Survival guide for dating a mono

YouAreHere, who is mono (and not a cheater, lol, right YaH? You're too tired ;) ) has done a great job of loving a poly man. You might read her blog.

Bwa-hahahaha! No, most definitely not a cheater. I've determined that my kids are my other relationship, and that's hard ENOUGH to balance, thankyew. ;)

I took my blog thread on this board out of my .sig when my .sig got too long... I'm going to have to rewicker that, methinks. Anyhoo, the blog thread is here: http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50295

And boy is it in need of an update. :eek:

Edited to add: Boy, I didn't realize there was another page or so on this thread when I wrote my previous comment (not this one). So much for timeliness. At any rate, I do feel welcome on this board (well, now I feel almost like Norm on Cheers - lol). I think folks can express either monogamy or polyamory in a condescending way, and when I do see it here, it tends to be someone new and/or someone dealing with a lot of emotion at the time. Angry/hurt people can lash out.
 
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The judgment I've seen to monos (and vanillas) is mostly in my real life poly/kink community, and also some articles I see floating around the web and on FB...

I don't like the "we are more evolved" thing. But it's well...yes and no. People who are practicing good communication skills and honesty and respect for partners are doing relationships better. This can be mono or poly. I do think that those who participate in relationship development communities...which sometimes takes the form of discussion groups, forums, etc for alt lifestylers of some flavor...get in on some good ideas about how to relationship well.

Does that mean poly is somehow better? No. But having a community might be.

I used to post on a different site on a subforum for "Relationships." It unfortunately got pretty awful. General population talking about relationships was a lot of:

"Why won't girls give a nice guy a chance?"
"How important is height/weight/boob size/dick size/etc?"
"Why can't I have any 'luck' with women?"
"Why are guys all dogs/players/etc?"
"I only get trainwrecks on OLD, please critique my profile? (But actually I can't handle suggestions or criticism and will argue with you.)"
"Women suck so I'm joining an MRA group."
"Men suck so I'm going to be a lesbian"
"No one will ever love me and I don't know why."

And the ever popular most common response: "Seek therapy."

...essentially a lot of bitter people who are faring pretty badly in the game of love, and looking for a place to vent. It was...not fun...after a while.

So I come to a poly forum full of poly ideas. And here we are, being respectful and talking to each other like people, it's great. It's not because we're poly, but it might be because we've done some good reading and good talking and putting more effort into good relating.

Anyhoo. One of my partners, and the one I've grown extremely close to, Zen, is mono to me. And I found that being poly with him wasn't hard because the relationship started with the understanding that this was who I am and what I'm doing. He knows my other partners, and he is, sometimes with a bit of deliberate effort, cool with it all. And it was all easy peasy for quite a while. And any issues that have come up now aren't really because he's mono...they have much more to do with me, my life and time balances, my emotions, and my connections (or feeling a bit lacking in connection) with the others. His mono-ness hasn't caused any problems for us at all.
 
Well... readers are often encouraged to search for threads that fit the terms they're looking for. I wouldn't be surprised for an old thread to be resurrected in such a way.
Someone already made that exact (failed) rationale. Try to keep up. :D

As for the rest of it... well, weh. Weh, weh, weh. Oh, those poor picked-upon monogamous people!! How it must totally SUCK to be that way!!

Echoing Spork, I too have long sneered at the "poly is more evolved / morally superior / intelligent / logical / sane" rationalization.

However, it's the sort of thing that a LOT of minorities throughout history have claimed, especially those who have internalized a degree of fear for their continued well-being, safety, lives.

I mean, maybe those who want to quash polyfolk from Heavy Sarcasm (eyerolls optional) when mentioning the thick accretion of lies & delusions around monogamy should perhaps expand their reach to other benighted groups: people of color, Jews, Mormons, Wiccans, homosexuals...

This site is apparently for support of POLYAMORY. Anyone who's easily insulted by THAT fact is probably in the wrong place.
 
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I mean, maybe those who want to quash polyfolk from Heavy Sarcasm (eyerolls optional) when mentioning the thick accretion of lies & delusions around monogamy should perhaps expand their reach to other benighted groups: people of color, Jews, Mormons, Wiccans, homosexuals...

This site is apparently for support of POLYAMORY. Anyone who's easily insulted by THAT fact is probably in the wrong place.

