I've been having relationship issues after my gf came out poly to me

CFT, I had that feeling as well. Like you still concentrate on polyamory after several months, but this is not the major problem. It took half the discussion before you mentioned the dependent state, in which your wife is now, which seems odd to me.
Also I thought about your situation the other day and one more parallel crossed my mind. When I was in love with my current poly partner, whom I barely knew at that time, and was deciding what to do with it and with my monogamous relationship, I told my psychiatrist about my struggles. He is wise man, and he asked what was so important about that poly man. I gave it a thought and I said: He listened to me. The psychiatrist went like: Wait a minute, WHAT did he listen to? Because that is, what is really important.
After time has passed, I really agree with the psychiatrist.
it was solely about ME, my needs and my shortcomings. I actually think "being in love" (not loving someone in a true stable sense), that crazy feeling, is always about that to some degree at least. My partner at that time was actually great in many different ways, we had a great intellectual connection, and emotional understanding as well, common goals, we were a good match to cooperate. I find that love is blind to that, it is about unmet needs, but it disregards those which are being met. Me falling in love was in no way my partners "fault". Also, if I knew about my needs, my partner could have perhaps met some of them (with a lot of work together), but certainly not all of them.
Second, I think it might be really important to find out what was important to your wife about her online relationship. Finding alternate ways to fill that might be the necessary change your relationship, even the way out of her depression. Also, listening to that in a kind non-judgemental way, if you are able - very healing to her. (But it sound like perhaps you cannot and she cannot speak, so that would be work for her therapist then :(.)
She fell for someone else. If that means she is finding out she doesn't want you? Well, that is a good reason to be depressed, if a long (and perhaps somewhat codependent) marriage is to end. Sorry, that this is an option.
If that means she wants both? And she knows it is impossible with you? A good reason to be depressed again, if she has to choose, and both options are a loss.
If that means she doesn't actually want that particular person, but certain missing peeces? Find those.

I am very much hoping, you overcome this successfully, whichever that means for you.

Actually, I've been posting here since June, and albeit it one detail at a time, mentioning her psychiatric concerns is not a new practice. What keeps getting overlooked by most, however, is the fact that nothing was this severe until this certain someone entered her life, occupied so much f her time, and became the straw that broke the camel's back to push her into this need of psychiatric care. The physical health is something that's been under control for some time. And as for the mental health... The two previous drivers, had been her mother's passing, and her problems at work. Both of which, she had always been honest & open to confiding in me about. It wasn't until he came into the picture, that she began to take on an extremely secretive demeanor. It was coping/dealing with the poly, that pushed her over the edge. The problem is, that she held onto it for months before finally mentioning it... Before that, she would always tell me that it was the same things that were bothering her before... How is it that one day, she has no problem talking about work bothering her, and then the next, it seemed to have bothered her 1000 fold out of the blue?

Sharing in relationships is wonderful. I don't deny that... But in my mind, some things ought not to be shared.

Let me be clear... I do not derive my self worth from my wife... It's true that, I feel a special bond with her because she's shown a side to me that's unmatched to anyone else I've ever known. She has been the one person that I could share everything & anything with... And I've done my best to be that for her... Previously, she did see me that way (and had acknowledged as much), but neither of us have ever sugar coated things to each other either. If we disagreed with each others' approach or behavior in a certain instance, we had both been very quick to tell each other we were in the wrong... But enter someone who, instead of speaking to her in an honest and candid manner, chooses to fill her head with delusions that EVERYTHING she could ever say or do was the right choice. Being supportive, does NOT always mean agreeing with everything and telling them what they want to hear. Especially if it comes with the hopes of getting them into bed.

And fair enough... Maybe "easily" wasn't the right word, but it appears that way when it happened as quickly as it did. In less than two months from the time they began talking to each other last year, they were telling each other "I love you".

