Redpepper's journey

Glad you had a good day today. And you are smart, it isn't just Leo who thinks so.
 
It seems that you are working through things just fine, RP. I agree with much of what you, Mono, and Derby have said. Though there are basic guidelines to how we do this thing, and so many people want to play the poly role, but haven't the slightest idea how, you guys are speaking it and doing it successfully. It can look and work however you want it to, with transparency and communication. Live in the present and drop the 'what ifs.' They are to be pondered but not obsessed about.

Ponder the advantages/disadvantages of talking to PN about the sex thing. If you are seeking to change something, speak up. If not, let it be.

I'm also glad you are in a better place with the Leo situation. Go ahead and be his trophy for a bit. *hugs*
 
Hi,

Thanks for checking out my blog. After certain observations over the last few days, I have decided to open it up further. Initially I thought it was just monos that needed "a place," but now I'm thinking that both monos and polys in mono/poly relationships need somewhere specific to help with understanding.

Mr Rusty's comment came in the middle of this, so I was a bit fired up, I admit. Still, how can we have a life love based on "willpower"? We have to at least be working towards genuine understanding.

I have read some of your blog over the last few days and it made me quite sad. I felt it was all a bit personal to comment on and I wasn't 100% sure I had it right. From what I observed, Mono has come to terms with your closed polyamory tribe (for want of a better label), but not the concept that for you, polyamory means freedom of the heart to be continuously open. Is that right?

As for "How have I come to understanding?" that's a good question, and not one that I can just churn out a neat little answer to. It begs deep thought and a blog post, I think. But the starting point is a genuine desire to understand the person you love, born out of the love you feel for them. I think you also have to accept that in the process of understanding, you will be changed. You have to believe that is possible and be OK with it.
 
Actually, in rereading the posts, I don't know if you should take it for granted that Mono doesn't understand you. What he's worried about is hurting you if he loses his intimate connection with you as a result of your polyamory, right?

To me, that comes down to commitment. He calls you Lilo (lifelove) and seems committed to maintaining his love for you for a lifetime. You both worry that it might not remain sexual, right? Surely, if the sexuality goes for one, and not the other, that is something that in a committed relationship can be worked through.

These kinds of things are a positive for me in poly/mono relationships, because they force us to push through comfort zones that may never otherwise be challenged. "Love hurts." Kids get hurt when they go to school or play sports, but we would never keep them locked up to prevent it.

I agree with the others. Enjoy the wonderful present you've created for yourselves and have faith that the future "yous" will be eminently capable of handling whatever comes up. So, you may hurt each other a bit in the process. Allowing hurt and loving each other through it is just part of the process.
 
Sometimes people just fit together in a way that doesn't make any logical sense. There isn't any walking away from something like that. The both of you NEED each other, in the present tense.

Right now there isn't anyone out there who is worth the risk of losing what you and Mono have. Maybe there never will be. Maybe if there is his boundaries will change. Your lives are both richer for having been shared with each other. If you had just walked away you would have spent the rest of your life wondering about what might have been.

Holy crap you have a smart girlfriend RP!! ;)

Thanks Derby

If I am reading this right, there isn't anyone else in the picture yet right? Why worry about something that may never happen. Toss out logic and concern, and live and enjoy what you have now. Don't look for bumps int he road you haven't hit yet :D

Unless I am reading this wrong of course :D

All of this.

I love you guys!!!
 
From what I observed, Mono has come to terms with your closed polyamory tribe (for want of a better label), but not the concept that, for you, polyamory means freedom of the heart to be continuously open. Is that right?

.

I fully understand Redpepper's concepts. I just wouldn't be healthy in that situation with the level of integration and commitment I have. Perhaps if I wasn't so close, it would be ok. But that would mean stepping back from my level of commitment and family integration. Essentially it might work if my overall involvement were similar to a lot of other secondaries with less integrated lives. But we didn't want that, so we'll move forward and see what the future has in store for us. :) Who knows what can happen? :D
 
I think the big thing that Redpepper and I both constantly have to do is ask ourselves two questions: Am I, as an individual, healthy? Is this worth it?

Ultimately, my answer is yes. I believe she feels the same way, for now. Maybe one day the balance will tip, but for now we love and enjoy ourselves immensely, and every chance we get. ;)
 
Clarification

While I believe I fully understand the concepts of poly, I do not understand what it feels like to be poly. That is a very different thing. I can't truly feel what they do in loving multiple partners, probably no more than they could truly understand how I feel about loving only one.
 
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Sage, thank you for writing. There is definitely a need for polys to have space to have a voice when it comes to mono/poly relationships. Everyone is trying to work it out in that kind of dynamic, sometimes one over another. It ebbs and flows.

