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  #31  
Old 04-05-2011, 06:05 AM
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redpepper redpepper is offline
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I think that doing as I would want to have done to me is the best bet for me. I would not want to be told flat off to just fuck off because someones wife or whomever else decides I am not what "they" want for their partner... that is bullshit to me. But, I would be very willing to negotiate something that works better for a partner that is struggling or even decide to let the relationship go because I can see they have far too much to work on before being truly ready for what poly brings to ones life.

There is no way in hell I would accept a partner of mines veto. I have come too far

I think veto and primary/secondary language and descriptions are for newbies. Those who are stuck in the realm of relationships where one owns another and isn't able to let go of that just yet. It's based on fear and that, I think, needs to be broached before stepping into being an individual in ones relationship... I get that. I don't operate like that, but I get it... we are fed it in every bit of pop culture there is... it's hard not to get it. I just don't do that, is all.
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  #32  
Old 04-05-2011, 06:07 AM
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there are several threads on this if one were to do a tag search for "veto" and "veto power" btw....
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  #33  
Old 04-05-2011, 08:20 AM
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Morningglory629 Morningglory629 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I think veto and primary/secondary language and descriptions are for newbies. Those who are stuck in the realm of relationships where one owns another and isn't able to let go of that just yet. It's based on fear and that, I think, needs to be broached before stepping into being an individual in ones relationship... I get that. I don't operate like that, but I get it... we are fed it in every bit of pop culture there is... it's hard not to get it. I just don't do that, is all.
Perfect break down of how that language can damage.
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  #34  
Old 04-05-2011, 02:49 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Originally Posted by MindfulAgony View Post
..............
In the end, if you can't trust my judgment about people, you need to be willing to work with me as I learn to be a better judge. Deciding for me is not particularly helpful. I realize that this willingness might not be without some pain. But, it is pain that could help strengthen the relationship because of the trust given, wisdom shared, and stick with me through those growing pains.

If I'm a fool and can't learn, then you might as well get out while you can anyway...
This is a good summation I think MA.......

Because of the control dynamics involved, one of the basics of poly involves giving up that control option.
And I know that in many cases, after you do that, your example is the way that's left to flow.
You either choose to accept SOME risk and try to work towards something better long term - or you call a spade a spade - and bail !

Every situation is unique and everyone's willingness or ability to risk is different. So the "bail point" moves..........

GS
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  #35  
Old 04-05-2011, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by GroundedSpirit View Post
This is a good summation I think MA.......

Because of the control dynamics involved, one of the basics of poly involves giving up that control option.
And I know that in many cases, after you do that, your example is the way that's left to flow.
You either choose to accept SOME risk and try to work towards something better long term - or you call a spade a spade - and bail !

Every situation is unique and everyone's willingness or ability to risk is different. So the "bail point" moves..........

GS
Glad it resonated with you. I like the way you put a finer point on it. Giving up control, taking some risk, and committing to growth is inherent in making this shift.
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  #36  
Old 04-05-2011, 09:53 PM
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We have agreed we can veto someone early on if we get a really bad feeling about somebody - I know sometimes people get giddy over somebody new and don't really see things that could be problems. That is why we prefer to meet people the other is dating fairly soon, I don't think its fair to the third party to try be able to pull the plug whenever.

I don't picture using it - my husband hasn't dated crazy needy dysfunctional women for a long time, and I have only seen him date sane ones since we have been together, most of whom I have liked.

We do have veto in another way I suppose. We don't have hard and fast rules about dating somebody based on their sexual activities, lifestyle, or dating style (some things really just aren't our thing but we don't have a "you can't date somebody who does that" clause preset up because each person is an individual), but it is possible that we realize after awhile that we aren't going to be comfortable with that third person's choices. I have found some of that information just doesn't come up in the first few dates, and decisions might be made a bit later down the line.

I imagine that (working hard to come up with an example I would actually want to veto) if somebody my husband was dating for awhile started having unprotected casual sex now and then, got into risky blood play & started phoning at 2 am wanting to chat because she was feeling insecure - well he probably would've already broken up with her, but I imagine in that case I would be sitting him down at some point if there were ongoing issues and saying I didn't want this person in his life as a girlfriend anymore.

