Does poly help or hurt a marriage?

There is our life, the core or primary partnership, the marriage. As we date others there are external fluctuations that affect the marriage in both good and bad ways. Good ways, you come home excited to share your day, event or evening. You are exposed to new things and in turn take your spouse to that restaurant, that conversation, that new hobby or kink explored. You bring it home and share and explore those new things together. Great sex outside the home can be great sex inside the home. It can also generate sadness because, “you are not that creative with me”, “you never took me there”, “how come you didn’t think to bring me a trinket from your adventure?”, “can’t we do that together or is that reserved and special now”, “I know the sex is great over here but it means we’re having less sex together here”, “the time over there is detracting from our ability to take care of life”.

Then there’s the uneven ebbs and flows of other relationships. We may not be dating at the same time. Breakups mean we turn to each other for comfort. My new found “time” is now a burden because you going out this much was ok when I was dating and now feels lonely when I’m not. You go out too much. I have less opportunity. You have less interest. I’m injured and stuck at home. I’m glad your happy but I wish I could find that.

So I have all these questions rattling around as I think about our history in poly and I can’t decide if poly helps or hurts a marriage. Does it give us more of what we want and therefore we stay together getting our needs met or are we getting more of what we want outside the marriage and now I don’t share it at home. Does it feed or drain the marriage or do some parts feed or drain more than others. My point being that poly or casual both adds and detracts depending on how the couple sees and handles it.

How has it affected your primary relationship?
 
Not every polyamorist has or wants a relationship that is considered "primary" nor views their relationships hierarchically, but I would say that whether poly helps or hurts a marriage depends on the people involved.

Are the individuals who are married to each other self-aware? Are they able to handle their own difficult feelings, like jealousy, without getting into the blame game? Do they each recognize when/if they are feeling competitive or insecure and willing to take responsibility for their own emotional storms? Are each of them able to let go of the sense of entitlement, ownership, and possessiveness towards their spouse, and enjoy the gifts that others can bring into their lives? Or do they see their marriage as the center of the universe and other people with whom they are involved as extraneous satellites orbiting around them?

I think the biggest challenge for anyone who embarks on a polyamorous journey is to look at how we've been taught to view marriage and relationships, examine any expectations we hold over others (consciously and subconciously), and to be brave enough and okay enough with letting go of our pre-conceived notions about relationships and partnerships and marriage so that we can shape our relationships in new ways that work better for who we are right now. Although a healthy relationship is a healthy relationship is a healthy relationship, whether poly or mono, it doesn't work to try and fit poly into the traditional expectations of monogamous marriage.
 
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Depends on the marriage and the people involved.

One thing poly does do is show every single flaw in a relationship and magnify it ten fold. It's like placing a flashlight in a ceramic vase in a dark room. If there is any cracks you are going to find them quickly.
 
Hello Orlandobif,

My situation is somewhat different in that I am in a closed V, and all three of us are primary. All I can say is that two of us (the other two) are a legally/lawfully-wed couple, and their marriage seems (to me) to be doing fine.

I think you just have to deal with each little thing as it comes up, you know? Just as in monogamous marriages, there's no guarantee that the marriage will last (for how long?) and you have to put some work into it.

Hope that helps.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
So many variables

I think it's difficult to say whether poly has helped or hurt our marriage, because I can't say what position we'd be in if we hadn't opened up to poly, but my gut feeling is that it's helped. I was talking to my husband the other day about the fact that we've just lost a good portion of the stuff that couples argue over because we're both able to be honest with each other about how we feel about other people without fear of recrimination.

Of course there are poly-generated issues - like NRE, time management etc. - but I think from reading around and general courtesy we've been overly aware what those potential issues are, and tried to solve or work around them before they become a problem - like being extra careful to listen to the other's concerns during NRE, making sure that more of the time we spend together is quality time when there's someone else in the frame, etc.

