Starting a relationship, knowing it will also end--seems weird

Darkling

New member
Good evening,
I have a primary relationship that I am happy in, and my husband and I have been talking a lot about what it would look like if we weren't monogamous. In some ways I can see a lot of positive things that could come from this, balanced with some challenges as well.

One thing that has been kind of a mental road block to me is, even if we weren't monogamous, I would prefer that our marriage was the primary relationship for both of us. I'm afraid of risking that. I also have lived in the mono-get-married-and-stay-together-for-life model that it seems really strange to entertain the idea of pursuing another relationship knowing that it will end at some point. Maybe mutually and gracefully, and maybe not.

Why would I sign up for a relationship that has a shelf life from the start? It sounds painful. Does this concern make sense to anyone? Does everyone really end up with a loving extended family of ex-lovers? Or do they end up with a collection of uncomfortable exes that pop up periodically to cause problems?

~darkling
 
Why does a secondary relationship have to end? As long as everyone is happy, it could go on for years. If your secondary wants a primary relationship too, you give them the space to find that. As long as you have compatible partners, there is no need to think of relationships as inherently short term.
 
All relationships end. Even if you never stop seeing the other person one of you will die sooner or later.

Given that all relationships end sooner or later, for me, the questions are more around how to live so that the relationships in my life are the best they can be.

IP
 
One thing that has been kind of a mental road block to me is, even if we weren't monogamous, I would prefer that our marriage was the primary relationship for both of us. I'm afraid of risking that.

If your spouse and you and your dating potentials cannot agree on satisfactory boundaries for a primary-secondary model, don't try to practice that open model with those players.

Or if you yourself simply are not willing/able to go there in general -- respect your own limit and don't go there.

I also have lived in the mono-get-married-and-stay-together-for-life model that it seems really strange to entertain the idea of pursuing another relationship knowing that it will end at some point. Maybe mutually and gracefully, and maybe not.

ALL relationships come with a clock attached.

Even the one with your spouse. I certainly hope the ending for my and my spouse is "death do us part" when we are old, but that's never certain. He or I could get run over by a bus tomorrow. But one does not live life expecting doom at each corner. That's no way to live!

Why would I sign up for a relationship that has a shelf life from the start? It sounds painful. Does this concern make sense to anyone? Does everyone really end up with a loving extended family of ex-lovers? Or do they end up with a collection of uncomfortable exes that pop up periodically to cause problems?

First... Are you considering secondary relationships like casual sex or casual emotional flings? Or like serious relationships that could last years?

Again, if this journey sounds painful and unfun to you -- could not go there. Obey your personal limit.

Is it your spouse that wants to go there and you really don't? Do not do this for your spouse. Do it for you -- and if you cannot go there of your own joyful heart and spirit? Just say no.

Galagirl
 
One thing that has been kind of a mental road block to me is, even if we weren't monogamous, I would prefer that our marriage was the primary relationship for both of us. I'm afraid of risking that. I also have lived in the mono-get-married-and-stay-together-for-life model that it seems really strange to entertain the idea of pursuing another relationship knowing that it will end at some point. Maybe mutually and gracefully, and maybe not.

Why would I sign up for a relationship that has a shelf life from the start? It sounds painful. Does this concern make sense to anyone? Does everyone really end up with a loving extended family of ex-lovers? Or do they end up with a collection of uncomfortable exes that pop up periodically to cause problems?

~darkling

All relationships end. Even if you never stop seeing the other person one of you will die sooner or later.

Given that all relationships end sooner or later, for me, the questions are more around how to live so that the relationships in my life are the best they can be.

IP

I struggle with this immensely darkling. You are not alone.

I also find the idea that all relationships end sooner or later, as IP noted, to be not helpful at all in resolving this issue for me. First, it's depressing. Realistic and accurate but just not how I want to think about my relationships. Second, spiritually, it's not true for me. I'm pagan and believe in reincarnation. I also believe that beyond death, the entities that were my friends, lovers, parents, family still exist in some form and will interact with the entity I become after death in some way. Everyone dies. However, I believe death is not the end. But I digress. You may find those words more useful than I do.

I have struggled to let go of the idea that relationships must be committed and must be lifelong in intent, if not in actuality. I have struggled to cope with the inherent expectations of that worldview. For example, that relationships have to 'go somewhere' in certain ways. One idea that has helped me think about those expectations is that of the 'relationship escalator'. Basically, the idea is that once in a relationship, it moves in a strict direction ('up' to marriage and babies traditionally). The blog, Solo Poly, has some great posts about implications of the relationship escalator, and what it can look like to get off the escalator. http://solopoly.net/. It's also been discussed here. I've found the idea helpful in framing my struggles but not in resolving them just yet.

