The cure for polphobia

I am in a state of (semi) shock just now....K has actually reached out to me through facebook. I do alot and typically get no response. He sent me a link to today's CNN article on poly.

I am slightly overwhelmed, believe it or not. a pretty nice overwhelmed though.
 
Great news; sounds like his way of opening up (if just a little)!
 
Keep in mind, I am not a moderator. But my guess is your link to the other thread will be fine.

I read your post on that other thread. It looks good. Sounds like you're getting better at "trying on your wife's shoes," as well as taking a dare and let K even closer into your lives by taking him to the movie.

I'm of mixed feelings about how good the movie'll be (I've read the book), but so far I've been hearing good things about it.

Anyway, sounds like you guys are moving closer to the dream of being a tight-knit poly clan, and that's a good thing. :)
 
dream

Yes, that's my dream, but I think it will remain a dream. Dagferi is right, but it will never be a triad in my estimation. I'm finished trying to even attempt to communicate with him about the relationship, it's pointless, unnecessary, I'm wasting my time. Things are clicking along fine without it.

I know she felt sad yesterday as she had invited him to share Thanksgiving with us, his place she had set for him at the table went unfilled. :(



In the meantime, we have joined some local poly groups and I am digging meeting like minded folk who are happily living this life. There are discussion and social groups, and we've met some exceptional people. It's easier having friends who know and have confronted all aspects of a poly existence. Even though K will rarely pass up an opportunity to spend time with my wife, he seems pretty determined to avoid these scenes. Which is cool, no point in pushing that with him either.

The groups are not billed as hookup meets, but it seems very possible we may make friends we can connect with on many levels. We've discussed the possibility of getting together with a few outside the meetups, and this is something we're looking forward to, although my wife has questioned her ability to accept it if I were to develop feelings for another as we projected several scenarios.
 
Some of your communication issues sound related to the natural differences between how men and women communicate. I just returned from a Women's Weekend workshop (focused on monogamous relationships but a lot of the same ideas apply) and we learned a lot about communication between the sexes.

While women like to talk about their relationships and feelings, they get frustrated when their men don't share the same amount of emotional energy in the same way they do. In general, women communicate with words, men communicate through actions. Poly men seem more adept at communication with words than usual, but this guy seems less comfortable with being poly than you, so he's probably more of an action's communicator. Look at what he does instead of what he says or doesn't say. Do his actions make your wife feel loved? Are his actions friendly and welcoming towards you?

I'm not a man so I'm not sure exactly how this works, but I would suggest you try communicating with him "like a man." Find "man time" activities you can bond over, sports, beer or whatever you dudes like. Think about other men that you have close (friendship) bonds with and how you interact with them. He's probably more comfortable with this kind of communication than getting all emotional and complex and wordy.

And help your wife to relax about his lack of communication...if she were to talk to any of her woman friends about their husbands she would get an earload of "my husband is the same way," "can't talk about 'us'." She's probably spoiled by your extremely good communication skills and thus expects him to be the same.
 
Re:
"Find 'man time' activities you can bond over, sports, beer or whatever you dudes like."

Haha, a certain reference comes to mind about the moon being really bright tonight, and making a fire and having drum circle.

Anyway SparklePony, that was a good and timely post. A good slice of perspective. I remember one of my male married friends saying, "My least favorite words in the whole world are, 'We need to talk about the relationship.'" Some men just have a terrible time trying to sort out and articulate their feelings. And listening -- truly listening -- to the other person speak can be a hard thing to do. "It sounds like she's criticizing me for all my bad points, and yet I have to somehow re-interpret that as a desire on her part to hear me say, 'It must be hard for you to go through all that stuff. I just want you to know that I do love you and that my desires to help you are sincere.'" And sometimes the right answer to a woman's complaints is just to gather her into your arms. It's hard sometimes for a man to know what the right thing is to do or say!

