Kids, to have them or not?

LadyBearhugs

New member
Hi everyone!

This is my first post on the forum. I've seen countless other posts and everyone is so helpful. Was hoping i can get some insight here.

Thanks in advance!


*Names have been changed for privacy as well as for readers to follow the characters more easily instead of using A, B, C.



My name is Jane*.

My Husband (Darren) and I have been together for 8 years. He has a girlfriend (Kate) who has been with him for 1 year+.
My relationship with Kate is ok. We're not close but we have no problems hanging out.

My problem now is the discussion of having kids in the future.

Before Kate, I knew i would want kids with Darren someday if our financials allow it. Was quite looking forward to it actually.

Now, Darren would like both me and Kate to have kids with him. Kate is very eager and willing. Me, not so much.
Now, I've changed my mind and go so far as to say I will never ever have Kids.


I have some concerns and fears about this and i can't seem to handle them.
Now i'm just very depressed and stressed about this topic.

This is a huge decision. I can't yoyo back and forth. I have to be sure i will be ok with my decision whether to have kids or not.

And being sure of this, will help me to figure out whether i should still be in this relationship or not.

I have told Darren that if he wants to have kids with Kate, then i will never be having kids. He got upset, he says he loves me and wants to have this bond with me. We had a debate and he told me to think over this seriously and carefully.

He's worried that i will not be able to take it. He doesn't want me waking up years later with a child and saying "I can't take this life anymore" and walk out.

We both understand that there's another life involved and we are trying to be responsible.


My concerns and fears are:

1) Resource competition - If our funds are low, which baby gets what? It will surely affect the quality of things my baby gets if i have to spilt the funds.

I've always wanted 2 kids. If our financials only allow a total of 2 kids to be had. Kate gets 1, I get 1. Then what about the 2nd kid of my own that i want?


2) Irrational fear of being abandoned - I've read enough posts here to know that being pregnant and having a partner's child means nothing if they decide they don't want to be with you anymore. I am worried even in the case where he does loves me, I would get lesser time with him and in turn my baby gets lesser time with his/her father.

Darren is not superman. I don't expect him to be. I just don't think he can cope and spilt the time and resources fairly all the time.

I want someone who can take care of my baby fully and be there for my baby. Not just popping around when he has the time after taking care of his other family.


3) I get upset knowing that someone else will be having Darren's child. I know it's not rational but i just feel sad. It's a special bond that i don't think i am ready for him to share with someone else. I don't know if i can still stay with Darren if he does have a child with Kate. It would hurt too much.

The thing is, if he had another child from before, I know i would be ok with that and would love that child as my own. I just can't seem to grasp the concept of him having one now that i am already with him.


And in all my irrational thinkings, it doesn't matter if he has a baby with Kate or not, because if it's not with Kate, it might be with someone else years down the road. If i get pregnant after he breaks up with Kate, I still run the risk of him finding another partner and wanting to have a baby with her. By then it would be too late for me. I'd already have a child and i can't rewind time.

Ok i know, sounds totally irrational and something i cannot predict. Seems i am very risk adverse when it comes to this.

Logically, everything has it's risk. I know that. Even if we were in a monogamous relationship, i still can't guarantee that won't happen.


I don't know what to do now. At this point of time, Darren loves me very much and i trust him when he says he will never leave me and will love me forever. I love him alot too and I do want to be with him and spend my life with him.

However, I've also learnt that nothing is forever, it's merely a state of continuity until it stops. He loves me until the day he doesn't.



I want to know how to handle the fear and concerns in a healthy and rational way.

How can i make this work?

I don't want to waste everyone's time. I don't want to just surf through now and then in 3 years time, when it's time for kids, and realise that i can't handle him having a child with Kate and want out, or live my life miserable seeing him have kids with Kate, or just go through with it and have kids and be stressed and depressed all the time worrying about this.


Hope the information above is enough. Let me know if u need more information.

Thanks for helping out!


Love,

Lady Bearhugs
 
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I want someone who can take care of my baby fully and be there for my baby. Not just popping around when he has the time after taking care of his other family......