Translation, please. :confused:
 
Someone already made that exact (failed) rationale. Try to keep up. :D

Failed how? I think Opalescent mentioned that she encouraged the poster to search for existing topics. :confused:

As for the rest of it... well, weh. Weh, weh, weh. Oh, those poor picked-upon monogamous people!! How it must totally SUCK to be that way!!

When your partner complains that things would be SO much easier if you were poly, and could finally "see the light," that shit gets irritating, fast. It's playing out on another mono/poly group right now, in fact... it's not that isolated an incident, and it happened to me early on in my relationship.

It's not always framed as "mono people suck," and the feeling still makes one feel "less than."

I mean, maybe those who want to quash polyfolk from Heavy Sarcasm (eyerolls optional) when mentioning the thick accretion of lies & delusions around monogamy should perhaps expand their reach to other benighted groups: people of color, Jews, Mormons, Wiccans, homosexuals...

Anyone who relies on heavy sarcasm should realize that it may not work with every audience. Someone saying that something is offensive doesn't mean they're trying quash your speech, unless they're actually TRYING to quash your speech.

And some of these "delusions" aren't limited to monogamy. There are plenty of people (both mono and poly) who want assurances that their relationship will be (insert thing here), when the future is *never* certain. Monogamy gives you a bit of a road map, which can make it easier for some people. Neither relationship style ensures you'll get where you think you're going.

This site is apparently for support of POLYAMORY. Anyone who's easily insulted by THAT fact is probably in the wrong place.

Poly support doesn't have to mean denigrating monogamy. I think the people on this forum tend to be fantastic with the support (even the "tough love" kind) without being dismissive of monogamy as a whole. That's why I loves you guyz! :D
 
Worth mention:

I'm reading The Ethical Slut right now. I'm a little over halfway through, reading about conflict management at the moment.

Again I am struck by how many of the CONCEPTS are just "how to human pretty good" and "how to do healthy relating."

I totally welcome monofolk to this poly board, because you know, relationships can be hard, understanding yourself well enough to be good and kind to a partner can be hard, at the end of the day it doesn't matter that much if you're single and looking, mono, poly, or what. We are generally social creatures trying to get by in the world, and it's beneficial to share ideas on how to go about that.

If it helps, it helps.
 
And some of these "delusions" aren't limited to monogamy. There are plenty of people (both mono and poly) who want assurances that their relationship will be (insert thing here), when the future is *never* certain. Monogamy gives you a bit of a road map, which can make it easier for some people. Neither relationship style ensures you'll get where you think you're going.

Absolutely. Nothing can give a guarantee but something I've read several times (not often here, thankfully) is that marriages are safer somehow if they are non-monogamous. That an ability to have more sexual variety protects against people growing apart in some way.

People sometimes feel coerced into non-monogamy because they feel as it will help them keep a relationship going.

The desire to not be single is alive and well among mono folks and poly folks alike. To walk through the world without a romantic partner, to be happy to do so and to go to the extent of avoiding romantic attachment, so far as I can tell, remains one of the more unusual ways to live.

Poly support doesn't have to mean denigrating monogamy. I think the people on this forum tend to be fantastic with the support (even the "tough love" kind) without being dismissive of monogamy as a whole. That's why I loves you guyz! :D

Agree so much with you. :D The people here are great at giving support and welcoming everybody regardless of chosen relationship style.
 
Translation, please. :confused:
Oh, right, my "big words" tendency. Sorry.

So let me put it this way: what exactly the f@ck is wrong with sometimes making fun of MONOS on a POLY site?

(I suppose someone could make the case that monogamists generally demonstrate their moral superiority by defending alternatives all over the Web -- but that would be a few steps past ludicrous.)
 
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Okay, so I just spent a too-brief two days hanging out with a former (& possible future again) partner & her current primary, who is a language expert (semantics & linguistics) & we had waaay fun chattering about music & metacommunication. I'm still kinda stoked. :)
Failed how? I think Opalescent mentioned that she encouraged the poster to search for existing topics. :confused:
Again: previous posts are all that I refer to. For instance:
It's perfectly fine to revive old threads here, and we do encourage that.

However, it's better to revive them by adding something to the conversation -- not just a complaint that the thread doesn't meet expectations. What is the purpose in that?