(Solo Poly has some great posts on couple privilege which everyone who is in a couple, or wants to be in a couple should read IMHO.)

My relationship with my boyfriend started as FWB. It's gotten more serious over time. I've found that as it's gotten more involved and emotionally important, then my expectations went up. This has caused problems. I'm trying to examine the feelings underneath the expectations, examine the resulting envy and jealousy and get at what is really going on emotionally for me. Unfortunately, I don't have any other useful advice, beyond seeking the deep personal truth behind one's feelings, reactions and expectations.

It's hard. I'm not enjoying it. So far it's been worth it.
 
I struggle with this immensely darkling. You are not alone.

I also find the idea that all relationships end sooner or later, as IP noted, to be not helpful at all in resolving this issue for me. First, it's depressing. Realistic and accurate but just not how I want to think about my relationships. Second, spiritually, it's not true for me. I'm pagan and believe in reincarnation. I also believe that beyond death, the entities that were my friends, lovers, parents, family still exist in some form and will interact with the entity I become after death in some way. Everyone dies. However, I believe death is not the end. But I digress. You may find those words more useful than I do.

I have struggled to let go of the idea that relationships must be committed and must be lifelong in intent, if not in actuality. I have struggled to cope with the inherent expectations of that worldview. For example, that relationships have to 'go somewhere' in certain ways. One idea that has helped me think about those expectations is that of the 'relationship escalator'. Basically, the idea is that once in a relationship, it moves in a strict direction ('up' to marriage and babies traditionally). The blog, Solo Poly, has some great posts about implications of the relationship escalator, and what it can look like to get off the escalator. http://solopoly.net/. It's also been discussed here. I've found the idea helpful in framing my struggles but not in resolving them just yet.

(Solo Poly has some great posts on couple privilege which everyone who is in a couple, or wants to be in a couple should read IMHO.)

My relationship with my boyfriend started as FWB. It's gotten more serious over time. I've found that as it's gotten more involved and emotionally important, then my expectations went up. This has caused problems. I'm trying to examine the feelings underneath the expectations, examine the resulting envy and jealousy and get at what is really going on emotionally for me. Unfortunately, I don't have any other useful advice, beyond seeking the deep personal truth behind one's feelings, reactions and expectations.

It's hard. I'm not enjoying it. So far it's been worth it.
Why can't your relationship with your boyfriend last for (this) lifetime if you continue to make one another happy? I don't understand why people think they *have* to end at all?
 
We all die-but in the mean time-
I love my husband and I love my boyfriend.
15 years with husband. 20 with boyfriend.
No end in sight.

How you negotiate the terms of any relationship is important.
There is no guarantee that one or another will end.
So you need not look at it from the assumption that it will.

Dying isn't "an end" to everyone. Some people see it as simple another change.
Relationships will change. Your relationship wtih everyone in the world including yourself will change over the course of time. But end? That part is unnecessary.
 
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Relationships end, people move on, some things seem unfair, and so forth. That's life. Not every relationship is meant to last a lifetime, but it's totally possible to have more than one that does - if you feel you must subscribe to some kind of hierarchy and consider someone a "secondary," why would you assume that they would automatically be a temporary person in your life?

Live each day like it's your last and get the most out of it. There is no worse thing to waste than your time. Treat the people you love with respect, kindness, and appreciation every single moment, whether they will stick around or not, and you can have a rich life, full of love and loving actions.
 
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Why can't your relationship with your boyfriend last for (this) lifetime if you continue to make one another happy? I don't understand why people think they *have* to end at all?

There are circumstances and limits. For example, if he needs to move for work, we will break up because neither of us want a long distance relationship. But, yes, as long as we make each other happy and are in geographic proximity, I see no reason not to stay together!
 
I do have a spouse. I also have one partner where we are slowly creeping up on the three year mark, sometimes I think at some point in the future, this relationship may have to end even though it's a very happy relationship and our time together is certainly enjoyable. I also have one partner that I've been seeing less than a year, and I am sure this one has the potential to not end until maybe never. For me, the difference is one is integrating me into his life, and the other couldn't/wouldn't do that for various reasons. For me, this is probably what determines if a relationship has a shelf life or not for me.

Each person has their own criteria for what would work long term or not, I think it is very possible that even if a romantic relationship ends, other forms can continue. For instance, I'm starting to plan 21 years of friendship anniversary dinner for my ex husband right now, even long lasting romances don't always stay in the same form, that doesn't mean they weren't rewarding and successful. There are no guarantees, but there are also no for sure outcomes, and no reason to expect relationships will end if you choose somebody compatible and comfortable to spend time with with overlapping desires for the same sort of relationship.
 
