Minxxa's Little Corner of the World

Well, he's coming home soon - correct? Will he be extricating himself from the relationship or do you think they will continue long-distance after he returns? If it's something that he should get out of, maybe he can start now.

He's taking it one day at a time. There's no plan for the future... there can't be. It will be a however it goes type of thing.

Regardless of how it works with her, what has gone on between us since he started seeing her has affected our relationship and made me aware that I was trying to make us into something we're not.

I want to be open and honest and real and talk and be able to lean on him when I need it for empathy and for comfort and hugs.

I can do about half of that. And I have to learn to accept that's what he has to offer and be happy with that. And get any other needs met elsewhere, through friends, or counselors or other SOs.

That's the part I really need to work on.
 
I didn't mean to sound like I was giving advice or minimizing your concerns. I simply agree that, short of going over there and bringing him home by the scruff of his neck, there is only so much control you have. I think I've told you I am a worrier as well (always was but intensified after 9/11). I just meant that I think letting go of the activity of worrying and counting your blessings might bring you some peace. But I never meant to imply that you shouldn't be concerned. Sorry if it came out that way. I'll stop posting to your blog now and give you space!
 
I didn't mean to sound like I was giving advice or minimizing your concerns. I simply agree that, short of going over there and bringing him home by the scruff of his neck, there is only so much control you have. I think I've told you I am a worrier as well (always was but intensified after 9/11). I just meant that I think letting go of the activity of worrying and counting your blessings might bring you some peace. But I never meant to imply that you shouldn't be concerned. Sorry if it came out that way. I'll stop posting to your blog now and give you space!

Sorry nycindie... I warned you ... mood. :)

You are correct in that worrying won't help. And the problem is, I have been letting go of worrying... and ignoring the issue, and being with myself, going to yoga, blah blah blah blah. That works for a while, until it stops working because the worry is still there, just buried under some yoga mats and a bottle of cheap white wine. :eek:

I am going to the counselor today so hopefully she can help me out of this and into figuring out what to make of my wierd-ass marraige.

In all honestly... this whole thing is not really a poly issue. It's an issue with our relationship by itself, which has never really gotten the attention and love it deserved because there was always too much crap going on that had to be dealt with. Maybe it was all good... it needed to happen to shine the light on this stuff... if we can get better because of it, or figure ourselves out enough to know what we can and can't be to each other.. then maybe it was all worth it.

Or we won't.
 
Maybe it was all good... it needed to happen to shine the light on this stuff... if we can get better because of it, or figure ourselves out enough to know what we can and can't be to each other.. then maybe it was all worth it.

This is what happened to us. Had to hit bottom before we were ready to deal with 20 years of other shit. After nearly a year of struggling, we are in a better much place than we have ever been.
 
This is what happened to us. Had to hit bottom before we were ready to deal with 20 years of other shit. After nearly a year of struggling, we are in a better much place than we have ever been.

I do have hopes. When we were talking last night Hubs asked me "why does it always come down to you feeling like you need to fix it? " because I did what I always did and asked him what could I do to make things work better. The real problem here is... I feel that way because I feel like if I don't step up to do something, nobody else will. Part of that is life experience... but part of it is a deep-seeded feeling that I'm not worth the effort for somebody.

And the wierd part is it's not that *I* feel I'm not worth it... I just don't feel like anybody else will see that I am and actually put forth actual effort for me.

That's part of what I took away from last night. That I need to stop trying to fix everything. (Oh, yeah, my counselor told me that about two months ago...) It's time to let other people do some work, or not. But it's not always up to me to make things work. That's going to be a hard one to let go of, but I have to.
 
And for the conclusion of my blithering for the day... :-/

Here's a connection I just made. I have been spending a lot of time in the past couple of months working on ME. Doing my yoga, doing school, getting out to see friends, doing some self-work reading... etc. That has all been good stuff. Where I always end up getting whacked out again is ME in relation to my husband. US.

After last night I have really realized that while doing work on me alone is great, it does NOTHING for our relationship as a couple because when we get together we work the same way we always do and therefore are having the same issues we always do. So right now... alone, I'm fine. When with him, it goes awry.

The work I need to do now is still my own... but I need to figure out what I NEED from my relationship, and look at what's actually possible to get from my relationship with hubs. I have to be honest about who I am and who he is and what we are capable of being to each other. THAT is the work that I needed to be doing. Instead of focusing on what we "could be", or how things "could look" and trying to "work towards that", I need to just focus on who we are now and what we are to each other now.