Ok i know, sounds totally irrational and something i cannot predict. Seems i am very risk adverse when it comes to this.

Sounds to me like you're very rational about this! Mother Nature has built into women (who want children) a very active and loud child protection gene. You're thinking like a mama bear and this is a good thing! Every woman wants her children to have a father (and usually, she wants a mate) who is there for the family 100% and whatever 100% means to you is what 100% means to you. Yes, there are women in this world who can share a father with other mothers, but if that's not you, that's not you. It's very rational of you to think about this and know this about yourself. You're risk averse about this for very good reason.

Personally, I wouldn't go near "father sharing" with a ten foot pole. Sharing lovers can be wonderful, but raising children is an entirely different experience. Sure, some happily share fathers of their children, but the overwhelming majority of women, poly or not, want a father who is "all theirs." That is an extraordinarily strong genetic preference that Mother Nature has given to women and she knows what she's doing. Your intuition is speakng to you loud and clear. Listen!
 
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Would you be willing to live with Kate (or another partner with whom Darren chooses to procreate)?

Honestly, you sound like you've thought this through a lot. Coming from someone with an infant right now, I could not imagine doing this without the father here to help as much as possible. I wouldn't wish single parenthood of a baby on anyone and am amazed at people who choose it and rock at it. It's not irrational at all to want to have that support, so the only way I personally would want my husband to have a baby with someone else is if she were living with us so he could be there for both of us without having to choose/travel in between.

As for your specific fears.... 1 - Are you taking into account Kate's contribution financially? Again, if you're all willing to cohabit, would that cut costs? Would you expect Darren to mingle part of his finances with hers to kind of "even the playing field?" Would you prefer to have support documents set up legally so that everyone knows who is responsible for what? 2 - This is why I would want all baby-making partners to live in one space: to make sure the kids have both parents available and I have time with my partner. Kids are time consuming, energy sucking little things so you have to be able to squeeze in moments here and there. It would be very hard to do that if your partner is splitting time between multiple homes.
 
I would love to have kids with Nina sometime soon. Luckily she feels the same way. If for some reason however, she chose to have children with another partner - whether in addition to, or instead of with me - then at the very least, we would cease to be life-partners. Having kids takes time and money and energy. It's not a 'part-time' job. If it came down to her splitting her time and energy across multiple families, I think I'd rather she invest her time fully with me as a co-parent than also as a romantic partner. So if we had kids, and she later wanted kids with someone else, then I'd still probably prefer to walk away from the romantic side of our connection. I just cannot fathom it working any other way. It takes a lot of compatibilities to share a home and raise kids with someone. The chances of her finding someone that would be compatible with both of us for those things, even purely as a V, seem vanishingly small. I've said from day one that I'm not up for living with each other's others, and that would count double for raising a family with others too.

I'm curious as to what others think in this situation though, as I've often thought that my opinions largely stem from leaning a bit more to the monogamous end of the spectrum in many ways. In fact, pondering questions like this with Nina in the past has helped me to clarify how open I am to different relationship types. I really don't feel like I can (or want to) sustain multiple life-partnership type relationships. I like having deep emotional connections with multiple people, but not as part of the relationship escalator. If we go with that analogy, the top step of my escalator only has room for one other person, although the rungs below it have plenty of room for friends and lovers. If Nina had a strong desire to have multiple life-partnerships too, it would simply be an incompatibility we couldn't bridge. If this is where you are, OP, then you have my sympathies. It's painful to realise that in spite of all the many ways you ARE compatible with your partner, there can still be deal-breakers lurking unspoken. But as I'm sure you know, it's so much better to be seeing them and addressing them now before having kids, than to walk into that particular land-mine later. :(
 
I've said from day one that I'm not up for living with each other's others, and that would count double for raising a family with others too.

I'm curious as to what others think in this situation though, as I've often thought that my opinions largely stem from leaning a bit more to the monogamous end of the spectrum in many ways. In fact, pondering questions like this with Nina in the past has helped me to clarify how open I am to different relationship types. I really don't feel like I can (or want to) sustain multiple life-partnership type relationships. I like having deep emotional connections with multiple people, but not as part of the relationship escalator.

