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  #11  
Old 06-26-2011, 03:02 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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Originally Posted by Ignorant View Post
I began to see our little threesomes with women to be very little about who they were as a person but all about this extra body for our pleasure. They would get in their feelings and we barely registered their distress. I should want to be in this position just to nto be called a homophobe?!?
You wouldn't be in that position though. You would be in his position when there were two females. You don't seem to think HE was bing used by the two of you during these times. You feel SHE was.
Therefore, the equivalent would mean the male partner would be used. Not you.

I notice though that in both cases a female becomes the used person. It seems to be less about who is "extra" and more about who is male and who isn't. I'm just throwing that out there, because maybe psychologically you feel sex for a woman is a more vulnerable act, and that she's more likely to be used than a male?

At any rate, if you don't want to be part of a threesome anymore, don't be. If he wants to have sex with males, you don't need to be around. If you do decide to do it, you can make conditions, such as have it be about you and have you be in charge, which could help you feel less used.

Honestly, from the post I read it seemed more about feelings about homosexuality, but more of a general feeling that males were threatening, and two of them would mean you were used even more, when an extra female meant she'd be used instead. I'm female and I'm not used unless I want to be, and I use men if they want to be used.

I think you can explain to him how you feel the way you did here, or even have him read your posts. A lot of people seem to put more thoughts into creating posts that explain the whole situation than explaining things to their partners. Maybe because you have to explain the whole thing from the start. Either way, it could be insightful for him.
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  #12  
Old 06-26-2011, 04:17 PM
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Seasnail Seasnail is offline
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Originally Posted by Ignorant View Post
I don't envision a full on relationship with a woman and never have. I know this is unfair to female partners and knowing this has diminished my want for intimacy with women. It isn't real intimacy its just fucking and I don't want to make anyone regret sharing their body.
I'm curious why you think this is unfair? Like other posters, I wonder if it is because you are only interested in sex with love at this time. However, there are people who seem genuinely happy in various arrangements of sex, love, and committment.

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So we've been poly 2 years. Ups and downs but mostly good. He meets women and nothing works out for him long term. Meanwhile I could have a date any night I wish so there is a bit of a competitive vibe there but I don't go out more than one night a week with who I've been seeing.
Again, I'm curious. I don't think you would have said this if it wasn't important to you, but I'm not sure I understand how it is related to the rest of the issue, and I would like to understand. Would you tell more?

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I've know he liked to view shemale and transsexual porn. In the last 2 months, his bi side has been growing more expressive. At this point I am dismayed at my hypocrisy and the emotional response this has brought out in me.
It sounds like you are frustrated with yourself, and disappointed in your reaction.

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My partner assures me I am his ideal but he is also aware I'm a bit put off by two men having sex so I wonder how much he would flatter me on this subject by not expressing his level of interest in men/men in drag/intersexed people.... This is killing our sex life. He doesn't feel wanted and I feel inadequate. He feels I think he is gross and I suspect he'd put more effort into this if I did have a dick. UGH! On top of it all I get to feel bad because I am not turned on by everything that turns him on. If I don't get super charged up about his interest in transsexuals or guys, he gets in a twist and says he never should have let me know that side of him and he is just going to shut up about it and not act on it. Why do I have to be a part of the mix if he sees a guy? I haven't been part of the mix for every woman he has dated.
I get the understanding from this and more of your writing that you feel most uncomfortable when you believe that there are expectations on you to enjoy something that you don't find interesting. Are you also afraid that you (or your huband's interest in women altogether) will be replaced by his interest in men?

Something else I notice, is that you mention having gotten used to the idea and practice of polyamory, and now you feel thrown by the idea that your husband may also be interested in women. I wonder, since these seem to be related for you, if it is not so much about his interest in men, as it is about the change process. Though change is inevitable, we all experience it differently at different times in our lives. I have noticed that what is desirable for one partner is not always easy for the other, even if they can see the happiness that may come of it at the end. Do you feel tired? What nurture do you need from your husband in order to deal with this change? Can you make specific requests to him?