I think perhaps if I can remove some of the assumptions I have of what relationships need to be, and look honestly at who my husband is and what I get from him that would be very helpful. I think I have been asking way too much of him, and in a way have been trying to get him to be someone he's not. I've also been asking too much of myself... and giving far too much of myself (unasked for, by the way).

I think if I can learn to see him as he is and appreciate that with no other expectations, and learn how to give of myself a little less completely so I still have me left at the end... maybe we can get to a good place.
 
*hugs*

I think perhaps if I can remove some of the assumptions I have of what relationships need to be, and look honestly at who my husband is and what I get from him that would be very helpful. I think I have been asking way too much of him, and in a way have been trying to get him to be someone he's not. I've also been asking too much of myself... and giving far too much of myself (unasked for, by the way).

Your conclusion sounds healthy. It really sucks that sometimes it takes really long to accept that you really can't change another person. (Oh, how long I've thought regarding an issue "if only he wouldn't do things like that and everything would be perfect".) But it's really important to first accept who he is and what he does. By accepting I don't mean that one has to be OK with everything, just that one has to stop denying the issue/conflict. And then, I find it equally important to honestly look at the situation and see if it's something I can live with or not. And if not, what is it that follows: will I wait for a set period of time and hope for change or try to work on a solution or will I have to terminate the relationship. I guess this is what they call making your boundaries...
 
*hugs*

Your conclusion sounds healthy. It really sucks that sometimes it takes really long to accept that you really can't change another person. (Oh, how long I've thought regarding an issue "if only he wouldn't do things like that and everything would be perfect".) But it's really important to first accept who he is and what he does. By accepting I don't mean that one has to be OK with everything, just that one has to stop denying the issue/conflict. And then, I find it equally important to honestly look at the situation and see if it's something I can live with or not. And if not, what is it that follows: will I wait for a set period of time and hope for change or try to work on a solution or will I have to terminate the relationship. I guess this is what they call making your boundaries...

I think it's taken so long because I'm only just finding out recently that some things I thought WERE changing, weren't really. I thought there was progress being made, and I'm finding out it wasn't real. I think he wanted to change things as much as I did but instead of finding real inner change, he would change behaviors until it got to be too much (because it wasn't coming from deep inside), and then it would stop. I'm just seeing that now.

I'm going to sit down this weekend and write up the things that are good that we give each other, so I can focus on those. I'll share those with hubs. And I"m also going to write up the things that I need from people in my life (not all people, just need from someone or another), and I'm going to figure out how to get that met.

You're right in that it is setting boundaries. I don't know if there's anything I just can't live with yet. That will come with time. I do know that something in me has finally given-- and I'm not afraid of losing the relationship anymore. It would make me sad, I don't want to, but I'm not living in fear of it. And I'm realizing that keeping this relationship is as much up to him as it is me...
 
The problem with that is, often you don't know how much drama or toxicity a relationship will have until you're smack-dab in the thick of it. You can ask a partner to avoid drama and unhealthy relationships, but that can't prevent them from happening.

Yep, and once in knee-deep, with feelings involved, you can try to communicate with your partner the things that make you feel upset, what worries you, what you feel needs to change etc., but chances are that by then, they are so blinded by NRE that they don't really see it the way you do or don't want to make the changes necessary. In the end, the only relationships you can control are the ones you are actually involved in, and even there, it's more often than not the control over whether or not you choose to be involved in the relationship.

And the wierd part is it's not that *I* feel I'm not worth it... I just don't feel like anybody else will see that I am and actually put forth actual effort for me.

I had the exact same problem with therapy. I thought I was a good, decent person, but didn't believe anyone else would see it that way :confused:.

The work I need to do now is still my own... but I need to figure out what I NEED from my relationship, and look at what's actually possible to get from my relationship with hubs. I have to be honest about who I am and who he is and what we are capable of being to each other. THAT is the work that I needed to be doing. Instead of focusing on what we "could be", or how things "could look" and trying to "work towards that", I need to just focus on who we are now and what we are to each other now.

I think this is so important and an invaluable insight. Instead of trying to force our relationships to a particular mould; "primary/secondary/tertiary", "partners/lovers/FWBs", "husband/wife/boyfriend/girlfriend", "triad/vee/tangle", we should just learn to accept that each relationship is different and unique. I struggle with this occasionally.

