Is polyamory more evolved?

Kerala

New member
Many people living that way imply this - as most people assume there livestyle is better than those of otheres - the very reason they chose it, right? Then people thinking a bit deeper recognize the asymmetry in this style of thinking and stigmatize it as arrogant (like in this http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showpost.php?p=299445&postcount=42.

My view on this: in general if you have a sea of possibilities to create loving relationships and then choose for you that only a tiny subset of it can make you happy and you limit your life and that of your partner to it, you should have good reasons for it and be able to articulate them! Just getting angry by the sheer mentioning of other possibilities or just stating "I never could do this" or referring to relegion or moral does not do the trick.

No wonder polyamorists who (mostly) went through the process of thinking through their desires, options, fears and so on come to the conclusion that they are a step ahead.

Even more so if you see how convinced monogomists suddenly change their mind when they fall in love (and then experience that their current/previous love does not disolve all of a sudden as expected) or you look at the world full of cheating (shure, all those who have not cheated yet are the better (ah - there is it again, the thinking to be 'better' I mean ) ones and never will do it - lol ).
 
I think the most truly evolved people are the ones who know themselves well enough to say "I'd never do that".

I can understand why some people might want to feel that they are more evolved than people who want monogamy, but it simply isn't the case.
 
My personal thoughts on this is that living a life of love is more 'evolved' or 'healthy' or 'forward moving' than living a life of fear. Regardless of the form that takes. If living a life of love means one relationship for someone, and not choosing monogamy out of fear, then that's great. If living a life of love means multiple relationships for someone, and not choosing polyamory out of fear, then that's also great. More love, less fear.
 
No.

More right for person X, perhaps. Ill-suited as a love-style for person Y, maybe. But certainly no more evolved than any other. The trick is simply figuring out what is right for YOU - whatever that is is what will feel more 'evolved' to you.
 
"Evolved" just means that you're "doing things the way I think they should be done." There are no levels in life, no person "higher" than another and stratifying people this way (even if highly esteemed people do it - and many of them do) is to miss the gifts that every single person has to offer. Anyone who thinks he is "more evolved" than other "lesser thinking" people is seeing things from a very limited perspective, cutting himself off from an enormous treasure and a big part of himself. There are people who allow their well being to flow more than others and who would be a lot happier if they chose to do so, but no such thing as a "superior" or more evolved way to live.
 
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Nope. Non-monogamy and monogamy are simply approaches to relationships that a person can choose from for themselves. Neither is more or less "evolved" than the other. The only questions one need ask is whether the particular approach they've chosen is right for them, and whether they can manage whatever type of relationship they want in a manner that is caring, considerate, ethical, and respectful towards themselves and the person(s) they are in relationship with.
 
While I would not say that polyamorous people are "more evolved" than monogamous people, I will say that I believe acceptance toward those who are polyamorous is "more evolved" -- if by "evolved" we mean more mature, wiser, more sophisticated ... and kind. (To me, kinder people are both wiser and more mature than unkind people.)

At present, all forms of non-monogamy (apart from serial monogamy, perhaps) in our society are at least somewhat stigmatized and taboo. This includes the "ethically non-monogamous" such as polayamorous people. And the consequences are very similar to other types of unfair and unjust marginalization and abuse as has been the case with other classes of marginalized (i.e., disempowered, oppressed, castigated, punished, excluded, shunned, ostracized, abused...) people such as LGBT people and certain "racial" groups, etc.

My hope is that, over time, our culture / society will come to see polyamory as a perfectly normal, natural and acceptable choice from among a range of valid choices on how to be within intimate relationships. And that, for me, will certainly be "more evolved".
 
I would say not at all more evolved. It's just a different way of going about things. A way that is as fraught with chances to get things wrong and behave unkindly as any other way of going about relationships is.

Yes - lots of mono folks can't stand discussing any form of non-monogamy or refuse to consider it without really being able to give reasons for their utter dislike of it.

There are equally plenty of poly folk who operate with a list of rules that are intended to keep their marriage as always more important than any other relationships that either party may form. A practise that is restrictive both to the people in the marriage and to anybody outside it who forms a relationship with one of the people in the marriage.

Then there are the people who dump their other relationships if there is any hint of problems in their marriage.

Then there are is fairly regular stream of pregnant women or women who are caring for infants who's husband has come to them and said that he is polyamorous, in love with another woman and that if the wife loved them, they would understand why they need to be out fucking the other woman rather than caring for the new life they helped create.

None of these situations seem particularly evolved to me.

People can do poly very well and very considerately too. People can also do mono very well and very considerately.

Depends on the people involved really - rather than the relationship style.
 
Our culture accepting polyamory as a legitimate lifestyle/orientation might make us more evolved as a society.

But individually? I've seen plenty of users and abusers practicing their version of "ethical" non monogamy. They are more evolved than no one.
 
Like River and LoveBunny indicated, society has yet to do a good job of recognizing and accepting polyamory as a valid relationship model. In that sense we could "evolve more." However, I don't see polyamory itself as a "more evolved" relationship model.
 