As for what she wanted... That's just it. She never came right out and said it. Everything from both of them was so vague, made to sound so sanitized, that none of it really added up. When asked what she wanted, where she saw it going, even what the developing stages could be, it was always "nowhere from here", but without ever really saying where "here" was in the first place. So there was no comparison. She did admit that if I were genuinely okay with them sleeping together, she would do so... And fair enough, I obviously can't fault if I were to be in legitimate agreement, but it was all I could do to gain insight into where she viewed things, or at least the potential. And that was pretty much the answer for everything... Her wish was for things to stay how they were... But if I can't get a clear answer on where they were, then I have no way of even beginning to understand if it's something I can accept. There are really only three things that are clear cut boundaries for me: 1 - There is to always be open & honest communication & behavior; 2 - Our lives (including those of the children) are to always take priority; 3- nothing sexual of physically intimate in nature whatsoever. Anything else, can be negotiated, and can be dealt with as long as no one is kept out of the loop. That being said, numbers 1 & 2 were ignored repeatedly, which gives me concern that number 3 could have been as well... At least, as it related to a virtual setting.

As for the psychiatrist, I'm not disagreeing with your statements. Listening IS important, and while I'm sure that most of you see me as this stubborn mule that turns a deaf ear when I don't like what I hear, that's not the case at all. Yes, I tend to dig deep into whatever particular issue is at hand. I do this because I cannot responsibly react unless I have the complete story. Unfortunately, I've not been given the clear story from the beginning. Not because I "shot her down" from the beginning, but because none of it adds up to what I've been told. And it's worth noting, that my wife has never previously had trouble with giving me news that I may not want to hear at the time. And while I'll admit that there are things I would say/do differently if given the chance to have that initial conversation over again, I've never done anything to make me undeserving of the truth.

And again... I'm not the terrible listener that you might see me as. That doesn't mean that I'm not without my opinions. So when she confesses something like this to me an says "tell me what you need me to do", I will have an answer. I have ALWAYS been willing to fill the needs she's spoken about. I have ALWAYS been very upfront with letting her know that I am very open to criticism. Sometimes things in type, don't translate well to real life. On here, I type with a great deal of emotion, and so the day to day calmness & good times tend not to appear in the proper context. I believe that I've done my very best to support her. Even during times where I may have disagreed with her decision. But I guess when one begins to hear that everything's being done right, and consequences are meaningless, then someone like myself begins to appear more judgmental than I really am.

Logically, yes, I KNOW that her wish is not to hurt me, but it doesn't change the fact that, in spite of knowing that such actions and even desires DO hurt me. Especially, when it's something we've discussed on several occasions in the past. I can get my head around her wanting to try it regardless of my feelings, what I can't accept, is her allowing herself to get so deeply involved with someone, that it could become a distinct possibility if given the chance. If we had never talked about it before, or if I had appeared more open/willing in prior talks, then I would understand. But this was not the case.... It felt as if she began to dive into something, knowing full well my opposition, without regard for anything I've said about it before. Do I believe she intended to hurt me? Of course not. But do I believe that she considered my feelings before acting? No I don't.

I'm sure she chose not to ask based on my reaction. And I take full responsibility for that. As much as I would have liked to know her thoughts much more, I'm actually very relieved that she never asked, nor pressured.

No, I'm not surprised that she chooses to engage in other activities with other people... But sleeping with someone, is not like shoe shopping, or hiking... To me, it's more in line with having a child with someone, or buying a house... Sleeping with another is a VERY, VERY big deal, not just a mere activity. So for her to "sometimes, rather" sleep with another person, she might as well be saying that she'd like to have a baby with him.

PS- My post was a bit too long, so I had to cut out some of the quote. Sorry for any confusion.
 
Polyamory seems to be the whipping boy for a whole host of other long standing issues between you two, CTF and in each of you. Poly gives you something to circle around, but there's not even much poly going on here, it's just absorbing a lot of attention and energy that comes from so many other places in your lives.

That said, you're solidly monogamous, CTF, and she wants to explore something beyond a long term monogamous partnership, so you've got a big mismatch here. Your wife is clearly shriveling on the vine, having put herself back into containment, and you're miserable. Where do you go from here?

I don't know if I'd call polyamory a "whipping boy". In fact, with all due respect, I'd deny that as accurate. It's not as though we'd been lacking in communication for a long time, it was only when the poly idea was first introduced to her, as well as a certain someone entering her life, when the communication from her to me ceased. I was given a very misleading set of circumstances for the reasons behind her need to psychiatrists & therapists.

