Not so much jealousy as feeling like a loser

In my first officially non-monogamous relationship, we both wanted it from the first date (9 months ago) and we're a pretty awesome couple. She is constantly telling me how great I am and how she can't imagine ever leaving me, she doesn't understand why I'm not constantly surrounded by women, etc. I trust her and am not worried about her leaving me.

Since we started dating, I've tried going out with 3 other girls, weren't really into each other, pretty awkward, nothing happened. I'm really shy and maybe a little picky, so that's pretty typical for me?

Meanwhile, I can't even keep track of all the guys she's gone out with. I can think of 8, but there are probably others I'm forgetting (several with the same names). Went on several dates each, excited about them, made out with most of them, had sex with at least 4. It's kind of intimidating.

Likewise, the latest guy she's seeing already has a wife and a girlfriend, and after their date tonight I find out that he's also currently dating another girl, and is interested in yet another... who just happens to be one of the three I unsuccessfully went out with. :/

Before we met, I hadn't kissed anyone in over a year, and I was trapped in self-reinforcing feelings of insecurity, loneliness, and depression. Now that I'm seeing just how easy dating is for everyone else, how they're all having such a great time, and I'm just seeing her and struggling elsewhere, I'm beginning to feel the same as I did then. It's bizarre to feel lonely or insecure when I'm in such a happy, stable relationship, but I can't help but compare myself to the success of others and feel like a loser, or feel that I'm somehow being taken advantage of, though I know that's not the case.
 
Hullo and well met!

I know this will probably make you want to punch me in the face, but when it comes to dating, you only need to go on to one REALLY good date if it's with the right person (my first-ever real relationship began with a nine-hour first date, and we didn't even have sex - just nine hours of talking, straight). And in the end, even that didn't work out because we were fundamentally incompatible to have a long-term monogamous relationship together.

Check out the Life-Stories and Blogs sections - plenty of people struggle with dating. So you are not alone. Poly may well feel like a joke when you struggle with having A relationship, much less multiple ones. So you are already better off in some ways with having a primary for whom you care deeply.

Is finding someone becoming a mild obsession? If it feeds into your negative self-image, it might be good to take a break from active searching all-together for a while and work on self-image issues instead.
 
Is finding someone becoming a mild obsession? If it feeds into your negative self-image, it might be good to take a break from active searching all-together for a while and work on self-image issues instead.
Excellent comment! You're not in a competition here. Accept the fact that you're shy, work on that shyness (and ESPECIALLY any feelings of inadequacy - these are in your head, not in your worth as a person), and relax a little.

Think about this: Would you really rather be dealing with 16 sexual relationships with physically VERY attractive people, be the most popular guy around, [have your girlfriend jealous of your success], have it leaked that you're dynamite in bed, have strange women 'phoning you up in the middle of the night... but for all those relationships and all that sex to leave you feeling emotionally empty, physically used, and with the taste of dust and ashes in your soul?

Would you really?

Stop trying to compete and appreciate your girlfriend. Isn't she wonderful? If somebody else comes along (or you go out and find them... but without STRESS) and it all works out happily, even better. But don't suffer until then!

Look at me: I'm polyamorous (by conviction) and have had no more-than-me sex in years (by circumstances). [links to my introduction and my thread "Polyamorous and celibate"]

Oh GOD! Am I jealous of you!!!:(:(:(:mad::mad::mad:

[;):rolleyes::D]

Welcome on board!
 
I've got to ask...your wife is practicing extremely safe sex right? Your indirectly sleeping with a lot of people. Sorry if the question is out of turn but my curiousity has gotten the best of me :eek:
 
I'm in the same place. I just left a relationship where my (female) partner was a magnet for male attention. I found myself constantly trying to figure out what was wrong with me. Since then, my husband and I have wanted to open up our relationship more completely--and I'm terrified, 'cause he's a good-looking, confident guy who knows exactly what he wants. I'm jealous, of course, but that's not the problem--I'm afraid he'll be much more successful at dating than me! :(

Our solution: we've put things on temporary hold while I learn to flirt. Just flirt, so I have a better sense of how often people are attracted to me, and how I'm comfortable responding. It also takes away the pressure of "achieving" sex or a relationship. So far, it's been helping my self-esteem...but it's also scary as hell.

It helps, of course, that neither of us is actively involved with anyone at the moment, so that may not be an option for you. But it might be healthy for you to figure out your style of interacting with women, and see when it works and when it doesn't. It certainly sounds like your style is very different from hers, and that's okay. :cool:
 
It's not that dating is easy for everyone else. It is just easier for your girlfriend than just about everyone else. Sounds like you are feeling rather hurt and perhaps you are feeling a need for your girlfriend to slow down a bit and allow you to catch up to where you want to me in your own dating world.

