The inevitable thirdness of being the third

C

Ceoli

Guest
A while ago, I made a commitment to myself to keep my heart open to whatever kind of love that would be available to me. This commitment to remain open has lead me to some unexpected places, including this relationship I'm now having with a married couple. We've approached it slowly and with little pressure on each other and allowed it to grow into whatever it would be, not some preconceived notion that any of us may have had.

So throughout that, and despite my general aversion to getting involved with couples, they have both really endeared themselves to me and I've found myself really grateful for their support in other ways (my current displaced life situation really could use some of that support). So the last couple of weekends, I've realized how attached I feel to them. We've had some lovely times together so far.

However, the last two weekends, the wife has been struggling. Each weekend started off fabulous but then she got very moody and ended up hiding herself under the covers last weekend, and the same thing happened this weekend. It felt very clearly that she needed me to leave her space and she got very moody again. She was clearly upset and overwhelmed. I wanted to comfort her, but not knowing if I was part of the problem I didn't really know where my place was. I sort of hovered in limbo for a bit before leaving. I left feeling very hurt. I texted her today to make sure she was alright, because clearly she wasn't yesterday. She apologized for what happened and said that she needs to do some soul searching about what happened and why she's reacting this way. I expressed that it hurt me and she said that it wasn't my fault and that she knew how horribly unfair it was to me. I said I'd hang back and follow her lead.

So here I am. The third. Keenly aware of what I have to lose and with nothing to do about it but wait. The future of my feelings with regard to each of them depends on them working this out and I will have little say in it. She will work this out with her husband and I will sit and wait. They will have each other while I have neither. This is exactly why being a third is hard.

I am working very hard to keep my heart open and not close it off after this experience. Things haven't ended between us and it could just very well be just a rough patch. But it's a rough patch that makes me keenly aware of the vulnerability of my position in this relationship. And the fact that I opened my heart to this possibility makes it hurt more.

That's kind of a hard place to be.
 
Well, I of course don't know the situation. Just as there are crucial things you do not know yourself. Nevertheless, if I remember correctly, both of these two with whom you are involved expect you to depart the country and the continent before too long -- heading back to England. I have no idea how this plays into whatever is going on with her, him, them, and all of you. But I do know this. If I were involved with someone likely to be leaving the country pretty soon, I'd assume that our regular intimacies would have a sort of limit imposed. (I don't have funds to fly across the pond regularly, etc.) Just a thought. How relevant, I have no idea.
 
Actually, that's a whole separate thing that's different from the issues that arose this weekend. It was hard for me to enter into this knowing the impermanence of me being here, but we all agreed that it was better to be open to what might happen. I've always found it a bad idea to enforce a limit upon feelings that develop. Feelings rarely follow directions :)

But you make a good point.
 
Sorry to hear you're having a rough time. And thanks for sharing it- you give me a lot to think about in regards to being one of a couple and how to take care of someone who would come into one of our lives and have to deal with both of us.
 
Thanks for that Rarechild. That's kind of why I wanted to post it.
 
Like Rarechild, I would like to offer my thanks for sharing your feelings with us about this sensitve moment in your relationships. I can't say I know just how you feel, as I have never been the third, but my heart goes out you. *hugs* I do know just how it feels to be waiting for another to address issues that are vitally important to me, without any control over how/when.

I would like to ask some questions and offer some thoughts:

First, it looks to me like you are working to keep the lines of communication open. Good for you! That's exactly needed what's make a poly relationship work. (So I hear. My own triad is no more, for that very reason, among others.)

It also sounds like the wife is periodically shutting you, and everything else, out by hiding in bed. If the weekends started out "fabulous" something happened to trigger the shutdowns. Were there intermediate steps between fabulous and shutdown? There usually are. Identifying where things went off the track may point the way to the solution.

May I ask what kind of relationship do the three of you have? Is it a triad, a V, or something else (perhaps double V or something more extended)? This, in my mind, makes a significant difference, because if you're in a triad, she's not merely the wife, but also your girlfriend.

So here I am. The third. Keenly aware of what I have to lose and with nothing to do about it but wait. The future of my feelings with regard to each of them depends on them working this out and I will have little say in it. She will work this out with her husband and I will sit and wait. They will have each other while I have neither.