Going around to this thread and that thread only to post, "I wanted to like this thread but it sucks" isn't very useful!
It's not always framed as "mono people suck," and the feeling still makes one feel "less than."
Let's posit that people who show up on this site are (1) adults in at least some senses of the word & (2) of at least moderate intelligence. Given those presuppositions, then maybe they could explain what specific perceived jabs have hurt their feelings. See, from there, perhaps a discussion might ensue. :eek:
Anyone who relies on heavy sarcasm should realize that it may not work with every audience.
FWIW, I do not rely upon sarcasm of ANY weight or thickness. I'm told it's a defense mechanism when faced with manipulative or passive-aggressive tics.
Someone saying that something is offensive doesn't mean they're trying quash your speech, unless they're actually TRYING to quash your speech.
Hmm... no. That essentially saying "you aren't allowed to demonstrate that something is obstructive until you first demonstrate that it's obstructive." And, further, it sets up visiting monogamists as a special class deserving a degree of wariness which polyamorists are not afforded -- which, really, we don't give each other, possibly because it intentionally restricts communication.
some of these "delusions" aren't limited to monogamy.
While true enough on the surface, the fact is that much of these errors are functionally enshrined in monogamy, presented as necessary & in fact inarguable. To merely examine these fundamental mistakes is to risk being accused of being "anti-marriage" or even hating monogamists.
Poly support doesn't have to mean denigrating monogamy. ...being dismissive of monogamy as a whole.
No, that too is spurious. Heaving an occasional disgusted sigh about the failures of monogamistic superstition is nothing anywhere near "denigrating monogamy." And (ibid.) dredging up a hoary thread with a few :rolleyes: in it is itself low-level trolling.

Now, with all THAT said, I think it'd be instructive if someone were to actually present some of those cobwebby "anti-monogamy" statements, so that they might be discussed, & perhaps dismissed. Possibly those who feel they've been maligned could give some examples.
 
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YAH did give an example just before the sentence you quoted. It's just not referring to anything from this board:
When your partner complains that things would be SO much easier if you were poly, and could finally "see the light," that shit gets irritating, fast. It's playing out on another mono/poly group right now, in fact... it's not that isolated an incident, and it happened to me early on in my relationship.

It's not always framed as "mono people suck," and the feeling still makes one feel "less than."
I think we do a pretty good job here to avoid mono-bashing. A lot of members here don't ID as poly or mono, nor view them as orientations. When it's viewed as simply a structure for relationships that one can choose or not, rather than something one cannot live without, I think it's easier to be more accepting of people who prefer and thrive in monogamous relationships. I mean, a healthy relationship is a healthy relationship is a healthy relationship - the structure doesn't determine how healthy it is; the people in it do. We've seen some pretty unhealthy poly arrangements blow up in peoples' faces here, and we've seen plenty of healthy mono relationships, so there's no basis for anyone to make a blanket statement that poly is superior to mono. Usually the ones who bash monos are those who get really defensive about their particular choices, or what they consider their poly "wiring."
 
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Oh, right, my "big words" tendency. Sorry.

So let me put it this way: what exactly the f@ck is wrong with sometimes making fun of MONOS on a POLY site?

(I suppose someone could make the case that monogamists generally demonstrate their moral superiority by defending alternatives all over the Web -- but that would be a few steps past ludicrous.)

I have a simpler case: it's a dick move.

Many of the mono folks are here for support in their own relationships - they have a horse in this race, and not only has a race horse fallen into their laps, they have no friggin' idea what to do with it. Plus, a good number of them end up in bad situations when their spouses want to be poly RIGHT NOW, and they're getting steamrolled as they try to make sense of this.

You go to a monogamously-focused person or group for advice, and you get advice to leave. Full stop. You come to a poly site for advice, and you find that people are arguing that it's okay to make fun of you. Awesome.

It's extremely easy for a mono person in a mono/poly relationship to feel completely outside both worlds: mono friends don't understand why you're doing this, and you're not poly, so you don't fit in that world either.

A little compassion goes a long way.
 
Let's posit that people who show up on this site are (1) adults in at least some senses of the word & (2) of at least moderate intelligence. Given those presuppositions, then maybe they could explain what specific perceived jabs have hurt their feelings. See, from there, perhaps a discussion might ensue. :eek:

I will assume you're talking about OP's (RP's?) comment that the thread was sad, as opposed to plucking phrases out of the thread in order to justify it (and lead to discussion).

Shrug.
I hardly think the discussion has suffered any because of it.

Hmm... no. That essentially saying "you aren't allowed to demonstrate that something is obstructive until you first demonstrate that it's obstructive."