Much love to you as you figure all this out together.
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  #13  
Old 06-27-2011, 02:14 AM
Ignorant Ignorant is offline
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Originally Posted by Tonberry View Post
You wouldn't be in that position though. You would be in his position when there were two females. You don't seem to think HE was bing used by the two of you during these times. You feel SHE was.
Therefore, the equivalent would mean the male partner would be used. Not you.

I notice though that in both cases a female becomes the used person. It seems to be less about who is "extra" and more about who is male and who isn't. I'm just throwing that out there, because maybe psychologically you feel sex for a woman is a more vulnerable act, and that she's more likely to be used than a male?

At any rate, if you don't want to be part of a threesome anymore, don't be. If he wants to have sex with males, you don't need to be around. If you do decide to do it, you can make conditions, such as have it be about you and have you be in charge, which could help you feel less used.

Honestly, from the post I read it seemed more about feelings about homosexuality, but more of a general feeling that males were threatening, and two of them would mean you were used even more, when an extra female meant she'd be used instead. I'm female and I'm not used unless I want to be, and I use men if they want to be used.

I think you can explain to him how you feel the way you did here, or even have him read your posts. A lot of people seem to put more thoughts into creating posts that explain the whole situation than explaining things to their partners. Maybe because you have to explain the whole thing from the start. Either way, it could be insightful for him.
I think what you're not seeing is that I've worn that Bi tag very lightly if at all; women entering OUR bed were being emotionally held at arms length and were not invited simply so I could get my woman fix and still retain my bi status. I don't care what tag someone gives me for what act. It wasn't about a woman's body to me just that it was aother body. Two bodies for me. Two bodies for him. Both he and I already with an emotional investment leaving them - what in regards to their emotions?

Because my partner has faced physical threat for his sexuality and hid it for so long, it IS about the male body specifically. It isn't just about another body in the mix; he has a specific craving. We did not invite women because I had a craving for sex with a woman but a craving for another body in the mix. It is why I felt we were using them and felt bad about doing so if deeper feelings developed on their part. If I'm tossed in the mix for him and a guy I would be so in the same capacity as liquid courage because I have no craving for the sex that goes on between two men. At least when I wear a strap on for my partner I have a role to play albeit the tofurkey version of what my partner has been craving.
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  #14  
Old 06-27-2011, 02:42 AM
Ignorant Ignorant is offline
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Originally Posted by GroundedSpirit View Post
you just simply don't understand the dynamic.
Did you notice the username?

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Originally Posted by GroundedSpirit View Post
Personally, I doubt this is the case. I doubt he's uncomfortable (awkward) - except in your presence.
Why are you saying I'm the reason the reason he has been repressing this for 15 years? I have only known him for 8. If he is only awkward about this around me, why does he want me to participate?

I don't feel I've earned the bigot tag you need me to wear for speaking up about my own awkwardness in hte mix of something he feels awkward about and has for long before he knew me.

But you're right, it isn't worth arguing about.
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  #15  
Old 06-27-2011, 03:05 AM
Ignorant Ignorant is offline
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Originally Posted by Seasnail View Post
I'm curious why you think this is unfair? Like other posters, I wonder if it is because you are only interested in sex with love at this time. However, there are people who seem genuinely happy in various arrangements of sex, love, and committment.
Because it has always ended in a crash and burn situation. Not just with them feeling hurt and expressing it but also in acting out angrily or petty. If not for their reaction it might feel less unfair. Clearly I, we for the most part upset them.

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Originally Posted by Seasnail View Post
Again, I'm curious. I don't think you would have said this if it wasn't important to you, but I'm not sure I understand how it is related to the rest of the issue, and I would like to understand. Would you tell more?
It was to colorfully infer that he is feeling sensitive about his experiences in poly lately. He feels down on himself and compares my experiences in poly to his in a success VS lack of manner.

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Originally Posted by Seasnail View Post
It sounds like you are frustrated with yourself, and disappointed in your reaction.
Yes. But we are working through it better and more compassionately.


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Originally Posted by Seasnail View Post
I get the understanding from this and more of your writing that you feel most uncomfortable when you believe that there are expectations on you to enjoy something that you don't find interesting. Are you also afraid that you (or your huband's interest in women altogether) will be replaced by his interest in men?