Yes, freedom and comfort for me are based on the acceptance that my heart is always open to love and whatever that brings. I want others to trust. I want to let my heart go without the threat that they will leave me (my biggest fear). I find it impossible to trust Mono when he says he will just change how he feels. It's hard to trust when I am told that he will stay loving me as he does now if I control my love for others. It goes against my values. It goes against my nature.

I admit that I have needed to slow down with letting people into my life and not make myself vulnerable sexually and in a loving way to any Tom, Dick or Harry that comes along. Mono has helped with that. He is only comfortable with our tribe, rather than comfortable with my process and work towards achieving clarity, honesty and balance in my relationships from here on in, wherever they may appear from.

It would mean a change for him if he thought outside of our tribe. He is not willing to look at that. He is proud of what we have created. So am I. That seems to mean coveting, it to him.

I am not asking him to change either, but I fear that I will have to leave him one day, or force change.

To me, it feels like I am in a monogamous relationship with three people. I feel owned by them because of his point of view. If I lose one, or both, due to breaking up, and end up with just Mono, then I will feel the same as I do now (apart from the pain of breaking up, that is). Actually, I can include women in my life, no problem. Funny how that is not an issue for him, and therefore not my focus.

I guess I feel as if I am a single poly in a family-type poly-fi relationship. It's not that I am into many lovers on a casual basis, but I am into being open to the freedom to love.

To Mono, I am friends with Leo. I don't feel that. That is enough to make me feel uncomfortable being in this situation with Leo. I now feel that I not only have to suppress my desire to be closer, but suppress my emotions of love, so that they become that of friendship. This saddens me, but I can get through it, with him.

Sage, I appreciate your writing, because I respect you and your thoughts. You are in the position Mono is in. At least, I believe this to be so. Your thoughts and questions are invaluable to me, as I need a push to be able to see clearly what to do when that moment arises, when change happens, in some way. I know I could just leave it, but why not be proactive, if I can, right?
 
I am not asking him to change either, but I fear that I will have to leave him one day, or force change.

Letting go of the fear that I will disappear entirely, or wither and die, might help in this, Lilo. All of us have to be healthy. All of us have already survived a tonne of life experiences. Our hearts will persevere and our connection will remain, no matter what the future holds. I have complete faith in our life commitment to support each other in whatever way allows us to be free and healthy as a family. :)
 
Letting go of the fear that I will disappear entirely, or wither and die, might help in this, Lilo. All of us have to be healthy. All of us have already survived a tonne of life experiences. Our hearts will persevere and our connection will remain, no matter what the future holds. I have complete faith in our life commitment to support each other, in whatever way allows us to be free and healthy as a family.
I am relieved to hear that. I feel the same. :)
 
I am relieved to hear that. I feel the same. :)

What we have is only a part of what we have built. We have challenged our families to accept us, and in overcoming that obstacle, have created a wider web of interlinked people than is often acknowledged.

I have little fear of what the future will bring, because I already know what it holds-- a place and time of healthy and caring individuals connected by shared experiences and love that can never be undone. Everything, up to this very second, is immortal and irreversible. We cannot lose what we already have. The shape of what we will have is yet to be determined, as it is with everything in life. This is one part of a grand adventure, a journey of learning. :)
 
mono poly relationships

I see some stuff here. Bear with me.

- The mono is invested in the relationship in more of a secondary way, and therefore the poly can be free to love whom they chose, whenever they chose, as long as the people are not loved more than the mono. If they are, then it might or not have a bearing on the relationship between the mono and the poly, depending on the depth the mono has, or how much they are willing to tolerate.
- The mono loves the poly and expects that they stay with the loves they have, and be in a poly-fi situation for the stability and healthiness of their involvement in it. The poly agrees to this, until such time as it is not healthy for them.
- The mono desires certain aspects of mono life to be fulfilled in a mono way only, and expects/desires that the poly fulfil the requirements they have. The poly either agrees or disagrees with the arrangement, depending on how much they are willing to sacrifice to be healthy and maintain the relationship to any kind of length and depth.

Thoughts? Additions?
 
live in the present and drop the 'what ifs' (they are to be pondered but not obsessed about); do ponder the advantages/disadvantages of talking to PN about the sex thing (if you are seeking to change something, speak up. If not, let it be). I'm also glad you are in a better place with the Leo situation. Go ahead and be his trophy for a bit. *hugs*
Thanks for writing, Eklectc. I always enjoy your posts and your seemingly endless ability to have compersion, even though you yourself are going through your own struggles. I admire that in a person greatly.

I am pondering today without fear or obsession. It feels like a much better approach. I do have my moments where I slip. though, and dwell too much. ;)

I have decided that if PN wants to talk about it, he will. I am fine with how things are. I shouldn't assume that just because I am so happy with my sex life, that others aren't. I think I need to give him more attention and appreciation. So I am. :) And it's working. :)

I really am just a trophy to Leo, I think. I told him about some other male friends I spend time with, in terms of closeness. (I haven't spoken of them here, but maybe will one day.) He said, "Well, you are poly."

