New to Poly (Long post, sorry)


Yes. J is very generous when it comes to money. A is a young female who delivers papers at night and goes to school part time. So she has literally no money. J has made it clear that he doesn't mind helping her out with certain things. Example: A broke her phone so J went and got a cheap boost phone for her to use until she could get hers fixed or replaced. Example: She needed to see a female doctor to start her annual checkups but doesn't have insurance. J offered to help her get insurance and pay for the first visit. Example: J gave her money for her first insurance payment. And it goes on. He wants to put her on our phone plan. He wants to help find her her own place and maybe even buy a place for her...so yes, money is definitely another issue that I haven't even begun to really think about.
 
I must say, tiklemepink44, that this money aspect seems paramount to this situation. That your 45 year old boyfriend is positioning himself/your household to "keep" this 21 year old woman would be my first concern. Second concern would be that she is lapping it up. Is this OK with you?
 
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I think you guys need to let this relationship go... and rethink the kinds of rules you have. Why do you need such rules? This sounds like a swinger's distorted view of poly, and the way you and your bf are doing it doesn't really respect anyone's autonomy. Your expectations do not show a maturity in how adult relationships work - it's like you have this idea of what poly is supposed to be, and you're expecting that, but aren't realizing your ideal is unrealistic, like a cartoon about poly.

It is generally unreasonable and difficult to require a young woman to be involved with both of you from the start, as well demanding she be faithful to only you and your male partner from the very beginning. When you're monogamous, there is usually a dating period of seeing how things go before expecting exclusivity. Polyamory isn't different from monogamy in that way - human relationships take time. Paying someone's bills ain't gonna guarantee fidelity out of them - establishing and building intimacy, trust, and true caring over time does that.

It seems like the whole scenario is based on sex only, anyway. You're expecting a full-on relationship with her when you haven't spent time to get to know her. Look at what you've set up - basically you are acting out of Couple Privilege and treating her like a toy that is there to satisfy your own needs, and you're getting pissy because you're not getting access to the toy like you thought you would - and she has needs different from yours. I see a whole lot of growing up to do, on everyone's parts.

You say you aren't putting her into a box, but in actuality, you've done just that. Yikes, what a mess. Your bf's goal of having a three-person relationship shouldn't be the thing that comes first, that you then try to fit somebody into. It's much better to just be open to meeting people and then seeing what happens from there if you hit it off - and to allow room for each of you to date separately.

Good luck with extricating yourself from this situation - it will be challenging.
 
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I understand that perhaps this relationship would appear to be based on sex, but it isn't. We do have times where we just hang out and talk about random stuff, or about our relationship. She comes over in the early morning after work sometimes and we all have early morning coffee outside, or it's A and J outside alone, which is fine. A comes over for dinner all the time, even helps with dinner and the kids. There are times when her and I hang out by ourselves and have a good time. Despite my venting/ranting, we have had some good times in this relationship. But I don't really need advice on how to handle good feelings. It's fairly easy. :) It's the bad feelings I need help with, hence the lack of details about all the good that does happen in this relationship. Honestly, I know we didn't go about starting this exactly the right way. There should have been boundaries set, and it should have been taken one step at a time (we did start out by dating each other, sort of, but as I keep saying, it is going in more of a vee than a triad which isn't really what I signed up for) but it didn't and here we are. I am trying to learn how to deal with the current relationship and where to go from here so that maybe it WILL have a chance to improve. But I appreciate the outlook of third parties, it is proving to put my mind more at ease.
 
I must say, tiklemepink44, that this money aspect seems paramount to this situation. That your 45 year old boyfriend is positioning himself/your household to "keep" this 21 year old woman would be my first concern. Second concern would be that she is lapping it up. Is this OK with you?

I have thought this myself a few times actually and when I bring it up to J, he says he's just taking care of her because she needs it and he has the money, so why not? And it's not like she only comes over when she needs something, which is what she used to do. She comes over to actually spend time with us, to talk and be together. However, it pushes a button with me some of the time, and not other times, which is why I'm not really making a big deal out of it.

A would appear to be 'lapping it up', especially more recently. At first, she didn't want any money, but now she'll take whatever he hands her. So, I'm sure part of it is is that she is feeling more comfortable with him and more at ease and part of it is that she has a really shitty job and needs the help. So...yeah.
 
