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  #11  
Old 09-25-2015, 04:02 AM
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vinsanity0 vinsanity0 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starlight1 View Post
At the end of the day we're talking about adults, and yes the husband is male and may be less able to deal with emotions but women aren't designed to fix men's emotions.
lolwut?
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  #12  
Old 09-25-2015, 05:38 AM
Inyourendo Inyourendo is offline
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I think what she meant is that society expects men to be stoic and not allowed to have emotions whereas it's expected that women will be emotional. Not always but a lot of men just don't have the practice that women have when it comes to working through things. . Men are also seen as weak if they share their female partners so there could be a little machismo in play here.
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  #13  
Old 09-25-2015, 08:10 AM
sweetersong sweetersong is offline
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Have you guys read "more than two"? It is brilliant, and if he is willing, I would recommend you and your husband read it together, I have also heard great things of The Jealousy Workbook, but not looked at that myself.
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  #14  
Old 09-25-2015, 04:30 PM
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To give in and accept a stereotype about what men are or are not capable of only reinforces that stereotype and leaves no room for growth. I would have no interest in doing that because it is disrespectful and does not honor the man as a fully-rounded human being with enormous potential.

I don't want a man putting me in a box labeled "Equipped for emotions with no ability for logic," so why would I willingly set a man in a box labeled "Unable to handle emotions?" That is just silly and ridiculous.

Of course, we ALL have been programmed by society to focus on and develop certain areas of our inner life, according to stupid beliefs about what men and women are supposed to be about, but to play into them only makes those stereotypes right, creates imbalance, and neglects the larger part of a human psyche.

Husband feels upset over girlfriend breaking up with him, thinks forcing his wife set aside her other relationship will make the upset go away, but it will only stunt his growth as a person not to feel his feelings of loss, grief, rejection, confusion, anger, unfairness, sadness, and so on, not to mention how it dismisses the boyfriend as entirely unimportant. Bending to his demand helps no one.

Would love to see an update from the OP!
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Last edited by nycindie; 09-25-2015 at 04:32 PM.
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  #15  
Old 09-26-2015, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camembert View Post

Before my husband and I married ten years ago, we discussed the possibility of becoming non-monogamous. We both came from broken homes where our parents’ marriages ended because of affairs and betrayal, and we thought our marriage could be strengthened by being open to other partners and honest about our needs.
Marriages can be strengthened by being open, but it's not all wine and roses. Did neither of you ever consider that, in beginning another relationship, there was a chance it would only last X number of months or years? Surely you both experienced breakups before you met each other. It's naive to not see that as a possibility. Some friendships, some love relationships, are not meant to last forever. People come into your lives, you enjoy them, you learn from them, and sometimes you, or they, move on! Fact of life. Yes, loss hurts, but the pain doesn't last forever. Nor should it! Heartbreak can make one so depressed it feels like the pain will last forever. But it doesn't! We heal. We are resilient.

Quote:
Four months ago, we embarked on polyamorous relationships. We began sleeping with another couple who were married but separated. At the start, the rule was “no falling in love...”
Another mistake. We can't make rules about "falling in love," or avoiding "new relationship energy." It is emotional and chemical. We can only control our behaviors in response to our feelings.

Quote:
...but my husband very quickly fell in love with his new partner, and it seemed like she did with him. She was still smarting from the breakup of her marriage though, and very erratic in her behavior.

Meanwhile, I’ve steadily been pursuing an affectionate, erotic affair with my lover...
After a few months, things got very intense—there was talk of blending the two families...

Then my husband’s girlfriend bailed. Very suddenly, she just announced this wasn’t what she wanted and left. I think she was spooked by the intense intimacy, so soon after leaving her husband.
Another not so great idea was each of you dating a member of a couple that had just split. Both are in rebound mode. And why would they even want to consider living as a foursome, when they couldn't even make it as a duo? They were just carried away, as you two are, by happy lustful endorphins and infatuation.