I feel EXACTLY the same way. Polyamorous, but mono when it comes to life partnership. The compromises involved in sharing your entire life with one partner are complicated enough... I simply couldn't handle doing it with two or more.

Lady Bearhugs, I don't have or want kids of my own, and I would still consider my life partner having them with someone else a deal breaker. It's just a level of entanglement with a metamour I don't want.

Not having kids yourself - while accepting that Darren will have them with others - certainly saves you from worrying about how to parent without sufficient help. But how will that affect your relationship with your husband? I am a big believer in "kids' needs come first", so I know that if my husband did have children with another partner, I would feel like I needed to fade into the background and let him devote almost all of his time and energy to the kids and his relationship with their mom.

I can see "father sharing" working out if you all 3 love each other (even platonically) and want to commit to living as one big family, raising all the kids together. Maaaybe even in separate homes, if they were next door or something. But it would still require you to have a truly exceptional metamour relationship, one where you consider each other life partners and love each other's kids like your own.

Is Darren absolutely set on wanting the freedom to have kids with Kate and/or other partners? Is setting a "we have kids with each other and not anyone else" limit even a possibility?
 
If YOU want kids with Darren and funds are low he shouldn't be having kids with Kate.

If Darren has kids with Kate and not you that's a TON of time and resources he's going to divert to that relationship. The children will bring them together in a way you could never compete with. IMHO as a father.
 
I'm on the other end of the parenting spectrum from you, my children are young adults. They were teenagers when we opened up our marriage. However, before we opened our marriage, my husband was in love with one of his best friends and the way he treated his relationship with her was very similar to how he treats his relationship with his girlfriend, there just was never sex involved with the friend.

Our boys (we have 2 children, both boys) were 7 and 9 when my husband met his friend, she was hired at his work in his department. I most definitely felt like he diverted time, energy, and resources away from us as a family to devote to her. It was difficult because our sons were young enough to still need a lot of active parenting, I was a stay at home mom, so resources were tighter than they would otherwise have been, and I homeschooled our boys. I felt like I never got a break because even when he was home, he'd either be chatting with her or lost in one of the many online games they played together over the years.

Similar things happen now that we're poly. He divides his time between me and his two girlfriends. It's hard enough to deal with the whole poly thing with grown children. There's been lots of times that I could have used his support or help with things and he just wasn't there. Even when he is home, he's often chatting with one or the other of his girlfriends on his phone.

There is no way in hell I'd sign up for having children (if we were at the beginning of our parenting journey instead of where we are) with my husband if he was also going to have children with a girlfriend. Little ones are so time and energy consuming. I don't think my husband would do a very good job of splitting his time fairly between the families, if he had two, and I never wanted to be a single mom.

I realize I'm probably a biased voice because my husband hasn't been a good hinge, so that colors how I feel about this topic. I can tell you that when we opened up our marriage, I was grateful that our kids were older, because I could already, at the very beginning, see how time consuming dating is.
 
I'm going to say I'm closer to the other end of the spectrum - if TheKnight was ever to fall in love deeply enough with someone else that we shared living spaces / they wanted children, I'd consider it, despite the resources it would potentially take away from our child. ONLY if we all lived together though - I would *not* be ok with him having two separate households, as that's too much time split.

That said, it's pretty easy for me to say that given that he's even more done than me with children.
 
In our case we are three adults and two toddlers right now. The combination is good, there is never enough time seemingly and the more adults the better. We live together and there is always someone available for the kids. Separate households? No way! You do not have enough time on your hands as parents living close together in one household, managing two seems impossible to me without someone missing out somewhere.

If you could imagine living with the other partner and co-parent all of the children, it could work out, from my point of view. But dividing everything (space, time, money) will lead to serious problems.
 
Hi Jane,

I am generally of the mind that most people shouldn't have kids, at least not unless they're 100% sure. It's just too hard to take care of the kids and be a good parent. It takes too much time, energy, and money. It can suck the life out of a marital relationship.