@ dali5671 ... It looks like you're headed for a V configuration in which the two legs/ends of the V only have a minor friendship or even just an acquaintanceship. Which isn't necessarily bad per se. It all has to do with what works for the three of you, as you're all three unique individuals.

Carry on and I hope we can continue to help!
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
Had a feeling things were going to go this way.

My advice is if your wife wants I in her life she needs to relax and enjoy the ride. Do not push for the attendance at poly events or etc. Murf would flip the fuck out if I asked him to attend a poly event. Why? Because he isn't poly. He wants to enjoy his relationship with me without pomp and circumstance. Heck I feel like he does. I have no urge to attend such events either. Butch is a social butterfly so he attends local munches and etc.

Your wife also needs to not be so self centered. She needs to ask herself why its it ok for her to date someone but for you she is not comfortable with it.
 
. I remember one of my male married friends saying, "My least favorite words in the whole world are, 'We need to talk about the relationship.'" Some men

Not just men, that line brings on a gag reflex with me too...I hate over processing and analysing every little tiny thing that happens in a relationship, why can't people just enjoy the people they are with I'll never know.....
 
Not just men, that line brings on a gag reflex with me too...I hate over processing and analysing every little tiny thing that happens in a relationship, why can't people just enjoy the people they are with I'll never know.....

Same here.. I do not need to talk about or overanalyze every aspect of my relationships.

If my guys actions show me they care. I am happy. I do not need constant verbal affirmation. I also can not deal with someone who needs that kind of relationship.
 
I suppose as polyamorists, we often find ourselves walking a fine line, because we know communication's a BFD, and yet there is such a thing as *too much* communication. Sometimes it might be a quality versus quantity thing. A whole buttload of talking isn't as good as some quietly shared moments with just a meaningful word here or there to give the meaning expression.

In the MFM V I'm in, the other guy just hates communicating, period. Well I take that back, he likes to talk about hockey, sports in general, what's going on at work, what the weather's like and what the forecast is, did the dog poop or just pee on her last trip around the apartment building, what's for dinner, even Muppets and My Little Pony :) ... but relationship matters? Ohhh, way to heavy for him. He can't collect his thoughts/feelings internally let alone articulate them externally.

So we don't make the poor guy talk, unless it's a full-blown emergency. Mostly we just share in his light chat and everybody's happy. True, took a few years of forming and storming before reaching today's state of norming, but ahh is this norming ever blissful.
 
Some of your communication issues sound related to the natural differences between how men and women communicate. I just returned from a Women's Weekend workshop (focused on monogamous relationships but a lot of the same ideas apply) and we learned a lot about communication between the sexes.

While women like to talk about their relationships and feelings, they get frustrated when their men don't share the same amount of emotional energy in the same way they do. In general, women communicate with words, men communicate through actions. Poly men seem more adept at communication with words than usual, but this guy seems less comfortable with being poly than you, so he's probably more of an action's communicator. Look at what he does instead of what he says or doesn't say. Do his actions make your wife feel loved? Are his actions friendly and welcoming towards you?

I'm not a man so I'm not sure exactly how this works, but I would suggest you try communicating with him "like a man." Find "man time" activities you can bond over, sports, beer or whatever you dudes like. Think about other men that you have close (friendship) bonds with and how you interact with them. He's probably more comfortable with this kind of communication than getting all emotional and complex and wordy.

And help your wife to relax about his lack of communication...if she were to talk to any of her woman friends about their husbands she would get an earload of "my husband is the same way," "can't talk about 'us'." She's probably spoiled by your extremely good communication skills and thus expects him to be the same.

OK, thanks SparklePony, I have never really had many guy friends, like I have ONE real friend that was not female, so maybe I am limited in being able to talk freely with him because of that. We have a few common interests, but he not the typical guy, zero interest in beer or sports, etc...:confused::confused: I am seeking some ground on which we may connect in this way. I get mixed vibes from about his feelings for me...I think I care for him much more. He's slowly getting more open with her about what's on his mind, and in his heart, so she is satisfied with the improvement.