Quote:
He’s been devastated for nearly a month now, and it’s been awful. His immediate reaction to the breakup was to insist that I not see my partner anymore, because it was “killing him,” and “making him crazy.” He wants to close our marriage and go back to monogamy. Not only that, he can’t sleep, he dry heaves, he rages at me for “ruining our marriage,” and so on.
He is grieving. That is normal for a breakup. In the future, once he recovers, he may be able to handle a breakup better. Live and learn. But you are not ruining the marriage. He is blame shifting. He (and you, for that matter) chose to date a woman in rebound mode, while his wife dated her ex husband! Of course that would/could feel weird and sticky all around.
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I do not want to break up with my boyfriend.
Of course not. But remember, your h is in a very bad place. I went through an extremely bad breakup last year (although we had been together 2 1/2 years, not just a mere 4 months), and it took me a good 6 months to recover. But my gf dating others, or not, had no bearing on my recovery. That is totally separate thing. She was extremely supportive of me as I healed though. And she wasn't seeing other loves several days a week. She was there for me. I could see you getting out to see your bf once a week at least! You could limit the meetings for a while, since your h is in a crisis. But just because your h broke up DOES NOT mean you need to! That doesn't even make sense! Misery loves company? How would it help for you BOTH to be missing your OSOs and grieving? Your bf can give you a break from the sadness and therefore more strength to go home and support you h in his grief. He must be made to understand the way he is bargaining here, grasping at straws to avoid doing the work of coping and healing from his loss.

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On the other hand, I don’t want to live with someone who flies into a rage at me on a regular basis, or tells me I’m killing him with my behavior. I don’t want to “kill him”—the thought of hurting him makes me very sad. But I’m not doing anything that we haven’t already negotiated—the only difference is that now he doesn’t have a girlfriend.
Nope, he is reneging on your agreement. Poly isn't "fair." In a couple, there is never ever ever a guarantee you will both have perfect OSOs. Sometimes you will both be happy, sometimes you will both be struggling, sometimes you might have 3 lovers and he has none, or vice versa. It's all part of the game.

I'd let my h vent about his sadness, but walk away if he starts to blame shift. You don't deserve to be treated that way. If he is being emotionally abusive and seeming out of control depressed, he should see a counselor. Talking it through with a 3rd party, and perhaps an antidepressant medication for a while, might calm him down enough to do the healing work.

He is treating you as if you are cheating on him, and the only thing to do is give up your lover, or end the marriage with him (like your parents' marriages both ended). There are better solutions!
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Mags (poly, F, 63)
Pixi (poly, F, 41) my nesting partner since January 2009
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  #16  
Old 09-26-2015, 01:06 PM
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Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savant View Post
With respect, the husband has had a month to attempt to 'work through his feelings' and it's gotten them nowhere. If he had the emotional capacity to deal with his feelings, he would have done so already.
I couldn't disagree more!! It can take a helluva a lot longer than a mere month to recover from a breakup, especially if you are new to poly. One month is nothing. It can take several months, to even a year or more, to get over a bad and sudden, unexpected breakup. The husband was naive, and he was blindsided. He needs to move through all the stages of grief, just as if there were a death. And we all do that at our own pace, and in our own fashion.

Quote:
Men are expected to be emotional rocks, and when they break down, they often don't have the emotional intelligence to process what they are feeling....

It would be different if the couple negotiated an open marriage and the husband did NOT get a girlfriend, but the wife did. If he was acting that way in this scenario, I would agree with you, since his actions would be solely driven by jealously. But that's not the case here.

You can't treat a burn while a person is still on fire, and you can't put out the fire if you keep pouring gas on it. The boyfriend is gas. If the fire is put out, then it's not a problem to have gas around. But the fire has to be put out first.

After a month it's clear that maintaining the status quo isn't going to work here.

There are two likely options. She can change nothing in regard to her relationship with her boyfriend, and 'hope' the husband somehow gets over it. Since it's been a month already, that's unlikely to happen. If nothing changes the marriage will continue to degrade. Sooner or later they will have to end the marriage, since things will have become too toxic.
Again, I disagree. And we don't even know how often Camembert is meeting with, or talking with, her bf. Is it every day? Once meeting a week? Constant texting because of NRE, while her husband writhes in agony? We don't know.

Quote:
]The second option is to remove the 'fuel' (boyfriend) temporarily, as a means to calm the situation. Once the husband gets back on his emotional feet, she can pick up where she left off with the boyfriend, and the husband will (hopefully) be in a place where he is looking for a new companion too. It's not about kicking the boyfriend to the curb, it's about hitting 'pause' in their relationship while she puts out the fire in her marriage.
It's not black and white. There are many more than "two" options. A counselor may be needed to find a balance, so the wife can continue to be nurtured by her new friend, while also having time to nurse her grieving husband. And he can look for other resources for healing. Websites and books about poly, specifically poly breakups (there are many stories here, for example) and/or a poly friendly counselor.