Why do you feel you have no power or right to address the issue(s) involved? You may be the "third" but this is your relationship, too, and you have the right and responsibility to be fully engaged in it. To be alternately allowed in/ pushed out is not fair, and will eventually doom the relationship.

IMO, it is a good and compassionate thing to give the wife/gf some space to think and soul-search. But while she is doing so, why do you not feel you cannot talk and connect with the husband/bf? It seems to me that you need healing in this situation, too, and that need deserves respect and attention too.

I wish you and your others peace and joy, however this works out.
 
What a great insight into what it's like to be a third...thanks for that!:)

I think about my relationship with my two men and remember how important it was at the beginning that I make sure I keep Mono (the third) up to date on everything that came up for me and my husband. My husband did the same. There were times I was completely over whelmed by it all but I realized that I had a responsibility to both of them and that it wasn't an option to hide in bed. I was (and am) completely open about how I felt as it came up. Sometimes I had know idea what it was coming up, just that I was feeling strongly. I don't know if I would be satisfied with "following the lead." I think I would be a bit more demanding.

I would be asking what the trigger is and working on finding out WITH them. I would want to know what she wants me to do if she deeks and avoids in bed. I'd ask if she wants you to come and console her, chat with her, sit in silence, get the hell out of the house, what?! If you are unclear about what you should do or what your role is, shouldn't you be asking, discussing, setting boundaries. Perhaps it is not okay for you that she does that rather than talk it out? And the should be fine. Radical honesty baby. If you are really becoming a part of their already established relationship then shouldn't these things be out in the open?

What does the husband want? There is no mention of what he thinks and what their already established dynamic is around her repeating this behaviour. It sounds as if she may be accustom to trotting off to bed when the going gets tough.

If you are going to be three then shouldn't you BE IN IT? It just seems that you have put yourself in a position of being the third wheel, rather than the third.
 
Just want to offer hugs and moral support.

I've been in your exact position, so I know what it's like to have the feelings you are experiencing... and feeling somewhat "helpless" while the established couple figure out what it is they want. In my situation, they made it clear that no matter what, THEY came before WE. My opinions would never matter as much as theirs... Therefore, it was easy for me to walk away from the relationship.
 
May I ask what kind of relationship do the three of you have? Is it a triad, a V, or something else (perhaps double V or something more extended)? This, in my mind, makes a significant difference, because if you're in a triad, she's not merely the wife, but also your girlfriend.

We are a triad. I am definitely in relationship with both of them. I've been avoiding using terms girlfriend or boyfriend in general because for myself, it's not to the point where I feel that describes our relationship. More of that has to do with myself and my past and how those terms get a bit loaded for me.

Why do you feel you have no power or right to address the issue(s) involved? You may be the "third" but this is your relationship, too, and you have the right and responsibility to be fully engaged in it. To be alternately allowed in/ pushed out is not fair, and will eventually doom the relationship.

I addressed the issues involved by letting her know the effect her actions were having on me. These two people have been together for 15 years. I've been there for about 3 months and we've not had regular face to face contact for those 3 months. Things have been definitely getting more serious in the past month, but the fact remains that this is still very new and how deep the relationship is going to run in our lives still remains to be seen. Those issues that were coming up for her go much further back than the 3 months I've been there. So I feel as fully engaged as I can be under the circumstances.

IMO, it is a good and compassionate thing to give the wife/gf some space to think and soul-search. But while she is doing so, why do you not feel you cannot talk and connect with the husband/bf? It seems to me that you need healing in this situation, too, and that need deserves respect and attention too.

I have talked a bit with him about it and he has been as reassuring as he can be, much of what arose for her was about having difficulty sharing. Since my contact with him is directly related to that issue, I need to be sensitive to that. The fact is, I still come in second to each of them and that is an undeniable fact in the design of this relationship at this stage. So if my needs end up being in conflict with any of their needs, I can keenly feel the weight against me in such negotiations.
 
Sometimes I had know idea what it was coming up, just that I was feeling strongly. I don't know if I would be satisfied with "following the lead." I think I would be a bit more demanding.