Well, you wouldn't be the first couple that was taken advantage of. Many have come here after having been ripped off by someone professing to want a relationship with both of them while not really following through on their words, yet somehow convincing the couple it would happen eventually - all while taking their money. We've seen a few stories here about couples even giving their "third" access to their bank accounts and passwords and really regretting it later, followed by receiving threats, filing restraining orders, and changing locks... all the couples believed their love for the third was being genuinely reciprocated, ha! Those women usually promise fidelity while already having secret lovers. They just give enough to sucker people in and get what they want out of them. That is what happens when people have a relationship configuration in mind and seek someone to fit into it - they make poor choices and jump into things too soon when someone comes along and seems like they want it too.

Don't say you weren't warned!
 
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No, nycindie, you are absolutely right. Which is why this whole thing with A's roommate has me concerned that she is that type of female exactly and I'm the only one seeing it or being slightly cautious about it. There are many...yellow flags, I guess...with A that I am monitoring. Such as her need of birth control if J is fixed? I know her periods are regular (occur right after mine) and she doesn't have any outrageous problems with her periods where she would need to be on BC (ie, no horrible cramping, no acne, etc.) Sooo, of course my mind jumps to the worst scenario which is that she is indeed sleeping with her roommate and is not being honest about anything at all. I want to trust her and I did until I saw that text. So now I'm skeptical again but I'm giving it some time and perhaps will say something to her later about it and she may have a perfectly rational explanation. Ah, it's all so confusing!

And the whole box thing; my point is that we were bluntly honest about our expectations and she was bluntly honest about hers. We are all trying to fit into each other's boxes, for lack of a better way to put it. We are all trying to be compromising and understanding of each other's wants and needs as far as general relationships go (like, needing space from one another now and then...A is able to go back to her place to sleep after work, but sometimes she comes over here to sleep so when she gets up, she's with us...don't think I'm explaining that right, but oh well...) Of course I'm finding out that I need to have more specific wants and needs when it comes to sex with all of us in general but I will be having that talk soon with them. Overall, the compromising seems to have worked and everyone is happy (aside from my personal issues).
 
I hope it all works out for the best, whether the relationships among the three of you continue or not. But to be honest, I think you've put blinders on, and only peek out from under them a little bit to see what she's up to, without really looking at your and your boyfriend's parts in this. He comes across as someone who really has his head in the sand. Sorry, but that's my impression.
 
I have to agree with Cyndie on this. While I understand that your history with A gives you a reason to be suspicious of her, you can't control what she does. You can only control what *you* do.

You can talk to J and express your concerns about A and her roommate.

You can tell J you're uncomfortable with him and A having sex in the same bed with you (or in the same room, or whatever) unless they let you know they're doing it and give you the option to join in.

If you and J share finances, you can ask him to stop giving A money, or at least to discuss it with you first.

You can ask A what her situation is with her roommate.

You can ask both of them to set times where each dyad within the triad has one-on-one time without the third being present. In addition to needing to nurture the you-J-A dynamic, you also need to nurture you-J, J-A, and you-A.

You can make a written list of the things you need from each of them in order to be more comfortable and happy with the arrangement. You can share that list with them and negotiate those things.

There's a lot of other things you could probably do. But at the end of the day, you only have control over yourself. You could ask J and A not to have sex while you're in bed with them, but you can't control whether they agree to that, or whether they stick to the agreement if they do.

It seems like you feel that you have *no* control in a lot of this situation, so I'd advise you to step back and look at all the things you *can* control, and then take control of those things.

On a side note... I get that age doesn't matter to some people, but to me it seems a little concerning that J seems to gravitate toward much younger women. That might be just a personal bias on my part, but given his behavior, it bothers me a bit.
 
On a side note... I get that age doesn't matter to some people, but to me it seems a little concerning that J seems to gravitate toward much younger women. That might be just a personal bias on my part, but given his behavior, it bothers me a bit.
To me, this isn't a side note, it's the elephant in the room!!! It's central to this entire situation. Are you OK with your significantly older boyfriend seeking out younger women? There are general power dynamics involved here and I'm trying not to judge so much as make sure you're aware.