Plus I would also be inclined to agree with others that if the relationship wasn't great in the first place, chances are poly isn't going to help - but it would be hard to blame poly if it doesn't work out without knowing what the outcome would have been otherwise.
 
Broccoli can hurt a marriage if your partner is prone to gas...lol

This is probably the ONLY case in which I'd advocate revenge. :D
Sweet, sweet, horrible, poisonous revenge.

Also, I agree with the "poly will shine light on the cracks in your relationship" comment above. Any insecurity will be highlighted like a neon sign in the desert. Learning to work through all that is key, and really can help your relationship be stronger in the long run.
 
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As nycindie said, there are a number of different ways to do poly...not all of them involve a married couple who are primary, dating others who are secondary.

I think that a big question is whether the people involved are being very honest with themselves, and then with others. So you have this married couple and they are opening or doing poly in some way. Maybe they are swingers, maybe they are unicorn hunting, maybe they each date others or they date another couple as a quad/group. Etc. Is everyone involved really...REALLY...doing that is happy and natural, safe and sane and truly consensual in an informed and thought out way...? Is one maybe wanting something and the other going along to make them happy or not lose them? Is there coercive behavior going on to push one to accept something they are unhappy with? Are compromises discussed fairly and agreements adhered to? Are the agreements made reasonable ones in the first place?

This stuff is pretty high-level relating. I do not think that everyone is necessarily capable of it. I know many people who adhere to the preconceived assumptions about what relationships are supposed to be, simply because examining their own selves in that much depth is scary, because confronting insecurities is scary, because change and growth are scary. Honestly, I know a lot of people who carry a bit of attitude that being part of the kink and/or poly communities makes one a little more evolved. Well that isn't necessarily true and I don't think that poly is necessarily "better." HOWEVER...I do think that it's far more common for those who have found happiness in these lifestyles to have explored their own inner workings in greater depth, than the majority of monofolk do. I often refer to "muggles" and I mean those who assume there is only One Right Way to do love, sex, and relationships...and anyone else is just a weirdo.

So. I think that some people who have a history of poly living, especially those who have been in communities, who have done a lot of learning and thinking and exploring, by virtue of simply being more inclined to self awareness and having done the work to develop communication skills...as individuals, might be better partners and therefore a marriage might benefit.

EDIT: I should say, I strongly believe that my experience and lessons learned in poly would make me a better mono partner if I were to do that in the future. The self exploration has been good for me.

But that is only meant to apply to those who are well past the fumbling early stages of "we're seeking our third," "we just opened," "no feelings allowed," "we went to a swinger club," and "I caught spouse cheating, now spouse says they are poly." Etc.
 
I consider my marriage "primary" only in the "we are legally married and live together" sense, not in the emotional/mental sense. In other words, I place weight on whichever of my relationships needs the more attention and energy, regardless of whether that's my marriage or my relationship with Woody.

I would say, however, that poly has been good for my marriage, because Hubby understands how I do it. It took a while for him to comprehend that I was offended when he said things like "I'm your husband and he's just your boyfriend" (which was two boyfriends and about two and a half years ago), but he now gets that while he is important to me, and I intend to give attention to our marriage, he is not *more* important than Woody, or any other partner I might have; he's just important in different ways.

Hubby is introverted to the point that he barely interacts with me, preferring to be alone in his man-cave and just know I'm around. We have some discrepancies sexually in terms of drive and interests. I have been abused and bullied, and was taught from an early age that I was unwanted, unloved, and unlovable, and that having any interest in sex at all was WRONG, so having Hubby not want to spend time *with* me instead of just near me, and having him shoot down most of my sexual requests, did a lot of damage even though he had no ill intent. Three and a half years ago, our marriage was at the breaking point. Last year, because of external stress, it reached that point again.

But because I have other partners, I have someone I can turn to at times like that. I am not always accurate in my perceptions of what's going on with other people, because I've been conditioned to believe people are either going to hurt me or dislike me, so Hubby and Woody (and Hubby and my previous two boyfriends when I was with them) serve as "guy translators"; with their consent, I talk to each of them about problems or concerns I'm having with the other, and they help me sort out the reality from my abuse-warped perceptions.