There may not be much poly going on in practice, that's true. But undoubtedly, there was more of it going on (in her eyes) in the months leading up to her revealing it to me.

Where we go from here is really up to her at this point. It's clear that, from my end, there's noting more to her that I can say. I find myself constantly biting my tongue, and holding back the negative feelings from the concern that she's been less than truthful, or casting aside the unpleasantness when something is said or done that associates & brings the anxiety back. I hope that in time, she will eventually reveal EVERYTHING to me, and once that happens, I can feel comfortable again. But I am VERY aware that I have to assure her that I can give her the environment where she is comfortable in doing so. Now, I don't yell, or lash out physically or anything. She knows I'm not going to scream or beat her, etc... But from harsh judgement.

Yes, I'm solidly monogamous. And while she claims to be poly, she does insist that she can remain happy without exploring. If true, that's where we go... Nowhere, we stay as we have always agreed. If it's not true, and she is not happy without exploring, then she will have to go elsewhere to fulfill that. As much as it pains me to say, there is nothing stopping her. But I cannot endure the agony of knowing she's in bed with someone else.
 
Vinsanity, sorry to say, but I think you are being overly harsh on CFT. Like you are comming from the other side, but with a similar level of misunderstanding. I agree that it is not good to derive one's self worth from other people. But I don't think this is the case here. Perhaps to some degree, but not as much as you suggest. His reasons for not wanting polyamory are different, and different then your reasons were.*

I may have been blunt, but my words came from sadness, not anger.

I don't agree with you about the reasons being different. Pretty much everything he has said went through my mind as well. The only difference is that I wasn't completely happy in my relationship with her.

Look at his words. It is definitely the case. Perhaps he is a poor communicator? Of course, he denies it, as he denies everything that is repeated back to him. I would go back and quote everything to make my case but it is really not worth the effort. At this point it is best for me to ignore his potshots at us poly folk and let you guys feed his narcissism if you'd like. His problems have nothing to do with poly.
 
I may have been blunt, but my words came from sadness, not anger.

I don't agree with you about the reasons being different. Pretty much everything he has said went through my mind as well. The only difference is that I wasn't completely happy in my relationship with her.

Look at his words. It is definitely the case. Perhaps he is a poor communicator? Of course, he denies it, as he denies everything that is repeated back to him. I would go back and quote everything to make my case but it is really not worth the effort. At this point it is best for me to ignore his potshots at us poly folk and let you guys feed his narcissism if you'd like. His problems have nothing to do with poly.


Look, I'm sorry if what I've said offends you in any way. It's certainly not my intention to do so. I've had a lot of time over the past (roughly) 6 months to reflect on everything that's taken place in our lives, and our marriage, and believe it or not, I've taken more into consideration from the poly folks on here than it may seem.

As I've said in a previous post, what I say here may not always translate in the true context of what currently takes place with us today. I tend to get very emotional over the subject, and thus, tend to get defensive. I'm not denying things that are said back to me for sport. I have no interest in telling others how to live their lives. I've repeated myself until I'm blue in the face, that if polyamory works for others, then that's great. It's not my concern when it doesn't affect me.

I guess when I first came here, it was in an effort to see if I really could get a better understanding of how poly works, how others view love, and so on. The problem is (and I'm not blaming any of you. I take full responsibility) that try as I might, I never could fully understand it in a way that spilled over into being able to accept it in OUR marriage.

What started off as a thread by someone else, who had very similar struggles as I have, has turned into a thread where I (apologetically) have more or less taken over. Not my intent, but I feel that it's fair that the struggling monos that come here, should to feel that they shouldn't be forced into opening their relationships at the pressure of their partners.

One of the things that we often have suggested to us, is to try & locate where the jealousy, insecurity, and the range of other negative emotions associated within, come from. And for many, they're hard as hell to locate. But just because they can't place it in an eloquent, comprehensive manner, does not invalidate those feelings. And while I - myself- have not located all of them, I have managed to discover the origins of many. And it's difficult when someone who may not agree with MY assessment, tries to invalidate them - just as it is when you may feel that I'm mis-characterizing your assessment. I'm not saying that I'm right, I'm just telling you how I feel, and doing my best to try & explain why I do.