....he says he's just taking care of her because she needs it and he has the money, so why not? And it's not like she only comes over when she needs something, which is what she used to do. She comes over to actually spend time with us, to talk and be together. ....At first, she didn't want any money, but now she'll take whatever he hands her.
This is the very definition of "kept," especially since your BF is looking to finance her digs. Kept people don't just show up for sex, they provide a sexual relationship in exchange for their upkeep. Plenty of kept people are in love with their keepers. Are you OK with this financial arrangement?
 
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To me, this isn't a side note. It's the elephant in the room. It's central to this entire situation.

Yes, it is. I think most unicorn hunters look for very young women with little means, because they believe (consciously or subconsciously) their monetary "help" puts them in control of her and the situation. But they soon become disillusioned when the unicorn turns out to have a mind of her own!
 
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Expectations

To me, it is impossible to meet a couple and then say that you are willing to be in a relationship with both of them. The best one can hope for is that the new person doesn't automatically rule out having a relationship with both of them but it is impossible to say that in six months, I will definitely feel romantic and sexual towards both of you and you will both feel that way about me. Just like I couldn't go on a first date with someone tomorrow and promise that I'll be in love with them this time next year.

I think that sort of unrealistic expectation is asking for trouble.
 
The age thing bothers me, and I am a woman who has had an ongoing relationship with a woman 22 years my junior for 6 1/2 years.

Your bf is 45. You are 28 and came into the r'ship with 3 young children. Did he take you under his wing, help YOU financially, give you a place to live? Were you just out of a failed r'ship with the father of your kids? It sounds like you have full custody. If that was the scenario, he is repeating it. He has white knight syndrome.

Then your bf (I will call them Jack and Annie, those initials don't work for me), Jack, has the idea to go unicorn hunting. He finds Annie, you 3 have 3way sex, she cheats, she is dumped. Some time later, Annie is back in the picture, repentant and promising not to cheat. But you suspect she is cheating again.

Also, I don't know how rich Jack is, or even if you have shared finances, but I'd resent it if he was spending so much of OUR money on this young woman. Insurance, dr's appts, even considering setting her up in her own place?

Another thing: how does his teen child feel about him having a 21 year old lover? About Annie coming and spending the night in his bedroom along with his 28 year old gf (you)?

One benefit of Jack helping Annie get her own place would be, they could fuck privately and not disturb your sleep or peace by fucking next to you in your bed, since there's no other available room for it with 4 kids in the house. Her having her own place would also reduce temptation for her to fuck her roommate (if she is) somewhat. But then again, she could have other lovers over whenever Jack is not expected.

Personally, I think Annie is far too young to know her own mind or to be able to truly know what she desires. I think it is different from my situation, since I was 54 when I met my gf, and she was 32. She was/is a full grown adult with lots of relationship experience and her own financial support. The situation with Jack and Annie seems more like a power imbalance based on gold-digging on her part and white knighting on his side.

Oh, there is so much going on here that is unsavory. I could go on, but I will stop there.
 
When the bed is empty, there is no need to ask for consent. When the bed is full, everyone needs to consent. I don't understand how someone couldn't see that.

This.

It is actually one of the few rules we have. No having sex in the bed if other people are trying to SLEEP in it.

We only have one bed, it's primary purpose is for sleeping in, when it is not being used for that it can be used as a sex surface. There are plenty of other places for sex-having (couch, in front of the fireplace, countertops, garage "sex-bench", the great outdoors, the car, the shower, the dining room table, etc.!). There are blankets and pillows and padding piled anywhere to make a sex nest - but SOME of us need to get up for work in the morning.

ETA. Read on further where there are limited options for sex-having places in this household. All the more reason, though, why negotiating appropriate place and timing is important if you have kiddos to consider.
 
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Hi tiklemepink44,

Was just wondering if you had any news about your situation. I wasn't sure what advice to give because it seems that the bottom line is that you just don't want J and A seeing each other anymore, whereas they do want to keep seeing each other. So, breaking up with them would seem like the logical thing. But I am thinking you don't want to break up, you just want to know how to be okay with everything.

What does your counselor have to say about all this? Are you still trying to pretend like everything is fine, or have you had a frank talk with J (and A?) about that? I am concerned that pretending may not be healthy for you, and may be making you feel worse.

Just wondering and concerned.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
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