I'm in the acceptance, kindness, honesty, ethics and empathy are evolved behaviours camp. Not how many people you love.

Plenty of people claim to love more than one but there is very little of any of the above in their behaviour towards their partners.
 
I believe that it's more evolved to accept things that you don't like if it makes people that do like it happy... as long as it causes no harm to you or others that are unaccepting.

If that makes any sense.

Several examples:
  • It's more evolved to accept homosexual relationships... as long as those in the relationships are made happy by them. Even if you don't want one for yourself or it wouldn't make you happy.
  • It's more evolved to accept polyamorous relationships... as long as those in the relationships are made happy by them. Even if you don't want one for yourself or it wouldn't make you happy.
  • It's more evolved to accept BDSM relationships... as long as those in the relationships are made happy by them. Even if you don't want one for yourself or it wouldn't make you happy.

When a person or group believes that their way is the ONLY way, and that they have the right to force that way upon others, they show that they are NOT evolved.
 
Like others have said, poly isn't more evolved or morally superior. I do think that for some people, the process of opening a relationship results in more self-awareness and a kinder, more loving, accepting, and self-less approach to others. Because the individual has evolved, he/she erroneously believes that poly is more evolved when really opening the relationship was just the catalyst for the growth.
 
The skills necessary for successful and healthy Poly are hard won and more evolved. They are skills that are useful for ALL relationships. Is an Olympic level runner more evolved than my slow ass? I would say so.
 
The skills necessary for successful and healthy Poly are hard won and more evolved.
More evolved than what, exactly?

They are skills that are useful for ALL relationships. Is an Olympic level runner more evolved than my slow ass? I would say so.

An Olympic runner's skills may be more expert and practiced and evolved than your running skills, sure. But relationships are relationships are relationships. A polyamorous approach to relationships requires the same relating skills as a monogamous approach to relationships. Off the top of my head, as I see it:

  • Good communication - listening, sharing your inner thoughts/feelings honestly, asking for what one wants, allowing space for your partner to do the same, and letting go of criticizing while expressing disappointment, etc.

  • Self-management & self-knowledge - knowing oneself very well, recognizing one's own thought processes and beliefs so as not to blame or ascribe one's own emotional reactions to things on a partner, accepting one's own strengths and weaknesses, having some sort of method or plan to set or reach goals and manage one's life.

  • Conflict resolution - staying present and focused on the topic, willingness to apologize and/or forgive, express gratitude for things one appreciates, having empathy for the other, knowing when to table a discussion, letting go of the need to be right.

  • Respect for oneself and one's partner - being able to bend when necessary but not tolerate shitty treatment, showing that you care for and value a partner with acts of kindness and consideration, giving a partner a safe space to be who they are, acknowledging each person's autonomy, allowing them privacy, accepting differences between you.

  • Responsibility & maturity - taking care of what needs to be done, being reliable and trustworthy to show up as promised, helping foster a caring and safe environment, looking out for and caring for the people we love.

  • Cultivating the relationship - keeping the fun & excitement alive, not taking a partner for granted (never giving in to the idea that each of you is the same person you always were, unchanging), noticing the little things that make a partner happy and feel valued, knowing their love language, surprising each other with gestures of love regularly, striving to balance doing pleasurable things together along with mundane chores, and making an effort to re-connect when feeling distant.

None of these are pertinent only to monogamy or only polyamory. These are some of the skills and efforts needed for either approach. So, no, even though polyamory might require better time management skills for some people, neither is more evolved than the other.
 
More evolved than what, exactly?



An Olympic runner's skills may be more expert and practiced and evolved than your running skills, sure. But relationships are relationships are relationships. A polyamorous approach to relationships requires the same relating skills as a monogamous approach to relationships. Off the top of my head, as I see it:

  • Good communication - listening, sharing your inner thoughts/feelings honestly, asking for what one wants, allowing space for your partner to do the same, and letting go of criticizing while expressing disappointment, etc.

  • Self-management & self-knowledge - knowing oneself very well, recognizing one's own thought processes and beliefs so as not to blame or ascribe one's own emotional reactions to things on a partner, accepting one's own strengths and weaknesses, having some sort of method or plan to set or reach goals and manage one's life.

  • Conflict resolution - staying present and focused on the topic, willingness to apologize and/or forgive, express gratitude for things one appreciates, having empathy for the other, knowing when to table a discussion, letting go of the need to be right.

  • Respect for oneself and one's partner - being able to bend when necessary but not tolerate shitty treatment, showing that you care for and value a partner with acts of kindness and consideration, giving a partner a safe space to be who they are, acknowledging each person's autonomy, allowing them privacy, accepting differences between you.

  • Responsibility & maturity - taking care of what needs to be done, being reliable and trustworthy to show up as promised, helping foster a caring and safe environment, looking out for and caring for the people we love.