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I do not do the whole primary /secondary relationship thing. I love Murf as much as my legal husband. Hell. I consider him my second husband and treat him accordingly. If Murf and I are both happy there is no reason we cannot continue on forever.
 
Why would I sign up for a relationship that has a shelf life from the start? It sounds painful.

The end of a relationship can be quite painful, depending on the circumstances. Am I correct in interpreting this to mean that you have never been party to a relationship ending? Friend, family, lover...?

I also have lived in the mono-get-married-and-stay-together-for-life model that it seems really strange to entertain the idea of pursuing another relationship knowing that it will end at some point.

This statement blows my mind. In the same sentence you have stated that it is a foregone conclusion that any relationship with the mono-for-life stamp on it will in fact last for life... and any other relationship is doomed for failure.

Just because you have stated that your mono-mate-for-life preference has no bearing on whether it will last for life. Some rare relationships are the very first one for both people, they mate for life, they constructively and positively tackle every difficulty life has to offer, their sex drives remain perfectly compatible for their entire lives, and they have compatible philosophy growth for their entire lives. If this happens I'd say that is one for the record books. Assuming that it's going to happen just because that's the way it's supposed to... that is almost blind optimism.

The defeatist approach that a relationship can't last simply because it doesn't have the mono-forever stamp is setting up a self-fulfilling prophecy. It is also applying traditional life-long-mono viewpoints onto a relationship style to which it doesn't apply.
 
On one hand I understand your worry. I'm married, hubby and I have kids, we've both discussed it and neither of us want more kids so have taken care of that issue on our ends. That means, my boyfriend one day will want kids, probably a wife. I can't be that for him, so does that mean that at some point this relationship will end?


Maybe.

I agree with Marcus here that you are putting the cart before the horse and setting yourself up for pain. Relationships end, many times you are dating someone and it ends. Amicably or not. So? You stop dating? Forever??

Each relationship is it's own relationship. Meaning if you subscribe to the idea of poly you understand that a relationship is not successful or fulfilling solely on the basis of ending in marriage and kids! It's successful if it's loving, if it works for the people involved.


My current boyfriend and I have discussed this a lot, and the discussion has changed over time. At first, we sort of tried to accept that at some point, he may have to say goodbye to me. That if he meets a woman he is wanting to marry and have kids with, she's going to want him all to herself. Then it evolved. He's happy with this model and while we both understand that especially with NRE and all that he may back off a bit, spend a little less time with me while they are building their relationship, why does it mean that I CAN'T remain in his life?

Now a days we have discussions on how he hopes any future relationship and I get along and how I plan on spoiling their children just because I can!

The point is, why go into it assuming it will fail? Maybe you will break up maybe you won't, but why is that dependent on the fact that you are already married? If someone is dating you and knows you are married they should be pretty aware that the relationship model you two will have will not include a legal marriage and be okay with it! Lots of successful relationships have nothing to do with marriage!
 
Bad metaphor, but...

Hey folks,

Thank you so much for all of the replies! I'm sure some of this feeling comes from my particular situation. In my marriage, I am the one who suggested that we consider non-monogamy. I wasn't interested in something casual, either sex or a minor fling with the person I had this crush on. OK, this is a bad metaphor, but I was so into him on a bunch of different levels that I was totally ready to bring this person home like a puppy (OMG, I'm so into him, he's so fucking hot, and he followed me home--can I keep him?). In the end when I asked that guy if he was into me, well, he wasn't.

In the meantime, my husband has met someone that he wants to date. I really like her, even if I don't want to date her myself, and I completely support him pursuing a relationship with her. She likes doing some things I don't (takes pressure off of me), her son is adorable, and when she comes over she just feels like she could be family. But my husband feels guilty about the whole thing since my crush didn't work out. He even offered to go get me a new puppy. The thing with my crush just sort of happened, I wasn't expecting it, and now I can't see why I would go out and purposely try to meet anyone else. I don't want a new puppy, I'm still totally miserable over the last one. Conversely, everything in my life is going great right now with the exception of that one disappointment. I don't want casual, apparently, but with that intensity of emotion there is the potential for a proportional amount of discomfort.

The person I had a crush on...I think the situation would have been like Vixtoria. I don't want any more kids, and I assume that he would at some point have wanted to do the whole get married and have kids thing. Him having a primary partner would have been fine.

I think I am just going to get on with my life for the moment, and see if I can get to the "acceptance" stage of grief. :)

Thanks again,

~darkling
 
Funny

Perhaps a bizarre take on relationships: I've ONLY signed up for monogamous relationships with expiration dates.