I feel the comment about not understanding why you aren't constantly surrounded by women to be rather condescending...as if if is some fault of your own that you aren't. In fact, your feeling intimidated over your girlfriends focus on her other relationships over your feelings sure isn't helping you be attractive to anyone else. Here again is more reason for her to slow down on her outside relationships if your happiness is truly important to her.

I want to be clear that I'm not saying that she has any direct power over your emotions. We cannot expect anyone else to be able to make us feel a certain way. However, I feel it is very important for primary partners to show they take their partner's emotions into consideration and choose to make sacrifices when their partner is feeling hurt by a situation that involves both of them.
 
I think its a matter of choice really. What is your poly compared to hers? I understand that you care about her, maybe even love her, but perhaps your gut is telling you something about your core values, what you would prefer in a relationship or maybe there is something missing. I only offer this as a thought, of course I could be totally wrong and you really wish you were as permiscuous and datable as her.

By the way. I don't think you're a loser. If it is that you value a connection that is built on getting to know someone first and something a bit more special and private about your sex life, I would date you over her any day just on the grounds of values alone. I just thought it should be said that there is room for that. My poly is not not of the "dating" and casual sex variety. Yours doesn't have to be either.
 
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I feel the comment about not understanding why you aren't constantly surrounded by women to be rather condescending...as if if is some fault of your own that you aren't.
I rather understood it as an attempt to encourage cuddlecakes, to make him feel that he is attractive. Is that condescending? Maybe. [shrugs]

@ cuddlecakes: I've just read your 6 comments on your thread, "Hello" and it really seems to me that you need to work on this insecurity/contest issue.

I also think that you should pay attention to redpepper's comment. I wonder if your gf is really poly (does she actually define herself as such?), a flirter - giddy with the freedom of a new date 4 times a week or whatever - or a swinger, hopping into (and out of) as many beds as possible. For me, poly implies emotional attachment. This seems to be important to you, too, and is probably why you're moving much more slowly than her.

This isn't meant as a criticism of her. If she wants to swing, is careful about protection, and you're OK with that [in principle] then that's your [plural] business. And maybe she is investing emotions into all those other relationships. What the hell do I know? But I think that you [singular] do have to stop using her as a measuring stick... and then beating yourself with that stick.
 
I've found that comparing myself to others never works out well for me. Is it that she has more partners than you or that you really wish that you had more partners? If it's the first then let it go. If it's the second then it sounds like you need to put yourself in the position to meet more people (especially since you are self-proclamed picky). You're not likely to make a connection with everyone you go out on a date with and there's no point in forcing something that isn't there. It just won't turn out well for anyone in the end!
 
If it's the second then it sounds like you need to put yourself in the position to meet more people...

This. Which can be incredibly hard to do if you're comparing yourself to someone else, so make sure you're going out separately.

And finding out that everyone else is sexually interconnected is a horrible, isolating feeling--I've been there, and I felt like a sexual leper--so try to socialize with people outside that circle. It really does help.
 
So 3 years later and I'm back in the same place. :D Guess I could respond to some of these messages at least...

I know this will probably make you want to punch me in the face

No, that would be mean.

you only need to go on to one REALLY good date if it's with the right person (my first-ever real relationship began with a nine-hour first date, and we didn't even have sex - just nine hours of talking, straight).

More like nine hours of sitting in the dark not talking for me. :D But a series of such bad dates did turn into a second relationship, which lasted 2 years, during which I was quite confident and happy, then she went monogamous on me and it's been descending back into insecurity and depression and jealousy since, as #1's dates increase in number and sexiness again, while no one is even responding to my messages. There was a period of time where things were flipped around, but not for long.

Poly may well feel like a joke when you struggle with having A relationship, much less multiple ones. So you are already better off in some ways with having a primary for whom you care deeply.

Yes, it's easy to take it for granted.

it might be good to take a break from active searching all-together for a while and work on self-image issues instead.

Or I should be doing both at the same time.

But is it possible for self-esteem to exist in a vacuum? I can't imagine where self-image could come from if not from what other people think of me. What other metric is there?

Excellent comment! You're not in a competition here.

Not with other people, no, but if I'm not happy with my own stuff, then it's a problem.

Accept the fact that you're shy

But it holds me back from sooooooo much that I want out of life. I don't want to accept it, I want to change it. I started seeing a therapist but it's not really doing much.