You might see me as a narcissist, and I can see how you think that. But the fact is, that I am clinically depressed (something I have mentioned several times in the past). I have dealt with rejection & insecurity for as long as I remember. For this reason, I have chosen to keep my circles small. So when I find the few people that truly matter to me, I hold them in extremely high regard. And I've had far too many instances where someone I valued, turned out to reject me in the end. Sure, from the vantage point of some, I either held too close, or perhaps trusted too much, but from my angle, all I ever thought I was doing, was feeling lucky to have someone who cared about me, only to find unexplained pain when they chose to bolt. After a while, you start to expect that they're going to leave & you don't b other trying to get close in the first place. Hell, every girl I've dated, but one, in the past had left me for someone else. So you get used to it... UNTIL, almost like magic, you find that one who gets you & accepts you. My wife & I had both had some unpleasant childhoods, and the teen years for both of us had been no picnic. as the Foo Fighters song goes "You and I were two old & tortured souls, repaired by a love of broken things". That was us, and for the next 19 years, that continued to be us. We were for each other, what no one else could have, or ever would be. Things were great. We were just as in love recently, as we were when we first started dating.

For that duration, I had no insecurity. At least, not when it came to relationships (of any type) with people. And while I was confident for the time being, my biggest fear in life, was that she could find in another, one of the best things that was so unique to US. Like I said, I didn't ever see it happening... Until it DID.

Now, am I a great communicator. Not always. I don't think I'm terrible at it, but I admit (and have done so on here) that I could be better. I still maintain that I could never see anything positive about her sleeping with another. I still will always feel that love is quantitative, and that giving it to another, takes some away from me... Primarily because I saw it happen. And at a time when I felt like I needed her the most in the wake of my dad dying. I would call her on my way home because I was upset and needed to talk, and the calls would get sent to voicemail. After I got home and mentioned I called, she'd tell me that she was talking to him because he had a bad day. Sure, once or twice, I can understand, but this was daily for about 3 weeks following my dad's death.

It's not just the sex that I had a problem with... Even without that, it was as though she was asking me to approve of a relationship model where I was going to be constantly ignored just like I had been.

So you can think I'm dishing out potshots if you want. I'm really not. I'm coming from an emotional place, where it, to me, feels like the one person who had given me two decades of helping me feel like I matter, elected to put that all at risk by trading it to do the same for someone she's never met. It's one thing to base your existence on the "need" of someone, it's another to feel lonely and abandoned by someone who swore never to do so.
 
CTF, I'm not offended. I just don't get anything out of this discussion with you, nor do you get anything out of it either. Yes, you do take potshots, even if they come from an emotional place. I understand. I don't have any use for that negativity.

Good luck with your marriage. I hope the two of you can find happiness again.
 
CTF, I do find your posts fascinating, rewarding and heartfelt but I agree very much with vinsanity that your struggles really have nothing to do with polyamory or "this certain someone who entered her life." Especially after reading these last few posts of yours, it's clear that you and your wife each have deep issues which you've come to realize (as everyone eventually does) that no relationship and no partner can fix. Relationships always, always, always reflect what is going on in the individual and the way to improve relationships is to work from the inside - always. Asking or expecting a relationship or another person to change in order to make us feel better is never a lasting solution. I highly encourage you to take your focus off of your wife and your marriage and keep your sights on your inner life. There are many ways to move forward this way, and I don't especially think that "therapists" are the best at this, for many tend to be problem oriented, but just know that the only way through is to follow the guidance of your own soul. You're so very other-focused that I doubt you'll find much help in my words, but perhaps you might, or perhaps another who is reading along might. You and your wife feel the weight of each other's tremendous NEED and neither of you can fix the other. Really, the only way forward is to let the other off the hook, stop expecting the other to behave better and focus on your own inner journey. You can for sure do this without parting company (I'm not recommending a break up at all) but a 180 shift in focus is definitely required here. Your wife's "good behavior" will never be able to make you both feel better, but you can make yourself feel better in so many ways that will be deep and lasting and not dependent on other people's comings and goings, ups and downs, changes and stability.