I think he sees me as a friend that he could've had more with, so why invest more when there will be none? Until he finds someone who can offer more, then I will be the one he treats and enjoys the company of. It will really hurt when he finds that someone, though.
 
You both worry that it might not remain sexual, right? Surely, if the sexuality goes for one, and not the other, that is something that, in a committed relationship, can be worked through.

These kinds of things are a positive for me in poly/mono relationships, because they force us to push through comfort zones that may never otherwise be challenged. "Love hurts." Kids get hurt when they go to school or play sports, but we would never suggest that we keep them locked up to prevent it.

I agree with the others. Enjoy the wonderful present you've created for yourselves and have faith that the future "yous" will be eminently capable of handling whatever comes up. So, you may hurt each other a bit in the process. Allowing hurt and loving each other through it is just part of the process.
Thanks, Sage. It seems that Mono agrees that we can get through whatever comes up, if we love each other and have the will to be together. We have committed to being a family, in whatever way that means, I think, and will adjust if we put our hearts and minds to it.

I agree that if the sex goes, our love won't. At least, I can speak for myself on that. We are the best of friends also, and share more than anyone else knows. We don't hold back on anything, and that, to me, means that what we have can be sustained.

I like the sport/kid analogy. Well worth remembering in all this. Thank you.:)
 
I see some stuff here. Bear with me.

- The mono is invested in the relationship in more of a secondary way. Therefore, the poly can be free to love whom they chose, whenever they chose, as long as the people are not loved more than the mono.

Not necessarily. I expect you to love your husband more than me, or at least recognize the greater impact on your life that he has, and therefore prioritize accordingly. I embrace and enjoy that. I see it as a sign of a committed partner and mother.

- The mono loves the poly and expects that they stay with the loves they have, and be in a poly-fi situation for the stability and healthiness of their involvement in it. The poly agrees to this, until such time as it is not healthy for them.

In my case, the boundary around other men was initially a key factor in moving forward with plans to live together, as well as commit to a higher level of integration than most strive for. That changed to my acceptance that we could all still be family if the nature of our relationship becomes more one of friends than lovers.

- The mono desires certain aspects of mono life to be fulfilled in a mono way only, and expects/desires that the poly fulfil the requirements they have. The poly either agrees or disagrees with the arrangement, depending on how much they are willing to sacrifice to be healthy and maintain the relationship to any kind of length and depth.

Thoughts? Additions?

This last quote implies that the mono is making no sacrifice. In my case, I made a lot of sacrifices, just as you did. I essentially gave up social ties with those that think something is inherently wrong with me. I have strained personal relationships with those closer to my daughter than anyone else (thus affecting my goal to reconnect with her). But you are worth it, so I accept that.

The mono person has a partner who has other partners, which in itself is a sacrifice for many. The partners you have are not a sacrifice for me. I hold them above my own happiness.
 
I agree that if the sex goes, our love won't. At least, I can speak for myself on that. We are the best of friends also and share more than anyone else knows. We don't hold back on anything and that, to me, means that what we have can be sustained.

Thank you.:)

All of this, times 1000!! I love you and will always love you. :)
 
Not necessarily. I expect you to love your husband more than me..or at least recognize the greater impact on your life that he has and therefore priotitize accordingly. I embrace and enjoy that. I see it as a sign of a committed partner and mother.
I forgot the mono in a relationship with someone who has a primary! How could I forget? *hand slapped into my forehead* :eek:

Just so you know, this part wasn't about you, Mono. It is part of figuring out what works and what doesn't in a mono/poly dynamic.

Really good points, though.:)
 
Just so you know this part wasn't about you Mono, it is part of figuring out what works and what doesn't in a mono/poly dynamic.

really good points though.:)

Not to worry, Sunshine. :) I think this type of learning through sharing is great!
 
I got a text from Leo to tell me he had a good meeting. He'd cancelled our date tonight to go to it. He was drunk and walking home, as he couldn't drive. Its about 15 kms to his house so I went and got him and took him home. It was nice to do that and I feel like I could participate in his life in some way. It made me feel needed. I am also taking his girl out on Sunday afternoon with my boy. They are the same age and friends (as we all camp together). I am looking forward to that. too.

I talked to Derby today and was entirely overly sarcastic about a bunch of stuff. It made me feel bad afterwards, as I was negative and hurtful without meaning to be. She is a lovely woman who deserves more than what I could give today. I am feeling very negative and she bore the brunt of that.

I went to see a movie tonight with PN, the same one I went to last week with Mono. What could I do? They wanted to see the same movie *shrug* He really enjoyed it and so did I. We all like the same movies in this house. It rocks! PN was happy as he feel asleep. Good movie, good chat and good sex.

So, I got two thumbs up today and one down. The day before it was the same, just different loves. I try.:eek:
 
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