Think about this: Would you really rather be dealing with 16 sexual relationships with physically VERY attractive people, be the most popular guy around, [have your girlfriend jealous of your success], have it leaked that you're dynamite in bed, have strange women 'phoning you up in the middle of the night... but for all those relationships and all that sex to leave you feeling emotionally empty, physically used, and with the taste of dust and ashes in your soul?

I would like some of those things, and not the others. Isn't it a little sex-negative to assume that they are inseparable? ;) I've never had a relationship/sex experience that left me feeling empty with the taste of ashes in my soul.

I've got to ask...your wife is practicing extremely safe sex right?
I sure hope so! It's been rule number 1 all along.

It's not that dating is easy for everyone else.

Maybe not "easy", but certainly "easier" for all the people I know and the people they know, than it is for me. I am very socially anxious.

and perhaps you are feeling a need for your girlfriend to slow down a bit and allow you to catch up to where you want to me in your own dating world.

Yeah, we've done that a few times when I was going through periods of insecurity. It can be reassuring, but also makes me feel petty/guilty for holding her back.

I feel the comment about not understanding why you aren't constantly surrounded by women to be rather condescending

No no. More like "You're cute and intelligent and fun. I don't understand why aren't you surrounded by women! They must be idiots!"

your feeling intimidated over your girlfriends focus on her other relationships over your feelings sure isn't helping you be attractive to anyone else.

Troof. I'm also afraid that my negative mood will make me less attractive to her, so I am sometimes afraid to express it.

I want to be clear that I'm not saying that she has any direct power over your emotions. We cannot expect anyone else to be able to make us feel a certain way.

Absolutely.

However, I feel it is very important for primary partners to show they take their partner's emotions into consideration and choose to make sacrifices when their partner is feeling hurt by a situation that involves both of them.

She does... mostly. She probably doesn't realize how upset I get because I don't express it.

This. Which can be incredibly hard to do if you're comparing yourself to someone else, so make sure you're going out separately.

Like go on dates separately? We've never done anything else. Once flirted with a couple at a poly event, but I was super awkward, of course. The other dude even sort of criticized me: "I thought we poly people were supposed to be great communicators" :mad: THAT'S NOT WHAT THAT MEANS
 
Yes, you can have self-esteem in a vacuum. In fact it is a necessity.

So let me ask you, what does the self-talk in your head sound like? Are you always telling yourself negative things about yourself? Sure someone else may come along, telling you great things, but all that other person is doing is drowning out the negative self-talk; she isn't changing it.

Think about your long term partner. Sounds like she frequently tells you that you're a pretty awesome guy. Did it stop the negative self-talk? Nope.

Only you can do that.

I once recommended the following exercise to another person: write down 10 things you like about yourself. An interesting thing happened. She returned to this forum and said that for everything she wrote down, she found her mind trying to contradict her. "I am good at X," and the negative voice would come back with, "but you suck at Y." She hadn't even been aware of how unkindly she spoke to herself, and in fact realized many of the downers she told herself really weren't true.

She made a concerted effort to be aware of the negative self-talk and to talk back. In time she banished the negative self-talk altogether.

Maybe start there?
 
But is it possible for self-esteem to exist in a vacuum? I can't imagine where self-image could come from if not from what other people think of me. What other metric is there?

I do not know if this could help you but I offer it in case it does. I mean this kindly, ok?:eek:

  • Self image is what you think of yourself and your skills.
  • Self esteem is how you feel about your self image.
  • Self respect is how you treat yourself.

If you sit around calling yourself names like "loser" and thinking you stink? That is mean and not very respectful. You are painting a poor image of you with your thoughts. It is going to be hard to feel proud of yourself for thinking behavior like that and your self esteem will take a ding due to your treating yourself with little self respect.

"I recently broke up. I feel sad. My other partner is dating lots right now. I am not. I think she is having fun. I am having ugh. I feel envy ... Wishing I had what she had.

Not fun feelings right now. I am having a hard time dealing with it. My emotional coping skills right now are poor."

See?

It is possible to express what you think and feel without resorting to calling yourself names.

I think that the "other metric" you might be overlooking is treating yourself with self respect.

You could improve that area in your intrapersonal skills. Could keep it real, but could talk to yourself with more respect than how you have been. See if you start to feel a bit better in time. To me feelings ensue after behavior.... So behavior has to change somewhere before new feelings can ensue.

It is appropriate for the situation to feel sad. Most break ups have a layer of that. Your are not a loser for having normal response to that kind of situation. Evaluate if your feelings are appropriate for the situation.Maybe it helps to evaluate that rather than your "loserness" or "winnerness."