In theory, you could have one child, Kate could have one child, and the three of you (plus the two kids) could share a single home. In that case, I would suggest not having more than those two children. And other than breastfeeding, the babysitting would be traded around so that each adult would take a turn babysitting both kids. That way the other two adults can have a rest.

Darren seems to be pretty determined to have kids with both ladies. But you, Jane, don't want that. So, somebody's going to end up disappointed in this scenario. I wonder if the thing to do isn't to divorce so that you can look for a monogamous husband. I know you don't think that would solve the problem, but at least it would cancel a guaranteed problem.

Having kids is such a complicated thing to do. That's why I don't generally recommend it.

Regards,
Kevin T.
 
Hi Everyone!

Thank you for your replies.

I'll do my best to reply to each of ur posts and to add any information i find relevant.


@Phy Currently, what Darren wants for us in the future is for us all to live together and share responsibilities co-parenting. Everyone would be expected to chip in financially. One house for all of us to live in.

Currently Kate handles her own finances. I handle Darren's and my finances.


@kdt26417 Darren is determined to have kids with both ladies. My thread here is to help me figure out what i can and cannot accept. For me to see points of views from others that i might not have come to on my own. If the end result is divorce, then it can't be helped....though i really really want to avoid that.

Darren have mentioned time and time again, that he does not want to lose me over this. He's hoping i can think about this and come to a conclusion. He wants to make both Kate and I happy but he also understands that certain things are hard to accept. Thus, he wishes to have a discussion once i sort out my feelings. I love him, so i also don't want to limit his life and the choices that he can make. I'm not his anchor, i don't want him to feel stuck. I want him to experience life fully, and in ways that he can be happiest.


@GirlFromTexlahoma The possibility of limiting the relationship so that Darren only has kids with me is out of the question. I find this limit to be very unfair to Darren and Kate. I have understood from conversations with Kate that she is very eager to have children. When Darren and Kate started their relationship, there was no limits set. She came into this relationship with no expectations of being barred from anything.

In some ways, i respect that Kate is brave and has no problems having children under these circumstances. I'm no psychiatrist, but i always thought part of the reason why she has no qualms about having kids, sharing the father, is because she doesn't have close family. She lived alone for most part of her life (she migrated when she was a teenager to study overboard and work) and she wants to have her own family. Someone to share her life with. Or perhaps she just made up her mind to have kids and she is at that age where she is ready.

I am 27, Darren is 35 and Kate is 32.

When they got into a relationship, i was perhaps naively under the impression that it was just a romantic and sexual relationship that will not involved children.
Past conversations with Darren about opening up our relationship have never mentioned children with others. I guess the topic just never came up.

That's why when Darren mentioned children, I came to realise that I would be very affected by Darren having kids with someone else.

@icesong Darren is a good man, but none of us have any experience with children before and as good as a man he is, like i mentioned in my first post. He's not superman. Everyone will fall short at some point even if they try their very best. Who gets hurt because of that is no one's fault. What we can do is to try and minimize the damage.



@Hannahfluke I'm sorry to hear that u went through a difficult time. I want to thank you for sharing your experiences with me. I really appreciate it. Yes, little ones are very time consuming. Like you, i would like to have the full support available to me. It really does suck when the husband is distracted and can't fully be there for us.
In our household, all 3 of us would be working to maximise funds.
So time management and resources have to be planned out very carefully.
I am unclear at this point if Kate would want to be a stay-at-home mom or not in the future.

I expect this to be an added stress point in the future. I would be willing to be a stay-at-home mum only if i was the only one having children with Darren.

I do not want to become the baby sitter of the house and having to depend on Darren and Kate financially. Besides, I want to have my career to aid me and my own funds during my time of need should things go south.



@AJM Thanks AJM for your insights. I know time and resources are going to be diverted, but I never really thought about the bond they will share if they have kids together and i don't do that with Darren. Another useful point for me to ponder about.

As for having kids when funds are low, it can be argued that Kate may have money of her own to support the child that she wants.

Currently Darren and I have more commitments (mortgage, renovation loans etc.). Kate is currently not merging finances with us. She is capable of saving enough for herself and a child, should she wish for that.