Hubby is thrilled that I have others to talk to, who do actually spend time *with* me and whose sexual interests and appetites are a better match for mine. Woody and each of my previous two partners actively and by choice help(ed) to keep Hubby's and my marriage intact, and more than once Hubby has helped keep one of my other relationships intact. (Most recently, when I had a major issue with Woody, Hubby actually said, "Please don't break up with him. He's so good for you.")

So it isn't only that poly has been good for my marriage. Poly has been good for *me* because each of the three actual partners I've had since poly/open marriage became a thing three years ago have had almost a symbiotic thing with Hubby, where we all work together to keep both relationships healthy.
 
. . . I can’t decide if poly helps or hurts a marriage. Does it give us more of what we want and therefore we stay together getting our needs met or are we getting more of what we want outside the marriage and now I don’t share it at home. Does it feed or drain the marriage or do some parts feed or drain more than others. My point being that poly or casual both adds and detracts depending on how the couple sees and handles it.

So it isn't only that poly has been good for my marriage. Poly has been good for *me* . . .
I do think there is an important distinction that KC made here. Many people place preserving their marriage/relationship as the highest priority, above all others in their life. That is usually what's behind someone desperately trying to "save" a marriage "at all costs" - even when it costs them their own satisfaction and happiness. Why is the marriage more important than the emotional health and psychological well-being of each person who entered the marriage? Marriage is not a concrete thing, like something a thief can steal from you; it is simply an agreement between two individuals. When one or both of those individuals are unhappy, why do most people in society automatically look at the marriage as needing fixing/saving/rescuing, rather than advising the individuals to ask what they each need to be happy? It's puzzling to me.

To me, monogamy is just as high a level of relating as poly is. Otherwise there wouldn't be so many self-help books out there aimed at people who want healthy monogamous relationships and haven't figured out how to have them. People who say monogamy is the easy route just because it's socially approved as the norm, are wrong. The parameters are different, but certainly, any kind of intimate relating has its challenges, benefits, and downsides. Any kind of relating challenges a person to grow. And yes, for either polyamory or monogamy to work as the structure for a relationship, that relationship does need to be strong and healthy. But a relationship is only as healthy as the people relating.

Orlandobif, instead of asking whether poly helps or hinders a marriage, ask whether it helps or hinders YOU, as an individual, in your own self-growth, journey to self-knowledge, and ability to be happy. You come first in your life, and your partners come first in their lives. All we can do is, while taking care of ourselves, see how we can meet others on their paths and share who we are with them, for whatever amount of time it works for everyone.
 
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I do think there is an important distinction that KC made here. Many people place preserving their marriage/relationship as the highest priority, above all others in their life. That is usually what's behind someone desperately trying to "save" a marriage "at all costs" - even when it costs them their own satisfaction and happiness. Why is the marriage more important than the emotional health and psychological well-being of each person who entered the marriage? Marriage is not a concrete thing, like something a thief can steal from you; it is simply an agreement between two individuals. When one or both of those individuals are unhappy, why do most people in society automatically look at the marriage as needing fixing/saving/rescuing, rather than advising the individuals to ask what they each need to be happy? It's puzzling to me.

To me, monogamy is just as high a level of relating as poly is. Otherwise there wouldn't be so many self-help books out there aimed at people who want healthy monogamous relationships and haven't figured out how to have them. People who say monogamy is the easy route just because it's socially approved as the norm, are wrong. The parameters are different, but certainly, any kind of intimate relating has its challenges, benefits, and downsides. Any kind of relating challenges a person to grow. And yes, for either polyamory or monogamy to work as the structure for a relationship, that relationship does need to be strong and healthy. But a relationship is only as healthy as the people relating.