Our relationships always reflect what we've got going on inside, so the way to change relationships is to change our inner experience. That's the only way to really, truly do it. Otherwise, we're just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic or at best, on an awfully rocky boat. Truly stable and loving relationships only happen when two stable, loving and whole individuals come together without need for the other to make anything better.
 
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CTF, have you ever tried a 12 step program? For codependents or such? It might help you get the focus off your wife and back onto yourself, where it belongs. FA is right, until you work through your own issues (and we all have issues, every single one of us), your life and marriage will be chaotic. A 12 step program may help (and it's incredibly cheap/free compared to therapists and you can attend as frequently as there are meetings. And you'll meet other people.)
 
CTT, I appreciate learning about your view.

But I, too, get more and more the impression, that we are going in circles.
It seems to get polarized over and over again in the sense of "your view is your view, my view is my view", which is fine to clarify the initial standing point, but not a learning place.

And after the last few posts, I agree with FallenAngelina wholehartedly. There are other issues, which were just covered up by the seemingly-functional relationship and came out along with "poly".
There needs to be a major shift of focus, or I would say a change in attitude towards yourself and your wife (actually any kind of major inner change, that gets you into motion), else you won't get relief. And sadly, I know of no way to initiate that, unless you want to :(

Good luck.
 
And after the last few posts, I agree with FallenAngelina wholehartedly. There are other issues, which were just covered up by the seemingly-functional relationship and came out along with "poly".

We're all basically trying to decipher from CTF's posts whether "poly" is the cause of his wife's issues, or a symptom, or a completely unrelated coincidence. I'm not sure even the collective wisdom of this board can tease that apart, at least not without his wife's open and honest participation :(

CTF, a lot of us seem to share the view that poly feelings couldn't be completely responsible for all of the changes in your wife. Why :confused: To me, it just seems that if being poly were that important to her - so important that the idea of life without it sends her into a deep depression - she would fight for it. And if it wasn't that important, she'd let it go and fight to rebuild your marriage.

I just don't see how a mentally healthy, emotionally together person could contemplate poly, get a firm "no" from their spouse, and then just ... Give up on everything. The way you have described her actions, they just seem so extreme, it makes me think there MUST have been some other stuff going on, either other big stressors or mental health issues.

But. I don't know your wife. So, even though it seems illogical to me, I'll acknowledge the possibility that she was completely happy and stable before. That meeting people online, developing feelings for them, and seeing how against it you were was the thing that shattered her well-being. That this one experience was enough to render a well-adjusted adult incapable of communicating her feelings or advocating for her own needs.

If all of that is true - you STILL need to fix the communication, the mental health issues, the relationship between the two of you. You can believe with all your heart that poly caused this, but finding the cause is not fixing the problem. You still need to either move forward with her or move on.
 
Let me start off by saying to everyone, that I truly do appreciate your concern. I'm sure it seems that the various offers on perspectives & so forth, are going unnoticed. I can assure you that they're not. I really do take everything that's said into consideration. And believe it or not, some of it works.

Now, I can't even begin to affirm whether or not poly is the cause, the symptom, or coincidental. Living inside the fishbowl, the timing & behavior seems to correlate with the revelation. I don't deny that there are other (perhaps more important) issues that need to be worked on. Not just in the present, but previous, underlying problems that have existed well before all of this. I guess they just don't show up on the radar because they never seemed to have the tangible effect before.

I don't blame poly itself for everything that happened. And to tell you the truth, I still doubt as to whether or not my wife really is poly, or if it was simply a way to justify getting closer to someone than she knew I'd be comfortable with. Back when she first revealed this to me, she had insisted that it was merely platonic love, but would never exclude the possibility of it escalating into something more at an undetermined time in the future. So I set out on an effort to find out if that really was poly, or something different. I guess, looking back, it shouldn't have mattered since it is what it is, no matter what one chooses to call it. But, perhaps, at the time, I was really trying to find out if she was telling me the truth... Either, she (with the help of a therapist) erroneously defined polyamory, or she really was involved deeper and chose to tell me otherwise.