Like Vanilla said to me, I would likewise be really sad if ever it came a time when another person might mean more to her than I, but if it came to be, then it would be a new situation we would accept and try to work out new boundaries and a new paradigm for our relationship instead of panicking and severing contact either way.

Often we put down on this forum a lot of things to NRE, which is responsible for a huge deal, of course. But what if sometimes, a new relationship indeed becomes a more meaningful one (not implying that this is your case, Minxxa!)? Or equally important than any previous connections?

-- and I'm not afraid of losing the relationship anymore. It would make me sad, I don't want to, but I'm not living in fear of it.

It's a huge difference between not wanting for something to end and not being able to cope if it does.

Power hugs!
 
NRE is an interesting thing to watch from the outside. For a while it was really frustrating me, but I did realize there's not a thing I can say or do about it, so why keep worrying about it?

I have been thinking about the whole feeling/labeling/prioritizing/status of relationships a lot. I'm not really sure where I am with it yet. I do think each relationship is very different, and needs to be seen individually. And I do see how relationships change as time goes by. I guess I just need to keep that in the back of my mind.

Part of rethinking the relationship between myself and hubs is to realize and remember who he is. I've always accepted him for all of his qualities, but I just forgot about some of them for a while, LOL. He's got ADHD, so there's a whole set of behaviors that come with that, that are a part of who he is, especially within relationships. Being impulsive, jumping full force into situations without considering consequences and being completely focused on one thing and not seeing, hearing, paying attention to anything else-- these are the things that are so powerful when you're on the receiving end... and a little painful when you're no longer benefitting from that focus, but on the outside.

I do know that we love each other, though. And we have a lot of fun in life together... even in the day to day stuff. Maybe that's enough for us...
 
I started rereading some of my ADHD books this week.

I know that being a psychology counseling student there is a danger of "diagnosing" people-- and noticing traits and things that I wouldn't have before. I'm trying to balance noticing these things with not sticking people into a "category" based on a diagnosis.

However... I do think that knowing these things can sometimes be helpful. For example, I have anxiety. All of my life I've been a "worrier"... but really it's just been anxiety-- I just never had that name for it until now and I really truly wish I had! It helps me so much to understand it better, find ways of coping with it and accepting that it's a part of me that sometimes makes things harder, but I have to deal with and not pretend it doesn't exist or feel like I should just stop being that way.

It also helps me, because knowing certain things trigger anxiety I can avoid at least some of this by avoiding those things/situations or approaching them differently. I can't always avoid it, but I can mitigate it better and I can avoid some of it completely. This, to me, is a useful tool.

Hubs, has ADHD. It's part of his charm. :) Truthfully a lot of the things I love about him are traits associated with ADHD... as well as some of the traits that drive me crazy. :) I would never want to put him in a box-- you have ADHD, you are like THIS. Each person is different. But there are underlying traits that are common, and I see these traits in him. To me, knowing those traits are part of how his brain works because of ADHD helps me accept them.

Things like zoning out in the middle of a conversation, or sentence and not really hearing me. Not remembering things I've said. Not taking anything that is perceived as criticism without getting defensive and angry. And then there's the hyperfocus. In the beginning of a relationship he's hyperfocused on you... it's like NRE x 10,000. It's a bit intoxicating. But of course, NRE in general wears off, and the hyperfocus always wears off too... sometimes rather suddenly and it can be shocking.

Now I adjusted to the loss of the hyperfocus years ago... and we've replaced it with smaller doses of focus and I'm all good with that! :) And I just realized that part of our issues with his new relationship was that he's had this hyperfocus with her. And when he's like that-- nothing else gets in. And reason, logic and good judgment fly out the window completely.

He was like that with me, too... so this is not a surprise, although it was 10 years ago, so I forgot! LOL. And I think it's been REALLY hard for him to maintain our relationship while he's in this hyperfocus place. Harder than normal NRE, I think. If we were all in the same town, I think it would have been a million times worse because I'd have been getting ignored in person.

Knowing this actually makes things a little easier for me. Because I know this is part of who he is... I know it will pass and things will calm down, as they always do.
 
He's got ADHD, so there's a whole set of behaviors that come with that, that are a part of who he is, especially within relationships. Being impulsive, jumping full force into situations without considering consequences and being completely focused on one thing and not seeing, hearing, paying attention to anything else

I would never want to put him in a box

Things like zoning out in the middle of a conversation, or sentence and not really hearing me. Not remembering things I've said. Not taking anything that is perceived as criticism without getting defensive and angry.