Instead of asking whether poly helps or hinders a marriage, ask whether it helps or hinders YOU, as an individual, in your own self-growth, journey to self-knowledge, and ability to be happy. You come first in your life, and your partners come first in their lives. All we can do is, while taking care of ourselves, see how we can meet others on their paths and share who we are with them, for whatever amount of time it works for everyone.

I think that poly has helped me to grow and become better at relating because I've sought and found healthier ideas from others, from communities, I've done more self-work. I've had to explore my choices and motivations in greater depth. It's not that those ideas did not exist to be found when I was monogamous, or that I couldn't have done the self work then to become better at relating...but I felt no need to seek. I followed a set of rules whether I believed them or not, and I didn't question that I had to, because it was "the way things are" and if I didn't do what I was "supposed to do" then I was simply a bad person.

And frankly, with my ex, there is no way that this level of self awareness and honest talk about emotions and motivations would have gone over well in that relationship...it would have been perceived as a threat. Basically anything but "follow the rules that mono marriages are made of" would have been an unwelcome threat. I put my head down and plodded onwards for 18 long years like that.

But even when I got out of it, I spent a few months just kind of flailing around with no idea what I wanted or was trying to do, before I started even beginning to get a clue. But getting into polyamory opened up this entire world of information, different ways of thinking...THAT is what, I believe, has improved my relationship skills in ways that would help me regardless if I were living mono or poly.

So you're right that it's not so much a matter of one or the other being the high level relating...but I still think that many mono people just go on cruise control of "the way things are and how we're supposed to be" instead of exploring their thoughts, feelings, etc in greater depth, and that those who set out to take a more unusual path are perhaps more likely to explore more ideas and skillsets out there, and learn from them in positive ways.

I didn't know the term "NRE" when I was monogamous. I didn't know the word "compersion" although I'd felt it many times for many people in my life. I feel that with as much as I've learned about myself in the last year, I can negotiate new relationships far more fairly than I ever could before.
 
My previous post was for the OP and wasn't a criticism of you nor directed to you, Spork, just to be clear.

Oh, I know.

I guess...it's just a question of what helps a person grow?

Some people probably would or would not take the steps to expand their understanding of themselves and others, regardless of their circumstances.

FWIW I also get more of the feeling that poly people understand that relationships are voluntary things that optimally, you choose freely.

To me, an unsuccessful marriage is an unhappy one, no matter the duration of it. When one or more people is just miserable. What does it take for someone to be more inclined to walk away from unhappiness, rather than stick with it longer than they should? I think that's a valid line of inquiry, as many seem to think that a "successful marriage" or relationship, is measured by if it can last "happily ever after" until someone dies. Or if not happily, at least the people can cope in it.

I posted on a thread on FB about a poly article once, and there were plenty of the anti-poly camp there and one man, after I discussed my life config as it presently stands, simply said, "It will fail." I was not even defensive, I just sat and wondered what on earth he could possibly mean by that?

Eventually I replied that if he meant my relationships will at some point end, I expect he is right...I don't expect or demand that they last forever. I want them to last only so long as everyone involved wants to keep doing them. However, I suspect that I'll continue being good friends with these folks long after we have moved on from being lovers. Which, in my thinking, is no kind of failure...but only success.
 
I know I've grown immensely, and give credit to my partners--which means, indirectly, I give credit to being poly.

I don't consider myself good at relationships. It is very easy for me to say "fuck it, this is too hard" and walk away. It is also very easy for me to think "Okay, they just feel sorry for me, and if I cause too much hassle or ask too much, they'll leave."

My marriage to Hubby suffered because of that; he was the first real relationship I had after the end of my first marriage. (I met him not quite a year and a half after leaving my ex.) I had spent that time saying I didn't want another relationship, let alone marriage, because it was too much pressure. I was pretty successful with hookups and FWBs, because there wasn't as much of an emotional investment. I was like that at first with Hubby, too, but when we agreed we were in a relationship, all of a sudden I fell back into the same thought and behavior patterns as I'd had with my ex. Like hiding from Hubby when I thought I'd pissed him off because I was afraid of what he might do to me. (He has never, ever done anything remotely abusive. I can count on one hand the number of times he's even raised his voice to me in the eight years we've been together, and I would have one or two fingers left over.)