By the way, the husband may not be ready for another partner for quite some time. It can be true that dating a new person can heal the pain of a breakup, but it can take much time to really be ready, get out of rebound mode, so you're not bringing a full suitcase of shit into the new relationship. It's not a panacea.
Quote:
Marriage is for 'better or worse'. Well I think this counts as 'worse' in my books. Now is the time when partners in a marriage show just how much they care about one another. It's a choice only the original poster can make. She needs to decide how much she is willing to 'invest' in helping her husband through this. I don't see how crossing her fingers and hoping for the best is going to end well for her.
Who says she is merely crossing her fingers and hoping for the best? But she needs to look out for herself too. Her husband is out of control, raging and awfulizing ("you're killing me!"). She shouldn't just sit back and take his craziness. She is looking for resources for him, wisely. Breaking up with her bf won't heal her h's broken heart.
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Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

Mags (poly, F, 63)
Pixi (poly, F, 41) my nesting partner since January 2009
Master, (mono, M, 37), Pixi's bf since April 2013
BigGuy (poly, M, married, 43, dating me since late summer 2018)
Ravi (poly, M, married, 37, dating me since late summer 2018)

Last edited by Magdlyn; 09-26-2015 at 01:09 PM.
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  #17  
Old 10-01-2015, 02:39 PM
Savant Savant is offline
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(Sorry, I didn't get a reply notification, I'll respond to your points below)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magdlyn View Post
I couldn't disagree more!! It can take a helluva a lot longer than a mere month to recover from a breakup, especially if you are new to poly.
I wasn't suggesting that a month is enough for someone to 'get over it'. What I was saying is that if he hasn't been able to make any kind of 'progress' in a month, that says to me that this is a lot more serious to him. As such, it's a bit much to expect him to just 'get over it', which seems to be the prevailing opinion here.

However, I wasn't saying she needs to *break up* with her boyfriend, I was saying take a 'step back'. It's like kids in a house where one parent dies, and then (the parent they are living with) starts dating right away. I agree there needs to be a grieving period, but that is not going to work if he has to compete for his wife's affection. When the husband says it is "killing him", he is saying that because it is killing him *emotionally*, and yet no one here seems to care about him or his feelings. All he is getting is criticism for not 'sucking it up like a man'. All I see here is (paraphrased) "your wife has a boyfriend, deal with it." With respect, I fail to see how that kind of advice will be helpful to him.

The bottom line is that if the boyfriend stays in the picture it may kill the marriage. Whether it *should* happen is irrelevant, since it shouldn't be this way--we both know that. But we're not dealing with someone who is seeing things rationally right now. This marriage is on shaky ground, so it really depends on how much the wife wants to hang onto it. Sometimes in marriage we have to face choices that aren't 'fair', but that we do for the relationship. (Like moving to a new city when your partner gets a job.)

There are times when a person can have their cake and eat it too. My personal belief is that this isn't one of those times. What could very well happen is that the husband could 'force' the issue, and then the marriage crumbles. The wife will now be left with a solo relationship with the boyfriend, but maybe he doesn't want that kind of relationship where he is the 'primary'. It may end up that it could indirectly torpedo that relationship as well, so both husband and wife will end up alone with a broken marriage. All because the husband got 'emotional'. (And people wonder why men are forced to swallow their emotions.)

As I said, it boils down to how important her marriage is to her. If keeping her marriage means temporarily scaling back the relationship with her boyfriend, then it's a choice she has to make. Alternately, if the relationship with her boyfriend is more important than her marriage, she should likely end the marriage now so that the husband can move on and they don't have to live in a tormented relationship. She shouldn't *have* to make that kind of choice, but life isn't fair. Personally I think it is taking a huge risk right now waving the boyfriend in the husband's face every time she sees him, but that's just my opinion.

I wish her all the best, and I hope she is able to work it out.
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  #18  
Old 10-01-2015, 09:08 PM
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vinsanity0 vinsanity0 is offline
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Some random thoughts...

When a person in a monogamous relationship breaks up, they are forced to go it alone. They may latch onto someone else in rebound mode. Maybe that is what is happening here? This couple was monogamous. Hubby suffered a breakup. Several things are running through his head. Poly failed so he wants to go back to mono. He is sitting there hurting while wife continues to have fun. He'll never find anyone else again. Yes, that is what us non-emotional guys go through when we lose someone. I went through a major depression when Elle and I de-escalated.

So...hubby wants to run back to something that is safe. It is up to wife to talk him down. Isn't that one of the "jobs" of a hinge, which is what she is right now? Sure, it's not all on her, but there is some responsibility there.

Perhaps point out to him that her dumping her guy would make him feel as bad as hubby feels? Assure him that he will be ok? These aren't fixing his emotions. It is being there for your partner when they are down.
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