LOL! You have just described my entire family :)

We all have ADD in some form and some more intense than others. My mom is probably the only "normal" one and my MIL is definitely ADHD. My kids were diagnosed ADHD, but I see the "H" wearing off as they get older, so I think that was misdiagnosed and an easy excuse for teachers to get kids medicated (that's a whole different rant). I have recently met some people with true ADHD, which I'm sure is more HDAD (superball in a box:eek:)

I have noticed, especially with my husband, is that he isn't happy unless he has 5 things going at one time. He actually starts to get anxious and even more forgetful if he has too much free time.

When you figure out how to handle the "criticism" thing, let me know?:p
 
LOL! You have just described my entire family :)

We all have ADD in some form and some more intense than others. My mom is probably the only "normal" one and my MIL is definitely ADHD. My kids were diagnosed ADHD, but I see the "H" wearing off as they get older, so I think that was misdiagnosed and an easy excuse for teachers to get kids medicated (that's a whole different rant). I have recently met some people with true ADHD, which I'm sure is more HDAD (superball in a box:eek:)

I have noticed, especially with my husband, is that he isn't happy unless he has 5 things going at one time. He actually starts to get anxious and even more forgetful if he has too much free time.

When you figure out how to handle the "criticism" thing, let me know?:p


You know I think it's not that uncommon! :) I do think it's gets overdiagnosed a lot, though, especially in kids. His daughter has it as well, and is currently taking meds, but we're going to have her reevaluated when she moves down here. And that should be REALLY interesting because he tends to get frustrated by some of her behaviors (that are strikingly familiar to me :eek: )

And my hubs is the same way about too much free time! It's like the more time he has the less he can do... he's had a month or two off from work before, and stopped working out, stopped walking the dog as much, etc. I never got it before! LOL... I totally do now, though.

My feeling about the criticism issue is that hubs needs to work on figuring himself out first before we can work on how to communicate more effectively and listen without getting defensive. He's planning on going to counseling when he gets back and I think that will be really helpful for him (it has been for me). I honestly feel that until he does that -- FOR HIMSELF -- we can't make much progress on other things.

Accepting that has been freeing for me. Not that I've given up on us improving, not at all. But accepting where we are and knowing it's not all up to me.

Also... knowing that this is how he is, I can express things differently to him. Like figuring out what I REALLY need to tell him and doing it in as short, succinct manner as I possibly can. Preferably one sentence. LOL.
 
he tends to get frustrated by some of her behaviors (that are strikingly familiar to me :eek: )

My oldest son and I are alot a like, and tends to get emotional (especially between 11-14 :eek:), which my husband doesn't get at all. I on the other hand recognized what was going on right away and was able to help.

Also... knowing that this is how he is, I can express things differently to him. Like figuring out what I REALLY need to tell him and doing it in as short, succinct manner as I possibly can. Preferably one sentence. LOL.

Have him repeat it back to you in his own words. ADHD/ADD people have a very bad habit of making up (mixing up) definitions to common words. So you only thought you were expressing your self clearly, the problem was you weren't working off the same dictionary :rolleyes:.
 
Have him repeat it back to you in his own words. ADHD/ADD people have a very bad habit of making up (mixing up) definitions to common words. So you only thought you were expressing your self clearly, the problem was you weren't working off the same dictionary :rolleyes:.

LOL... that is the TRUTH. The other fun one is when he says something that makes no sense because whatever information should have come first he didn't tell me, he only thought he did. Or he had that part of the conversation in his head.

He's aware of all of that... I just really think that's where we need the third party... to give us the tools and help us practice using them with supervision!

We need a chaperone! :p
 
LOL... that is the TRUTH. The other fun one is when he says something that makes no sense because whatever information should have come first he didn't tell me, he only thought he did. Or he had that part of the conversation in his head.

ROFLMAO! :p

It's like a record that skips (opps, showing my age:eek: - a DVD with laser burn). "Remember you have to use your out-loud voice, the telepaths were all re-called back to their space ship".
 
LMAO I like that one. I'm good at asking for clarification, for sure.

Interestingly... since I've been kind of going back to basics here for myself in looking at the people we are and how we function and what we give each other, I reminded myself of a lot of stuff I had come to conclusions about at the beginning of the year that I totally and completely forgot about in the mixed up whirl of emotional dealing that came with his new relationship. I got so overwhelmed with trying to handle things that I forgot some very basic truths about how he and I function in life. And now, looking at the big picture-- hindsight being 20/20 and all that-- I'm seeing that most of the issues that have happened with us lately have little to do with poly and a lot to do with how we relate as people.

