was during our first 3 way talk and introduction. Prior to this I was given high expectations of who she is by him and I believed it until she burned me right after our first meeting.

I wonder, then, if this is a defense mechanism based on how she was treated before. It doesn't excuse her treatment of you, of course, but it may mean that she needs the separation in order to see, over time, that you're NOT the same type of person his previous partner was. Maybe time and experience, or extra reassurance will help her break out of this a bit?

Again, it doesn't justify her treatment of you, but maybe it would help her to have some reassurance somehow... is this something that your partner can help her with?
 
I'll come on out and deliver yours personally. It'll be a nice break from the snow!

TOOT TOOT!
:D
 
My struggle isn't with my relationship with Julian; it's with my friends and family who don't understand. Everyone seems to want to know what Julian and I are working towards, like our relationship needs to have some ultimate goal. Almost all of my close friends think that I should want Julian and Maya to break up, and to have Julian to myself. I keep trying to explain that I don't want that, and that I went into this relationship (with a married man, after all) presuming that I would never "have him to myself." This morning I took a walk with my friend at work and she wanted to know when I intend to give Julian an ultimatum about making a choice between Maya and me. She implied that I am dragging it out too long and I will regret staying with him if he can't be all mine.

I am not very articulate, I guess. I can't seem to explain that there is no goal. I suppose that all those years I was with my ex, people kept expecting us to get engaged? I don't know why other people are so sure that their model of happiness is also mine.
 
I am not very articulate, I guess. I can't seem to explain that there is no goal.

Time to work on being more "articulate" and respond immediately to your friends comments, like:

  • "I LIKE the relationship dynamic as it is! Stop trying to get me to change things to suite your fantasies, they aren't mine."
  • "I would be saddened and horrified if he and his wife broke up! Why in the world would I even consider giving him an ultimatum."

Be clear and very direct. Not sure if your friends are misreading your lack of response to their comments as agreeing with them or are you complaining about things to them, leading them to jump to certain conclusions. The next time someone says something of the kind, ask what you have said or done to make them believe that's what your really want.
 
MorningStar,
you're actually a veteran in all of this compared to me. I'm mono, 21-year spouse to a man who just confessed he's had these feelings the entire time and just didn't know it was an option. So really, our situations are apples and oranges, but maybe my perspective might give some insight.

First, you said your partner had another girlfriend before you and your metamour (look at me with the jargon!) should know what to expect and how to behave. Was that her first and only before you that burned her? Or were there others before that? I'm looking at this from a perspective of terror. What kind of woman would want a married man? (Yeah, I know polyamory is different and doesn't see marriage and commitment the same way monogamists do, I'm working on it). But if her first and only experience sucked, I'd be amazed if she wasn't a little batcrap crazy when it comes to a new metamour.

Second, how did that first relationship end? Did your partner defend and protect her or was she on her own to defend herself against a negative lover? In addition to the damage done by an attack by your lover's other, there may be damage to her trust in him to keep her safe. I know, poly folk are responsible for managing their own relationships and blah blah blah, but if you're going to bring someone into my world and demand I treat her like gold but you let her crap all over me without defending me? There's a serious problem. Is he calling her on it? Doing anything to defend you? Did he defend her? Or is he a strictly "hands off" partner?

Third, and this made my eye twitch. "...that it would come down to she and I have as little contact as possible. I had envisioned 'family' and growing together." I'm having a hard enough time envisioning sharing my husband's heart, body and limited free time without seriously freaking out, not even there yet, may never get there. BUT, the only way I could conceivably do it would be with as limited contact with his other partners as possible. I'm sorry, but those are the boundaries I need. And the thought of another woman moving into my home is a huge deal breaker. Territorial? Yes. Immature? Probably. But this has been OUR home for 18 years. I have blood, sweat and tears invested in the restoration and renovations. I've poured my heart and soul into making it our home and sanctuary. I also have a bit of OCD that makes more than casual guests in my house uncomfortable for me. NOBODY goes in my kitchen. Could you live with a less involved relationship? Focus on what you want to build with your boyfriend and leave his other partner alone? Someone who respected those boundaries would start to earn my trust. Someone who trampled them would raise my defenses. Do you know and respect her boundaries? Or are you just focused on the "family life" you want?

I'm sorry if this doesn't help, but I thought maybe some perspective from a reluctant spouse might shed some light on her behavior. Good luck.
 
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