His actions do completely make her feel loved. He is always there for her. He has some deep sadness regarding Thanksgiving from his past marriage, thus the no show Thursday. But he has on his indicated he is happy with their relationship, no pressure to commit from anyone, and is sticking around, we have discussed him moving in with us.
 
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Re:


Haha, a certain reference comes to mind about the moon being really bright tonight, and making a fire and having drum circle.

Anyway SparklePony, that was a good and timely post. A good slice of perspective. I remember one of my male married friends saying, "My least favorite words in the whole world are, 'We need to talk about the relationship.'" Some men just have a terrible time trying to sort out and articulate their feelings. And listening -- truly listening -- to the other person speak can be a hard thing to do. "It sounds like she's criticizing me for all my bad points, and yet I have to somehow re-interpret that as a desire on her part to hear me say, 'It must be hard for you to go through all that stuff. I just want you to know that I do love you and that my desires to help you are sincere.'" And sometimes the right answer to a woman's complaints is just to gather her into your arms. It's hard sometimes for a man to know what the right thing is to do or say!

@ dali5671 ... It looks like you're headed for a V configuration in which the two legs/ends of the V only have a minor friendship or even just an acquaintanceship. Which isn't necessarily bad per se. It all has to do with what works for the three of you, as you're all three unique individuals.

Carry on and I hope we can continue to help!
Sincerely,
Kevin T.

Thanks Kevin.

Yeah the comment about the drums and moon said loads. Basically I interpreted it as "back off!!" But I have no problems taking about feelings or the relationship if the need arises. Dahlia has a need to talk about it regularly, so the important thing is I am there for her when she needs it.:)
 
poly meetups

Had a feeling things were going to go this way.

My advice is if your wife wants I in her life she needs to relax and enjoy the ride. Do not push for the attendance at poly events or etc. Murf would flip the fuck out if I asked him to attend a poly event. Why? Because he isn't poly. He wants to enjoy his relationship with me without pomp and circumstance. Heck I feel like he does. I have no urge to attend such events either. Butch is a social butterfly so he attends local munches and etc.

Your wife also needs to not be so self centered. She needs to ask herself why its it ok for her to date someone but for you she is not comfortable with it.

Our plan is keep the invitation open for the non discussion groups, I think he may enjoy meeting some of the people, but no pushing!!! Easy access all the way. I am impressed by the people in attendance in the groups. OK, I am new to poly so forgive me if this sounds naive, but these people have their shit together, I think you must have things in order personally to live this life. But it is a huge relief to me hear them say things that I can relate to so fully, since my only other info comes from this website and a couple of FB groups one of our members introduced me to.

Is there some irony in the fact that it's me who is joining this website and the meetup groups?? I have one lover. I am doing so in order to fully understand and embrace poly I guess. I am familiar with the compersion feeling though, I can feel real joy through her feelings.

As far as her being self centered? This entire excursion was prompted by my hotwifing dreams. We evolved to poly more or less from there. I would say she is by far, much less selfish than I. Like not even close. In fact, I am delighted that she is such the center of attention between K and I, and admits she feels a little spoiled by all the love, attention and sex she receives from two men. I think she deserves it. Of course, affairs of the heart are different, but she has agreed it is something that may take some adjustment to accept if I find a lover as well. I would prefer if we do find another, she would be bisexual, someone she may be able to build a loving relationship with as well.
 
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I loooves me some poly forums. But there's just something about a live poly group you can meet with in your area that isn't quite the same thing, am I right?

To be able to look someone in the eye, see the face and body language of approval, shake their hand and say you're glad to see them again. My last poly potluck had so many happy greetings, yet so many wistful good-byes (as I move from Albuquerque to Seattle next week).

I know we'll find a new poly group in Seattle though, and make just as good of friends.

I hope things work out well for you guys, whether you end up with just the configuration you were looking for, or perhaps a pleasant surprise!

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
hmmmm

Had a feeling things were going to go this way.