If you are going to use evaluation words, put it on your situation and/or on your behavior choices.

In this case the behavior choice of talking to yourself poorly while experiencing normal grief feelings after a break up situation. It is crushing to the spirit to call yourself names and there is enough in life to deal with without being a detriment to your own spiritual health. Grief cake is load enough to digest without self bullying frosting on top. Ykwim?

Hang in there. You will be ok. :eek:

HTH!

Galagirl
 
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Everything doesn't have to be equal. Just because she is dating and having relationships doesn't mean you have to run right out and get yourself dates or try to make a relationship happen in order to keep up. It ain't a race.

Enjoy what you do have. People who are basically happy attract others to them. Desperation and a scarcity mentality do not.
 
My husband had the same feelings

For the longest time my husband wondered what every other guy had that he didn't. I had boyfriends and lovers galore, his ex-wife was the same way. One of my lovers was intimate with me, my sister and three of my friends, my husband's girlfriend and my second boyfriend's wife. My husband had tried to get my sister to go out with him several times, but it never happened. When my lover asked her out, she went out with him (and they had sex.) My husband knew that this lover was well built, in every way, was financially successful, good looking and owned several houses. He began to wonder if he was just a loser.

When my sister told my husband that she loved him and only had sex with my lover because he was very attractive and it was an ego boost for her, it didn't make my husband feel any better. When we went to swing clubs and my husband would approach women and they would turn him down, but have sex with several others, this didn't boost my husband's ego either.

At one time we put ad on Craigslist for my husband. We have put ads on Craigslist for years and met several men that I simply had sex with. Some I have been with numerous times since. The ad we put up for my husband simply stated, "We are a married couple. I am straight and I want to see my husband have sex with another woman." We got no responses. When we have put up ads for me to have sex with other men we got literally hundreds of responses. This was not good for my husband.

We then put an ad on Craigslist for both of us to be with another couple. We had a few responses, but the responses were from men who said their wife let them date but would not be with them if they came to our house. This was not agreeable to us. When we did finally get with another couple, the wife of the other couple told us that she was not interested in sex with anyone other than her husband and it turned out to be me and the other woman's husband pleasing her. Not good for me or my husband.

It wasn't until just recently when my husband met up with his current girlfriend, who is 29 years younger than he is, that his ego got a bit of a boost. My husband used to always say, "When a woman goes out she knows if she is going to get sex or not. When a man goes out he hopes a woman will at least talk to him." I agree that may be true, but I have been with several men, and they were just very confident, self assured, and made things happen. I think that is the real key to attracting women.

My husband is 51 years old, was married to his ex for 28 years. In the last 31 years my husband has been intimate with me, his ex-wife and only one other woman other than his current girlfriend. That is 4 women that my husband has been intimate with in the last 31 years. One of my lovers, who I have been seeing for about 6 years now, has been with me, my sister, three of my friends, my second boyfriend's wife and my husband's girlfriend numerous times. Hell, my oldest boyfriend is currently intimate with me, his wife, my husband's girlfriend and my other boyfriend's wife. Does that make him a better person? NO! It just means that he is intimate with more people.

My husband did get depressed at times. And yes, since he has been with his new girlfriend he has been a much happier man. You can't give up or compare yourself to others. We are all different people. Each of us have different personalities and preferences. I do feel that if my husband and his relationship with his new girlfriend were to go South that he would probably go back to being depressed. As a matter of fact I guarantee he would, but you can't let it get to you.

If you know that your girlfriend loves you, then relish in that fact. Know she loves you and love her enough to be happy for her.
 
Re (from cuddlecakes):
"I can't imagine where self-image could come from if not from what other people think of me. What other metric is there?"

There's what you think of yourself. Don't be too quick to pooh-pooh that metric ...

I'll never forget my attempts to get something going with various people on OKC and PMM. Frustrating is an understatement. I actually gave up on the whole thing eventually, and was glad I had one woman who wanted to be with me. So, if you're tempted to put yourself in the "loser" category, you'll have to put me there too.

One's worth as a person should not be determined by how many dates one can secure. There's plenty of other things that can make someone a winner. [shrug] Maybe being a "dating Superman" is just a particular talent. Not everyone has that talent.

What about the idea of joining a club of some kind that does something you're interested in? You wouldn't be in it to date per se, but it would get you out there amongst people with similar interests and help you make some platonic friends. And some platonic relationships may turn into romantic relationships eventually.

I've only really been with two women in my life, and in both cases we were platonic friends for quite awhile before anything romantic developed. Just some food for thought.
 
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