I do recognize that I bungled things. Not only with my reaction, but with the way I handled things in the wake of it all. I do know that I have a lot of work to do on myself, and while I feel that I am trying, I admit that I could definitely do a lot better. I'm not the greatest multi-tasker, and often get caught up in a sort of a tunnel vision until whatever happens to be bothering me is handled. So looking at the big picture tends to be something I that can be very poor at.

Although I don't take back any of my feelings on whether or not to invite poly into our marriage, nor does my opinion on the person she was having this connection with change, I do have a ton of regret over the way I acted during various stages within. I may never be able to truly understand how someone can love more than one other as a partner, but I do accept that it happens with some. And for those that can make it work, great. I just don't happen to be one of those people, and thought that I made it clear enough a long long time ago, that I'm not.

It seems that this whole ordeal was born out of a perfect storm of shitty happenings. Her problems at work, her operation & recovery, my dad's death, her quitting her job, my longtime friend passing away, and my own work related problems to contend with, and him entering the picture, along with the subsequent disturbing things I learned about him . In the past, I'd be able to talk to my dad about most of these things. I never discussed relationship problems, because I knew my wife wouldn't feel comfortable with him knowing certain things, but losing him, erased an outlet that I had to help me vent & clear things up within my head. And losing someone else to a motorcycle wreck, began to present this overwhelming feeling of loss & abandonment. Couple that with my wife being emotionally unavailable for close to a year, and it felt like I had no one who wanted me anymore.

I think, perhaps, one of the enormous problems my wife has, is her OCD. And while it may have taken some time & thought to discover, I have to think that it's more the cause that led her into poly - or at least, what she considers poly. She's been know to take up activities & hobbies in the past, where she would go all out with them. But it was never considered to be a problem when it seemed to be something productive, like crocheting.

I'm thinking it would be a really good idea to speak candidly with her therapist. According to her, he tells her to put the unpleasantness into a box, and just do what eases her mind. While to some, this may seem like the right advice, but I don't think I can agree when whatever activity that happens to be her thing at the time, becomes an obsession that occupies the entire day, at the expense of dealing with real life. I try to offer alternatives, especially if they're low stress activities, but the interest is not there. Currently, it's all day movie marathons & online shopping.

So perhaps, it was spending time online with another person that was her previous obsession. I get that that can happen... But I firmly believe that his presence did more harm than good. Not just for me, but for her especially. He was into her, so there was no way he was going to turn down the opportunity to chat, etc... whenever she beckoned. From what I saw - poly aside - he was more of an enabler, and an escape mechanism, than part of a support system. And after learning that he's had a habit of getting involved with married women in the past (5 others, all of them romantic. One led to a divorce, another neared divorce), I had to get rid of him once and for all. That's why I gave her the ultimatum. Even if I were to be accepting of poly in our lives, even if I'd have been willing to open our marriage, I still would have never been comfortable with his presence in hers, or ours.

So if I seem bitter over the concept of poly, I apologize to those of you with positive experiences. I knew extremely little about poly before my wife brought this up. And in my struggle to figure it out, I was met with many remarks about selfishness, and how "unnatural" monogamy is, and all kinds of other nonsense.
 
I can see why you might be leery of the guy she was seeing online.
 
I can see why you might be leery of the guy she was seeing online.

It definitely seemed to exacerbate things, that's for sure. She maintains that she had any indication that he was into her romantically. Whether that's true, or she didn't catch on due to her mental state, is something I may never know. I had a couple of conversations with him myself at the time, and I could definitely see what he was after, although he was very vague & somewhat misleading, so never full admission... But in either case, learning of his track record, it wasn't worth the risk. Especially with her safety...

There were plans to go to a gaming convention back in September. It was to be a big group. My wife didn't go, and so he didn't go either. But I hate to think what could have happened if they did. Of course, my wife had insisted that she would never allow anything to happen, and that she would reject any advances if he made any... BUT, remember, we're talking about someone she's never met in person before. Anyone can represent themselves any anything online. And I don't think anyone knows anyone completely, when all they know is what they represent online. Suppose he decided not to take no for an answer!?
 
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