My advice is if your wife wants I in her life she needs to relax and enjoy the ride. Do not push for the attendance at poly events or etc. Murf would flip the fuck out if I asked him to attend a poly event. Why? Because he isn't poly. He wants to enjoy his relationship with me without pomp and circumstance. Heck I feel like he does. I have no urge to attend such events either. Butch is a social butterfly so he attends local munches and etc.

Your wife also needs to not be so self centered. She needs to ask herself why its it ok for her to date someone but for you she is not comfortable with it.

I agree the wife needs to look inward and I wonder as he is bi what would be the feelings if he met a guy only into him ,would it illicit the same I am the only woman for you reaction or one of a quandary he finds himself in????
 
2 years later

So I was having an online discussion with a friend and she referred me to this site to read an article. And rereading my thread from Oct. 2013. My post sounds a little naive as I read it today. I have learned. I'm a little wiser. But that would be the hope for anybody two years later, right? But the poly LS is still a little bumpy for us.

Here's where we are now. K is a part of our home, and has been since Feb of 2014, nearly 2 years ago. We was getting ready to move from his apartment, was having some health issues too. So we decided it would be better for everyone if he moved in. It's been good. Good for their relationship and good for his health. He gets plenty of exercise, gardening, and outdoor time, stuff he couldn't get at the apt.

We are not open to our kids however. They are HS seniors, and we decided not to self disclose this to them. Do they know??? I don't know, but kids usually know more than what the adults think they know. To our friends, come out to several, but neither advertise or deny. I am certain some would struggle with the notion.

The bumpy part includes any relationships beyond our V. Dagferi wrote "
Your wife also needs to not be so self centered. She needs to ask herself why its it ok for her to date someone but for you she is not comfortable with it." If I made a description of my wife self centered wouldn't be on it. She is probably the least selfish person I've met, and I have tried to encourage to more for herself. But she spends her time worrying if she's doing enough for us. Which she does, and more than enough. But I think it's her personal self esteem issues that may discourage either K or myself from getting involved with anyone else. She also said I was too invested in our relationship. I think that is called co-dependence, and nothing could be more true. That co-dependence puts me the odd man out on a regular basis, maybe not such a healthy trait for a poly dynamic, right?


..to be continued...
 
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beyond the V

Me dating

I tried the dating. The poly folk we met at the local potluck, all married and dating, suggested OKC. I ran an ad, and had a couple of dates. The online chatting was more fun than the dates, they seemed a bit boring, and overall, a waste of time. I feel like I did it simply because everyone else was. I deleted the ad and decided if I were to encounter someone on my everyday path, perhaps we could go out, maybe have fun, be friends, maybe more. But I was not doing an online dating scene. It seems forced. Desperate??

K dating

We (Dahlia and I) have been more involved with our local Ren Faire this year. Several weeks ago, we ran into a woman there who is a friend of K., and she informed me that she wanted him to escort her to Last Day. The twist is, he introduced us to the place, and had yet to come with us this year. The woman is very pretty, and a musical protege to K., and Dahlia is jealous of the relationship. She feels threatened. We have talked at length on the possibility of something blooming there. I feel like she should be supportive, I think she nothing to fear. But it's because I have taken that leap of faith.

They went together and spent the day wandering around, we caught up later after closing and attended some parties, but she was jealous, and to combat these feelings, drank too much and we had to go before we should have.

Other than that, he is a total homebody.


Dahlia dating

I think neither myself or K would have a problem with it. My only suggestion would be to date a woman, she has enough male energy in her life right now.


Unrelated note
Interesting that a large number of Rennies we meet are in open relationships. Anyone else notice that?
 
Hi dali5671, good to hear from you again. It sounds like things are going fairly well for you guys, glad the move-in with K went smoothly.

Alternative/fringe groups (Renaissance fairs, goth culture, sci-fi conventions, indie music, BDSM) tend to have more open-minded people and thus, I'm not surprised you've encountered more open relationships among Rennies.

Regards,
Kevin T.
 
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