My thought was, suppose I meet someone else I want to be intimate with? I'll only have to move on anyways. Best to just not get too involved and have an easy out ("I'm moving the country; I'm graduating college), rather than have to tell the person, "I just don't want to be with you anymore."

Now that I'm poly, I'm realizing, I don't HAVE to have an exit strategy. If I fall in love with another person, I can bring them INTO my life, rather than transition to a new life. I don't have to worry about getting emotionally attached. I can freely fall in love with my partner, and know that I'm never going to have to make a choice between them and someone else.
 
Thank you for clarifying.

If you are just starting to get over a loss (your crush did not return the same feelings) then it seems natural to be at the "Why? Why me? Why this?" place. That doesn't mean all of life or relationships are doom. It could mean you are still sad about THIS recent thing.

Like you said -- you could wait to arrive at acceptance.

I don't want a new puppy, I'm still totally miserable over the last one. Conversely, everything in my life is going great right now with the exception of that one disappointment.

To me? That statement seems to recognize you are sad right now, but can also pull back and get some perspective. Maybe you just want your spouse to back off rushing you into dating anew so he can feel less guilty about having his gf? Give you space to be sad and get past it in your own time?

Hang in there.

Galagirl
 
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I was totally ready to bring this person home like a puppy (OMG, I'm so into him, he's so fucking hot, and he followed me home--can I keep him?).

He even offered to go get me a new puppy. The thing with my crush just sort of happened, I wasn't expecting it, and now I can't see why I would go out and purposely try to meet anyone else. I don't want a new puppy, I'm still totally miserable over the last one.

This has really helped me. My boyfriend gets a lot from me that he doesn't get from his wife, and I've actually been a little concerned about how he's going to handle it when it's over. But a new puppy to replace the old one who's leaving him...this is a great idea! :D
 
In the meantime, my husband has met someone that he wants to date . . . But my husband feels guilty about the whole thing since my crush didn't work out.

Well, tell your hubs that it's not a race! There is no rule in poly that says each person in a committed partnership must have the same exact number of relationships at the same time. Does he count how many friends you have and then make sure to either pursue someone to gain a new friend, or dump an old friend, just so you are both "even?" Of course not. You are two individuals, life has ebbs and flows, enjoy it. Attraction, romance, and love happens in its own time and place...
 
Why would I sign up for a relationship that has a shelf life from the start? It sounds painful.

This actually came up in bi group yesterday. Someone there was dating a guy and didn't see it leading to a long-term relationship, but they liked him and didn't want to break up just because they would never get married. She's young and hasn't dated much, so she was really enjoying being in a relationship, and she really likes him... just doesn't see him as future husband material... She was looking for validation for her desire to stay in the relationship and not worry about its finite lifespan.

We were all more than happy to give it to her. I'm a big fan of living in the moment. The future will happen soon enough without troubling over it too much right now. If you're enjoying what you're doing, the people you're with, then don't think of them as having a shelf life. What an awful thought. Maybe it will end eventually, maybe it won't. But if you get caught up on "when is this going to end?" then it's just a matter of time.

For that matter, being married doesn't mean you'll never break up, either. Of course we all expect our marriages to last forever when we walk down the aisle, but statistically that's foolish.

I don't see my relationship with Auto as having a built-in shelf life. Just because we'll never get married doesn't mean we'll eventually have to break up. There's nothing wrong with just being unmarried partners in perpetuity.

Does this concern make sense to anyone?

Not really, nope.

Does everyone really end up with a loving extended family of ex-lovers?

Absolutely not. I'm not sure I'd even want that. Nope, pretty sure I wouldn't. I like the past in the past.

Or do they end up with a collection of uncomfortable exes that pop up periodically to cause problems?

Is that the only other option?

I've always been pretty careful about ending relationships in good standing. My exes don't cause any problems at all. When I run into them, it's just like running into an old friend from high school.

Before you got married, you must have dated? Did you worry about ending up with a pile of exes then? Why worry about it now? I guess if you didn't really date before getting married, you have nothing to compare to... but most people do have to date a few people before finding their life partners, and to my knowledge accumulating exes isn't a huge concern in the dating game.
 
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All relationships are temporary (in the scheme of things)
What you take away from them can be life long.

Before you got married, you must have dated? Did you worry about ending up with a pile of exes then? Why worry about it now? I guess if you didn't really date before getting married, you have nothing to compare to... but most people do have to date a few people before finding their life partners, and to my knowledge accumulating exes isn't a huge concern in the dating game.

Ditto.. 100% ditto!!!!
 
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