Admittedly if somebody he dated cheated on say - their primary partner, he might be more tolerant because he just is and knows people make mistakes - but I might ask to veto that person at that point because of a lot of personal reasons and history. Hmm that makes good conversation fodder for tonight.
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  #37  
Old 04-05-2011, 10:18 PM
Malena Malena is offline
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I do not believe in Veto's as for me that belongs to a mono relationship. If someone loves me they do not want to decide for me who is my loved one and who is not. When a couple has multiple relationships i sometimes wonder if it is really polyamory or more like an open relationship. If there is one most important person to me that is an open relationship that has overlap with polyamory but isn't so to me.
In my relationships both my partners are equal which in the case of veto means they would both have a veto option. If only one of them dislikes the other and therefore uses his veto what the hell would be the point?? Even when someone is a drug addict I would say it is my partners choice.

Even though somewhere you of course have to respect one another and have the same idea what the word respect involves for you both. If you love someone you do not want to put that person in danger and you will make sure your other relationships do not do so.
Veto could be meaning: communication. Stay open about your feelings, give your partner time to trust again if trust is damaged. We are people and we do get insecure sometimes that is normal. Take time to tell and show to eachother what they mean to you. If that means that you have to invest more time with that person at that time then another or even means you have to sometimes take a time out with that other person to settle things with one i think you have to do so. You owe that to someone if you respect and love them the last thing you want to do is hurt them, even if you do not mean to and you are not in your own opinion. Listen to one another and talk! SHARE
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  #38  
Old 04-06-2011, 12:04 PM
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I think of vetoes more as ultimatums, in a 'this shit doesn't fly by me anymore - take it or leave it' kinda way, but I see that is not what people generally mean by the concept. Of course, if I had been married for ten years and just now starting to play the field, I might be more inclined to try to work on a veto policy when getting into poly.

What do you think of temporary vetoes, as in 'I love this person but they need to work their shit out before we can continue as metamours, because right now it's having too much of an impact on our family life'?
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  #39  
Old 04-06-2011, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by BlackUnicorn View Post
What do you think of temporary vetoes, as in 'I love this person but they need to work their shit out before we can continue as metamours, because right now it's having too much of an impact on our family life'?
Either way, is it your responsibility to veto? I mean that means anyone in the relationship Vee can veto anything they deem "impacting" life.

Example1: I am moody and snap at hubs for the umpteenth time he has left laundry on the floor just because I had a fight with 2Rings over something entirely separate from hubs....might be over KT, might be something else... I may have snapped because I was not my usual self and pissed-off in general. Does my argument with 2Rings impact family life, quite often but does that mean hubs has a right to veto a relationship I want. No. He can ask why I jumped in his ass today, bitch a little about it and may utter that a sock on the floor does not warrant a full-blown rant, pick up his laundry and move-on; he can point out "hey I am not 2Rings but I am sorry I was the last straw today" and pick up his laundry; or he can just pick up his laundry and lump the mood I am in until it passes. Trying to place a sanction on something HE has nothing to do with just adds another layer of annoyance AND excludes hubs from his responsibility in any discord he is causing as well.

Example2: Hubs is looking for ways to control the relationship I have with 2Rings because he is monogamous and does not agree with poly lifestyle etc, so he vetos this, that and the other. He argues with me until we are screaming in eachother's faces and in front of the kids almost daily because I do not agree with the vetoes and BTW I am an independent person with free-thought, right? So I am just as stubborn in my "rights." Kids are impacted NOT by metamour but hubs' reaction to my want of my relatinship with said metamour and to have this or that everyday, normal expectation in that relationship. What did the veto accomplish?

BTW- hubs doesn't ever veto. Thank god!

Just my thoughts on veto. And this applies to politics as well. That and filebustering really get on my nerves. I just don't see the point of it other than to piss people off, extend the argument, and cause further stress and discord. The exact opposite of ANY reason I have heard in support of the power of veto.
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  #40  
Old 04-06-2011, 03:57 PM
TruckerPete TruckerPete is offline
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All of the responses I've seen that talk about reasonable scenarios to use vetos could easily be categorized as common sense and/or good communication.

Veto literally means "I forbid". If something is common sensical or you're able to have a dialogue with your partner, then you're not vetoing.
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agreements, contracts, control issues, envy, jealous, jealousy, metamour concerns, new to poly, nre, relationship dynamics, relationship issues, secondaries, secondary, sex, veto, veto policy, veto power, vetos

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