I told hubs on Monday (in our horrible conversation) that I felt like we had been making some real progress on US in the six or so weeks we had, but all of that came to a screeching halt when he started dating her. And that IS true to an extent because once that relationship started he focused completely on that, and fell back into old behaviors which triggered my old non-healthy response behaviors and we fell into this same old crappy way of relating that we had before.

So now I'm refamiliarizing myself with those revelations I had, which in turn makes it much easier to deal with what's going on now because I can see it in perspective. And when I add to that the fact that I really do see now the importance of just taking things as they come, not putting so much energy into his other relationship (or any really), and learning to be a complete person all on my own-- I feel so much better about the whole situation.

Like I said before, I do hope we can work things out so that we can function more healthfully together. But if not, I can face that now and I know I will be fine.
 
Man am I glad it's Friday! :)

A lot of good stuff planned for this weekend... starting with hot yoga right after work! :)

It's been a hard week, but productive. I feel much more grounded now, much more in touch with things and much more optimistic-- in a let's take everything as it comes without expectations kinda way. I have a little project for myself this weekend, which I think will help TONS in looking at things realistically and optimistically.

I also have a lunch date on Sunday, with a guy from OKC. No big expectations about that, but he seems like he'd be interesting conversation.

It's always interesting to me how it can seem like things are ending, or horrible, or hopeless... and then you get through it and the other side is nice, or peaceful, or better... reminds me of my favorite quote in the world:

"Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, it became a butterfly."
 
So I had a good weekend. Spent Saturday with my daughter, went to a friend's house for a while, then did some shopping and such.

Sunday I met with a guy from OKC. It was a nice lunch, good conversation. He's already poly, and bi, so no explaining all of that which was nice. Not sure about the chemistry yet, but willing to give it a chance to see...

Skype date with hubs tonight, and then BUSY week this week. Ick. Not bad stuff, but I hate being super busy... blyeah! :) I need me a vacation!

Next weekend should be nice, too... lots of plans and such. It's the last weekend (hopefully) before hubs comes home. Still waiting to see if he can get back by Friday night or Saturday so we can actually spend some time... if not we'll manage no doubt.
 
So had a nice Skype date with hubs on Monday. Very mellow and we got to enjoy each other which was nice! :)

Making plans for when he gets home, though it's still up in the air. And I have a ton of crap I have to get done between now and then, as usual! LOL

I've been thinking a lot about people... and choices. One thing I've changed a lot since I was younger is that I really do accept people for who they are a lot sooner, but I also am very particular of who I keep involved in my life these days. I used to feel bad about cutting anyone out of my life-- guilty, like I was being mean or heartless. But one thing I've learned in my years on this earth is that you have to have boundaries of what you will accept, and what you do not want to be involved in, and stick to them.

If somebody is going to exhibit behaviors that are on my list of "crap which I do not tolerate", then they're going to get the boot. Sorry if they don't like that... they have the choice to not to behave that way, and I have the choice to not put up with it. I spent a lot of years with people expecting me to put up with every bit of stuff and nonsense they felt like throwing at me, and I was supposed to sit there and take it. I particularly enjoyed it when they went off on me because I had the audacity to say anything about it. Pfffft.

There actually a very few things on that list... but I am firm on them. Number one is honesty. If someone proves to be a liar (more than little white ones), I can't have them in my life because I will not trust anything they say, and how can you be friends or in any kind of relationship with somebody you don't trust?

I've removed more than one person from my life because they showed me that they would say one thing, when they really meant another thing-- trying to get a certain "reaction". And if they didn't get the right reaction there was drama and tears. Yeah... no thank you. I'm not psychic and if you can't put on your big girl panties and say what you mean, then you know where the door is.

And obviously anyone who is abusive or violent is out, if not just for me, then for my children who don't need that kind of influence around them.

I feel like I've gone through a lot in my life to develop these boundaries, and nobody is going to make me feel bad for that. I don't think people do that intentionally-- but it happens anyway. Or maybe it's just that they don't understand them... I forget sometimes that many people can't understand something if it doesn't happen to them. Empathy is not universal...

Anyway... it's been something good to ponder as I feel more than ever that my choices go along with my values and ethics. And I'm never going to feel guilty or apologetic for that again.
 
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