@GirlFromTexlahoma I suppose i was always more mono then poly. I've never had the urge to date others. I'm alright with Darren dating as long as i get treated right by my standards. So far, he has been wonderful and does beyond what i need, to make me feel safe and loved. The thing is, the 3 of us are not living together now. Kate is living in another country. Darren goes to visit every 2 months for a couple weeks at a time. I have never been to visit her as the air tickets aren't cheap and i don't have the extra funds to go. So i do not know how Darren will cope if all 3 of us are living together, and whether our individual needs would be met.

I don't know how it will affect my relationship with Darren, should he have kids with Kate. Perhaps like what you said. I will just gradually just fade into the background. And if Darren doesn't realise or is too busy with the baby, then i suppose our relationship would just end, or be in limbo. I'm in a relationship in name with Darren, but we don't behave like we are in a relationship.

I too, do not want that level of entanglement with a metamour. But things have come to a point where i can't reverse this fact that they want to have kids in the future.

@AlwaysGrowing I would be willing to live together, all 3 of us under one household.
What i can't imagine right now is being able to live together harmoniously.
Yes we've hanged out before, but we're really not that close. Kate is a nice person all in all. I do have jealous tendencies towards her. So does she, she can get jealous of me as well.

Darren keeps saying that we can actually be good friends. I agree with him, if only we had time to know each other better before they begin their relationship together. I get along well with everyone. I just didn't get the time to know her before i became jealous. Once there is jealousy involved, i find it hard to be good friends with her.

If i can't be good friends with her, and truly be able to care for her well-being and vice versa, like how any other good friend would care for each other, I don't see how it would work out living and raising kids together.

At this point, i am unable to improve our relationship as she lives in another country right now for work.

Due to me being stressed about this issue, I do not wish to, or, have the energy to text her or email her to improve our relationship as well.



@tenK Thanks for your reply! ^_^ I would prefer to have the romantic part as well as be life partners. I want to avoid having to walk away from my relationship after having kids. If i know there is a chance i may need to walk away. I will not have kids. This just make things less messy after breaking up. I can start a new life without having to be entangled with Darren because of the baby, and i don't want to be a single mom.

I agree with u that finding someone that is compatible with both u and Nina, as well as be able to live together and raise kids is very difficult. I reckon we'd have a better chance of striking the lottery first =P

Darren and I are very compatible as lovers and as life-partners. I do feel sadden by that fact that this issue of having kids may be our un-doing.


@FallenAngelina Thanks FallenAngelina for your reply. I just want to be sure about whether i can or cannot accept the whole "father sharing" thing. Thank u for your insight! ^_^






At this point, i am still unclear as to what i can or cannot accept. I am a very easy-going person. I usually just go along with what Darren wants to do.....until this.

My conundrum is this:

1) I accept that Kate and I both have kids, take things one at a time. If things work out, fine. If not, one relationship will be broken. Kids will be involved and everyone will be hurt if it falls apart. Very messy situation. At this point, emotionally i don't know if i can handle it. I know life is full of risks, but i want to be able to at least feel comfortable with this idea to proceed. But i don't right now because there are too many variables to account for. I also don't want to take too long to decide and just surf alone. I don't want to waste my time as well as Darren and Kate's time too.

2) I don't accept Kate and Darren having kids. Either i break up with Darren or he breaks up with Kate. I don't wish for Kate and Darren to break up because of me. I do not want to part with Darren either. I do not want Darren to have to choose, it will break his heart.

3) I accept that Kate and Darren have kids. I don't have kids. Can i take it emotionally? And how will it affect my relationship with Darren in the future? This option is kinda moot because Darren have explicitly said that he must have a kid with me, because he loves me and he wants this bond with me.


Darren have asked me what can he do or say to help me to be ok with the both female having kids idea. He says he will do anything to prove to me that it will work. He will take steps to make things better, to improve and to help me be comfortable.

I don't have an answer for him.

So.....yup. I still can't sort out my feelings well enough.

What should i do? What are the steps i can take to make things better? to be more clear?

My oh my.....
 