Perhaps, but in my case, she is letting me know what's coming up and if I were to be more demanding, I don't see how that would help her work through the issues she's having. I don't see putting pressure on her as being productive. I can't demand that she get over it. If I was struggling with something and someone demanded that of me, I would be pretty pissed off and alienated by that. I have let her know very clearly what impact this is having on me, I don't see how I can demand more of her at this point.

I'd ask if she wants you to come and console her, chat with her, sit in silence, get the hell out of the house, what?! If you are unclear about what you should do or what your role is, shouldn't you be asking, discussing, setting boundaries. Perhaps it is not okay for you that she does that rather than talk it out? And the should be fine. Radical honesty baby. If you are really becoming a part of their already established relationship then shouldn't these things be out in the open?

Oh, I'm all for radical honesty. I'm all about calling things out then and there and that's a practice I follow in all my relationships. :) And I asked her those questions at the time practically verbatim. She couldn't give an answer as to what she wanted, so it sort of grew into that general funk and air of tension that I elected to leave. Many of those boundaries are still being set. As I said earlier, this is in it's very early stages and we've been taking things slowly. We still haven't established how much of a part of this relationship I am. Plus we all know that I'll eventually be moving back overseas. So while things are in the open, that still doesn't make things certain. We're just very open about the uncertainty.

What does the husband want? There is no mention of what he thinks and what their already established dynamic is around her repeating this behaviour. It sounds as if she may be accustom to trotting off to bed when the going gets tough.

He only arrived towards the tail end of all this. At the time, he was comforting to me and squeezing my hand and making sure I felt wanted by him, but as I said earlier in my previous post, much of this issue is about her struggling with the sharing. We've talked about it since and he has been supportive.

If you are going to be three then shouldn't you BE IN IT? It just seems that you have put yourself in a position of being the third wheel, rather than the third.

The reality of the situation is what it is. I am in it as much as I can be at the moment. I have been honest about my feelings and the effects. I have offered what I can, and what she needs more than anything from me at the moment is space. I have only been involved with these people for a few months. They have been together for 15 years. These realities can't be denied when dealing with such things. I don't see any more I can do at this point that wouldn't be overstepping the limits of my position in this relationship at the moment. And this is why I try not to get involved with couples in this way. But feelings rarely follow directions.
 
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Just want to offer hugs and moral support.

I've been in your exact position, so I know what it's like to have the feelings you are experiencing... and feeling somewhat "helpless" while the established couple figure out what it is they want. In my situation, they made it clear that no matter what, THEY came before WE. My opinions would never matter as much as theirs... Therefore, it was easy for me to walk away from the relationship.

That sucks! What's keeping me around is that they've both been very open and generous about regards for my feelings. But perhaps sometimes the best of intentions aren't enough to overcome some obstacles. It still remains to be seen, I guess....

We're all talking now and I feel less adrift than I did this weekend, but am still keenly feeling the flaws in the design of being third.
 
Being a third doesn't have to be inevitable

I've been where you are, and have felt the same feelings. But here is what I've learned. If I feel like the third, it's because I put myself there.

My partners have been married for almost 30 years. There is a dynamic between them that I'm not apart of. It might be a look, or a validation to a past event, or something as simple as finishing each others sentence. I can't change that, but neither can they. If we dwell on what we can't change, we don't pay attention to what we can.

Does it hurt when there is silence. Absolutely. Do you feel like it might have been the wrong decision for you? Absolutely. It is worth fighting for to find out? Oh Absolutely.

I've lived through the silence. I've also lived through the anger when I refused to accept silence. It is a new relationship. Everyone is trying to figure it out. The unfortunate part is because they have a longstanding relationship, we think they are supposed to have it all worked out. It rarely works that way. Everyone is unique. Our feelings are not the same, the way we react is not the same.

The hurt is real. But if you are truly a part of this relationship. Then you voice your opinion. You can't wait for someone else to make the decisions for you. You have to be a part of the decisions.

Let your g/f have time to collect her thoughts. Respect her right to get it together, but no one should control your actions or feelings. You alone are responsible for that.

I hope it works out for you. I really hope you all figure out a way to make it the best experience you've ever had.
 
To be clear:

1) I have not expected them to have everything worked out and I knew that we would be facing some uncertain times when feelings started getting more serious.