So with Hubby, the dynamic became me as "needy person" and him as mighty taker-care-of. Which was what he wanted; he has told me he likes it when I'm needy because it gives him purpose. He sometimes actually gets turned on when I'm upset (once I've calmed down enough to be receptive to him being turned on) because he feels like he's taking care of me and protecting me, and that makes him feel more manly and attractive, I guess.

My relationships with Guy and S2 obviously had issues, and with S2, the "fuck it, it's too hard, I'm going to walk away" was too hard to go through with, as some of you might remember. But I did learn from those relationships. I learned that Hubby's avoidance of spending time with me wasn't anything about me; I had two other men who wanted to be around me and actually interacted with me when I was there, so obviously it wasn't a problem with me. I found my voice and learned to speak up when something wasn't right or went against my preferences or boundaries. I learned to trust someone so completely that I could fall asleep in his arms, after NEVER being able to do that wiht anyone, and regardless of what I think of S2 now, I will always thank him for giving me that.

Those relationships prepared me for the one I now have with Woody, which I would say is unquestionably the healthiest, most respectful, most equitable (despite him being my Dom) relationship I've ever been in. From him, I've learned to--mostly--accept myself as a sexual being, to ask for what I want sexually and otherwise, to believe that I deserve good things and good people in my life. I have relearned how to trust, because S2 broke that pretty severely at the end of our relationship, and I now trust Woody so fully that I not only fall asleep in his arms but am able to *stay* asleep there, and to accept him reaching for me, or allow myself to reach for him, during the night without fear that he'll be angry if I wake him. I actually believe him when he says he won't turn away from me just because I'm having a bad day or get bitchy or panicky. I believe him when he says our relationship lasts until *I* say otherwise. Things I haven't even believed when Hubby said them--but because Woody says them and I believe, I am slowly coming to believe Hubby as well.

I've changed in huge ways, positive ways. I've become more whole than I've ever been, and even though it's still a two steps forward, one step back process, I've made tremendous gains I wouldn't have made without the support and freedom to be who I am.

So yeah, poly has definitely brought me growth.
 
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Depends on the marriage and the people involved.

One thing poly does do is show every single flaw in a relationship and magnify it ten fold. It's like placing a flashlight in a ceramic vase in a dark room. If there is any cracks you are going to find them quickly.

I agree with this, I had no idea that my marriage had issues until I got a boyfriend. I think what we went through could have killed a lot of marriages. I was very dedicated on making my marriage work and we did a lot of talking and really getting to know each other the first year I had a boyfriend.
 
I wonder this too, sometimes, for reasons that are obvious for those who read my blog. All that said, though, I am pretty convinced that without the outlet? opportunity? to explore other connections without it being the end of our marriage we'd be in a lot worse shape. All the things that stress us out would still be there, which would make its lot more tempting to throw in the towel for "grass is greener" syndrome.

And there's the aspect of personal growth that KC43 has talked about - that's true for me, as well. TheKnight and I were seriously overly entwined, almost codependent for years, and I much prefer us relating to each other as the separate people we never learned to be because we met so young.
 
I agree that the success of poly depends on the people within the marriage.
When we opened our marriage it was a more a response to a few minor issues we had within it. While I doubt that those issues would have broke the marriage, they were making some aspect's unpleasant. At that time i had no idea what poly was, it wasn't until later on that i found i could have feeling's for someone other than my wife, and then discovered polyamory.
So far thing's have worked well. We found some challenges, Grown closer, expanded our mindset, and are more sexually attracted than ever. We both get different thing's out of relationship's and friendship's. I could only guess where we would be If we did not proceed this way. I feel our relationship would be in a bad spot, it's only a guess though.
 
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