Something else I notice, is that you mention having gotten used to the idea and practice of polyamory, and now you feel thrown by the idea that your husband may also be interested in women.
? I've known he was into women for about 8 years now and I've met about a handful of his ex GFs. I'm dealing with getting use to his interest in men.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seasnail View Post
I wonder, since these seem to be related for you, if it is not so much about his interest in men, as it is about the change process. Though change is inevitable, we all experience it differently at different times in our lives. I have noticed that what is desirable for one partner is not always easy for the other, even if they can see the happiness that may come of it at the end. Do you feel tired? What nurture do you need from your husband in order to deal with this change? Can you make specific requests to him?

Much love to you as you figure all this out together.
This is what I'm figuring out
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  #16  
Old 06-27-2011, 03:12 AM
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Seasnail Seasnail is offline
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Originally Posted by Ignorant View Post
Because it has always ended in a crash and burn situation. Not just with them feeling hurt and expressing it but also in acting out angrily or petty. If not for their reaction it might feel less unfair. Clearly I, we for the most part upset them.
That's too bad. I wish positive experiences for you.


Quote:
? I've known he was into women for about 8 years now and I've met about a handful of his ex GFs. I'm dealing with getting use to his interest in men.
Sorry, I think my grammar was muddled there. I was wondering if you were afraid that his interest in men might replace his interest in women, yourself included. But I think I understand what you're saying.
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  #17  
Old 06-27-2011, 06:21 AM
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redpepper redpepper is offline
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Originally Posted by Ignorant View Post
If he is only awkward about this around me, why does he want me to participate?
Why does he want you to participate? Extra bodies again? Or is there more for him? It sounds like maybe you are not clear on this.... again back to Seasnail question... are you worried he will leave you for men?
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  #18  
Old 06-27-2011, 12:28 PM
Ignorant Ignorant is offline
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Why does he want you to participate? Extra bodies again? Or is there more for him? It sounds like maybe you are not clear on this.... again back to Seasnail question... are you worried he will leave you for men?
Yes a bit due to him repressing it for so long. That he hasn't been up front with me about his interests for many years makes it hard to know if he is or isn't still doing that to some extent.

I only asked GSpirit why my partner wants me to participate if I'm the sole source of his anxiety because that poster seems intent on seeing what they want rather than something closer to the situation at hand.
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  #19  
Old 06-27-2011, 12:40 PM
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Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
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It is hard when a partner comes out after years of hiding their interest in the same sex.

You seem to be wondering, is he bi or is he gay? Does he still want me or is it really men he was wanting all along? Will he want to throw himself into sex with men and ignore my sexual and emotional needs?

You can't know this unless you ask him and get some answers. Hopefully he does love you and still desires you. Extremely honest and respectful conversations are definitely needed here. This is understandably very difficult and unsettling for you!

A queer friendly therapist might be useful. This is a fairly common scenario in our culture, where men often feel compelled to hide their homosexual feelings and take a wife as a "beard." Hopefully your partner is bi and really craves sex/love with both you and any prospective male partners.
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  #20  
Old 06-27-2011, 12:57 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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Originally Posted by Ignorant View Post
It wasn't about a woman's body to me just that it was another body. Two bodies for me. Two bodies for him. Both he and I already with an emotional investment leaving them - what in regards to their emotions?
Sounds to me like it would be the same if that other body was male. You're right that I don't get it. You say for you it's just another body, and it didn't matter that it was a female. So another body again, male this time, should be the same, right?

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Originally Posted by Ignorant View Post
Because my partner has faced physical threat for his sexuality and hid it for so long, it IS about the male body specifically. It isn't just about another body in the mix; he has a specific craving. [...] If I'm tossed in the mix for him and a guy I would be so in the same capacity as liquid courage because I have no craving for the sex that goes on between two men.
You're not "tossed in". You're the one he has a relationship with. Anyone ELSE is the addition, not you. He wants you there, presumably for the same reasons you wanted him there when there was another woman involved. Just because the additional person he wants, he doesn't want for the same reasons you did or do doesn't mean he doesn't want you for the same reasons he wanted you in your FMF threesomes.

He's attracted to males, but he's also attracted to females. That you have no interest in watching them together only means that you have leverage to say that if you participate at all, you want to always be involved, and never be just watching.
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