  • Cultivating the relationship - keeping the fun & excitement alive, not taking a partner for granted (never giving in to the idea that each of you is the same person you always were, unchanging), noticing the little things that make a partner happy and feel valued, knowing their love language, surprising each other with gestures of love regularly, striving to balance doing pleasurable things together along with mundane chores, and making an effort to re-connect when feeling distant.

None of these are pertinent only to monogamy or only polyamory. These are some of the skills and efforts needed for either approach. So, no, even though polyamory might require better time management skills for some people, neither is more evolved than the other.

These are all excellent -- valid and true -- points. However I think there is something to the notion that poly folk must develop specific and particular skills, in order to be successful at polyamory, which monogamous folks don't require for success in monogamy. Those skills are subsets of the ones you listed, Nycindie. And they are the same skills, in essence, which any marginalized (and/or taboo) minority or frequently ostrasized class of people will need to develop to be sucessful at their relationships.

Gays, lesbians, bisexuals (and biamorous...) queers, mixed race couples (or partnerships), people with handicaps... mixed ethnic couples/partnerships... these and more can be mistreated unfairly (a deliberate redundancy), and require yet more patience and skillfulness maintaining their relationships sometimes. They are at greater risk of all kinds of relational and personal stress because of their marginalization and mistreatment by those who will not accept them as just regular folk, ordinary people (ordinary in that we're all different and unique in lots of ways).

I've been generally treated kindly and with respect by most people -- as a biamorous poly guy. But some people can be brutally unkind to folks like me -- or anyone who is deemed "different," and thus "unacceptable". To maintain my well-being, I've had to refine some of the skills Nycindie listed to a greater degree than I imagine heterosexual (and heteroamorous) monogamous folk have required to maintain their well-being.

However, I do not wear emblems of my "differentness" everywhere I go, and I suspect my life would be much more challenging if I did. While I am not In The Closet about my differences, neither do I loundly proclaim them everywhere. And so I feel I have to be on some level of constant guardedness, however large or small, on account of my being "different" from what much of "society" expects and demands of its members.

Some special skills are probably involved here -- or the same skills weilded to a heightened degree. And I say this not as a brag, but more as a sort of sad but tolerable (I hope) complaint.
 
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An Olympic runner's skills may be more expert and practiced and evolved than your running skills, sure. But relationships are relationships are relationships. A polyamorous approach to relationships requires the same relating skills as a monogamous approach to relationships.

I'd definitely agree that poly relationships require more practice of these skills. I'm definitely more self-introspective and communicative than I ever was in my marriage, and it's because the occasion presents itself now where I *have* to use (and hone) these skills.

Maybe "more practiced" is a better phrase than "more evolved". If I run a marathon and then quit running for a while, my skills (and muscles!) will atrophy. Likewise, practicing the skills to run a marathon didn't evolve me into something else. It just strengthened what I already had.

Not being a runner (and therefore, not exercising those skills at all) doesn't make you a lesser person than a runner. It just means that you're not a runner.

(This analogy is HIGHLY apropos right now, as I think I'd DIE if I tried to run a 5k at this point, never mind the half-marathons I ran in the past... Oy.)
 
[*]Respect for oneself and one's partner.

This item on Nycindie's list is the one which comes with the greatest difficulty and challenge to those who belong to certain classes of people -- e.g., LGBT and poly folk.

When I was a youth, I was situated much closer to the "gay" (homoamorous, homosexual) end of the Kinsey scale than I am at present (Now I'm smack dab in the middle). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinsey_scale ... Yes, we can and do change our position on this scale.

I knew in my bones as a youth (this was now a long time ago, and the world--and USA-- was different then) that I could simply not be "out". Being out in my neck of the woods was tantamount to psychological, social... or even or physical suicide. The Closet was necessary for survival. And I know from half a centurly of life experience that we all --- those of us who grew up this way -- just survived ... some of us only just barely, with our self-respect. Just enough self-respect to survive. Not a lot more... It's difficult to maintain self-respect when you belong to a despised social group!

Now LGBT people are largely "normalized" in my society, and more than half of Americans believe we deserve to be treated as equal citizens with equal ritghts and treatment (in general). But this is not yet the case with the non-monogamous in love and sex -- at least not in most places in my country (USA).

I guess I've had a "double whammy".
 
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Evolved is a loaded word. I don't like the way its strayed so far from its literal, scientific meaning in some circles. There is an argument even amongst the evolutionary psychologists *cough, splutter* that we evolved to be more polyamorous, or at least non-monogamous, than monogamous. For all the ad nominem attacks I've heard, Christopher Ryan and Cacidla Jetha put forward some big ideas in their book Sex at Dawn that I've yet to hear a decent rebuttable of. Its (ahem) at least as well researched, if not a great deal more, than the kind of stuff that goes for text-book evolutionary psychology.

What I do believe is that polyamory, or at least acceptance of it amongst the many models of possible relationships, is more emotionally mature, culturally adaptive and socially harmonious than monogamy as a model of how things actually are instead of how we are trying to force things to be. We are capable of social order many magnitudes greater than what we see. That necessarily includes and transcends monogamy.
 
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