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As far as I can see everything involved here, in case you decide that you want to try and have children as a chosen family of 3, you should plan for time together just cohabiting and getting to know each other and see, if you can actually handle living together. If there is a connection between you and Kate and if you three work well als a family. And with time I mean 1-2 years, not some weeks. The kids bring stress ... any crack in your relationship will show as soon as they are there, but the added stress of multiple relationships do basically the same. This could go horribly if you rush any of it.

Darren sounds a bit ... hm. He must have a kid with you? What kind of reason is that for another humand life? This fixation sound like it is a lot about him and not so much about the child. He does not care if you have the same deep wish for it? He can only speak for himself, he can't 'make' you ok with anything, this is your thing to work through. I find his approach troubling, to be honest.
 
Hi Phy

One difficulty in seeing whether we work is because Kate lives in another country right now. I do not know when there would be a chance we would all be able to live together.

She has come to visit us for 1 week prevously. I thought she was nice, but during that time (it was xmas and new years) we had been attending alot of parties. So we didn't really have much one on one time. I was also working some days when she was here.

I didn't think that was enough time and i don't know when the next time would be.

My concern is lets say we only get to live together one year from now. Then we take another 1 to 2 years to see if we are compatible.
By then, 2 to 3 years would have gone past. I have the time to spare. But what about Kate? She would be 34 to 35 years old by then.
Don't know if this would be fair to her.....or this is just life? There are no certainties so if some years have to be spent, to figure this out, it can be considered fair?


Perhaps i didn't use the right words to describe Darren. When i say that he must have a kid with me, i meant it in a loving way.

We have been together for 8 years. We have always discussed kids from the beginning so that we know if our thoughts about this fit. How we would raise the kids in general and how many we would have etc.

We have always been excited at the thought of having children together. It was just a matter of time and getting ready our finances and home.
I am 8 years younger then Darren. So he has been more than happy to wait until i was ready.

He is a very considerate man. Thus he has been patient and slowly waiting for me to be ready.

Perhaps i shouldn't have said "want to have a kid with me" so bluntly without explaining.

I should have said "wishes to have a kid with me because he loves me and would be very happy if i agreed to raise a child with him. As that would show that our relationship is strong and we love each other a lot to be able to create another life together".

I don't know if that explains it properly.

Now we have a beautiful home. We're starting to build up finances again. It's just the issue of sharing him with another person in regards to having children.



Love,

Lady Bearhugs
 
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I agree with Phy. You guys need to move in together and see if you are compatible on that level before you can make the decision if all three having kids together or not. Your fears and concerns sound very reasonable to me, and not necessarily particular to being poly. I would be tempted to look at it this way: if you were mono, you wouldn't just decide to have kids with someone you'd met a few times, who lived in another country, even if your best friend in the whole world really vouched for them and trusted them. The proposal that is being put on the table is not 'I can have children with Darren, and Kate can have children with Darren', it's in all practical terms 'me and Darren and Kate can have children together'. You (and Kate) need to be able to evaluate whether you two are compatible as co-parents, and you need to put the same level of effort into figuring that out as you did when you considered Darren as a biological dad. When did you know you and he would make great parents? After how many years and conversations?

People can and do raise children with close friends and people they consider family. However, right now that's not you and Kate. At least not yet. I think this is what is triggering the red flag for you - and quite right too. Sounds like Darren is being a bit naive in his vision of how well this is going to work practically. Nothing he can say or do will be able to reassure you or fix this for you, because I think the issue is between you and Kate. If it's to resolve naturally, which would be best, then yeah, you might be looking at trying to speed up your cohabiting plans a while to give you all a few years to adjust before anyone gets pregnant. If they're not willing to do that and want to rush into it/put off thinking about these practicalities until there is a baby on the way, then you'll know where you stand. If she moves in, and you instantly know that it's not going to work, then you know where you stand.

In all honesty, they've only been dating a year, long-distance. THEY shouldn't even be considering kids until they've been dating up close and personal for quite a while anyway. They are still getting to know each other, and may yet discover incompatibilities that will spell the end of their relationship. Much of this sounds premature to me.
 