2) I have been very clear about my feelings in this and am not holding anyone else responsible for them but me. I have never apologized for my feelings in this or with them and never feel that I should sit on them or hide them to protect anyone else.

3) I do not feel controlled by the situation. I see the limitations of my position as she deals with this and as I give her the space she needs to deal with this, but I do not feel controlled.

4) I posted this not because I feel lost or because I feel things are coming to an end, but because I feel that many couples that want to bring a third into their relationship don't understand the perspective of the third when issues arise. Sometimes small things can have a larger effect and reveal the vulnerableness of that position.
 
Ceoli, I get it more now, thanks for clarifying. :):):) Poor you, that last post was clear... heehee, I guess really we (I am taking the liberty to speak for others here, hope that is okay) just want to be sure you are okay and taken care of. It sounds like, while it hurts, it's all growing pains and you are all working it out. Hope this weekend fairs better.
 
The unfortunate part is because they have a longstanding relationship, we think they are supposed to have it all worked out. It rarely works that way. .

I have been very fortunate in this. Redpepper and her husband sort of went through a new age of discovery last year. I would not have survived a week of the work and adventures they had..... my mono brain would have melted down LOL! I am glad to have met her towards the end of her search. I came along at a good time indeed.
 
Thanks, Redpepper :) I guess I also just posted it to be heard. I do appreciate all of the perspectives being offered.

It's just a nice feeling to be heard, ya know?
 
Yes, it is nice to be heard sometimes. Could you let us know when you just want to be heard... I wouldn't of gone off on you if I had known. I can see now that you have a handle on the situation and that you are feeling hurt and just sharing... sorry for stepping on your poly feet :D :eek:
 
No worries! And the caring is appreciated! Generally, I'll just ask for advice when I'm looking for advice. :)
 
Ceoli,

Thank you for sharing this because it gives me insight to what my (our) GF might feel when I'm insecure. Or really, more along the lines of what she felt early on after moving in when I was crazy from medication and all of my insecurities were magnified by like 1000.

Sweetie said something that caught my eye: "The unfortunate part is because they have a longstanding relationship, we think they are supposed to have it all worked out. It rarely works that way. Everyone is unique. Our feelings are not the same, the way we react is not the same."

This made me think of one thing that definitely I did not expect, and it's something my husband doesn't really see/feel. I obviously knew things would change by adding a third, but I don't necessarily know that I expected those changes to be so... crystallized. For example, when we first met in person, he told me he wasn't crazy about her kissing style. He loved to kiss her, but preferred how I kissed. What was interesting about this is that SHE told us we kissed "the same." Well, I guess after 10 years together, that's not so shocking... but what has evolved since is that he and I have observed, independently of each other, that we both kiss each other differently now.

That realization was significant for me. It showed me just what sort of very real, and sometimes tangible impact blending a third will have on our existing relationship. It sort of threw me for a loop, and scared me a little - at least at first. I thought, if something like that could change so dramatically, and so quickly, what else might change?

I share this only because when these thoughts were in my head, and I felt shaky as a result of that, I definitely withdrew a little. I was also acutely aware that she would not leave with either of us - this was a promise she made us, and he would never leave our marriage. He does not break promises, and marriage is the ultimate promise to him. So, when I was struggling, I kept thinking of all she'd given up and all she had to lose if I couldn't handle the whole triad thing after all. I was the one who wanted this... and if I took the two of them away from each other, it would've killed me, because I love them both, and I know they love each other. If I couldn't get my head in order and get a grip, and I cost them one another, and she lost everything as a result, that would've been devastating. Beyond that, I worried that my husband might stay in the marriage and never forgive me... I don't think he'd do that on purpose. Quite the contrary, I believe he'd try to forgive me... but I'm not sure he ever could, especially since I started all of this, and I wanted it. Not that he doesn't, too... but he didn't initiate it, he wasn't the one to dream it into something bigger than a virtual fling. I was.

All I am saying is that, hopefully, she is aware of your position even if she can't feel what you are feeling. I have definitely been very aware of my gf's position as our third... and still, reading your personal perspective is definitely enlightening and helpful. And now I must be a sap and go tell her I love her.
 
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