Not at all. I'm saying that merely stating that you are offended by something isn't the same as asking the mods to remove it.

And, further, it sets up visiting monogamists as a special class deserving a degree of wariness which polyamorists are not afforded -- which, really, we don't give each other, possibly because it intentionally restricts communication.

How does "don't be a dick" restrict communication?

And we were *specifically* talking about offending mono people on a poly board. Of course, compassion should go to everyone. I'm not asking for something I wouldn't expect for anyone on this board. You can take your strawman down now.

Heaving an occasional disgusted sigh about the failures of monogamistic superstition is nothing anywhere near "denigrating monogamy." And (ibid.) dredging up a hoary thread with a few :rolleyes: in it is itself low-level trolling.

It was nowhere near trolling. It was not designed to evoke a response. It was designed to communicate one, regardless of whether or not the poster showed their work.

It is daunting for mono folks to come to a poly board for advice. Seeing smirks, eyerolls, and comments like "what the fuck is wrong with making fun of monogamous people" doesn't help.

Now, with all THAT said, I think it'd be instructive if someone were to actually present some of those cobwebby "anti-monogamy" statements, so that they might be discussed, & perhaps dismissed. Possibly those who feel they've been maligned could give some examples.

See the post you just quoted. The *good* thing is that, over the last five years (as poly has gotten more mainstream), I've seen less of it. You now have more of the sensationally-titled articles ("Why This May Be the End of Monogamy"), but that's the nature of news via the web.
 
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And again I wonder...

So allow me to simply, ASK...

That thing where I refer to monos, vanillas, or (more usually) "muggles", I am specifically speaking of the ones who will assert that "normal" = "right". Not just right for THEM, but for EVERYONE.

When a poly article gets posted on FB and I see the comments not from my own friends but from the public in general on that article, and so many are pearl clutchers who are disgusted with:
"selfish"
"shallow"
"don't know what love is"
"can't commit"
"hedonistic"
"slutty"
ETC...which they assume polyfolk are, nevermind how we must certainly be destroying society and harming the children (because obviously we have orgies in the living room during Saturday morning cartoons and Fruit Loops.)

Yeah, I'm gonna make fun of those assholes.

But I'm thinking it isn't fair to say, "monos" when you mean...those people. Since a person happily living as a mono but open minded enough to contemplate poly, for themselves, a loved one, etc and coming here for some support, should be welcomed.

Ravenscroft, when you draw comparisons...and I'm wanting some thought exchange with you on this subject, because I get the feeling you don't judge all monofolk so harshly...

I think of the fact that I want so badly for racial equality and an end to discrimination in my country. And the concept to me that minorities would (and do) bash "white people" to include me, and describe ALL as, well, racist to the degree of being perfectly fine with all of the horrors and injustices against them... I'm sorry, but that is wrong. I want to be your friend, please don't lump me in with skinheads and KKK, alright? Now I'm sure some do...but ya know, I really would prefer they didn't.

How about LGBTQ folks, on boards relative to that, bashing straights as though every person who prefers to shag the opposite gender is basically a Bible thumping southern right wing extremist right outta Duck Dynasty, how about that? I'm ~mostly~ straight, and I marched in a Pride parade not long back, and I would really rather not be lumped in with people who are hateful.

Basically it's treatment of those who would step forward as allies...as though no matter what THEY think, they are the enemy.

I don't like that. So I do think we should try to at least be decent to the monofolk who come here to explore ideas fairly and understand what poly is about. Am I wrong?
 
I'd go even further and say that even poly-unfriendly monos ("muggles") should be treated courteously when they post here. Let the mods decide when things go too far. When CTF started out here, he wasn't too keen on the idea of poly in general. People have been nice to him and he has come around. So turning the other cheek can be a worthwhile investment.
 
I have to wonder if I'm now more of a Squib than a Muggle. :p
 
This thread was started by someone who wanted discussion on how people in poly arrangements that include monogamous partners can make it work for all involved. It was meant to offer insight into what a mono person would need or expect in a poly relationship when polyamory is not their preference. In essence, the spirit of this thread is meant to be helpful to monos and polys alike. I fail to see how bashing or ridiculing monogamy would be appropriate. Let's please stay on topic and address how partners in a mono/poly relationship can have more understanding about each other's preferences and tendencies and work together for a mutually satisfying dynamic. If anyone doesn't have something practical, insightful, or helpful to offer in that vein, then I suggest staying away from this thread.
 
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