As far as I can see everything involved here, in case you decide that you want to try and have children as a chosen family of 3, you should plan for time together just cohabiting and getting to know each other and see, if you can actually handle living together. If there is a connection between you and Kate and if you three work well als a family. And with time I mean 1-2 years, not some weeks. The kids bring stress ... any crack in your relationship will show as soon as they are there, but the added stress of multiple relationships do basically the same. This could go horribly if you rush any of it.
This. I do not think you should decide anything about having kids or not before you know if you are able to cohabit with Kate.
LadyBearhugs said:
Darren keeps saying that we can actually be good friends.
Darren for sure hopes you two could be good friends. Of course, he might be right but it is not always the case. Not all metamours are good friends or even tolerate each other. My two live-in partners are friends, I'd say, but my husband does not like my boyfriend Jeremy. Jeremy and Mark are in good terms, but not exactly friends.

I am trying to conceive with CJ now, and I also would like to have Jeremy's child. As the situation is now, I have put the thought of having a kid with Jeremy in the back burner realizing it might never be a good idea. What helped me with that decision was that Jeremy is not willing to rock the balance of my household with such a big thing, even though he eventually wants kids and sees me as a good mama candidate - to the point that I am the first person he has ever considered having kids with.

I have read the book "Polyamory and Pregnancy" by Jennifer Burde, and it helped me get some thoughts more clear in my head. I warmly recommend that book for you! Also, browse this forum about threads on moving in together. That should really be the first thing you three start planning in detail.

I see posts popping on this tread while I was writing this - not read the few latest ones but will post now nonetheless.
 
.....Kate lives in another country right now......
She has come to visit us for 1 week previously. ......we didn't really have much one on one time.

Just clarifying: Kate lives in another country, you three have spent a total of one week together with you and she having had virtually no one on one time? If this is the case, talk of baby making is grossly premature.
 
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All of this needs to slow down. You absolutely need to spend more time with Kate, and Darren does as well. You shouldn't decide to have kids with someone you hardly know! Waiting a few years isn't unfair to Kate - it's the only true fair way to do things! You're talking about a baby, a human life. Cohabitating needs to happen first. If it isn't possible right now, then it isn't possible to consider having a baby either.
 
It sounds like Kate definitely wants kids, and you're. ...maybe wanting kids. It's great you're talking about this early on. This isn't a surprise you want 5 years in!

That being said, at least some fears are irrational. If you can push those aside, it might make it easier to deal with harder issues. You say you're worried about money. But Kate is going to bring her income to the table and families find ways to make things work. You can still have your two kids, if you even want them! Don't stress TOO much on this. And Kate will likely have responsibility for hers and you for yours. .with the dad caring for all.

This could be an amazing and loving family.
 
Hello everyone~

From reading everyone's views and insights, It seems that the general view is that I should move in with Kate and assess the situation, whether we get along or not, before i make my decision. Not to be too rash.


@tenK
Thank you for your example. It really helped me to view things more clearly. You are right. It's me and Darren and Kate having children together. I wouldn't want a stranger, someone i can't trust to be in my house, around my baby. I have to find out if she's would be a compatible co-parent. Being unable to view Kate a s a trusted friend and family is a red flag for me.

I don't welcome people like this to be so involved in my life and in my home.


For Darren and I, we had the whole kids conversation early on in our relationship. it was about 2 months in. It was more of a general Q&A we gave each other to see how similar or different our views are before we decide to move on further in the relationship. We talked about kids, whether we'd be ok if a parent had to stay with us long term in the future, views on religion etc.

As we dated and got to know each other, we would continue to ask questions and feel for each other, to see if anything major had changed. Like checking in on each other's views and sentiments. I knew 1 year in that he'd be a good husband. 2 years in, to confirm 100000% that he'd be a great dad too.

Darren just wants me to view this in a more positive light. He's not forcing me to accept. Just wants me to genuinely give it a shot. He does have a point. For e.g, if i keep telling myself it wouldn't work, even if it could have worked, I'd have thrown away the possibility by being stubborn and purposely negative. I wouldn't put in any effort and if Kate does do something nice for me, I would just be suspicious of her. I admit, I do have a tendency to do this whole negative thing.

Darren knows that his relationship with Kate is still in early stages. They were just talking about kids, like the general Q&A i mentioned. They know that there is a chance their relationship might not work out after all. They are not pushing to have kids, just a general discussion, with the option being put out there in the case their relationship works after all.

I am the one jumping the gun. To me, if there is a possibility that they will have kids (since there is no limit and they would like to if they could and even if it's just 10% possibility) i want to consider the ramifications it could have on me, my relationship with Darren and my life.


As for plans to cohabit, Darren might get be getting a job at the country Kate is working now. If it's successful, he will move over first (probably in May) and i will follow suit in a couple of months (once i settle my own affairs in my own country and Darren can provide for me while i look for employment)

This whole moving thing has it's own complications by itself..... but that's for another thread, when the whole thing is confirmed.



@Nadya
Thanks for sharing your experience with me! It's really helpful and you are so lucky to have such wonderful partners.
Thanks for the recommendation! I will surely check out the book! I will also check out more threads about moving in together.



@FallenAngelina
It's more of a general Q&A type of discussion. Nothing set in stone yet. I have explained further in details in my above reply to @tenK.

Yea, really did not have any one on one time.
And to be honest, i really don't know what to say to her. Even if i were to converse with her online now. I have no idea what to say to her? I mean, how much small talk can i dish out until i run out of things to converse about?



@Bluebird
I really hope waiting a few years is ok.
I was worried that after a few years, I'd just call it off. Then what's the point of wasting everyone's time you see.
I'm worried that because i can't feel and think clearly about this issue now, I end up stringing them along, only to hurt them in the end.

If Darren doesn't get the job in the same country as Kate, then i don't see any chances of co-habitating at all. For personal reasons, she can't leave that country. She can easily find a job in my country, my country has a very open frame work when hiring foreigners. Her country is much more strict. It's very difficult to find a job over there. So yea.....

We'll see what happens with Darren's job offer.



@Candiedlove
Thanks Candiedlove for your reply.

I do want kids, I'm just unsure when it comes to having kids with Darren and Kate is involved.

Yes i do admit some fears are irrational, or perhaps the more correct saying would be, I am imagining all sorts of situations that could happen and in a bad way.

I can see how it could be an amazing and loving family. In an ideal setting, more people would mean more financial freedom. More free time as there are more people to help. More people to care for and help each other. More people to just hang out and have fun. More social life as more people tend to mean more friends etc.

On the other hand, there could be a lot of drama and jealousies and unfairness.

I'm scared. Suddenly after many years together, just us two, I have to face the possibility of Darren starting a family with someone else. I have to face the possibility that as long as i am with Darren, I will have to face Kate as well. I feel sadden, just a little, that what was "mine" is no longer "mine". My whole life, just changed all of a sudden. Even though i am open to poly, somethings just hit a little harder i guess.


To be fair, I currently am not giving it a chance or putting in any effort to try and be friends (even online) with Kate.
I really don't have the energy for it at all.

Thinking about talking to her is like forcing me to eat a rock now. I realise that I am being unfair by projecting my stress and negativity to be associated with her being in my life.

Kate did text me 2 weeks back to try and talk to me. I didn't really respond in a way that a conversation could be continued....I didn't want to talk to her if i didn't feel it from my heart. I'm just responding like a robot.

Maybe i'm just giving myself an excuse to give up.
To run away instead of facing this.


Darren has been very supportive. He's giving me all the time i need. Even when i tried to be difficult last night, instead of calling me out for being difficult, he just came over and hugged me and said he understands I'm not feeling well now. If i wanna talk or ask any questions, he's always there to support me.

That made me feel guilty for trying to be difficult and at the same time so loved and secure that I actually do feel some hope that perhaps this could really work.
 
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As for plans to cohabit, Darren might get be getting a job at the country Kate is working now. If it's successful, he will move over first (probably in May) and i will follow suit in a couple of months (once i settle my own affairs in my own country and Darren can provide for me while i look for employment).

is he getting a job there to be with Kate?
 
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